TRFites, I need some serious advice....

[dman]

I have been offered an unbelievable offer and wanted to get the advice of my friends here. You all know my love for my Yacht-Master, but I have a chance to trade it for a watch that is much more rare and with an equal or better movement.

I have been offered a Panerai 190, with a JLC 8 days movement. This movement is only manufactured for this particular watch so it is very rare. I will have some pics later today, but for the first time since I have owned the YM I am torn.

I really think that I can replace the YM later on, but a deal like this on a 190 does not come up often if at all.

Chime in guys, wht do you think? I am really torn, and don't know what to do.

:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

[Rockrolex]

Daren, knowing how you are not tied to any of your watches - unlike some of us - I would say go for it. This could be a once in a millenium offer. And as you say, the YM is a dime a dozen. You'll be able to pick one up anytime.

The only question is: How long are you going to keep this PAM? :thinking: :thinking:

[dman]

Here are a few pics, the gold hands on this baby are beautiful.
http://www.dream-watch.com/pic/Panerai/PAM190G-1a.jpg
http://www.panerai.com/img/2/prodotti/dettagli/1086975104294_vista_2.jpg

[dman]

Daren, knowing how you are not tied to any of your watches - unlike some of us - I would say go for it. This could be a once in a millenium offer. And as you say, the YM is a dime a dozen. You'll be able to pick one up anytime.

The only question is: How long are you going to keep this PAM? :thinking: :thinking:
I really can't say how long, but it will fit the bill as the dress watch I don't have. I can justify reasons for and against, that is why I am not sure.

[padi56]

Yes I would tend to Agree with Ed the Pam 190 is becoming quite a well sort after watch,and IMO will increase in value.You can pick up a Y/M quite easy anywhere,and at any time,there are thousands of those around.And that JLC movement is far Superior in every way, almost all hand built and not mass produced,not like the Y/Ms.

[----]

Daren, you know my answer - go for it! :thumbsup:

The YM is a very common watch compared to the Pam, so I would say the Pam should be the new "keeper" on your list. I know you love that YM, but it is only a Rolex after all........

[Atomic]

Daren, come on.... like you have to ask?

This is 100% a no-brainer. YMs are dime a dozen and easily replaced. The JLC movement is only made for the 190. The classic cushion case, YG hands, sandwich dial, the 8 day movement's history with Panerai... no question.

Remember some of those original 8 day movement watches from the 50s recently went at auction for close to US$100,000. Granted they were original, but who's to say this limited production watch won't see the same exponential growth in the future (assuming you hold on to it for more than a few weeks, LOL).

JUST DO IT!

[Uncle-AJ]

Go for the YM Darren, there are lots of them around and you could get parts very easily should you ever need them. Why go for a very rare watch at a discount price? Whilst you are at it buy some shares in the South Sea Bubble Company. :banghead: :banghead:

Honestly man, why are you asking the obvious?

Get the Panny!!

[Launch Mini]

You know my answer Daren.
A Pair of Pannies. Not even a second thought over here buddy.:thumbsup:
BUT, you must wear it when you come to Seattle this fall.:cheers:
Maybe by then, you might want to flip it ( ala JJ) and I will be there with an empty wrist waiting.:rofl:

[JJ Irani]

I don't know what to say, Daren....I'm shattered! To see that gorgeous YM go for that Panny which seriously does absolutely nothing for me! :crying: :crying:

But it's your call and your decision. I won't say anything further. I only hope for one thing....that you sell this 8-Day model some day and make a helluva lot of cash...and then buy back the YM or any other ROLEX of your choice.

Good luck in your moves - JJ:thumbsup:

[C.J.]

Go for it, Daren. You can always get a YM. You may not get another chance to get this Panny. :thumbsup:

[Goodwatch]

I say do it. That YM isn't THAT special. Afterall, JJ has one too (who hasn't, these days) :rofl: :rofl:

[AJC]

Hey Daren,

If you are taking the Daytona clasp off and refitting the original clasp back on the YM I would say go for it.(Once this has been done she is just an ordinary old YM which can easily be replaced.)

I don't know nothing about this model Panny,or in fact most Pannies but it sounds special and is worthy of doing something.

:cheers: Aaron

[Earl]

Daren, How robust is the JLC movement, will it with stand what you have to offer it? Shinny SS for a dress watch?

If your thinking of getting it to flip down the road and need the capital of the YM to get it well, then flip your YM and get the 190 and store it since it's already semi rare. As you say you can get another Rolex YM when you want ie. no supply shortage.

[Launch Mini]

Don't forget, Daren was going to sell the YM earlier because of bad kharma felt around the club house.
So, there is more than one reason he should move to the Panny.
And, he does love the feel & look of his current Pan's.
:cheers: :thumbsup:
ps WE WANTS PICS ASAP:rofl:

[dman]

Thanks alot for the replies guys, but I really am torn. This YM is still a special watch to me, I just don't know what to do. :banghead: :banghead:

I am almost at the point of flipping a coin.

Earl, the movement is a very nice manual wind, but it is not a tank like the 3135. I think the accuracy should be close to the Rolex, but my YM is almost always spot on.

I am still very stuck in the middle. Any other advice is appreciated. :thumbsup: :thinking: :thinking:

[mailman]

Yo Daren. Seeing how this might be a once in a lifetime deal, I say go for it. I love your YM. If I were ever to get another Rolex, that would be the one. I know it has sentimental value to you, but you can always get another. The Panny is beautiful. I like the gold hands and the sandwhich dial. I say do it.

BTW, all kidding aside here, if you're going to sell the YM, can I PLEASE have first dibs on it? :read: :read: :clap: :agree:

[C.J.]

Thanks alot for the replies guys, but I really am torn. This YM is still a special watch to me, I just don't know what to do. :banghead: :banghead:

I am almost at the point of flipping a coin.

Earl, the movement is a very nice manual wind, but it is not a tank like the 3135. I think the accuracy should be close to the Rolex, but my YM is almost always spot on.

I am still very stuck in the middle. Any other advice is appreciated. :thumbsup: :thinking: :thinking:

Seriously, bro I know you love the Yachtie, but if the Panny is that rare, you're going to kick yourself if you miss out on the only shot you may get at it. If you ever want another YM, they're a dime a dozen, almost every AD has a couple in stock. If the Panny doesn't smile at you the way you thought it would, flip it, make a few bucks and another YM could be had the same day. On the other hand, if you pass up the offer on the Panny, it may not present itself again for a very long time, if ever at all. Good luck :cheers:

[dman]

The 190 is rare, but I am sure I might be able to find one later if I were to save up the money. I am not sure I could justify having two 7K+ watches in the family though.

What to do, what to do. :banghead: :banghead:

[C.J.]

The 190 is rare, but I am sure I might be able to find one later if I were to save up the money. I am not sure I could justify having two 7K+ watches in the family though.

What to do, what to do. :banghead: :banghead:

If the 190 isn't all that rare and it seems like you can get another one if you want, I don't see why you would flip the yachtie. Ever since I've been here, it's the one mainstay in your stable and the only one you were always absolutely happy with :thumbsup:

[dman]

If the 190 isn't all that rare and it seems like you can get another one if you want, I don't see why you would flip the yachtie. Ever since I've been here, it's the one mainstay in your stable and the only one you were always absolutely happy with :thumbsup:
That is why I am so torn mate. I love that watch and have kept it through some serious flips, but I also wear it maybe one day a week. I think I need to wear a watch that expensive more than once a week. I just don't know. :dummy:

[C.J.]

That is why I am so torn mate. I love that watch and have kept it through some serious flips, but I also wear it maybe one day a week. I think I need to wear a watch that expensive more than once a week. I just don't know. :dummy:

I don't think expense has anything to do with it, pal. You wear what smiles at you the most. The yachtie has been with you through many a flip, and even though it only gets wrist time once a week, you know it's there for those occasions.
With the new Panny, rare as it may be, you just don't know if you're going to feel the same way about it as you do your YM. Lets face it, the yachtie has proven itself to be a keeper time and time again. You know it smiles at you. With the Panny, it may just be the thrill of the acquisition. Whereas with the ym, it's still a thrill to know you own it. Just my 2 cents. :cheers:

[JJ Irani]

Have to agree with CJ on this one, Daren. Also, the big question is how much of a hit are you taking on the YM? Your watch is virtually brand new and if you get rid of it now, you will be hard pressed to buy a new one later on. It's a bloody expensive watch, much more than even a TT Sub....so why lose out on such a beauty.

Want my sincere and friendly advice? Do whatever the hell you like as far as the Panny goes, but don't sell the YM!!:thumbsup:

[Atomic]

Don't listen to Baldie. DO IT, DO IT!

The 190 has far more history and pedigree than a YM. The YM was 'only' introduced about 15 years ago... the 8 day Panny history goes back 50+ years. That, my friend, is pedigree.

Besides, you can always pick up a YM down the road for a good deal and you KNOW you can sell the 190 at a profit because it is SO rare and SO desirable. :thumbsup: :cheers:

[padi56]

Would have to agree with John on this,you will be kicking yourself if you miss an opportunity to get such a rare watch Daren.The Y/M will never increase in price just to many of them.And you can get them anywhere,with a discount its not one of the best sellers.But the 190 with all its pedigree and heritage make it a truly desirable time piece.

[SLRdude]

I'll say get the Panerai.
I have yet to see a dealer that does not have the YM on display. It can always be replaced in a matter of minutes.

Get the Panerai. And... in an earlier thread you said that you wouldn't have a dress watch if you ditch the Rolex... just call me and I'll deliver something that you could wear with a suit to your door. Or Starbucks.

[Atomic]

I'll say get the Panerai.
I have yet to see a dealer that does not have the YM on display. It can always be replaced in a matter of minutes.

Get the Panerai. And... in an earlier thread you said that you wouldn't have a dress watch if you ditch the Rolex... just call me and I'll deliver something that you could wear with a suit to your door. Or Starbucks.

How's that for the brotherhood of TRF??

BTW, do you deliver to Canada, too? :chuckle:

[SLRdude]

How's that for the brotherhood of TRF??

BTW, do you deliver to Canada, too? :chuckle:


If I am ever there... why not?

[JJ Irani]

Daren,

All I'm saying is that I don't give a rat's ass what you get. Get the Panny, get a friggin' RADO for all I care!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Don't let go of the YM....YOU WILL REGRET IT!!! Please trust me on this one!! :thumbsup:

[Atomic]

Daren,

All I'm saying is that I don't give a rat's ass what you get. Get the Panny, get a friggin' RADO for all I care!! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Don't let go of the YM....YOU WILL REGRET IT!!! Please trust me on this one!! :thumbsup:


JJ, if Daren does the deal, will he regret it the way you regretted selling the GMTII? The three Submariners? The white Explorer II, the Black Explorer II?

What about the regret you had when you sold the keeper of all keepers, the TT blue sub. Will he regret selling the YM the way you regretted parting with that one? What about the regret of selling your DJs?

Hmmmm.... yeah Daren, take JJ's advice. He's still spilling tears over Sub #1 and Sub #2. :dummy: :bartmoon: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[JJ Irani]

You forgot the SD, tosser!! :dummy: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You must remember though, Johnny, that when I sold the TT Blue Sub (yes, I still miss that baby), it was only for a better looking watch - the TT Blue YM with all that extra gold on that stunning bezel.

The older SS Subs? Well, all of them were on non-SEL bracelets. This one is different and I love it.

Now, back to Rolex....what we were talking about? :thinking: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:

[Atomic]

You forgot the SD, tosser!! :dummy: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You must remember though, Johnny, that when I sold the TT Blue Sub (yes, I still miss that baby), it was only for a better looking watch - the TT Blue YM with all that extra gold on that stunning bezel.

The older SS Subs? Well, all of them were on non-SEL bracelets. This one is different and I love it.

Now, back to Rolex....what we were talking about? :thinking: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:


Sorry, I'm still not seeing the difference. And not a good rationalization. When you sold Sub #1, there was no SEL. I'm gonna guess that when Sub #2 sold, SEL still wasn't available. Am I wrong?

And what about the SD? At the time you were saying it was the ultimate.

JJ, really... giving advice to someone about keeping a watch is like Bill Clinton giving a lecture on martial fidelity. :lol: :bartmoon:

[JJ Irani]

I love giving advice, Johnny! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Atomic]

I love giving advice, Johnny! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yes you do... but it seems a case of 'do as I say, not as I do.':banghead: :banghead:

[dman]

You must remember though, Johnny, that when I sold the TT Blue Sub (yes, I still miss that baby), it was only for a better looking watch - the TT Blue YM with all that extra gold on that stunning bezel.


Now, back to Rolex....what we were talking about? :thinking: :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:
Okay hold on a second my friend. You had me starting to make up my mind till this post. In fact you may have made up my mind for me. I don't care about the brand, only if the watch is what I think is better looking. Re-read your post, I have highlighted what I mean. Thanks for the advice. :thumbsup:

[dman]

Anyways guys I am still on the fence, but I am meeting my buddy tomorrow in person to discuss the deal and look at the watch in person.

I will have pics by tomorrow night or Friday at the latest. :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :cheers:

Thanks for all the replies TRF, you guys are the best. :thumbsup:

[JJ Irani]

Okay hold on a second my friend. You had me starting to make up my mind till this post. In fact you may have made up my mind for me. I don't care about the brand, only if the watch is what I think is better looking. Re-read your post, I have highlighted what I mean. Thanks for the advice. :thumbsup:
I'm not sure what you mean, Daren. All I'm saying is when I traded in my Rolex (Blue Sub) it was only for a better ROLEX. Your YM is pure beauty! Why trade it in for something less? Keep it and still buy what your heart desires. Yes, you will get another YM....but at what price and what kind of hit are you taking on this one? I know their resale is not as good as say the 16610 or some of the other SS models.

Anyway, you do what you feel best. You asked for advice and I gave it.

JJ

[padi56]

I'm not sure what you mean, Daren. All I'm saying is when I traded in my Rolex (Blue Sub) it was only for a better ROLEX. Your YM is pure beauty! Why trade it in for something less? Keep it and still buy what your heart desires. Yes, you will get another YM....but at what price and what kind of hit are you taking on this one? I know their resale is not as good as say the 16610 or some of the other SS models.

Anyway, you do what you feel best. You asked for advice and I gave it.

JJ
Now JJ how can a Y/M be better than a TT Sub,they are basically the same watch they have same movement.What you meant was, the more expensive one, there are know better Rolex, only more expensive ones.But the Pam is almost unique in its manufacture and built by hand,and not by robots,like the 3135


:chuckle: :cheers: :thumbsup:

[Atomic]

I'm not sure what you mean, Daren. All I'm saying is when I traded in my Rolex (Blue Sub) it was only for a better ROLEX. Your YM is pure beauty! Why trade it in for something less? Keep it and still buy what your heart desires. Yes, you will get another YM....but at what price and what kind of hit are you taking on this one? I know their resale is not as good as say the 16610 or some of the other SS models.

Anyway, you do what you feel best. You asked for advice and I gave it.

JJ


JJ, what makes you think a YM is 'more' than a PAM190? The Pam has a ground-breaking movement specially made for Panerai by JLC and has a power reserve of EIGHT DAYS! The displayback actually shows the power reserve indicator, which is a nice WIS touch and it doesn't clutter the pure, simple dial. The movement is a work of art. A 3135 is a tugboat, but one fugly looking movement. Plus, with a 190, you have strap options, which Daren obviously likes.

I don't see how you can consider a PAM190 'less' off a watch than a dime a dozen rolesium Yachtmaster??? :thinking: The 190 is made in seriously small quantities and is in high demand now, and will continue to be in high demand... much more so than any YM ever will.

[dman]

Is the 16613 not as good as the TTYM different than the 190 better than the YM.

[----]

JJ, what makes you think a YM is 'more' than a PAM190? The Pam has a ground-breaking movement specially made for Panerai by JLC and has a power reserve of EIGHT DAYS! The displayback actually shows the power reserve indicator, which is a nice WIS touch and it doesn't clutter the pure, simple dial. The movement is a work of art. A 3135 is a tugboat, but one fugly looking movement. Plus, with a 190, you have strap options, which Daren obviously likes.

I don't see how you can consider a PAM190 'less' off a watch than a dime a dozen rolesium Yachtmaster??? :thinking: The 190 is made in seriously small quantities and is in high demand now, and will continue to be in high demand... much more so than any YM ever will.

Well said John - you have almost convinced me to buy one!! :thumbsup:

[Atomic]

Well said John - you have almost convinced me to buy one!! :thumbsup:


I know it's too big for your tastes, but it's a helluva watch! :thumbsup:

[JJ Irani]

Hey guys,

Read the thread title...the guy asked for "serious advice"....so I gave mine....if you fellas don't like it....too bad.

I pesonally would never give up a ROLEX for any other watch except another ROLEX....but then that's me. And that's exactly what I did from the TT Sub to the TT YM....the latter is definitely a better looking watch although it has the same movement.

I'm a straight up honest person....I said what is in my heart and what I think is right...if people don't like it, then next time I think it's better I keep my trap shut!!

[Atomic]

Hey guys,

Read the thread title...the guy asked for "serious advice"....so I gave mine....if you fellas don't like it....too bad.

I pesonally would never give up a ROLEX for any other watch except another ROLEX....but then that's me. And that's exactly what I did from the TT Sub to the TT YM....the latter is definitely a better looking watch although it has the same movement.

I'm a straight up honest person....I said what is in my heart and what I think is right...if people don't like it, then next time I think it's better I keep my trap shut!!


You'll only trade a Rolex for a Rolex. Damn JJ, I have a Patek Phillip that I wanted to trade you for your Sub, but I guess that cancells the deal, huh? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


BTW, never keep your trap shut, JJ. You're too much fun with it open. :thumbsup:

[JJ Irani]

You'll only trade a Rolex for a Rolex. Damn JJ, I have a Patek Phillip that I wanted to trade you for your Sub, but I guess that cancells the deal, huh? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


BTW, never keep your trap shut, JJ. You're too much fun with it open. :thumbsup:
You can keep the PP....I think they suck!! Too much hype over nothing!! Wear one on your wrist, go to the opera, clap as hard as you can after the show and the damn thing STOPS. No thanks, pal....give me a Rolex anytime, anyday and anywhere. :clap:

I LOVE ROLEX and would NEVER EVER trade up a Rolex for anything except another Rolex...and that is dead serious talk! :thumbsup:

[Atomic]

You can keep the PP....I think they suck!! Too much hype over nothing!! Wear one on your wrist, go to the opera, clap as hard as you can after the show and the damn thing STOPS. No thanks, pal....give me a Rolex anytime, anyday and anywhere. :clap:

I LOVE ROLEX and would NEVER EVER trade up a Rolex for anything except another Rolex...and that is dead serious talk! :thumbsup:


I guess you never thought about selling the PP and buying multiple Rollies with the proceeds, then, eh? :dummy: :rofl:

I'm just yankin' yer chain, ya bald flightless bird! :bartmoon: :justkiddi

[JJ Irani]

I guess you never thought about selling the PP and buying multiple Rollies with the proceeds, then, eh? :dummy: :rofl:

I'm just yankin' yer chain, ya bald flightless bird! :bartmoon: :justkiddi
I know that, pal....but let's say, just for the heck of it, if I did "find" a PP....yes, I would get rid of it pronto and trade-up for as many Rollies I could get out of the proceeds! :chuckle: :chuckle:

[Atomic]

I know that, pal....but let's say, just for the heck of it, if I did "find" a PP....yes, I would get rid of it pronto and trade-up for as many Rollies I could get out of the proceeds! :chuckle: :chuckle:


That's the JJ we all know and like. (I'd say 'love' but I think CJ and Renato might get jealous :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: ). :clap:

[JJ Irani]

That's the JJ we all know and like. (I'd say 'love' but I think CJ and Renato might get jealous :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: ). :clap:
Hey, by now you must know that I'm absolutely hetero....and, besides, CJ and Renato have their cleavages at the WRONG end!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Atomic]

Hey, by now you must know that I'm absolutely hetero....and, besides, CJ and Renato have their cleavages at the WRONG end!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Perhaps, and now who's the butt of this joke? :rofl:

[JJ Irani]

Perhaps, and now who's the butt of this joke? :rofl:
CJ and Renato?:thinking: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[C.J.]

How did you freaks drag me into this. :thinking: :thinking:

[Atomic]

How did you freaks drag me into this. :thinking: :thinking:

Catch up on your reading, Mr. Plod, and you'll get it. :dummy: :rofl:

[dman]

You can keep the PP....I think they suck!! Too much hype over nothing!! Wear one on your wrist, go to the opera, clap as hard as you can after the show and the damn thing STOPS. No thanks, pal....give me a Rolex anytime, anyday and anywhere. :clap:

I LOVE ROLEX and would NEVER EVER trade up a Rolex for anything except another Rolex...and that is dead serious talk! :thumbsup:
JJ, I wanted all thoughts on this, that is why I asked. I also value the input of everyone here, that is why I asked.

That being said, that is totally nuts talk to say that Rolex is the be all and end all in horology. Crazy and insane also come to mind. Rolex is a damn fine watch, no doubt about it, but there are many and I mean MANY brands that are par or way above Rolex. They are by no means at all at the top of the watch foodchain.

For you they might be, but to think that everyone else will snob, and that is what this is, everyother brand out there for the sake of one is nuts. Blind devotion is not something that I would ever pledge to a watch company.

Unless the endorsement deal was good enough. :chuckle:

[JJ Irani]

JJ, I wanted all thoughts on this, that is why I asked. I also value the input of everyone here, that is why I asked.

That being said, that is totally nuts talk to say that Rolex is the be all and end all in horology. Crazy and insane also come to mind. Rolex is a damn fine watch, no doubt about it, but there are many and I mean MANY brands that are par or way above Rolex. They are by no means at all at the top of the watch foodchain.

For you they might be, but to think that everyone else will snob, and that is what this is, everyother brand out there for the sake of one is nuts. Blind devotion is not something that I would ever pledge to a watch company.

Unless the endorsement deal was good enough. :chuckle:
Then "blind devotion" it is, Daren. Yes, I have no shame in admitting that I do have a blind devotion toward Rolex. However, in all fairness to me, I do apperciate and admire other brands too. I love watches in general and anything with a dial and hands will capture my interest.

But, yes, I am a super die-hard Rolex fan....and there's not a damn thing even I can do about it...this one comes straight from the heart!!:thumbsup: Now, can I help that?