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eyeheartny · 5 April 2018, 06:36 AM

I’ve got $30k I can use on watch(es) currently.
I've got a SubC No Date and a few inexpensive but sentimental pieces (blue Deep Blue diver, Orient Polaris GMT) that I don’t want to double-up on in terms of look/feel.
I don't have a pure dress watch but I also never really wear suits, so I'm looking for at least one piece that's dressier but maybe not a classic dress piece.
Hardly ever wear suits, so the watches should work with a casual lifestyle that includes some dressy-casual occasions where I’ll wear a sportcoat.

Also, I recently posted this thread in the Rolex-specific subforum. It has some useful information about my build, style, etc that may be relevant for this discussion. For those that don’t click over, here are the highlights. Late 30s, athletic (6’2”, 215lb), shaved head, beard, 7.75-8” wrists. I'm debating between a few ways to go and am curious what you guys would recommend.

Only One of:

Rolex Day-Date 40 in Rose Gold with Sundust or Green dial
AP Royal Oak 15400 in SS with blue dial

OR

Any TWO of:

Rolex Datejust 41 TT RG/SS (Sundust dial)
Rolex Datejust 41 WG/SS, blue or rhodium dial and fluted bezel for these options
Ressence Type 1 Squared, blue or rhodium dial
AP Royal Oak 15400 in SS with silver dial
Panerai 512, 42mm Radiomir with black dial and gold hands
Jaeger LeCoultre Master Ultra Thin Reserve de Marche, blue dial
IWC Portuguese Chronograph, blue dial

Looking forward to feedback! If you respond to the poll I'd also be grateful for your opinion in the thread here!

AK797 · 5 April 2018, 07:36 AM

I'd go for 1 big one, including a Lange 1 or 1815 Up/Down too. Probably the AP as you have a Rolex. Can add a used Lange Saxonia for the best value dress watch out there.

eyeheartny · 5 April 2018, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AK797

I'd go for 1 big one, including a Lange 1 or 1815 Up/Down too. Probably the AP as you have a Rolex.

Interesting. I'm attracted to the full PM of the DD40, but you make a good point about diversifying my collection. My hesitation on AP is about fragility. Part of why I love Rolex is the bulletproof-ness; I travel everywhere with my Sub, wash it in the sink, and it's just always ready to go. I know the PM bezel or full case on the DJ41 or DD40 aren't as sturdy as the steel/ceramic ones on my Sub, but they feel burlier. I have read a lot of reports of the AP showing a lot of wear, which (to me) seems to minimize some of the value of the exceptional finishing that people laud AP for. Know what I mean? It's a tough balance, because I want watches I can wear without feeling like they're going to look beat after a short period of time. That's especially true at these higher price points.

dmash · 7 April 2018, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AK797

I'd go for 1 big one, including a Lange 1 or 1815 Up/Down too. Probably the AP as you have a Rolex. Can add a used Lange Saxonia for the best value dress watch out there.

Vacheron Patrimony Small Seconds?

Don’t get me wrong, I love the Lange, but that 35mm is a total deal breaker for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

Let me know when you put up some decent options to choose from, I’d love to cast my vote…

X1000

Some pretty weak choices for $30k, IMO

eyeheartny · 7 April 2018, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmash

Some pretty weak choices for $30k, IMO

Interesting. What would you recommend, knowing that I have a pretty casual lifestyle (haven't worn a suit in years), that I'm looking for a 'lifetime' purchase, etc?

dmash · 7 April 2018, 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eyeheartny

Interesting. What would you recommend, knowing that I have a pretty casual lifestyle (haven't worn a suit in years), that I'm looking for a 'lifetime' purchase, etc?

So no dress options? Why you looking at DD and DJ then? I’m biased though as I find those pieces to be incredibly bland. Especially when you’re talking DD prices, way more interesting stuff.

I like the 15400 suggestion you picked out. White face is easily under $20k too. PJ had some awesome stuff, but I’m going to assume you’re like most and want to keep it more mainstream high end branding (absolutely nothing wrong with that and in no way an insult). If we’re talking not ‘dressy’, here’s some solid suggestions:

AP ROO (ton of colors, 42 or 44mm models)
AP ROC (a lot of people like the panda dial)
Lange 1815 Chrono (white face is in budget, black face is slight stretch, this is the clear winner if you wanted to save a little, a grail watch for some)
Patek 5164 (if you can stretch budget a touch, incredible versatility)

All my other suggestions are stuff I’d say to wear with ‘dressy’ wear so I don’t think you’d be too interested.

AK797 · 5 April 2018, 07:47 AM

Yes the AP finishing is finer and should be preserved imho, but you have the Rolex for the hard yards so you can be more selective. Bit of wrist awareness too and it should be fine, so just pick which one makes your heart race the most, heart over head at this price point.

subtona · 5 April 2018, 07:49 AM

Dd green

PJ S · 5 April 2018, 07:59 AM

Let me know when you put up some decent options to choose from, I’d love to cast my vote…

eyeheartny · 5 April 2018, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

Let me know when you put up some decent options to choose from, I’d love to cast my vote…

Haha. None of the listed pieces worked for you?

superstarmar · 6 April 2018, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

Let me know when you put up some decent options to choose from, I’d love to cast my vote…

Same boat here ..

beshannon · 6 April 2018, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

Let me know when you put up some decent options to choose from, I’d love to cast my vote…

Exactly

I do not agree with any of those

JayAK · 5 April 2018, 08:34 AM

RG DD sundust, it’s on my radar too!

PJ S · 5 April 2018, 08:54 AM

^
What gave it away?

jb335 · 5 April 2018, 08:58 AM

I think you have an itch that needs to be scratched. A PM itch. You want to go big, so forget this two watch scenario. I think you need to find the PM watch you like best under your $30K budget.

And it seems you are really focused on those two Rolex DDs, and rightfully so. I personally prefer the RG Olive dial, but the RG Sundust is beautiful as well. I would focus on those two and try each on multiple times with different types of outfits and decide which sings louder. And take pics!

Also, don’t worry about the casual clothes with a DD. I know from your other post you keep it stylish (smart casual) and a DD will pair just fine. I have rocked my friends YG DD with a t-shirt and dark denim and it’s a great look. Pull up some images of Shaun White in his DD while dressed casual but well. Looks awesome. Don’t even worry about not ever wearing suits. Non-issue.

Lastly, I am confused why the AP 15400 is in both the 1 watch and 2 watch scenarios? I get why it would be in the two watch scenario (it is about $10K less than the DDs) but why it would it be in the 1 watch scenario? BTW, I love AP Royal Oaks, and am actively trying to source a 15202 Jumbo blue dial. You may be too big for that though, so the 15400 would likely suit you better.

eyeheartny · 5 April 2018, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jb335

I think you have an itch that needs to be scratched. A PM itch. You want to go big, so forget this two watch scenario. I think you need to find the PM watch you like best under your $30K budget.

And it seems you are really focused on those two Rolex DDs, and rightfully so. I personally prefer the RG Olive dial, but the RG Sundust is beautiful as well. I would focus on those two and try each on multiple times with different types of outfits and decide which sings louder. And take pics!

Also, don’t worry about the casual clothes with a DD. I know from your other post you keep it stylish (smart casual) and a DD will pair just fine. I have rocked my friends YG DD with a t-shirt and dark denim and it’s a great look. Pull up some images of Shaun White in his DD while dressed casual but well. Looks awesome. Don’t even worry about not ever wearing suits. Non-issue.

Lastly, I am confused why the AP 15400 is in both the 1 watch and 2 watch scenarios? I get why it would be in the two watch scenario (it is about $10K less than the DDs) but why it would it be in the 1 watch scenario? BTW, I love AP Royal Oaks, and am actively trying to source a 15202 Jumbo blue dial. You may be too big for that though, so the 15400 would likely suit you better.

Great thoughts and feedback, much appreciated. You're right that there's a PM itch I'm wanting to scratch. I was looking at the RG version of the Panerai I mentioned...the 42mm Radiomir (PAM 513) just to find something in RG. So, very good call.

The 15400 in blue is noticeably more expensive than the silver dial version, so much so that I'd be exceeding what I've set aside if I got the blue dial 15400 plus something else. That's why it's in the 1-watch versus 2-watch category. On Chrono24 (which I use to get a sense of the market), new ones are going for around $24-25k, whereas the silver dial version is going for around $17-18k. I guess the blue dial are that much more rare/desirable. The trusted sellers on TRF don't seem to have much of anything in the RO anyway. There's one seller on Watchuseek with that reference for $300 less than list price but that's it. Hard to find in any color, it seems. I haven't yet reached out to any trusted sellers on here to see what they could source, and I know they have access to many more pieces than are listed, so I could still find a good option that way if I decide go that route.

jb335 · 5 April 2018, 09:19 AM

I didn't realize the 15400 blue dial was commanding that much more than the 15400 silver dial. I that is waaay over MSRP. I wouldn't pay that for a 15400.

eyeheartny · 5 April 2018, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jb335

I didn't realize the 15400 blue dial was commanding that much more than the 15400 silver dial. I that is waaay over MSRP. I wouldn't pay that for a 15400.

Yeah, it's 43% over MSRP if you assume an average of $25k and MSRP of $17,400. Craziness. I have a gut-level problem paying over MSRP for anything, you know?

I'm leaning hard toward the DD40. Now to find one with a trusted seller at the right price! DavidSW has a Sundust one for what looks like a killer deal but I need to try on the green one ASAP.

brandrea · 5 April 2018, 09:23 AM

WG DD40, olive dial

You’re welcome

eyeheartny · 5 April 2018, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay (Eire)

40 DD Green Dial.

No question you can dress it up. No question it'll still work in a more casual lifestyle. Done.

Okay okay, you're convincing me!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgwatch

I'd most likely pick one nicer watch over two others. The Royal Oak is nice, but I'd prefer the DD40. I haven't seen the RG DD40 live. But I used to have the 36mm version, which I thought was beautiful. Mine had a white Roman dial. Of the two choices you mention, I would probably choose the sundust dial. I bet the chocolate diagonal motif dial would be really nice as well. The DD40 could be worn virtually any time. By the way, you've selected a bunch of great watches as options. I can see why the choice is difficult.

It's a tough choice but a great problem to have! I'm certainly not complaining. More just trying to combine reason and emotion to make the right choice.

Leaning toward the DD40. I think it's not a piece I've ever regret owning. I am going to try to get some photos of the different color variations on my wrist to see which looks better. I may post some pics and ask for feedback!

Quote:

Originally Posted by brandrea

WG DD40, olive dial

You’re welcome

Leaning in that direction!

I love the look of the green from pics but I still haven't seen it in person, so that's a priority for as soon as I can find an AD that has one. There are only two ADs in San Diego (crazy, right?) but one is a pretty big jeweler with 2 locations, so hopefully one of them has both colors I'm interested in.

sgwatch · 5 April 2018, 09:44 AM

I'd most likely pick one nicer watch over two others. The Royal Oak is nice, but I'd prefer the DD40. I haven't seen the RG DD40 live. But I used to have the 36mm version, which I thought was beautiful. Mine had a white Roman dial. Of the two choices you mention, I would probably choose the sundust dial. I bet the chocolate diagonal motif dial would be really nice as well. The DD40 could be worn virtually any time. By the way, you've selected a bunch of great watches as options. I can see why the choice is difficult.

PJ S · 5 April 2018, 11:03 AM

LAFLARE · 5 April 2018, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

I always enjoy when you chime in with the less known watch brands. It leads me wonder..given your vast knowledge on watch brands and models, just how big is your collection?

Edit: I think you mislinked the first line. The TT GP is absolutely hideous

PJ S · 5 April 2018, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAFLARE

I always enjoy when you chime in with the less known watch brands.

I think you mislinked the first line. The TT GP is absolutely hideous

I’d say it’s a case of us having a difference in aesthetic preferences – I like RG/Ti TT, when done correctly. It’s less stark than black and RG.

Never base any decision off of computer rendered images – they pretty much all suck – so best to see one in the metal or with decent quality photos, hopefully on a well balanced display, if not a calibrated one (which is only so good due to dependencies in the whole chain that I’ll not bore you with).

eyeheartny · 6 April 2018, 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

Not sure where you are in the grand scheme of horology, but assuming you’re open to looking outside the usual stalwarts of residual value, then here’s a bunch of brands and models you may wish to contemplate and research further.

Thanks for sharing these! Some really interesting pieces in there. I'm definitely not on the haute horlogerie end of things; my interests are in "lifetime" purchases that will last, be durable, need infrequent servicing, and easy to clean (my SubC gets a soap/purified water treatment every week or so and a deeper clean with a toothbrush in the nooks/crannies every few months). I'm not taken in by exclusivity or small-batch stuff.

On the other hand, I am very impressed by precision manufacturing with high build quality and tactile enjoyment. That's part of my fascination with Rolex-- they are true masters of precision design/production. Every little part of my 114060 is tight, precise, solid, etc. The feel of the screw-in crown is incredibly reassuring, the movement of the bezel on its ceramic bearings is just awesome, etc. I love wearing a piece that feels so crisp/precise.

I'm admittedly very, very picky about how luxury objects feel. I've never been ultra-impressed with the build/fit & finish of Omega. Take the date window on the GSOTM: looks really sloppy to my eye. Their bracelets are not super impressive on the Omegas I've handled as well. I wasn't all that wowed by the JLC Reverso's case finishing either when I saw it. Pretty dials with the guilloché, but not extraordinary. The Panerai I had and sold (PAM 422) was finished beautifully and had a buttery-smooth manual wind movement that was a real joy to handle, but the piece was too big and clunky/uncomfortable for my taste.

These are of course subjective judgments, but they're not unconsidered opinions: when I spend my hard-earned money on stuff I like it to feel worth it. In my wardrobe, for example, I have no problem paying >$100 for a sweatshirt if it is really well-made, like a Reigning Champ one. Sure it's just a plain grey sweatshirt, but it fits perfectly and feels great.

All that is to say that I'm less attracted to small-brand pieces that may be rare/amazing accomplishments horologically, but need more frequent service or be less than perfectly reliable.

alpharulez · 6 April 2018, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eyeheartny

Thanks for sharing these! Some really interesting pieces in there. I'm definitely not on the haute horlogerie end of things; my interests are in "lifetime" purchases that will last, be durable, need infrequent servicing, and easy to clean (my SubC gets a soap/purified water treatment every week or so and a deeper clean with a toothbrush in the nooks/crannies every few months). I'm not taken in by exclusivity or small-batch stuff.

On the other hand, I am very impressed by precision manufacturing with high build quality and tactile enjoyment. That's part of my fascination with Rolex-- they are true masters of precision design/production. Every little part of my 114060 is tight, precise, solid, etc. The feel of the screw-in crown is incredibly reassuring, the movement of the bezel on its ceramic bearings is just awesome, etc. I love wearing a piece that feels so crisp/precise.

I'm admittedly very, very picky about how luxury objects feel. I've never been ultra-impressed with the build/fit & finish of Omega. Take the date window on the GSOTM: looks really sloppy to my eye. Their bracelets are not super impressive on the Omegas I've handled as well. I wasn't all that wowed by the JLC Reverso's case finishing either when I saw it. Pretty dials with the guilloché, but not extraordinary. The Panerai I had and sold (PAM 422) was finished beautifully and had a buttery-smooth manual wind movement that was a real joy to handle, but the piece was too big and clunky/uncomfortable for my taste.

These are of course subjective judgments, but they're not unconsidered opinions: when I spend my hard-earned money on stuff I like it to feel worth it. In my wardrobe, for example, I have no problem paying >$100 for a sweatshirt if it is really well-made, like a Reigning Champ one. Sure it's just a plain grey sweatshirt, but it fits perfectly and feels great.

All that is to say that I'm less attracted to small-brand pieces that may be rare/amazing accomplishments horologically, but need more frequent service or be less than perfectly reliable.

Have you considered the Marine series from Breguet?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

eyeheartny · 6 April 2018, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alpharulez

Have you considered the Marine series from Breguet?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have looked at them online, but none of them really speak to me style wise. I know Breguet is a great house but I haven’t been really excited by anything.

alpharulez · 6 April 2018, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PJ S

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

PJ S · 6 April 2018, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alpharulez

I may be misinterpreting this, but does that mean I got 2 points, you know, for the conversion kick?

Jay (Eire) · 5 April 2018, 11:09 AM

40 DD Green Dial.

No question you can dress it up. No question it'll still work in a more casual lifestyle. Done.

View Poll Results: These are intentionally a little provocative. Having fun. Agree w/any of these?
The RG DD40 is so great it’s worth the risk of folks thinking it could be fake or is too flashy	18	26.47%
TT Rolexes are old-man chic and could make a guy in his 30s seem aged-up	9	13.24%
A RG DD40 is hard to style with more casual clothes	5	7.35%
I hate Panerai	18	26.47%
AP is overrated and has reliability issues in addition to expensive service	18	26.47%
If the DD40 is even an option, go for it	31	45.59%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 68. You may not vote on this poll

5 April 2018, 06:36 AM	#1
eyeheartny "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2016 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 258	$30k Budget: Which of these grail-level pieces, or pair of other options? I’ve got $30k I can use on watch(es) currently. I've got a SubC No Date and a few inexpensive but sentimental pieces (blue Deep Blue diver, Orient Polaris GMT) that I don’t want to double-up on in terms of look/feel. I don't have a pure dress watch but I also never really wear suits, so I'm looking for at least one piece that's dressier but maybe not a classic dress piece. Hardly ever wear suits, so the watches should work with a casual lifestyle that includes some dressy-casual occasions where I’ll wear a sportcoat. Also, I recently posted this thread in the Rolex-specific subforum. It has some useful information about my build, style, etc that may be relevant for this discussion. For those that don’t click over, here are the highlights. Late 30s, athletic (6’2”, 215lb), shaved head, beard, 7.75-8” wrists. I'm debating between a few ways to go and am curious what you guys would recommend. Only One of: Rolex Day-Date 40 in Rose Gold with Sundust or Green dial AP Royal Oak 15400 in SS with blue dial OR Any TWO of: Rolex Datejust 41 TT RG/SS (Sundust dial) Rolex Datejust 41 WG/SS, blue or rhodium dial and fluted bezel for these options Ressence Type 1 Squared, blue or rhodium dial AP Royal Oak 15400 in SS with silver dial Panerai 512, 42mm Radiomir with black dial and gold hands Jaeger LeCoultre Master Ultra Thin Reserve de Marche, blue dial IWC Portuguese Chronograph, blue dial Looking forward to feedback! If you respond to the poll I'd also be grateful for your opinion in the thread here! Last edited by eyeheartny; 5 April 2018 at 07:54 AM.. Reason: Fixed broken links

5 April 2018, 07:49 AM	#8
subtona "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Real Name: gus Location: East Coast Watch: APK & sometimes Y Posts: 26,040	Dd green __________________

5 April 2018, 07:36 AM	#2
AK797 Banned Join Date: Feb 2010 Real Name: Neil Location: UK Watch: ing ships roll in Posts: 59,278	I'd go for 1 big one, including a Lange 1 or 1815 Up/Down too. Probably the AP as you have a Rolex. Can add a used Lange Saxonia for the best value dress watch out there.

5 April 2018, 07:47 AM	#7
AK797 Banned Join Date: Feb 2010 Real Name: Neil Location: UK Watch: ing ships roll in Posts: 59,278	Yes the AP finishing is finer and should be preserved imho, but you have the Rolex for the hard yards so you can be more selective. Bit of wrist awareness too and it should be fine, so just pick which one makes your heart race the most, heart over head at this price point.

5 April 2018, 07:59 AM	#9
PJ S Banned Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: UK Posts: 3,990	Let me know when you put up some decent options to choose from, I’d love to cast my vote…

5 April 2018, 08:34 AM	#13
JayAK "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: USA Watch: 116618LN Posts: 609	RG DD sundust, it’s on my radar too!

5 April 2018, 08:54 AM	#14
PJ S Banned Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: UK Posts: 3,990	^ What gave it away?

5 April 2018, 08:58 AM	#15
jb335 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: The States Watch: Cosmograph Daytona Posts: 6,974	I think you have an itch that needs to be scratched. A PM itch. You want to go big, so forget this two watch scenario. I think you need to find the PM watch you like best under your $30K budget. And it seems you are really focused on those two Rolex DDs, and rightfully so. I personally prefer the RG Olive dial, but the RG Sundust is beautiful as well. I would focus on those two and try each on multiple times with different types of outfits and decide which sings louder. And take pics! Also, don’t worry about the casual clothes with a DD. I know from your other post you keep it stylish (smart casual) and a DD will pair just fine. I have rocked my friends YG DD with a t-shirt and dark denim and it’s a great look. Pull up some images of Shaun White in his DD while dressed casual but well. Looks awesome. Don’t even worry about not ever wearing suits. Non-issue. Lastly, I am confused why the AP 15400 is in both the 1 watch and 2 watch scenarios? I get why it would be in the two watch scenario (it is about $10K less than the DDs) but why it would it be in the 1 watch scenario? BTW, I love AP Royal Oaks, and am actively trying to source a 15202 Jumbo blue dial. You may be too big for that though, so the 15400 would likely suit you better.

5 April 2018, 09:19 AM	#17
jb335 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: The States Watch: Cosmograph Daytona Posts: 6,974	I didn't realize the 15400 blue dial was commanding that much more than the 15400 silver dial. I that is waaay over MSRP. I wouldn't pay that for a 15400.

5 April 2018, 09:23 AM	#19
brandrea 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Real Name: Brian (TBone) Location: canada Watch: es make me smile Posts: 74,217	WG DD40, olive dial You’re welcome

5 April 2018, 09:44 AM	#21
sgwatch "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Seattle Posts: 432	I'd most likely pick one nicer watch over two others. The Royal Oak is nice, but I'd prefer the DD40. I haven't seen the RG DD40 live. But I used to have the 36mm version, which I thought was beautiful. Mine had a white Roman dial. Of the two choices you mention, I would probably choose the sundust dial. I bet the chocolate diagonal motif dial would be really nice as well. The DD40 could be worn virtually any time. By the way, you've selected a bunch of great watches as options. I can see why the choice is difficult.

5 April 2018, 11:03 AM	#22
PJ S Banned Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: UK Posts: 3,990	Not sure where you are in the grand scheme of horology, but assuming you’re open to looking outside the usual stalwarts of residual value, then here’s a bunch of brands and models you may wish to contemplate and research further. Since C24 is handy for ballpark prices, and the odd (half-)decent photo or three… https://www.chrono24.co.uk/girardper...-id6393501.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/girardper...-id7608366.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/lleroy/ma...-id3775864.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/schwarzet...-id6328349.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/laurentfe...-id7927525.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/debethune...-id7640974.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/debethune...-id6880028.htm – just because it’s closer to you https://www.chrono24.co.uk/piaget/po...-id7178391.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/blancpain...-id6850632.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/chopard/l...-id6764275.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/chopard/l...-id6589617.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/chopard/l...-id7879496.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/arnoldson...-id7922005.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/louismoin...-id2424587.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/louismoin...-id7868251.htm https://www.chrono24.co.uk/louismoin...-id6810108.htm – only for the video of the feature

5 April 2018, 11:09 AM	#30
Jay (Eire) 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Real Name: @jb.watching Location: NYC Posts: 1,477	40 DD Green Dial. No question you can dress it up. No question it'll still work in a more casual lifestyle. Done.

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