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kyle L · 4 April 2010, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsWatch72

And why would those lugs have any wear at all???? OHHH yeah, someone tried to take off the bracelet and caused that damage.......rightttt. And why doesn't it have the original minty mint 9315 bracelet with absolutely no wear on it because it is a "NOS" DRSD???? And why does it have a mello yellow dial on it (patina) if it never saw the light of day since it's a NOS DRSD???? All good questions. And kyle....some feel that it is a genuine DRSD on the VRF and some don't judging from the fact that I received emails from those who feel differently than those posted in the forum. Maybe they are afraid to post any questions and get inappropriate and/or arrogant responses from those who claim (constantly reminding us) of their expertise. If I have to.......I will mail/email Geneva the pictures of the watch and try and get an official ruling on this issue. I have already talked with New York about the case edge and they comfirmed that the edge is original on my DRSD.

While I can only answer one or two of those questions, may I suggest that you post it on VRF and the knowledgeable folks would be more than happy to answer your questions. Jedly could probably answer your questions, but right now he is offline.

kyle L · 4 April 2010, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaveDiver

Save some for me!

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kyle L

While I can only answer one or two of those questions, may I suggest that you post it on VRF and the knowledgeable folks would be more than happy to answer your questions. Jedly could probably answer your questions, but right now he is offline.

I have posted my views on that forum, and this one. I have read them all and find them all equally interesting. I have even received a few emails in response to my questions. Regardless of my views, questions, or what my concerns are regarding the watch, I always post them in a respectful and "point blank" way. How a person responds to a question tells me volume's of information about that person in regard to character. I'm sure that ole Jed will reply in his usual manner.....

CaveDiver · 4 April 2010, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsWatch72

It color is due to the phosphor degradation, not the tritium degradation .

http://www.timezone.com/library/arch...04126660375902

Dads, please step back a take a breath of fresh air.

Not sure why you are getting so emotional. As far as I can tell folks are being nice to you. This shows their education, patience and their gentleman character.

BTW, your emotions are getting to best of you and your link does not support your claims.

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaveDiver

Dads, please step back a take a breath of fresh air.

Not sure why you are getting so emotional. As far as I can tell folks are being nice to you. This shows their education, patience and their gentleman character.

BTW, your emotions are getting to best of you and your link does not support your claims.

I'm not emotional in the least CaveDiver,, I'm only trying to help you understand a few things about chemical reactions (without much success I'm afraid). Tritium releases beta particles which excite Phosphor in the Tritium/Phosphorus compound. When Tritium decays it produces Helium 3 which would not cause a color/pigment. Just because you don't understand what your reading doesn't mean it's invalid.

mike · 4 April 2010, 05:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsWatch72

Hey Jed......I called Rolex USA and asked them about the "bevel". They stated "The bevel on my watch is original to the 1665 when it was produced." I also received a few emails from VRF memebers that feel the same as I do and have doubts about that DRSD you posted and feel there is something not right about the case. I also think that the patina on the dial is very strange since it never saw the light of day being a "NOS DRSD". Even if the watch is authentic, your responses to questions don't sound like they come from a respected expert of watches but from someone that is desperately trying to convince someone that you are "such an expert" that your evaluations or claims shouldn't even be questioned or reviewed. That is just absurd. Another absurd claim is that Rolex USA doesn't have the knowledge or the ability to put a correct edge on a 1665 MK III. Maybe some look at you as if your the final say in Rolex history and knowledge but I don't take anyone persons word as "gospel" so easily. All of those DRSD's out there and they ALL have an incorrect/worn/polished off edge????? And you have the only example of a correct DRSD case/edge???? I don't think so buddy.

While everyone has a right to thier opinion and a healthy exchange is always enriching to us all, it's now time for you consider your words carefully.

I will not tolerate attacks on anyone on this fourm.

Nor will I issue another warning.

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 05:36 AM

[QUOTE=jedly1;1751859]sooooooo.. based on your vast knowledge base, years of experience and having handled thousands of watches the implication of your statement, and your moving it to VRF and posting the pictures there is :

1. that neither i, or eric ku, one of the worlds most prominent dealers dont know what we are talking about

or

2. the watch case has been polished and the caseback letters painted a black colour - which in your opinion they never were, because 'only new ones have black on'....and through the out of focus shot you can see the wear marks on the case lugs that i've failed to hide in my attempt to prove you wrong and besmirch your perfect example watch ...................................... lord give me strength.

and fyi...that isnt the first one you've seen , in the very original thread where we started talking about this i gave you a link to the James dowling example found in 2006 in a safe.. the reason drsd doesnt have NOS examples shown for each different mark is because they are rare as Hens teeth, what is shown is very good very nice examples.. and as the author od drsd is now a member here perheaps you could ask him what NOS looks like as it appears he's the only person you may listen to.

Just looking for a friendly debate and not looking to attack anyone Mike......

It just seemed as if he was saying (judging from his previous post above) that I shouldn't even question anything that he said or about his watches and I guess I took the way he said it a bit offensively. I will try and continue to phrase my opinions respectfully in the future.

CaveDiver · 4 April 2010, 05:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsWatch72

I'm not emotional in the least CaveDiver,, I'm only trying to help you understand a few things about chemical reactions (without much success I'm afraid). Tritium releases beta particles which excite Phosphor in the Tritium/Phosphorus compound. When Tritium decays it produces Helium 3 which would not cause a color/pigment. Just because you don't understand what your reading doesn't mean it's invalid.

I understood what I read on that site.

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaveDiver

I understood what I read on that site.

From what you have read, what specifically is causing the color change in the dial?

greekbum · 4 April 2010, 06:17 AM

DW72 There are some of us on these forums (me) who welcome expert advice and opinions from experts on vintage watches. I have been collecting for years and always can learn something from other knowledgeable collectors or like to share in a debate or discussion about a watch.You might not like what they say or have a difference of opinion but there usually is a point when respect shows up. What I have seen in every forum from one time or another is the unselfish people that have experience and information that for the sake of the hobby or because of a passion to vintage reach out to share this with others. Please share with us your collection and knowledge on vintage Rolex watches as this is the vintage Rolex section of TRF and lets all be wiser tomorrow.

CaveDiver · 4 April 2010, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsWatch72

From what you have read, what specifically is causing the color change in the dial?

In short, the answer in the link you provided describes how tritium excites phosphor to produce visible luminance not what causes color change over time in the material it is applied.

I really don’t want to go into to much “techie” stuff.

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greekbum

DW72 There are some of us on these forums (me) who welcome expert advice and opinions from experts on vintage watches. I have been collecting for years and always can learn something from other knowledgeable collectors or like to share in a debate or discussion about a watch.You might not like what they say or have a difference of opinion but there usually is a point when respect shows up. What I have seen in every forum from one time or another is the unselfish people that have experience and information that for the sake of the hobby or because of a passion to vintage reach out to share this with others. Please share with us your collection and knowledge on vintage Rolex watches as this is the vintage Rolex section of TRF and lets all be wiser tomorrow.

Thats why I went out and had some pictures taken of my watch....so I could share it with you guys. Thats why I ask questions and I share any new developments that come my way with TRF.

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 06:34 AM

Quote CaveDiver. In short, the answer in the link you provided describes how tritium excites phosphor to produce visible luminance not what causes color change over time in the material it is applied.

I really don’t want to go into to much “techie” stuff.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fusionstorm

Your lack of knowledge becomes more and more apparent with every word you type in this thread. Do you know how patina develops in tritium? And you definitively know that patina NEVER develops without the addition of sunlight?

It is common knowledge that as tritium degrades, it reacts differently due to a variety of factors - - humidity, moisture, light and darkness. There is extensive anecdotal evidence from collectors worldwide of patina developing on watches that had been stashed away in safes for years without seeing the light of day.

Yes, this is what causes the glow. I was initally responding to fusionstorms remarks about how tritium degrades and what causes the color of the patina effect. Tritium degrades into Helium 3 but the phosphor also degrades which is caused by many things including Oxygen reaction. I have heard people say that watches in safes patina after years in storage. Light may or may not play a role since UV light does excite the Phosphor directly but this would inversely effect the patina not increase it if the watch was in a safe. It may be a watch seal issue allowing Oxygen to enter into the case and increase the Oxygen/Phosphor reaction. Or it could be that a particular dial was actually not in a watch for an extended period of time allowing it to be exposed to Oxygen.

Some people collect dials and keep them stored in dial boxes which aren't air tight. There are also many different kinds of Phosphous. Look at the different colors involved in the different types of phosphorus. Without furthur study I couldn't say that this is where the pigment comes from (in a genuine patina) but it is interesting to speculate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phosphorus

oinkitt · 4 April 2010, 06:49 AM

Dadswatch - you have made a fool of yourself through out the whole Rolex community. It now appears you are not happy with this and you are still trying to "kick yourself in the groin".

Please give it a rest!!!!!!!

DadsWatch72 · 4 April 2010, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oinkitt

Dadswatch - you have made a fool of yourself through out the whole Rolex community. It now appears you are not happy with this and you are still trying to "kick yourself in the groin".

Please give it a rest!!!!!!!

Thanks for your input.

jedly1 · 4 April 2010, 07:36 AM

whilst i wait for the kids to get up and the choclate fest begins !!

dd72, i have no problem with someone questioning anything i say, as long as they base it on experience or knowledge rather than the wild stabs in the dark and a single example they have in their hand, and whatever they can find on the net... and they afford me the courtesy of not making veiled suggestions of deceit or dishonesty.... and to be clear AGAIN.. no one has attacked your watch, said anything particluarly negative about it, or claimed it is anything other then a nice example with nice family pedigree.

The 1665 i have is one of the finest examples i and many others have ever seen, i clearly believe so as i bought it, and to be honest only really for the purpose of this discussion, your attempts at suggesting it is anything other, based on a knoweldge base you don't have are quite perplexing to say the least. Your statements are clearly worded to suggest that you consider the watch incorrect.. based on nothing you have presented other than the fact it's not like yours :(

All good questions. And kyle....some feel that it is a genuine DRSD on the VRF and some don't judging from the fact that I received emails from those who feel differently than those posted in the forum

I am well aware of mysterious emails that have been circulated, written and presented as being from someone in Europe , though actually eminating from USA, someone acting all pally but that in fact no one has heard of, supposedly from experts, though using terminology that simply isnt used, making claims involving others who know nothing about them.....and as you saw when you took it to VRF most that really know the subject gave you an opinion on the forum...... but anyway.

to be blunt, having seen numerous dealers sell off watches described as unpolsihed cases when they clearly have been, id be more suprised if there weren't people arguing the bevel wasn't always there.

SO just to recap, because you do have some questions, which again if they were asked innocently would be fair :

And you have the only example of a correct DRSD case/edge????I don't think so buddy

I dont think so either...I don't know which part of the thread you are struggling to follow, maybe it is my writing style, but to be clear i have posted THREE examples not just my one.

i have posted mine. ( interestingly i point out again that head on, like most of the shots you will have seen on the net, it appears to have little or no bevel)

i have posted james dowlings discovered in 2006

I have posted the Omani one discovered in 2007 from memory.

all three showing the same bevel and patina, all three some of the most desireable pieces in the world the omani piece whilst the one with the most wear being one of THE most desireable pieces in existance, and i certainly wouldnt claim mine to be anything less than the least desireable of the three.

And why does it have a mello yellow dial on it (patina) if it never saw the light of day since it's a NOS DRSD????

I can't tell you the exact chemical process that is going on with the tritium powered luminous mixture, what i can tell you is that it is established beyond doubt from numerous examples that watches exposed to and worn in the light stay whiter brighter and lighter, watches stored in the dark ( be it a safe, or a sock drawer) as per the three examples above have luminous markers that darken. It is even possible to take a watch with a patina and place it in the sun ( or other uv source) and over the course of several months watch it lighten up.

And why would those lugs have any wear at all???? OHHH yeah, someone tried to take off the bracelet and caused that damage.......rightttt

i have happily placed a photo up angled to show there is no lug wear only light surface scratches. your tone is basically an accusation of deceit based on nothing more than a previously blurred photo and to be honest isn't very nice, it just makes you come across as bitter.

And why doesn't it have the original minty mint 9315 bracelet with absolutely no wear on it because it is a "NOS" DRSD????

ermm, you are confused again, , who says mine doesnt have the 9315 folded link bracelet from the pictures it clearly does, a crisp sharp edged pateted ( incorrect spelling inside clasp) folded link ?? , the dowling watch on 4 million serial has a solid link as it should, you seem to be confused agian.

I will mail/email Geneva the pictures of the watch and try and get an official ruling on this issue. I have already talked with New York about the case edge and they comfirmed that the edge is original on my DRSD.

unfortunately that just shows how little experience you actualy have with Rolex, its a great idea in theory, except they dont do that, firstly you think they are going to turn around and say they cant/dont polish in the same way as Geneva - rolex might be odd, but do you know any company that would do that ?? - ( i'll speak to Bexley in the week and get you the technical name of the lapping machine that only they and Geneva use - maybe you could ask them if they have one) - secondly they don't even comment on watches YOU own without knowing someone or getting lucky - you think you will contact Geneva with a pciture of a random watch you dont own and they will tell you all about it, christ they dont even do that most of the time when its your own watch and it's been serviced by them???

STEELINOX · 4 April 2010, 07:49 AM

Gentlemen, lets be clear about what we are talkin about here.
Its called a "chamfer" not a "bevel edge."

Oh never mind, call it a "bevel" !

Thanks,
Randy

SLS · 4 April 2010, 07:59 AM

I just came across this thread, jedly that is a beautiful watch, conrats! As far as the "beveled" or "chamfered" edge, the DRSD is not the only watch to have this, the 1655 also has this. I do believe it was even discussed on this forum a few months back. But back to the matter at hand....So to say that one watch from a similar era does not have the beveled edge, when others certainly do is being a bit close minded. I will say that the information that is put forth in this thread is great.
just my 2 cents
Scott

Tools · 4 April 2010, 08:04 AM

Quite a debate....

I expect that just like all the other models Rolex has produced, there are slight differences with them at the end of the assembly line. Based very much on who/what process the watch went through.. Rolex has been changing their robotic systems in mid runs, and before robotics, they likely had several watchmakers who finished in their own particular "signature" fashion..

As for Tritium........ It is radioactive, as everybody has stated..... It emits Beta radiation.......... Beta will burn you after too much exposure... That same Beta is bombarding the phosphor mix, and the radioactive interaction produces heat, something that the paint mix will respond to differently, depending on other conditions... Sunlight is UV radiation, which would have a more bleaching effect...

Tritium, which is found naturally in water and it has an affinity to readily combine with water, therefore any moisture will be "picked up" by the tritium in the paint, further degrading the mixture. After the tritium degrades to he3, it has become an inert gas and will not affect anything...

Half life does not mean "half the tritium has decayed" as the article said..... What it means is that at it's half-life, it is half as "active" as it was initially and only emits about half as many beta particles.. but it continues to emit them. Over the next 12.3 years, it becomes halved again, and so on until it all has completely degraded.

So, my theory:

A watch kept in a safe for 30 years will exhibit a patina as the constant bombardment of radioactive Beta will actually burn some of the pigments in the paint mix, and those will exhibit that coloring throughout>>

Sweramic · 4 April 2010, 08:07 AM

Fantastic!!!

Mrdi · 4 April 2010, 08:14 AM

Spelling?

I'm drooling.

greekbum · 4 April 2010, 08:21 AM

Since this all started with the bevel discussion I would like to show this.A friend of mines watch.This watch had never been serviced and was sent to RSC NY for a service last year.The picture shows a 1st time polish and how it takes away the original bevel.RSC NY does not have the proper tooling to put it back on.The next picture is a submariner I am restoring. Notice the original bevel edge.My experience has been that those who don't have a correct finish on there watch are the ones that dispute this or say things like some did and some didnt etc.In the late 70's this type of finish went away.I do not not know what serial number range this started and perhaps this would be of interest to all of us.

STEELINOX · 4 April 2010, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greekbum

Since this all started with the bevel discussion I would like to show this.A friend of mines watch.This watch had never been serviced and was sent to RSC NY for a service last year.The picture shows a 1st time polish and how it takes away the original bevel.RSC NY does not have the proper tooling to put it back on.The next picture is a submariner I am restoring. Notice the original bevel edge.My experience has been that those who don't have a correct finish on there watch are the ones that dispute this or say things like some did and some didnt etc.

Hey Nikos, nice chamfer. I believe these edges are not cut by a machine but done by hand, one of the last finish processes for the mid casing. Hence why we really dont see it anymore, even on the new BLING pieces...

greekbum · 4 April 2010, 08:29 AM

I have yet to see anybody that can put this on right outside of UK or Geneva.

jedly1 · 4 April 2010, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEELINOX

Hey Nikos, nice chamfer. I believe these edges are not cut by a machine but done by hand, one of the last finish processes for the mid casing. Hence why we really dont see it anymore, even on the new BLING pieces...

actually it is machine, i spent last week trying to persuade either Rolex Australia or the Rolex trained independent nearby to buy the machine, but apparently its about £25k worth and neither can justify it when most people are perefctly happy with a standard finish, and its only a few mad watch geeks who notice the difference.

there are a few watchmakers who have a damned good go by hand, but if you put it under a loupe or macro photo you can always see some wobble and unevenness.

STEELINOX · 4 April 2010, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greekbum

I have yet to see anybody that can put this on right outside of UK or Geneva.

Me neither, its an "art" and its prolly cut in a single file stroke !

STEELINOX · 4 April 2010, 08:34 AM

The cut is prolly started at either the "3" or "9" and filed toward the end of the lug...

jedly1 · 4 April 2010, 10:27 AM

that watches at this level are often not presented on public access forums, and as a result posting them relies on obtaining permission from the owners. heres another one that i now have permission to use the scans.

this one is a good example of how internet photo's can mislead... look at the shot head on, nice watch unpolished fat lugs, small bevel only like dd72 watch....perfectly reasonable that someone may assume it has only a tiny bevel (chamfer :) ) - exactly as it appears in the head on shot in the drsd booklet

then take a minute and look at the photo of the watch that remained private, turn it on an angle to display........

whadda ya know.. nice big bevel.

thanks Ed for use of the scans.

STEELINOX · 4 April 2010, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jedly1

that watches at this level are often not presented on public access forums, and as a result posting them relies on obtaining permission from the owners. heres another one that i now have permission to use the scans.

this one is a good example of how internet photo's can mislead... look at the shot head on, nice watch unpolished fat lugs, small bevel only like dd72 watch....perfectly reasonable that someone may assume it has only a tiny bevel (chamfer :) ) - exactly as it appears in the head on shot in the drsd booklet

then take a minute and look at the photo of the watch that remained private, turn it on an angle to display........

whadda ya know.. nice big bevel.

thanks Ed for use of the scans.

Cool, it appears as the chamfer originates at the "3" or "9" and is its smallest, then "outwards" to the tips of the lugs it gets more pronounced. It would be interesting to see the machine that does this...

maverick · 4 April 2010, 11:41 AM

I would trust Jed's opinion any time. He is an expert on these watches. Also Mike is too.

He posted one of the nicest DRSD I have seen and both ones he showed are gorgeous.

From experience it is known that tritium will tend to turn a dark patina when in a safe. When out in the sun they seem to stay whiter.

FYI, I have never seen anyone continue to question the amount of metal taken off on a lug (chamfer) in my life and I have been going to Rolex forums for many years now.

DW72, you seem to be obsessed with this. No offense intended but after 7 pages on this site and many more on other forums it should be apparent that the answer was given long ago. Just accept what has been said by experts who have handled hundreds of watches for years and years.

Just enjoy your beautiful watch.

=) maverick

Any more on this is just........

4 April 2010, 06:17 AM	#70
greekbum "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Real Name: Nikos Location: Florida Watch: Rolex GMT 16750 Posts: 8,415	DW72 There are some of us on these forums (me) who welcome expert advice and opinions from experts on vintage watches. I have been collecting for years and always can learn something from other knowledgeable collectors or like to share in a debate or discussion about a watch.You might not like what they say or have a difference of opinion but there usually is a point when respect shows up. What I have seen in every forum from one time or another is the unselfish people that have experience and information that for the sake of the hobby or because of a passion to vintage reach out to share this with others. Please share with us your collection and knowledge on vintage Rolex watches as this is the vintage Rolex section of TRF and lets all be wiser tomorrow. __________________ Follow Me On Instagram @nickgogas Original Owner ROLEX 16750 GMT Daily Wearer For Over 13,000 Days And Counting

4 April 2010, 07:36 AM	#76
jedly1 "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: mel(oz)/Yorks(uk) Posts: 1,917	morning all, clocks have gone back here so you get me early. whilst i wait for the kids to get up and the choclate fest begins !! dd72, i have no problem with someone questioning anything i say, as long as they base it on experience or knowledge rather than the wild stabs in the dark and a single example they have in their hand, and whatever they can find on the net... and they afford me the courtesy of not making veiled suggestions of deceit or dishonesty.... and to be clear AGAIN.. no one has attacked your watch, said anything particluarly negative about it, or claimed it is anything other then a nice example with nice family pedigree. The 1665 i have is one of the finest examples i and many others have ever seen, i clearly believe so as i bought it, and to be honest only really for the purpose of this discussion, your attempts at suggesting it is anything other, based on a knoweldge base you don't have are quite perplexing to say the least. Your statements are clearly worded to suggest that you consider the watch incorrect.. based on nothing you have presented other than the fact it's not like yours :( All good questions. And kyle....some feel that it is a genuine DRSD on the VRF and some don't judging from the fact that I received emails from those who feel differently than those posted in the forum I am well aware of mysterious emails that have been circulated, written and presented as being from someone in Europe , though actually eminating from USA, someone acting all pally but that in fact no one has heard of, supposedly from experts, though using terminology that simply isnt used, making claims involving others who know nothing about them.....and as you saw when you took it to VRF most that really know the subject gave you an opinion on the forum...... but anyway. to be blunt, having seen numerous dealers sell off watches described as unpolsihed cases when they clearly have been, id be more suprised if there weren't people arguing the bevel wasn't always there. SO just to recap, because you do have some questions, which again if they were asked innocently would be fair : *And you have the only example of a correct DRSD case/edge????I don't think so buddy* I dont think so either...I don't know which part of the thread you are struggling to follow, maybe it is my writing style, but to be clear i have posted THREE examples not just my one. i have posted mine. ( interestingly i point out again that head on, like most of the shots you will have seen on the net, it appears to have little or no bevel) i have posted james dowlings discovered in 2006 I have posted the Omani one discovered in 2007 from memory. all three showing the same bevel and patina, all three some of the most desireable pieces in the world the omani piece whilst the one with the most wear being one of THE most desireable pieces in existance, and i certainly wouldnt claim mine to be anything less than the least desireable of the three. *And why does it have a mello yellow dial on it (patina) if it never saw the light of day since it's a NOS DRSD????* I can't tell you the exact chemical process that is going on with the tritium powered luminous mixture, what i can tell you is that it is established beyond doubt from numerous examples that watches exposed to and worn in the light stay whiter brighter and lighter, watches stored in the dark ( be it a safe, or a sock drawer) as per the three examples above have luminous markers that darken. It is even possible to take a watch with a patina and place it in the sun ( or other uv source) and over the course of several months watch it lighten up. *And why would those lugs have any wear at all???? OHHH yeah, someone tried to take off the bracelet and caused that damage.......rightttt* i have happily placed a photo up angled to show there is no lug wear only light surface scratches. your tone is basically an accusation of deceit based on nothing more than a previously blurred photo and to be honest isn't very nice, it just makes you come across as bitter. *And why doesn't it have the original minty mint 9315 bracelet with absolutely no wear on it because it is a "NOS" DRSD????* ermm, you are confused again, , who says mine doesnt have the 9315 folded link bracelet from the pictures it clearly does, a crisp sharp edged pateted ( incorrect spelling inside clasp) folded link ?? , the dowling watch on 4 million serial has a solid link as it should, you seem to be confused agian. I will mail/email Geneva the pictures of the watch and try and get an official ruling on this issue. I have already talked with New York about the case edge and they comfirmed that the edge is original on my DRSD. unfortunately that just shows how little experience you actualy have with Rolex, its a great idea in theory, except they dont do that, firstly you think they are going to turn around and say they cant/dont polish in the same way as Geneva - rolex might be odd, but do you know any company that would do that ?? - ( i'll speak to Bexley in the week and get you the technical name of the lapping machine that only they and Geneva use - maybe you could ask them if they have one) - secondly they don't even comment on watches YOU own without knowing someone or getting lucky - you think you will contact Geneva with a pciture of a random watch you dont own and they will tell you all about it, christ they dont even do that most of the time when its your own watch and it's been serviced by them???

4 April 2010, 07:49 AM	#77
STEELINOX 2024 ROLEX DATE-JUST41 Pledge Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Sink-O! Location: a praire in AZ Watch: ROLEX-less atm... Posts: 14,007	Gentlemen, lets be clear about what we are talkin about here. Its called a "chamfer" not a "bevel edge." Oh never mind, call it a "bevel" ! Thanks, Randy __________________ *Positive Waves Baby* Lug Hole Loyalist / Chamfer Line Inspector INFORTHE WIN 274

4 April 2010, 07:59 AM	#78
SLS "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Real Name: Scott Location: GMT -7 Watch: GMT's & Sub's Posts: 10,399	I just came across this thread, jedly that is a beautiful watch, conrats! As far as the "beveled" or "chamfered" edge, the DRSD is not the only watch to have this, the 1655 also has this. I do believe it was even discussed on this forum a few months back. But back to the matter at hand....So to say that one watch from a similar era does not have the beveled edge, when others certainly do is being a bit close minded. I will say that the information that is put forth in this thread is great. just my 2 cents Scott __________________ "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of lower price is forgotten." -Benjamin Franklin Member No. 922

4 April 2010, 08:04 AM	#79
Tools TRF Moderator & 2024 DATE-JUST41 Patron Join Date: May 2007 Real Name: Larry Location: Mojave Desert Watch: GMT's Posts: 43,146	Quite a debate.... I expect that just like all the other models Rolex has produced, there are slight differences with them at the end of the assembly line. Based very much on who/what process the watch went through.. Rolex has been changing their robotic systems in mid runs, and before robotics, they likely had several watchmakers who finished in their own particular "signature" fashion.. As for Tritium........ It is radioactive, as everybody has stated..... It emits Beta radiation.......... Beta will burn you after too much exposure... That same Beta is bombarding the phosphor mix, and the radioactive interaction produces heat, something that the paint mix will respond to differently, depending on other conditions... Sunlight is UV radiation, which would have a more bleaching effect... Tritium, which is found naturally in water and it has an affinity to readily combine with water, therefore any moisture will be "picked up" by the tritium in the paint, further degrading the mixture. After the tritium degrades to he3, it has become an inert gas and will not affect anything... Half life does not mean "half the tritium has decayed" as the article said..... What it means is that at it's half-life, it is half as "active" as it was initially and only emits about half as many beta particles.. but it continues to emit them. Over the next 12.3 years, it becomes halved again, and so on until it all has completely degraded. So, my theory: A watch kept in a safe for 30 years will exhibit a patina as the constant bombardment of radioactive Beta will actually burn some of the pigments in the paint mix, and those will exhibit that coloring throughout>> __________________ (Chill ... It's just a watch Forum.....) NAWCC Member

4 April 2010, 05:36 AM	#67
DadsWatch72 Banned Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: USA Watch: DRSD 1665 #3551XXX Posts: 2,401	[QUOTE=jedly1;1751859]sooooooo.. based on your vast knowledge base, years of experience and having handled thousands of watches the implication of your statement, and your moving it to VRF and posting the pictures there is : 1. that neither i, or eric ku, one of the worlds most prominent dealers dont know what we are talking about or 2. the watch case has been polished and the caseback letters painted a black colour - which in your opinion they never were, because 'only new ones have black on'....and through the out of focus shot you can see the wear marks on the case lugs that i've failed to hide in my attempt to prove you wrong and besmirch your perfect example watch ...................................... lord give me strength. and fyi...that isnt the first one you've seen , in the very original thread where we started talking about this i gave you a link to the James dowling example found in 2006 in a safe.. the reason drsd doesnt have NOS examples shown for each different mark is because they are rare as Hens teeth, what is shown is very good very nice examples.. and as the author od drsd is now a member here perheaps you could ask him what NOS looks like as it appears he's the only person you may listen to. Just looking for a friendly debate and not looking to attack anyone Mike...... It just seemed as if he was saying (judging from his previous post above) that I shouldn't even question anything that he said or about his watches and I guess I took the way he said it a bit offensively. I will try and continue to phrase my opinions respectfully in the future.

4 April 2010, 06:49 AM	#74
oinkitt "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Earth Posts: 259	Dadswatch - you have made a fool of yourself through out the whole Rolex community. It now appears you are not happy with this and you are still trying to "kick yourself in the groin". Please give it a rest!!!!!!!

4 April 2010, 08:07 AM	#80
Sweramic "TRF" Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Europe Watch: Movies Posts: 4,531	Fantastic!!! __________________ There are three kinds of people in the world: those who can count, and those who can't. -Warren Buffet

4 April 2010, 08:14 AM	#81
Mrdi Banned Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: PA Posts: 3,478	Spelling? I'm drooling.

4 April 2010, 08:29 AM	#84
greekbum "TRF" Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Real Name: Nikos Location: Florida Watch: Rolex GMT 16750 Posts: 8,415	I have yet to see anybody that can put this on right outside of UK or Geneva. __________________ Follow Me On Instagram @nickgogas Original Owner ROLEX 16750 GMT Daily Wearer For Over 13,000 Days And Counting

4 April 2010, 08:34 AM	#87
STEELINOX 2024 ROLEX DATE-JUST41 Pledge Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Real Name: Sink-O! Location: a praire in AZ Watch: ROLEX-less atm... Posts: 14,007	The cut is prolly started at either the "3" or "9" and filed toward the end of the lug... __________________ *Positive Waves Baby* Lug Hole Loyalist / Chamfer Line Inspector INFORTHE WIN 274

4 April 2010, 10:27 AM	#88
jedly1 "TRF" Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: mel(oz)/Yorks(uk) Posts: 1,917	should point out that watches at this level are often not presented on public access forums, and as a result posting them relies on obtaining permission from the owners. heres another one that i now have permission to use the scans. this one is a good example of how internet photo's can mislead... look at the shot head on, nice watch unpolished fat lugs, small bevel only like dd72 watch....perfectly reasonable that someone may assume it has only a tiny bevel (chamfer :) ) - exactly as it appears in the head on shot in the drsd booklet then take a minute and look at the photo of the watch that remained private, turn it on an angle to display........ whadda ya know.. nice big bevel. thanks Ed for use of the scans.

4 April 2010, 11:41 AM	#90
maverick Banned Join Date: May 2005 Real Name: maverick Location: Prescott Watch: Rolex Posts: 1,180	I would trust Jed's opinion any time. He is an expert on these watches. Also Mike is too. He posted one of the nicest DRSD I have seen and both ones he showed are gorgeous. From experience it is known that tritium will tend to turn a dark patina when in a safe. When out in the sun they seem to stay whiter. FYI, I have never seen anyone continue to question the amount of metal taken off on a lug (chamfer) in my life and I have been going to Rolex forums for many years now. DW72, you seem to be obsessed with this. No offense intended but after 7 pages on this site and many more on other forums it should be apparent that the answer was given long ago. Just accept what has been said by experts who have handled hundreds of watches for years and years. Just enjoy your beautiful watch. =) maverick Any more on this is just........

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