FPJ vs Rolex

[dakkonmc]

Originally Posted by ILoveFerrari

2016 FF is the one to get for the standard glass roof. Internal material quality FF is nicer. Thicker padding, smell of the leather remained after 15k miles. Lusso interior design definitely wins. FF exhaust is classically Ferrari V12, cannot mistake that. Sounded like F12 as there is no GPF. Lusso only when start cold sounds powerful or during high load.

Transmission wise as for all next generation Ferrari, Lusso much quicker than FF.

Besides the look, FF is 90% of the car, but needs to buy a CPO from dealer because, yes, the PTU issue is real. I had PTU changed in the Lusso.

Overall, I think I will get the Lusso as it is much more modern design.

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Thank you for the thoughtful response. Really appreciate it.

Do you have any experience in the backseat of the FF? I heard from a few owners mentioned the ride quality in the back is awful, and Lusso made dramatic improvements.

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[vliberman]

Originally Posted by dakkonmc

Are you suggesting Rolex is like a Porsche because you can't see the engine?

It's not the most compelling or logical argument. The primary goal of watch is time keeping, and the secondary goal is aesthetically pleasing. That's why finishing and complication are important.

Intellectually speaking.... if you want an accurate and reliable timepiece, probably better off buying a Casio.

I think Rolex is closer to a BMW than a Porsche. Porsche doesn’t just make sport car. They make car enthusiast driven vehicles. I think Porsche does a better job catering to the enthusiast than Rolex does.

Btw, Mustang is legitimate sports car and it has been the best-selling sports car in the last 10 years globally.



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I will start responding with the easiest argument to dismantle: are u seriously suggesting that Rolex is somehow less enthusiast centered than Porsche? I don’t know if you noticed the forum u are in? I presume you are watch enthusiast, aren’t u? Are u saying that there are not 1,000s of dentists and accountants driving Porsche because it is cool? U see where I am going. Porsche and Rolex are equal in terms of end user they serve.

Second: are you really going to compare Rolex to Casio? Can u name one mechanical watch Casio produces that is even somewhat similar to any Rolex produces? If you stop a random person on a street and ask to name a luxury watch, it ain’t Casio they would suggest. Same with Porsche.

BMW chases trends. That is why it went from 3 model lines to over 9. It is not perceived as reliable or desirable automobile. It had in the past. Rolex has never made similar mistakes. It stared with 4 lines and currently has 5 after 70 years. Never lost focus on quality. It is very much like FPJ in that regard. Every watch has clear heritage and can be traced back to its DNA.

Now, let’s address the logic here. Sports cars are designed to perform. Full stop. If u know the history of Ferrari, you would understand my point. Rolex is the best performing watch out there full stop. Nobody else can produce the size times quality times desirability. Same with Porsche. Ferrari makes around 15,000 cars, Porsche 300,000. In terms of aesthetics, Porsche makes 911s. That is first that comes to mind. Rolex makes oyster cases, that is first that comes to mind. Everything else are details. They are important to u but not to the argument.

[ILoveFerrari]

Originally Posted by dakkonmc

Thank you for the thoughtful response. Really appreciate it.

Do you have any experience in the backseat of the FF? I heard from a few owners mentioned the ride quality in the back is awful, and Lusso made dramatic improvements.

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My adult children all feel that Lusso in the back is like 1 - 2 inches more cramp. Panaramic roof is a must and should help. I sat in the back a few times only out of 15k miles in each car.

I think Lusso should not disappoint. What is your alias in Fchat? We can continue our conversation over there.

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[ILoveFerrari]

Originally Posted by vliberman

I will start responding with the easiest argument to dismantle: are u seriously suggesting that Rolex is somehow less enthusiast centered than Porsche? I don’t know if you noticed the forum u are in? I presume you are watch enthusiast, aren’t u? Are u saying that there are not 1,000s of dentists and accountants driving Porsche because it is cool? U see where I am going. Porsche and Rolex are equal in terms of end user they serve.

Second: are you really going to compare Rolex to Casio? Can u name one mechanical watch Casio produces that is even somewhat similar to any Rolex produces? If you stop a random person on a street and ask to name a luxury watch, it ain’t Casio they would suggest. Same with Porsche.

BMW chases trends. That is why it went from 3 model lines to over 9. It is not perceived as reliable or desirable automobile. It had in the past. Rolex has never made similar mistakes. It stared with 4 lines and currently has 5 after 70 years. Never lost focus on quality. It is very much like FPJ in that regard. Every watch has clear heritage and can be traced back to its DNA.

Now, let’s address the logic here. Sports cars are designed to perform. Full stop. If u know the history of Ferrari, you would understand my point. Rolex is the best performing watch out there full stop. Nobody else can produce the size times quality times desirability. Same with Porsche. Ferrari makes around 15,000 cars, Porsche 300,000. In terms of aesthetics, Porsche makes 911s. That is first that comes to mind. Rolex makes oyster cases, that is first that comes to mind. Everything else are details. They are important to u but not to the argument.

Yes, and Michael Jordan has won 6 championships and LeBron 4.

Buddy, you win.

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[rolexpatek363]

Originally Posted by vliberman

Rolex is the best performing watch out there full stop.

I think Rolex is the best-marketed brand out there. In terms of quality, it's good, but nowhere near the best.

Comparing Rolex to FPJ, it's a tractor vs a Rolls-Royce.

[ILoveFerrari]

Originally Posted by rolexpatek363

I think Rolex is the best-marketed brand out there. In terms of quality, it's good, but nowhere near the best.



Comparing Rolex to FPJ, it's a tractor vs a Rolls-Royce.

+1
But let this thread die and let him win.

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[dakkonmc]

Originally Posted by vliberman

I will start responding with the easiest argument to dismantle: are u seriously suggesting that Rolex is somehow less enthusiast centered than Porsche? I don’t know if you noticed the forum u are in? I presume you are watch enthusiast, aren’t u? Are u saying that there are not 1,000s of dentists and accountants driving Porsche because it is cool? U see where I am going. Porsche and Rolex are equal in terms of end user they serve.

Second: are you really going to compare Rolex to Casio? Can u name one mechanical watch Casio produces that is even somewhat similar to any Rolex produces? If you stop a random person on a street and ask to name a luxury watch, it ain’t Casio they would suggest. Same with Porsche.

BMW chases trends. That is why it went from 3 model lines to over 9. It is not perceived as reliable or desirable automobile. It had in the past. Rolex has never made similar mistakes. It stared with 4 lines and currently has 5 after 70 years. Never lost focus on quality. It is very much like FPJ in that regard. Every watch has clear heritage and can be traced back to its DNA.

Now, let’s address the logic here. Sports cars are designed to perform. Full stop. If u know the history of Ferrari, you would understand my point. Rolex is the best performing watch out there full stop. Nobody else can produce the size times quality times desirability. Same with Porsche. Ferrari makes around 15,000 cars, Porsche 300,000. In terms of aesthetics, Porsche makes 911s. That is first that comes to mind. Rolex makes oyster cases, that is first that comes to mind. Everything else are details. They are important to u but not to the argument.

Yes. I think Rolex are less Enthusiast Centric then porsche. They're in the volume business. There not 1.5M watch enthusiast in the world. A number of posters on this forum agrees with me on this. Comparing Rolex to Bmw is not a knock. Is there a reason you dislike BMW this much?

You mentioned a number of times how accurate and well made Rolex are. Rolex and FPJ are luxury items. If the focus is accuracy and reliability. Casio does a better job keeping time more accurately than both.

BMW was just named best car brand by consumer report 2 month ago and very high in reliability .... it is desirable and reliable.

I think you should check out a few other watch brands and see if you still feel this way.

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[John Doyle]

You are comparing an independent watchmaking company (Rolex) with Journe? hah i guess i don't need to answer or contribute to this thread at all.

[llngoc]

Originally Posted by ILoveFerrari

Both dial and movement are finished by Kari. The movement are made by SE which manufacturers its own hairspring.



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Thanks for the clarification

[GB-man]

The only things Rolex and FPJ have in common is they are two of the only brands still headquartered in Geneva and people love to hate them for no apparent reason other than their success.

The watches themselves are not comparable. If you think they are I envy you because you just got into this hobby and have lots to explore and indulge in. I’d start by visiting NY/Miami/LA to handle the watches.

[vliberman]

Originally Posted by GB-man

The only things Rolex and FPJ have in common is they are two of the only brands still headquartered in Geneva and people love to hate them for no apparent reason other than their success.

The watches themselves are not comparable. If you think they are I envy you because you just got into this hobby and have lots to explore and indulge in. I’d start by visiting NY/Miami/LA to handle the watches.

thank you for the advise, and i do mean it.. now, i am not new to the hobby. I own pieces by MB&F, URWERK, AP and others.. however, thru my journey, i realized that the essence of what appeals to me as a collector is embodied by Rolex, however incomprehensible to some that might be. I heard i am not alone. Many well respected collectors talk about going back to Rolex after experiencing everything else. I am not there yet, but not far. I do want to experience FPJ, GF and a few others.

This is akin to my auto journey, where i owned pretty much everything and now i only drive '17 Carrera base model. Hence the argument and comparisons..

The reason I started this silly to some topic is that i would like to explore this subject a bit further, perhaps for egoistic reasons. I appreciate all these who are helping along the way. I do also understand these who consider this to be a joke. It is not to me....

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by vliberman

thank you for the advise, and i do mean it.. now, i am not new to the hobby. I own pieces by MB&F, URWERK, AP and others.. however, thru my journey, i realized that the essence of what appeals to me as a collector is embodied by Rolex, however incomprehensible to some that might be. I heard i am not alone. Many well respected collectors talk about going back to Rolex after experiencing everything else. I am not there yet, but not far. I do want to experience FPJ, GF and a few others.

This is akin to my auto journey, where i owned pretty much everything and now i only drive '17 Carrera base model. Hence the argument and comparisons..

The reason I started this silly to some topic is that i would like to explore this subject a bit further, perhaps for egoistic reasons. I appreciate all these who are helping along the way. I do also understand these who consider this to be a joke. It is not to me....

Well having owned a 2013 c2 and 2021 c2 base I can agree with you on that front. Simple and perfect for public roads. If you find the answer to your watch journey let us know because I’ve been looking for decades and don’t have the answer!

[dakkonmc]

Originally Posted by vliberman

thank you for the advise, and i do mean it.. now, i am not new to the hobby. I own pieces by MB&F, URWERK, AP and others.. however, thru my journey, i realized that the essence of what appeals to me as a collector is embodied by Rolex, however incomprehensible to some that might be. I heard i am not alone. Many well respected collectors talk about going back to Rolex after experiencing everything else. I am not there yet, but not far. I do want to experience FPJ, GF and a few others.

This is akin to my auto journey, where i owned pretty much everything and now i only drive '17 Carrera base model. Hence the argument and comparisons..

The reason I started this silly to some topic is that i would like to explore this subject a bit further, perhaps for egoistic reasons. I appreciate all these who are helping along the way. I do also understand these who consider this to be a joke. It is not to me....

At the end of the day. Buy what you enjoy and what you appreciate. No other person's opinion really matters.

Your 2017 911 is a great example. It's a fantastic vehicle. I would rather own your car than a GT2 RS. For the purpose of what I would need the vehicle for.

GT2 RS is a better vehicle, but for the purpose of what I would use for it, it would be better for me.

I will probably be complaining about ride quality, ground clearance, why I bought the bucket seats, and not the 18 way.

I really suggest going into a FPJ boutique near you and see if you connect with the watch. The staff and the enthusiasts I came across wearing FPJ are very impressive and knowledgeable.

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[enjoythemusic]

hmmmmm....

THE+DUDE_edited.jpg

[ILoveFerrari]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

hmmmmm....



Attachment 1437530

+1

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[ILoveFerrari]

Originally Posted by dakkonmc

At the end of the day. Buy what you enjoy and what you appreciate. No other person's opinion really matters.

Your 2017 911 is a great example. It's a fantastic vehicle. I would rather own your car than a GT2 RS. For the purpose of what I would need the vehicle for.

GT2 RS is a better vehicle, but for the purpose of what I would use for it, it would be better for me.

I will probably be complaining about ride quality, ground clearance, why I bought the bucket seats, and not the 18 way.

I really suggest going into a FPJ boutique near you and see if you connect with the watch. The staff and the enthusiasts I came across wearing FPJ are very impressive and knowledgeable.

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+1

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[ILoveFerrari]

Originally Posted by GB-man

Well having owned a 2013 c2 and 2021 c2 base I can agree with you on that front. Simple and perfect for public roads. If you find the answer to your watch journey let us know because I’ve been looking for decades and don’t have the answer!

+1

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[Bearxj86]

1) Handle Journe
2) Flip it over
3) You will see, it is obvious

[charger_vital]

Originally Posted by vliberman

thank you for the advise, and i do mean it.. now, i am not new to the hobby. I own pieces by MB&F, URWERK, AP and others.. however, thru my journey, i realized that the essence of what appeals to me as a collector is embodied by Rolex, however incomprehensible to some that might be. I heard i am not alone. Many well respected collectors talk about going back to Rolex after experiencing everything else. I am not there yet, but not far. I do want to experience FPJ, GF and a few others.

This is akin to my auto journey, where i owned pretty much everything and now i only drive '17 Carrera base model. Hence the argument and comparisons..

The reason I started this silly to some topic is that i would like to explore this subject a bit further, perhaps for egoistic reasons. I appreciate all these who are helping along the way. I do also understand these who consider this to be a joke. It is not to me....

I've heard a lot of people say that they've gone back to Rolex as well. It makes sense. They have cache. You can bag them around. And they can dress up and down.

Personally, and with the exception of some Rolex vintage pieces, I find most of them bland. I find the pretentiousness of the Rolex dealers laughable. And I never wear mine because I'm embarrassed to represent the image that they've come to portray (middle aged dudes trying to keep up with the Jones or young guys trying to project that they've "made it")... though in fairness, I can't quite convince myself to get rid of them either.

Rolex in general (and especially the dealers) remind me of the San Francisco "49ers": as in the large population of girls in San Francisco who rate as 4s but believe they are 9s. If you've ever lived there you know what I'm talking about... though, again, in fairness I married a San Francisco chick who likes the actual 49er football team, so maybe I'm jaded.