Submariner ND from grey; things to pay attention to?

[Swordfish]

Hello everyone,

I am thinking of getting a sub from grey market. Any trusted sellers you would recommend? What should I be careful about?

Thanks!


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[PBJ1925]

Personally speaking, Takuya and Nashville Watch are great options.

Pay attention to the descriptions, as if you want close to new, you'll want to look for terms:

Unworn, sized only, unpolished, NOS (I.E. - if you want a 114060) et.al.

[1William]

My go to is DavidSW but I have done deals with all of the big sellers on here. All of the big sellers have websites and many watches. Do some research and find the watch or watches you are interested in and get on the phone and call and inquire. Remember when comparing watches and prices to compare the same watches. Meaning age, completeness of books papers, warranty cards, etc. I had always been a huge fan of the 114060, Submariner-ND from the last generation. But I have recently purchased a 124060 and I do like it better. It has a 70 hour power reserve and a more refined case. In the end it is about the watch so don't get too hung up on the prices and you can always respectfully ask for a discount. Most will do a few hundred dollars and the shipping is included. Good luck and let us know what you find and decide.

[brandrea]

Welcome e to the forum.

Here is the “who’s who” section fir your referral.

https://www.rolexforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=28

[HHIslander]

This list of sellers from Reddit is fairly complete imo.

https://www.reddit.com/r/rolex/comme...st_of_trusted/

[Calatrava r]

You will be buying a pre-owned watch. As in any used market, find the best seller you can who can attest to the products authenticity, provenance and condition. Beware that many if not most re-sellers, touch up the watches they sell to make them look as unworn as possible. There are a lot of watches flipped the secondary market almost immediately, so opt for one with papers dated within the last 30 to 90 days, even if it is a tad higher than a watch a year old.

[Feseroni]

I would recommed the 124060 (I'm a little biased) but IMHO its pure class and almost perfect. In terms of sellers I would recommend to shop around the TRF recommended sellers, I have seen a few go for 11.5k or lower. Pay attention to the seller's reputation, date of the watch, box and papers, polished vs unpolished.

[RichM]

I’ve always had a great experience with Thanh Do. (Takuya Watches) No worries at all.

[Swordfish]

Thank you all for the responses!

Could someone clarify what exactly happens with the warranty when buying from grey? Does the warranty time starts counting down from the time of the purchase? Also is the watch registered under a different owner with Rolex or there is no such thing?

After buying from grey how can one authenticate the watch independently?

(I am interested for the 124060)


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[Swordfish]

Thank you all for the responses !

Could someone clarify what is the situation with the warranty when buying from grey? Does the countdown start from the original purchase from Rolex AD? Also, is the watch registered with a different owner with Rolex or there is no such record?

Finally, what is the best way to independently verify the watch after purchase?

Thanks!


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[piratfisk]

Originally Posted by HHIslander

This list of sellers from Reddit is fairly complete imo.

https://www.reddit.com/r/rolex/comme...st_of_trusted/

Wow, thanks for sharing this list. I hadn't heard of some of these sites.

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by Swordfish

Thank you all for the responses !

Could someone clarify what is the situation with the warranty when buying from grey? Does the countdown start from the original purchase from Rolex AD? Also, is the watch registered with a different owner with Rolex or there is no such record?

Finally, what is the best way to independently verify the watch after purchase?

Thanks!


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The Rolex warranty runs from the date of original purchase from an AD. Some used watch dealers have their own inhouse warranty which is usually not needed where the Rolex warranty is still in force. Reselling a watch in no way affects the information collected by the AD when the watch was first sold. An experienced Rolex watchmaker should be able to authenticate the watch for you. With a good seller, this step is not necessary as they do that before they sell the watch.

[jfmiii]

For a ND sub, buy BNIB from a good seller. These are selling BNIB for around 12k on Moda, if not slightly less.

[Tools]

Originally Posted by Swordfish

. . .
Could someone clarify what is the situation with the warranty when buying from grey? Does the countdown start from the original purchase from Rolex AD? Also, is the watch registered with a different owner with Rolex or there is no such record?

Finally, what is the best way to independently verify the watch after purchase?

. . .

You need to know what you are buying. Used is not the Grey Market.

Used watches that have been bought retail and are being resold will usually have the remaining warranty left so ensure you get the card.

Actual Grey Market watches are new and have not been sold at retail before but inserted into the market by, usually out-of-country distributors, and have not had the Rolex Warranty properly activated.

Costco, Jomashop, Alan Furman and many other actual Grey Market, new watch, Dealers cannot provide a valid Rolex Warranty, but usually provide their own.

[Swordfish]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

The Rolex warranty runs from the date of original purchase from an AD. Some used watch dealers have their own inhouse warranty which is usually not needed where the Rolex warranty is still in force. Reselling a watch in no way affects the information collected by the AD when the watch was first sold. An experienced Rolex watchmaker should be able to authenticate the watch for you. With a good seller, this step is not necessary as they do that before they sell the watch.

Thanks for your response. Could you elaborate a bit on “Reselling a watch in no way affects the information collected by the AD when the watch was first sold.”

When presenting the watch for service after some time, or if trying to use the warranty, is there any case Rolex will refuse service because the new owner doesn’t match the original?


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[Swordfish]

Originally Posted by Tools

You need to know what you are buying. Used is not the Grey Market.

Used watches that have been bought retail and are being resold will usually have the remaining warranty left so ensure you get the card.

Actual Grey Market watches are new and have not been sold at retail before but inserted into the market by, usually out-of-country distributors, and have not had the Rolex Warranty properly activated.

Costco, Jomashop, Alan Furman and many other actual Grey Market, new watch, Dealers cannot provide a valid Rolex Warranty, but usually provide their own.

Is there an actual “grey” market for Rolex then, or everything is used based on the way you describe it?

If there is a grey market, could you recommend any dealers ?


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[Njkdog]

Grey or preowned?

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Swordfish

Thanks for your response. Could you elaborate a bit on “Reselling a watch in no way affects the information collected by the AD when the watch was first sold.”

When presenting the watch for service after some time, or if trying to use the warranty, is there any case Rolex will refuse service because the new owner doesn’t match the original?


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No! The warranty follows the watch. If buy a watch listed as unworn, from a trusted seller, here, for instance, the warranty might be dated 15-12-2023. It does not matter who the original owner was. The watch is warranted for 5 years from that date. The only time a previous owner comes into play, is if you buy a stolen watch. That will not happen, if buy from trusted sellers listed here. I looked at the Reddit list, and saw some overlap with trusted sellers here. I cannot vouch for any others on Reddit, and at least one, I do not trust.

Kat


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[Swordfish]

Originally Posted by Njkdog

Grey or preowned?

Are there any rolex grey dealers? If yes, can you recommend?


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[csaltphoto]

Originally Posted by Swordfish

Is there an actual “grey” market for Rolex then, or everything is used based on the way you describe it?

If there is a grey market, could you recommend any dealers ?


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There is both a grey market and a reseller market. Grey market is any item that enters the market outside of traditional distribution channels. This could vary with the item. With Rolexes it is any watch sold that was not sold through an AD/Authorized Dealer so the warranty was not activated upon sale. Rolex will service the watch but not under warranty. You are kinda on your own with the grey market as far as anyone actually recommending someone but Alan Furman and Jomashop were mentioned as places where you are likely to get a genuine Rolex.

Resellers are all selling a "used" Rolex but in some cases these are basically new and in some cases still with stickers. These were bought from an AD and sold before wearing or sizing. The reputable resellers will distinguish between new and used.

[Swordfish]

Originally Posted by csaltphoto

There is both a grey market and a reseller market. Grey market is any item that enters the market outside of traditional distribution channels. This could vary with the item. With Rolexes it is any watch sold that was not sold through an AD/Authorized Dealer so the warranty was not activated upon sale. Rolex will service the watch but not under warranty. You are kinda on your own with the grey market as far as anyone actually recommending someone but Alan Furman and Jomashop were mentioned as places where you are likely to get a genuine Rolex.

Resellers are all selling a "used" Rolex but in some cases these are basically new and in some cases still with stickers. These were bought from an AD and sold before wearing or sizing. The reputable resellers will distinguish between new and used.

Thanks for clarifying! Based on this, it sounds safer to buy an unworn from resellers.


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[PBJ1925]

You can just buy this and call it a day.

https://nashvillewatch.com/product/r...2023-unworn-8/

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Swordfish

Thanks for clarifying! Based on this, it sounds safer to buy an unworn from resellers.


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Just call one of the trusted sellers here, and he will overnight it to you.
I’ve used Takuya. Very trustworthy.

Kat


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[tp105]

I just recently did this for a 124060. Saw a listing in the classified section for a price I was happy with. Searched out feedback for the seller, exchanged a few messages & phone call. Felt comfortable enough so I wired the money and had the watch in my hands the next morning.

It was a seamless transaction and I couldn’t be happier. There is a reason everyone states “buy the seller”. There’s plenty of good ones to choose from on these forums. Good luck.

[Philadelphialawyer1]

The fact pattern that I never see addressed when discussing warranty ramifications of buying from anyplace except for AD is the following---

I purchase a watch, full set, etc with 4.5. years left of warranty (assume original purchase was done at AD and card activated) and the source from which I purchase (insert trusted seller) opens up the watch to authenticate it before selling thereby voiding the warranty.

What happens if the 12 series movement stalls ans RSC tells me "sorry no warranty since this watch was opened and the warranty voided"?

Ive never gotten a clear answer on this

[CarlOver]

Originally Posted by Philadelphialawyer1

The fact pattern that I never see addressed when discussing warranty ramifications of buying from anyplace except for AD is the following---

I purchase a watch, full set, etc with 4.5. years left of warranty (assume original purchase was done at AD and card activated) and the source from which I purchase (insert trusted seller) opens up the watch to authenticate it before selling thereby voiding the warranty.

What happens if the 12 series movement stalls ans RSC tells me "sorry no warranty since this watch was opened and the warranty voided"?

Ive never gotten a clear answer on this

Always a risk. Should be attainable from then AD.

[Swordfish]

Originally Posted by Philadelphialawyer1

The fact pattern that I never see addressed when discussing warranty ramifications of buying from anyplace except for AD is the following---

I purchase a watch, full set, etc with 4.5. years left of warranty (assume original purchase was done at AD and card activated) and the source from which I purchase (insert trusted seller) opens up the watch to authenticate it before selling thereby voiding the warranty.

What happens if the 12 series movement stalls ans RSC tells me "sorry no warranty since this watch was opened and the warranty voided"?

Ive never gotten a clear answer on this

Is it impossible to authenticate without opening? Or otherwise, can RSC always know that the watch opened?


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[Joearch]

OC Watch Guy also a great option.

[huncho]

Originally Posted by Philadelphialawyer1

The fact pattern that I never see addressed when discussing warranty ramifications of buying from anyplace except for AD is the following---

I purchase a watch, full set, etc with 4.5. years left of warranty (assume original purchase was done at AD and card activated) and the source from which I purchase (insert trusted seller) opens up the watch to authenticate it before selling thereby voiding the warranty.

What happens if the 12 series movement stalls ans RSC tells me "sorry no warranty since this watch was opened and the warranty voided"?

Ive never gotten a clear answer on this

i don't think trusted sellers on here open new watches/watches under warranty. there are so many ways for them to authenticate without having to open it up, despite what people say about superclones. no fake will pass all the different checks they can do on the dial, case, bracelet, weight, with a loupe, etc

if for some reason they sell you one that's been opened before and rsc won't work on it i would be very surprised if the trusted sellers here don't refund you. i would be more worried about greys like watchbox, bobs, etc, but there was a thread here not too long ago about your exact scenario and watchbox ended up making it right, although no one knows if it was due to them coming across the long thread on here or because they genuinely wanted to

[KatGirl]

I highly doubt that the trusted sellers open watches, in order to authenticate. These guys are very experienced, as are most of us. I’m confident, that I could tell if a watch was fake, just by examining it with a loupe, handling it, and, perhaps most importantly, vetting the seller. If a new piece, box, docs, tags all matching, and intact. I’m guessing the trusted sellers do the same. Also, how could RSC even tell if a watch had been opened, as long as whomever did it, used the proper tool, and left no marks? Plus, I thought Rolex’s rule is that they won’t work on a watch, that someone else has worked on. Opening and closing a watch should not matter. The other thing about allowing anyone to open your Rolex, is that you mess with the water proofing. How do you know its rating is still intact?

Kat


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