Any BMW M4 owners??

[Rad22]

So I love the new M4. I was exploring the model on the website and stumbled upon the new M4 CSL. I was pretty much set on the M4 competition x drive until I saw the csl.

I know a lot of people dislike the grill on the new models but I really like it.

Anyone on here have any of the new models? Share some pics and thoughts on the line in general.

(Any bmw pics are welcome)





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[dk65]

BMW has lost their way. Ever since E36/E46 it's been downhill IMHO. It's like they're trying too hard to please folks that want pointless gadgets in cars. I test drove a X5 recently, and it has a feature, which the sales associate was very proud of, that allows passengers to adjust volume by spinning a finger in a circle, in the air, below two down-facing cameras in the rearview mirror. And the volume can also be adjusted by voice command, steering wheel control, or by the dial on the dash. Just seems like a pointless waste of money.

For reference, I have an E36 M3 with 360,000 miles on it, that my father bought new in 1995. He drove it 240k and I've had it for 120k. Had E46 M3, and a few others. So I have some experience with the brand.

I'd strongly suggest going to look at Porsche 718's if you're in the market for a sporty car. Much less BS and fluff, and the performance is excellent. Maybe not the same eye-bleeding numbers as the M4 CSL, but it'll get to Starbucks just as fast.

Looks are personal - sounds like you're ok with the new grill layout on the BMW's. Again, it's my opinion, but I think it's hideous.

[huncho]

Originally Posted by dk65

BMW has lost their way. Ever since E36/E46 it's been downhill IMHO. It's like they're trying too hard to please folks that want pointless gadgets in cars. I test drove a X5 recently, and it has a feature, which the sales associate was very proud of, that allows passengers to adjust volume by spinning a finger in a circle, in the air, below two down-facing cameras in the rearview mirror. And the volume can also be adjusted by voice command, steering wheel control, or by the dial on the dash. Just seems like a pointless waste of money.

For reference, I have an E36 M3 with 360,000 miles on it, that my father bought new in 1995. He drove it 240k and I've had it for 120k. Had E46 M3, and a few others. So I have some experience with the brand.

I'd strongly suggest going to look at Porsche 718's if you're in the market for a sporty car. Much less BS and fluff, and the performance is excellent. Maybe not the same eye-bleeding numbers as the M4 CSL, but it'll get to Starbucks just as fast.

Looks are personal - sounds like you're ok with the new grill layout on the BMW's. Again, it's my opinion, but I think it's hideous.

it depends on the line. they still have amazing cars like the m340, m550, x5. the m5 is still a monster supercar and not ruined (yet) and the m8 is very nice as well. after the grills (which i still don't understand) and the bloated lineups i've become much more of a mercedes fan now though, although they're making every car look the same now so we'll see...

718 is nice but it's a completely different car, i don't think anyone is cross shopping an M3/M4 with a 718

[Dyim]

At least you are in MI and don't have to deal with the front plates. Makes the grill a bit more acceptable.

Current BMW IMO are getting pretty bloated and disconnected. Like driving a video game. The CSL is an attempt to reverse this trend IMO.

At this price point, agree with above post and I would look at p cars.

But if you are a die hard BMW fan, I can certainly see the attraction.

[dk65]

Originally Posted by huncho

it depends on the line. they still have amazing cars like the m340, m550, x5. the m5 is still a monster supercar and not ruined (yet) and the m8 is very nice as well. after the grills (which i still don't understand) and the bloated lineups i've become much more of a mercedes fan now though, although they're making every car look the same now so we'll see...

718 is nice but it's a completely different car, i don't think anyone is cross shopping an M3/M4 with a 718

You’re right, M3 and M4 probably aren’t in the same category as 718.

The x5 I test drove (M version) felt like a disconnected pig. Steering feel was terrible/non-existent, throttle response was not consistent, as though the car had to spend too much time thinking about how much throttle to apply for a certain amount of pedal.

I was hoping it would feel at least like a distant cousin to my M3. It did not, it was closer to a Suburban… by a long shot.

But it could back itself along the path of a driveway entry, which might be useful… once?

I hope the CSL is better, for OP’s sake, but me personally, I am not a customer for the current BMW offerings.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by dk65

I hope the CSL is better, for OP’s sake, but me personally, I am not a customer for the current BMW offerings.

It won't be that drastically different in the respects most long time M owners care about. It will be faster and do many things better, but feel and connectivity to the car itself will not be on that list. Is it even coming to the US anyhow?

[huncho]

Originally Posted by dk65

You’re right, M3 and M4 probably aren’t in the same category as 718.

The x5 I test drove (M version) felt like a disconnected pig. Steering feel was terrible/non-existent, throttle response was not consistent, as though the car had to spend too much time thinking about how much throttle to apply for a certain amount of pedal.

I was hoping it would feel at least like a distant cousin to my M3. It did not, it was closer to a Suburban… by a long shot.

But it could back itself along the path of a driveway entry, which might be useful… once?

I hope the CSL is better, for OP’s sake, but me personally, I am not a customer for the current BMW offerings.

interesting, i haven't driven the x5m but have heard/read good things about them. i feel like if you want an suv that has a sports car feel you're really only left with a porsche, otherwise you just have to stick to a sports car

[Chiboy]

Originally Posted by huncho

interesting, i haven't driven the x5m but have heard/read good things about them. i feel like if you want an suv that has a sports car feel you're really only left with a porsche, otherwise you just have to stick to a sports car

My opinion is that it's a waste to buy an SUV if you want a sports car feel. I'm sure for an extra $100k over the cost of a Lexus or Acura SUV you will get more power and better handling, but it will still be a big, heavy pig of an SUV. Based on the popularity of Cayennes, Macans, Lambo and Aston Martin SUVs, XM BMWs, there are plenty of folks who disagree with me. But it's hard to make a 5k pound vehicle act like a sports car or even a coupe.

[dk65]

Originally Posted by huncho

interesting, i haven't driven the x5m but have heard/read good things about them. i feel like if you want an suv that has a sports car feel you're really only left with a porsche, otherwise you just have to stick to a sports car

I wound up buying a Macan S. It's not a sports car, but definitely much better driving experience than the BMW.

[sgarrity]

Originally Posted by dk65

You’re right, M3 and M4 probably aren’t in the same category as 718.

The x5 I test drove (M version) felt like a disconnected pig. Steering feel was terrible/non-existent, throttle response was not consistent, as though the car had to spend too much time thinking about how much throttle to apply for a certain amount of pedal.

I was hoping it would feel at least like a distant cousin to my M3. It did not, it was closer to a Suburban… by a long shot.

But it could back itself along the path of a driveway entry, which might be useful… once?

I hope the CSL is better, for OP’s sake, but me personally, I am not a customer for the current BMW offerings.

This is a ridiculous comment. The X5M is a disconnect pig?? What exactly are you looking for out of a 5,500 lb SUV?

A 2022 X5M Competition is the 5th BMW that I've owned. The previous 4 have all been great cars, all inline 6s, and all M Sport cars. No major complaints about any of them. But the X5M is on an entirely different level. A true M car is a significant step up. Power, shifting, handling, interior quality.....all superb! And 0-60 in 3.7 seconds? Sold!

Does my 5,500 lb SUV handle like a 911? No! It's not supposed to. but it handles at least as good, if not better, than my 440i did. It's got the room I need, it's fast AF, and it steers so well that it feels like you're driving a small sports sedan instead of a big ass SUV. You like Porsche? Fine, get one. Different feel and very different design aesthetic. But the X5M is a damn fine SUV!

[dk65]

Originally Posted by sgarrity

This is a ridiculous comment. The X5M is a disconnect pig?? What exactly are you looking for out of a 5,500 lb SUV?

Looking for something that doesn't drive like a Suburban. Just my opinion. I drove Suburban, Yukon, X5M, Cayenne base/S/Turbo, and Macan base/S. I didn't like the way the X5M drove, it felt disconnected and numb. Similar to the GM products. I felt that the Macan/Cayenne offered a much better driving experience than the X5M, for roughly the same spend. Again - my opinion only - BMW is trying to steal some of the Suburban market, and that's why it feels, well, like a Suburban.

But none of this has anything to do with a M4 CSL! Sorry for the thread derailment.

[springer]

That grill, oh my. I thought I was looking at a twin-grill Ford Edsel.

[Rad22]

Originally Posted by springer

That grill, oh my. I thought I was looking at a twin-grill Ford Edsel.

I knew this was going to happen.


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[twitch54]

Originally Posted by springer

That grill, oh my. I thought I was looking at a twin-grill Ford Edsel.

LOL, I couldn't agree more, uglier than sin and I'm a BMW owner......

[huncho]

Originally Posted by twitch54

LOL, I couldn't agree more, uglier than sin and I'm a BMW owner......

both audi and lexus have giant grills that work and look great (imo). i don't know how bmw came out with those. i think it's the fact that they're split down the middle that makes it bad, if it was one whole piece and slightly wider+shorter i imagine it would look fine

[-dustin]

Originally Posted by huncho

split down the middle that makes it bad,

makes me think of the last version of the WS-6 Trans Am.

blended with a pot belly pig.

[twitch54]

Originally Posted by huncho

both audi and lexus have giant grills that work and look great (imo). i don't know how bmw came out with those. i think it's the fact that they're split down the middle that makes it bad, if it was one whole piece and slightly wider+shorter i imagine it would look fine

again, to each his own and IMO the Lexus started all this 'uglier than sin' grill crap.

[huncho]

Originally Posted by twitch54

again, to each his own and IMO the Lexus started all this 'uglier than sin' grill crap.

yeah not saying i'm a fan of the trend, but rather that audi and lexus made the best of it. not a fan of how bmw went about it

[Atone]

Someone had an allocation for sale on a CSL in a car group I’m in. I’ll try and find the listing.

[enjoythemusic]

Does anyone know if they finally fixed the M4's simulated steering feel?

[Atone]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Does anyone know if they finally fixed the M4's simulated steering feel?

Unfortunately not. When they went from hydraulic to electric, that was that.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Atone

Unfortunately not. When they went from hydraulic to electric, that was that.

Big bummer, BMW ruined what was a great feeling car. Ah well.

Don't they know how bad it is? Shoot, even the fat pig modern Bentley have good steering feel. Hopefully by 2026 BMW fixes it.

[binArt]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Big bummer, BMW ruined what was a great feeling car. Ah well.

Don't they know how bad it is? Shoot, even the fat pig modern Bentley have good steering feel. Hopefully by 2026 BMW fixes it.

BMW has gone the way of Rolex. It's become a fashion accessory. The tool watch and the ultimate driving machine are consigned to your memories.

[V25V]

I had a 2005 E46 M3 up until last year when I sold it, was a great car and probably the last of the great ones, but the E90/92 was amazing as well with the V8. My wife has an F80.....its meh. G80 is worse in my opinion, car is fast, sure. But its big, stale and lifeless. We may get a G80 for my wife to replace the F80 but zero chance I would buy one for myself. Its a hard pass, BMW has lost its way.

[golftime]

Originally Posted by Atone

Unfortunately not. When they went from hydraulic to electric, that was that.

This. I used to help out a friend who was a high end wholesaler and drove all sorts of high end cars. After BMW changed over to electric steering I thought the first few I drove had a mechanic defect with no road feel and occasional pulsation in the steering wheel until I realized it was every one.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by golftime

After BMW changed over to electric steering I thought the first few I drove had a mechanic defect with no road feel and occasional pulsation in the steering wheel until I realized it was every one.

And 'Sports Mode' only adds physical resistance, not any actual feel.


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God i miss my old vintage 85 Ferrari, and the Formula 2000 car told you EVERY FRIGGEN THING.

So, about getting a Lotus....

[Rad22]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

And 'Sports Mode' only adds physical resistance, not any actual feel.


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God i miss my old vintage 85 Ferrari, and the Formula 2000 car told you EVERY FRIGGEN THING.

So, about getting a Lotus....

Lotus has never crossed my mind… I will look into it.

Porsche has always been a dream car of mine, But the models that interest me are in a different price range.


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[Chiboy]

My last BMW was a 2004 E46 M3 manual. I personally don’t really enjoy the same sausage, different size looks of current models, but haven’t driven one in almost 10 years. The CSL paint scheme is cool, and takes one’s eye away from focusing on… that grill.

Are they still squeezing in big, heavy engines to make them fast despite their ever increasing weight? I guess I’ve lost my appreciation for the brand, sorry!

[enjoythemusic]

Congrats DK65. Enjoy the drive :)

[rolexpatek363]

That BMW M4 looks "overwrought" to me, not a good thing. I'd recommend a 911 (992) GTS, understated excellence, and I suspect a far better car all round.