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22 September 2021, 08:03 AM | #61 |
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This is actually a Beautiful watch.
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22 September 2021, 08:10 AM | #62 |
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This is exactly my experience. The polishing and finish on a GS rivals or surpasses a Patek or an AP, never mind a Rolex, but I actually thought the bracelet on my GS was an aftermarket copy before comparing it in the Seiko boutique in Knightsbridge. Nowhere near the quality of the watch head. If buying a GS again I would go for a strap.
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22 September 2021, 08:12 AM | #63 |
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Hand painted lacquered dial, hand painted numerals (in platinum dust) finely polished rose gold case…what’s not to like, or at least (as a WIS) appreciate? If you have the time or inclination, check out GS’s artistry. Edit. God I apologize for my ugly thumbnail. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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16618 126710BLRO 116500 LN (White) 228235 228239 SBGK002 |
22 September 2021, 08:28 AM | #64 |
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I think GS is on the same level as Rolex. People have a hard time comparing Rolex the watch because they are entranced by the brand.
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22 September 2021, 08:34 AM | #65 | |
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22 September 2021, 08:54 AM | #66 | |
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The typical Spring drive power reserve indicator is best when it's located at the back of the watch. I believe they stuck it on the dial to diffentiate it from other watch technologies and it goes along with the novelty factor I can say that I have one GS, it's an sbgw253 which is my dedicated manual wind dress watch on a strap. IMO, no Rolex in this segment can compare to it on any level as a stand alone dress watch, but I am also embracing manual winds more as I grow older because I enjoy the simplicity of it all. The 9S64 movement is reported to be robust. I am down to 2 Rolex divers and I believe I'm done with Rolex. As they're both DSSD's I can say that I don't think GS can compare with a 116660 DSSD on any level. Especially where the DSSD bracelet is concerned Where the jury is out is with regard to serving. The Rolex watches give access to a first class customer service model that's operating on a global level. Where I live, my GS will automatically be sent back to Japan for any work that's required. How that works out is yet to be determined. If it's as stellar as my experience with sending a Rolex to Geneva, then I'll be very happy indeed Experience at the point of sale is very different as well and largely in accordance with expectations. |
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22 September 2021, 09:11 AM | #67 |
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22 September 2021, 09:14 AM | #68 |
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I own 5 Rolex. They are good watches. I used to own a GS chronograph, a very good watch with GMT but it is a bit large for my wrist. It was sold and now I own a SBGE257.
Grand Seiko churn out a number of watches and three different lines. Some have amazing dials, some are priced too aggressively. The SBGE257 or blue or black in my opinion is the best value. There is no metal ring between the glass and the ceramic bezel. Some other SBGEXXX has the metal ring and that can be easily scratched. The bracelet is not the best compared to Rolex but a leap in improvement. I particularly like the centre link near the end lug makes the bracelet more 3 dimensional. It is higher than the side columns. The end lugs are brushed unlike some Heritage models which are polished which makes a single scratch ruining the overall perfection of the watch. Some comment on the lumes, I have found that is a big improvement. You can now see the time in complete darkness, in a discrete way. The power reserve indicator is “love” or “hate”. There is also an “indifference”. I am indifferent. I do not see that fits very well to the overall design of the dial. I see it as a complication to show the power reserve. The clasp could have been better manufactured. The edges are a bit sharp. The extension feature could also be better designed but this is unlike its big brother, the diving watch. The extension itself is an improvement for this line. I used to have a SBGM029, fiddling the bracelet to fit perfectly was a pain. There is simply no micro holes to adjust the length. There are still a lot of “Heritage” do not have the adjustment feature. The GMT hand is easy to read compared to my Rolex GMT (Batman). Maybe the little triangle is too small or my eyesight has deteriorated as I age. Finally, its thickness which is slightly thicker than a Rolex Milgauss. A little bit thinner will be great. It does not bother that much. It is a sports watch not a dress watch. I do not need to talk about accuracy. My Rolex Explorer 1 is however just as accurate. The pros and cons, or Rolex vs Grand Seiko? They are different watches. When there is shortage in Rolex, pricing in grey markets is insane. It is unfair to compare the two brands. Using the AD pricing to make a comparison, Rolex probably still have the upper hand. Cos there isn’t much in a Rolex watch one can complain about. For a Grand Seiko, one really has to pick, “try it on” may not be enough, one needs to live with it for a week or so to see the flaws in an almost perfectly presented watch. All in all, the SBGE257 is very good value if one is looking for a daily watch or wear it when you travel. It is discrete and does not shout. Forget about the 20 Bar if you really want to go scuba diving. Other than that, you can wear it almost anywhere. To me, this trio from GS is close to perfect. |
22 September 2021, 09:33 AM | #69 |
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GS has some very interesting pieces as far as technology and execution goes. The spring drive watches for instance are their own thing and tell their own story. Not something I’d buy as part of a very small collection or as a single everyday watch (biased towards Swiss history with that). I’d add one to a good sized collection and after having acquired my personal favorites. Probably one of the quintessential understatement watches which is cool in and by itself.
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22 September 2021, 09:38 AM | #70 | |
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I keep hearing different things about that as well, but I believe I have seen it stated to be as long as 35 years after production ceases Spring drive is a curious thing. It's more accurate and stable than mechanical escapement, but it's not as accurate as Quartz. So what's the point? I believe if one wants accuracy above all else then regular servicing and a new battery when it goes flat(as a forcing function) is the best solution If one enjoys the idea of the mechanics, then simply go with a mechanical escapement and be done with it along with timely service intervals Besides, GS seemingly have an interesting new escapement design which may prove to be great |
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22 September 2021, 09:47 AM | #71 | |
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Going through another horror story right now with my wife’s Omega Constellation that apparently was butchered by one of their official subcontractors. Should’ve sent it to Switzerland like I did with my Speedmaster a few times over the years (always top notch). So dealers sending them to GS Japan sounds good to me. |
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22 September 2021, 09:53 AM | #72 | |
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I don't go to events these days, especially with C19 and all that goes with it so I wouldn't be able to comment. When I picked up my sbgw253 I was pleased they had removed the Seiko branding from the dial. I always thought it was superfluous having it on there and cluttered things on the dial unnecessarily whilst cheapening the watch. Let's face it, a Seiko is on a lower tier just as GS is on a lower tier to Credor. Am I an insecure watch snob, or a true WIS? Hopefully neither, as simply speaking I know what I like and have an eye for details |
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22 September 2021, 10:02 AM | #73 | |
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I've seen too many service problems to have a lot of confidence, but it hasn't stopped me from having 2 of them. The 1861 speedy I expect will be straight forward. The early co-axial i have has been to an independent once and is seemingly fine but I may chance it on an Omega service next time. There are great Omega independents around the world. Let's get back on topic before this thread goes pear shaped |
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22 September 2021, 11:10 AM | #74 | |
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I've been a GS fan on and off for 15 years, and have one incoming right now. At current prices, I'm not sure they're a particularly better value than an Omega or something. (it's generally pointless to talk about "value" in this hobby anyway). The current hi-beat movement 9S85, is fantastic, but I don't believe it's on the level of what you'd find in a Rolex (no freesprung balance, etc). This is remedied in the 9SA5, but those only seem to be appearing in the $10k watches. I think with GS, you need to see if the "whole package", their approach to watchmaking appeals to you. I personally would get bored pretty quickly if polishing of the hour markers and sides of the cases were the sole selling points (they are not!). |
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22 September 2021, 12:07 PM | #75 |
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22 September 2021, 12:32 PM | #76 | |
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22 September 2021, 02:13 PM | #77 | |
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22 September 2021, 02:32 PM | #78 |
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Double post.
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22 September 2021, 02:33 PM | #79 |
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I really want to love grand Seiko, as their dials are awesome and I always hear great things about the quality.
But every time I try one on they just seem to be bigger and thicker than they need to be. Who wants a 12mm thick dress watch. And I always find that the bracelets just don't look like they match the case. |
22 September 2021, 03:00 PM | #80 | |
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22 September 2021, 09:46 PM | #81 | |
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22 September 2021, 11:10 PM | #82 |
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Have you seen the newer 9R31 movement watches? Manual wind ; Power reserve on the reverse to leave the dial clean. Anticipating there will be further releases I the SBGY line-out over the next 12 months.
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22 September 2021, 11:27 PM | #83 |
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I don’t like the sword hands, I don't like the bracelets, and I don't like the double branding on the dial. On some models there is SEIKO and GRAND SEIKO on the dial.
I own a vintage SEIKO Chrono with jubilee bracelet. |
22 September 2021, 11:47 PM | #84 |
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Interesting to read multiple comments on "double branding" being a problem on GS dials....
I know someone else who is guilty of this. VERY guilty. |
23 September 2021, 12:10 AM | #85 | |
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I think its the double branding, but rather that it says, in one form or another "Seiko" People will make up all sorts of excuses not to like Grand Seiko, rather than admit snobbishness towards that name, and the frightful notion that people might think they are wearing a cheap watch...
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23 September 2021, 01:10 AM | #86 |
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23 September 2021, 02:02 AM | #87 |
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I've owned Rolexes for four decades (I have a lot, vintage and modern), and I've gotten into Grand Seiko over the last two years, in part because I have a GS Boutique a 5-minute walk from my office and I can see every model all the time (and I do). I've owned/own several GS watches.
Here's my main take on this debate: Rolex rules the watch market with classic but somewhat conservative (aka sometimes boring) watches that are built like tanks. They're very special, for whatever reason, and they have an unmatched history and marketing machine, coupled with a buying frenzy created by genius supply-demand shenanigans. Grand Seiko has the best dials AND cases in the watch industry. Yes, I said it. The quality, finish and design are insane, arguably "better" than Rolex. They're the most interesting, innovative and funky, with super-cool Japanese aesthetics that reference lakes, mountains, cherry blossoms, etc ... No other brand does this. Many of the watches are stunningly beautiful, a description I'd never give to Rolex, which makes solid handsome watches, but that's it. GS movements are also more special and interesting. And can we stop equating Spring Drives with quartz movements? They're completely different. For starters, there is no battery in an SD. The GS bracelets could/should be better, but I'm someone who considers bracelets almost like tires on a car. I swap them out a lot, and I love straps, so that issue is really a non-issue for me. Lastly, unless someone dislikes how virtually ALL watch companies brand their timepieces, stop picking on Grand Seiko. For example, I've never heard anyone complain about Audemars Piguet, and they do the exact same thing on their dials, with the "AP" logo atop "Audemars Piguet." P.S. All Grand Seikos in the U.S. can be serviced by the dedicated GS service center in New Jersey. They do not need to be sent back to Japan. Many things can be said about GS watches, and some guys just don't like them for whatever reason, but you cannot say their styling is "unimaginative." In fact, I'd argue GS design/styling is THE most imaginative in the industry. Who else would design a dial to look like white birch trees in a forest? |
23 September 2021, 08:14 AM | #88 | |
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16618 126710BLRO 116500 LN (White) 228235 228239 SBGK002 |
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23 September 2021, 01:20 PM | #89 |
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wow, you took a great picture of this watch, I think I owned it in a different dial, I think mine was champagne, it kind of changed colors... yes, great watch and certainly up there with and better than many Rolexs that I have owned...
trying to delete, this is in the wrong place, a lil out of practice... Last edited by Tbonewalk; 23 September 2021 at 01:36 PM.. Reason: trying to delete, in the wrong place |
23 September 2021, 02:52 PM | #90 | |
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Last edited by Tbonewalk; 23 September 2021 at 02:53 PM.. Reason: error |
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