Rolex has it exactly backward IMO

[seabreeze]

I may get flamed for this - but its how I feel.
This whole idea of manufactured scarcity (when they build 1 million pieces a year) and having to kiss ass at an AD to hope they sell you something, plays into the lowest base instincts of humanity, and preys upon those who crave validation through luxury brand pea cocking. This is not a luxury experience, nor is it befitting a company who founders and mission seemed to be to create some of the best most reliable timepieces, never the most expensive or the most luxurious or exclusive....these are/were tool watches for chrissakes. I have a 1967 Explorer that was bought in a PX by a chaplain for under $200 who went to 'nam with it....I love the story and I love the watch.

The natural evolution of this brand was increasing quality and increasing prices, and a status symbol effect came about with relentless marketing. Rather than keep the masses out in the cold, peering into the warmth of an AD hoping for crumbs, why not change the experience.

How nice would it be if say someone has $10-$30k to spend that they go to an AD, be greeted warmly, given a bourbon or espresso, take the time to show pieces, graciously take the customers money, special gift wrapping, a nice handwritten thank you note - elevate the experience.


Buying these watches now seems seedy, like buying crack or paying a 2 bit hooker in a back alley.....you get a call, drop what you are doing, agree to maybe a watch you want or not want in haste, or these great gray dealers, no disrespect, but its all email and fedex there is no experience that goes along wih and should be part of the pleasure of the purchase.

These are not scarce or limited edition pieces...Tudors are made en masse by robots. A check of Chronos24 shows like 6800 Rolex subs vs maybe 100 ALS Saxonia ( i can recehck for accuracy but just take the point)

I think Rolex risks becoming a caricature of itself.

I have long been a fan or Rolex.
When I was a young man and didnt think I deserved one there was a time when I was afraid to go into an AD. Like a kid afraid to buy condoms(yes that was a thing)

As i got older and could maybe afford one, but didnt think I deserved one yet, i remember going into my first AD....it was exciting!! I was treated wonderfully. I could have bought any watch in the case.......

When I bought my first and only AD watch, i chose a dealer across country based on some recommendations here because money was and still is an issue and they provided discreet discounts, but it was wonderful....lots of calls emails, a handwritten thank you, chocolates, a followup handwritten hows everything....this company EARNED my money.

I stepped away for a bit precovid and as my son and friends started telling me about watches I was a bit in disbelief but here we are.

I went into my local AD a couple of weeks ago, asked about buying a watch, she was lovely and suggested I "start coming in regularly, start a relationship, get to know a salesperson, inquire about his/her family

Thanks but no thanks This is moving in the complete wrong direction in my opinion. Its the Ticketmaster / Stub hub business model with Hermes pricing.

Just my 2 cents, im sure many will disagree.
I still love them, but I dont love this

Separately and unrelated, I would love to give a nod to this forum, the knowledge in here is priceless. I was reminded of this yesterday when had to get a few watches appraised because insurance is not keeping up, and I worry greatly about the appraiser - who didnt and couldn't possibly know 1 millionth of what people in here know.....holding my breath for his reports.

[WristWatchWonders]

Is scarcity really manufactured or the result of market forces?

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[Marcjvr]

Meh they are just watches. Buying and expecting the “buying experience” to be part of it is just looking to feed the ego

[askdanny]

Originally Posted by seabreeze

I may get flamed for this - but its how I feel.
This whole idea of manufactured scarcity....

False premise.

[bostonjetset]

Originally Posted by seabreeze

How nice would it be if say someone has $10-$30k to spend that they go to an AD, be greeted warmly, given a bourbon or espresso, take the time to show pieces, graciously take the customers money, special gift wrapping, a nice handwritten thank you note - elevate the experience.


Buying these watches now seems seedy, like buying crack or paying a 2 bit hooker in a back alley.....you get a call, drop what you are doing, agree to maybe a watch you want or not want in haste, or these great gray dealers, no disrespect, but its all email and fedex there is no experience that goes along wih and should be part of the pleasure of the purchase.


I went into my local AD a couple of weeks ago, asked about buying a watch, she was lovely and suggested I "start coming in regularly, start a relationship, get to know a salesperson, inquire about his/her family

Thanks but no thanks This is moving in the complete wrong direction in my opinion. Its the Ticketmaster / Stub hub business model with Hermes pricing.

Just my 2 cents, im sure many will disagree.
I still love them, but I dont love this.

It really sucks for sure. Not just Rolex but many luxury brands now, especially after Covid. I was a regular shopper at Hermes for years and after my SA left I felt things got lackluster. No more just popping in for a look; you need an appt or have to wait. May as well just buy from the website rather than queue up outside like you’re waiting to ride Space Mountain. That’s not a luxury experience at all. At least they have product to sell you though.

[Krash]

I don't believe it's a manufactured scarcity. I believe demand has exceeded supply, and they haven't been able to keep up with it. They're opening new manufacturing facilities, and this may help to a point, but even that might not be enough.

[askdanny]

There's Rolex S.A. which manufactures and distributes the watches.

And then there are Rolex Authorized Dealers.

I've spoken to reps at Rolex S.A. in Geneva and they're aware (and frustrated) how Rolex ADs choose clients and anger others. Rolex S.A. wants to introduce more people to the World of Rolex, not the few richest.

Rolex ADs want to reward high spenders.

Rolex S.A. is now investing $1 billion into a new manufacture and bought the largest Rolex retailer in the world.

I believe Rolex S.A. is moving in the right direction.

--Danny

[Afterglow]

This is one of the best posts (OP) I have read on this forum. I agree 100%.

[espanol]

Originally Posted by seabreeze

I went into my local AD a couple of weeks ago, asked about buying a watch, she was lovely and suggested I "start coming in regularly, start a relationship, get to know a salesperson, inquire about his/her family

Thanks but no thanks

Perfectly sums up why modern Rolex has no appeal to me anymore. How these practices became normalized is beyond me.

[Calatrava r]

One million watches per year in a world with over seven billion people? Once the desire to own Rolex took off globally from social media and such, there may be well over a hundred million potential buyers. No one knows the actual numbers. It is amazing as many folks who want Rolex watches are able to get them within a reasonable timeframe at this point.

I do not think anyone ten years ago could have predicted the current popularity of mechanical timepieces in the then growing digital era of wearable devices and cellphones.

With it comes a change in how watches are delivered and by whom. Getting the watches they want are most people's priority, hence the evolving marketplace.

[brandrea]

Times have certainly changed that’s for sure.

I’m lucky to have a great AD I guess.

I don’t bother popping in to random ADs anymore like I used to, it’s just not fun and there’s minimal inventory to handle. CPO watches are fun to see though

[emersm]

I disagree with "manufactured scarcity".

Twenty or thirty years ago most people only had one Rolex.

Rolex popularity has skyrocketed over the past decade and a half and people want to own more than one

I bought my first Rolex in 2005 and it was my one and only for about 7 or 8 years. Now, I own multiple references.

Take a look on the forum and see how many members have multiples in their collections.

Supply and demand, in my opinion.

[Wrathchild]

OP, End of the day, it’s just a watch. No one is asking you to kiss the ass of a AD.
Many other things out in the world in which you could find enjoyment.

[Watcheroo]

Don’t agree with manufactured scarcity. The mix of growth in global wealth and social media has created a marked uptick in demand for not just Rolex, but many quality luxury brands.

Rolex has evolved since its founding, as everything naturally does. I think that if they could have, they would have produced the same quality of watch that we have today, all those years ago. Evolution in manufacturing technology got us here.

I also agree with the earlier comment regarding the buying experience. Unless they shut the store down and bring my watch out with Champaign bottles and sparklers, a courteous exchange and walking out with my purchase satisfies me plenty. Anything in between is just fluff. Maybe sometimes fun, but fluff.

Price. It is what it is. Many could afford buying a condo in Manhattan when Rolex was founded. Not the case today.

[Chadridv]

Of all the things said, everyone seems to be hung up on the manufactured scarcity remark. I think there supply and demand issue is real to a certain extent, however I do believe there has been some serious manipulation. ADs have been directed to withhold certain pieces for only VIP clients.

That alone is enough evidence to at least argue the supply level has been manipulated. I’ve had different SAs from the same chain give me completely different inventory lists and state them as fact.

I used to work with a woman (that has since quit, which sucks btw) and she was always honest with me. She told me once they had 7 hulks in the system (across 4 stores), but said honestly it’s not looking good for me to get any of them. Another SA from a different store told me the same day they haven’t had one come through the inventory across all stores in a year.

[Watcheroo]

Originally Posted by Chadridv

Of all the things said, everyone seems to be hung up on the manufactured scarcity remark. I think there supply and demand issue is real to a certain extent, however I do believe there has been some serious manipulation. ADs have been directed to withhold certain pieces for only VIP clients.

That alone is enough evidence to at least argue the supply level has been manipulated. I’ve had different SAs from the same chain give me completely different inventory lists and state them as fact.

I used to work with a woman (that has since quit, which sucks btw) and she was always honest with me. She told me once they had 7 hulks in the system (across 4 stores), but said honestly it’s not looking good for me to get any of them. Another SA from a different store told me the same day they haven’t had one come through the inventory across all stores in a year.

If the premise is faulty, it needs to be clarified.

Stating the obvious here, but Rolex is a private luxury company. They don’t produce anything essential. Inventory management is up to them. Not us; as much as I’d like that to be the case!

[Chadridv]

Originally Posted by Watcheroo

If the premise is faulty, it needs to be clarified.

Stating the obvious here, but Rolex is a private luxury company. They don’t produce anything essential. Inventory management is up to them. Not us; as much as I’d like that to be the case!

I agree, they can operate anyway they’d like whether we agree, get angry or frustrated. Not sure how your response has anything to do with my comment though.

[Roger Lococco]

Pretty good post. I think that the Rolex brand has taken some damage in the past several years.


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[Jb1264]

Some have likened the current experience as the coin pusher game

Build a profile/establish a ‘relationship’ buying jewellery is one coin inserted

Buy another brand Watch - that’s another coin

It’s anyone’s guess if those coins actually move the watch

Your efforts could come to nought if your SA leaves or the AD no longer sells the crown

[jamesbondOO7]

Originally Posted by emersm

I disagree with "manufactured scarcity".

Twenty or thirty years ago most people only had one Rolex.

Rolex popularity has skyrocketed over the past decade and a half and people want to own more than one

I bought my first Rolex in 2005 and it was my one and only for about 7 or 8 years. Now, I own multiple references.

Take a look on the forum and see how many members have multiples in their collections.

Supply and demand, in my opinion.

I agree, I bought my first in 1986 and kept it as the only one for more then 25 years.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by Roger Lococco

Pretty good post. I think that the Rolex brand has taken some damage in the past several years.


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I think we’re confusing Rolex with Disney.

Rolex sells every watch they make and demand far exceeds supply. Rolex is more popular than ever.

Disney, on the other hand, lost close to a billion dollars on the last ten movies they released.


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[Roger Lococco]

Originally Posted by Krash

I think we’re confusing Rolex with Disney.

Rolex sells every watch they make and demand far exceeds supply. Rolex is more popular than ever.

Disney, on the other hand, lost close to a billion dollars on the last ten movies they released.


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I am not confusing Rolex with Disney and stand by my statement. From your post, I’m assuming Disney has an issue with its product :)

In my view, Rolex has a problem with its ‘sales force’, which in part represents the brand and impacts how people think about the company. Over time, the past several years will not be viewed by Rolex as positive.


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[Krash]

Originally Posted by Roger Lococco

I am not confusing Rolex with Disney and stand by my statement. In my view, Rolex has a problem with its ‘sales force’.


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Okay, so let’s use the right terms. You said Rolex is damaged. What you really mean is that you don’t like how the sales force operates.

EDIT: I noticed you edited your post. Rolex is not at risk. Certainly not like other companies that have serious fundamental problems with their operating models.


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[CaptT]

There’s currently some “manufactured scarcity” at the dealer level (not all ADs).

Whether by design - or the fact that consumer demand now/still outstrips capacity - there’s scarcity as a result of how much Rolex is manufacturing and/or releasing to dealers.

It’s unfortunate; the intended benefit of creating more brand allure does create a poor experience for many customers, in particular enthusiasts as well as those new to Rolex and aspiring to their first Rolex watch purchase.

It also has the unintended long term impact of alienating customers and thus not growing their customer base, which is part of the reason Rolex is asking ADs to allocate a certain % of of their inventory to new clients.

There’s a happy medium, and the pendulum is swinging in that direction.

[Roger Lococco]

Originally Posted by Krash

Okay, so let’s use the right terms. You said Rolex is damaged. What you really mean is that you don’t like how the sales force operates.

EDIT: I noticed you edited your post. Rolex is not at risk. Certainly not like other companies that have serious fundamental problems with their operating models.


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I’m using the right terms.

Yes, I believe that a sales force impacts a brand.

No, I did not say that Rolex as a company is ‘at risk’.


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[Nice marmot]

Originally Posted by Afterglow

This is one of the best posts (OP) I have read on this forum. I agree 100%.

Agree.

[JTL31]

Originally Posted by seabreeze

Separately and unrelated, I would love to give a nod to this forum, the knowledge in here is priceless. I was reminded of this yesterday when had to get a few watches appraised because insurance is not keeping up, and I worry greatly about the appraiser - who didnt and couldn't possibly know 1 millionth of what people in here know.....holding my breath for his reports.

If you haven’t already, look into Hodinkee as a possible insurance choice. You can adjust the monetary value of your watch based on the current market. They didn’t request an appraisal from me when I used them for discontinued models.

[seabreeze]

Originally Posted by JTL31

If you haven’t already, look into Hodinkee as a possible insurance choice. You can adjust the monetary value of your watch based on the current market. They didn’t request an appraisal from me when I used them for discontinued models.

Thank you I will. I read somewhere here. I think that someone had trouble getting them to pay a claim.


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[ArtNouveau]

Originally Posted by seabreeze

Thank you I will. I read somewhere here. I think that someone had trouble getting them to pay a claim.


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I have heard nothing negative about them, I am in my 3rd year of insuring with Hodinkee.

[Nico81]

Can we stop with these “scarcity” and cutting back inventory

There was never any holding back, cutting production , or similar
ADs did capitalize on situation by chosing where watch will be sold

The 2020 -2022 Hype and subsequent crash of 2023 ,it was simply an influx of $ as a result of post covid money supply of low int rates,
QE, printing, covid fraud, bitcoin, money laundering, and at the end of it all speculative behavior ( prices always going up) that caused surge in demand and had upward impact on pricing ( many asset classes experienced significant growth and irrational movements but Rolex being liquid and “mobile” asset had a higher trajectory )
Now, demand dropped significantly and only a handful of models are selling at much lower premiums
Gold professional rolex are selling as much as 20% below retail these days ( blue white gold submariner for example)
Party is over, but some ADs still didnt get the memo but will soon

Thats what happened… there was no secret board meetings by Rolex executives in dungeons under Geneva to cut supply and have fake scarcity strategy


Now, lets to back to posting beautiful pictures of these machines and asking technical questions


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