AFC Championship time....

[mannyv11]

what about Aaron rogers admitting that he over inflates the footballs?
why is no one talking about that?

[Kingair]

Saw yesterday the 'air' problem

But what makes the difference ?

The balls where under inflated but . . . for both teams playing with these balls ?

So . . . . ?

I don't get it . . .

[linesiders]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

what about Aaron rogers admitting that he over inflates the footballs?
why is no one talking about that?

Because it is the Patriots, silly. They are the only team that cheats.
/sarc

Originally Posted by Kingair

Saw yesterday the 'air' problem

But what makes the difference ?

The balls where under inflated but . . . for both teams ?

So . . . . ?

The benefits are apparently negligible. Both teams bring a set of footballs that are inspected so the Colts has their own set of balls (did I just say that?) and the Patriots had a set as well as a backup set.

[wantonebad]

No Mark, both teams use their own balls, and under inflating can give a grip advantage especially in bad weather.

[mtrunner]

Originally Posted by Kingair

Saw yesterday the 'air' problem

But what makes the difference ?

The balls where under inflated but . . . for both teams playing with these balls ?

So . . . . ?

I don't get it . . .

Each team brings their own balls and when they play on offense their balls are used. So the underinflated balls, which are easier to grip and catch, were only used by the Patriots. Ironically, the balls used for kickoff are supplied by the factory. Leave it to the NFL to make things beyond complicated.

But when it comes down to it, the Colts were absolutely terrible and there is no way they can blame the balls for the loss. Well maybe they can, since they clearly had no balls that day the way they played.

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

what about Aaron rogers admitting that he over inflates the footballs?
why is no one talking about that?

He also said, that his equipment manager puts more air in, but the officials take air out before the game when they test the balls.

He prefers a stiffer (more inflated) ball, but the officials test each ball prior to the game and take the PSI down to the spec level.

If they aren't out of spec during the game, which we all assume they are not with the Packer balls, then there is nothing to talk about.

[Tripp11]

IF, and that's a big IF, the Patriots are found to have tampered with the balls and purposely deflated them 2 PSI (or more) after the officials checked them, then the NFL should come down heavy on the team.

The difficult part for the NFL will be proving who knew what and when did they know it. BB might just deflect and it ends up being some low level equipment flunky that takes the fall and is fired.

If, and it's a big IF again, BB had knowledge and it can be proven, at least one year suspension, large fine, and loss of draft pick(s) would be appropriate, IMO.

[azguy]

Originally Posted by Tripp11

If, and it's a big IF again, BB had knowledge and it can be proven, at least one year suspension, large fine, and loss of draft pick(s) would be appropriate, IMO.

Seriously

Bitter Indy fan

We would have beat you guys using a tennis ball

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by azguy

Seriously

Bitter Indy fan

We would have beat you guys using a tennis ball

It has nothing to do with the Colts/Pats result. Absolutely nothing. As I stated in my other post, I would feel the same way if it were the Bengals versus Ravens.

And where did I state that properly inflated balls would have made a difference in the result? I didn't. Because it wouldn't have made a difference. The Patriots have been a better team as of late, period.

But you'll believe what you want to believe I guess.

[linesiders]

Tripp - we are just used to hearing this, including outlandish responses by fans of other teams.

I fully concur that after a proper investigation is completed a proper punishment should be handed down. But we are talking a low level infraction.

People are calling with wild eyed rage fire and brimstone for the firing of Belechik, removing Brady from the SuperBowl, kicking the Patriots out the league for a year, having the Colts or Ravens represent the AFC and all sorts of overarching penalties.

This was a misdemeanor offense and should be treated as such.

[Pix]

My understanding is under the NFL rules they can only be fined 25k, pocket change to go to the Superbowl.

[Baco Noir]

I've also read that the NFL refs are lax on doing these checks and they may not have been completed.. I know that Manning and Brady were the impetus behind having the run changed so they could use their own balls, but I think this price ledge should be revoked.


Sent from my iPad (so I blame autocorrect for the spellin' errs)

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by Tripp11

He also said, that his equipment manager puts more air in, but the officials take air out before the game when they test the balls.

He prefers a stiffer (more inflated) ball, but the officials test each ball prior to the game and take the PSI down to the spec level.

If they aren't out of spec during the game, which we all assume they are not with the Packer balls, then there is nothing to talk about.

you know what they say about assuming.....

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by linesiders

Tripp - we are just used to hearing this, including outlandish responses by fans of other teams.

I fully concur that after a proper investigation is completed a proper punishment should be handed down. But we are talking a low level infraction.

People are calling with wild eyed rage fire and brimstone for the firing of Belechik, removing Brady from the SuperBowl, kicking the Patriots out the league for a year, having the Colts or Ravens represent the AFC and all sorts of overarching penalties.

This was a misdemeanor offense and should be treated as such.

If the Spygate penalty was $250,000 fine for the team, $500,000 fine for BB, and the loss of draft pick(s), then I believe this penalty will be more than just a slap on the wrist. And Spygate was allegedly the Patriots filming opposing signals from an improper location.

NFL rules stated "no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches' booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game." They also say all video for coaching purposes must be shot from locations "enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead." That was re-emphasized in a memo sent Sept. 6 to NFL head coaches and general managers. In it, Ray Anderson, the league's executive vice president of football operations, wrote:"Videotaping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent's offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches' booth, in the locker room or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game."

Roger Goodell can employ language in the NFL constitution to increase the penalty, if he sees fit. Along those lines, Article 8.13 of the constitution makes clear that Roger Goodell shall review accusations against teams for violating rules "affecting the competitive aspects of the game" and issue an appropriate penalty. Article 8.14 is also potentially relevant, as it authorizes Roger Goodell to hear disputes between teams that "involve or affect League policy." So, in my opinion, I believe the NFL has the flexibility to punish the Patriots to a more severe degree than just what is stated in the rules for Balls.

I guess we will just have to disagree about this being a minor offense. I thought Spygate was much more minor than what is being alleged in this case.

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by Pix

My understanding is under the NFL rules they can only be fined 25k, pocket change to go to the Superbowl.

Roger Goodell can employ language in the NFL constitution to increase the penalty, if he sees fit. Along those lines, Article 8.13 of the constitution makes clear that Roger Goodell shall review accusations against teams for violating rules "affecting the competitive aspects of the game" and issue an appropriate penalty. Article 8.14 is also potentially relevant, as it authorizes Roger Goodell to hear disputes between teams that "involve or affect League policy." So, in my opinion, I believe the NFL has the flexibility to punish the Patriots to a more severe degree than just what is stated in the rules for Balls.

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

you know what they say about assuming.....

Do you have proof the Packer balls were out of spec?

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by Tripp11

Do you have proof the Packer balls were out of spec?

No point in arguing with you about it. I think spygate is a much bigger deal than this and I am a pats fan. But hey i will just agree to disagree. In the end we will see what the NFL decides to do, but no matter what it won't be enough in some fans eyes.

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

No point in arguing with you about it. I think spygate is a much bigger deal than this and I am a pats fan. But hey i will just agree to disagree. In the end we will see what the NFL decides to do, but no matter what it won't be enough in some fans eyes.

You mean BB's head on a stick wouldn't be enough?



I agree, it doesn't matter what they do, someone will find fault with it.

The talk of replaying the game or dumping them from the Superbowl is just silliness.

By the way, I've repeatedly told my friends the Patriots were simply the better team. You don't get thrashed 45-7 and think any sort of under inflated ball was the cause of that. Even Colts players have agreed. Plus, BB is a genius coach and he gets the best out of players most others wouldn't take a chance with (i.e. Randy Moss).

IF this is true, I just don't know why they would do it. They don't need to do it. They are a superior team.

[Ed Rooney]

Originally Posted by azguy

Seriously



Bitter Indy fan



We would have beat you guys using a tennis ball

I doubt this was the first time the pats played with their balls. Maybe Indy wasn't in the game, but the Ravens certainly were.

[mannyv11]

the only question i want to pose is this.

The refs touch the ball on EVERY DOWN. they catch the balls from the players, place them at the line of scrimmage, line measurements etc etc.
this was supposedly caught because a colts player picked off tom brady (even though the colts player says he didn't say anything) and it lead to all of this.

don't you think the refs the refs should have noticed how "deflated" the ball was every time they touched it and put some pressure on it?

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by Tripp11

You mean BB's head on a stick wouldn't be enough?



I agree, it doesn't matter what they do, someone will find fault with it.

The talk of replaying the game or dumping them from the Superbowl is just silliness.

By the way, I've repeatedly told my friends the Patriots were simply the better team. You don't get thrashed 45-7 and think any sort of under inflated ball was the cause of that. Even Colts players have agreed. Plus, BB is a genius coach and he gets the best out of players most others wouldn't take a chance with (i.e. Randy Moss).

IF this is true, I just don't know why they would do it. They don't need to do it. They are a superior team.

I agree if it is true i don't really understand why they would do it either. At least wait until the first half is over and see how close the game is lol. THEN mess with the balls if its close

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

the only question i want to pose is this.

The refs touch the ball on EVERY DOWN. they catch the balls from the players, place them at the line of scrimmage, line measurements etc etc.
this was supposedly caught because a colts player picked off tom brady (even though the colts player says he didn't say anything) and it lead to all of this.

don't you think the refs the refs should have noticed how "deflated" the ball was every time they touched it and put some pressure on it?

A former NFL referee addressed this very question on ESPN yesterday. He said the referee is too concerned with spotting the ball and running back to his position before the ball is snapped - and that there's not much "squeezing" of the ball like a QB would do or like a WR or RB would do when catching and securing and carrying.

He also said it was wet and windy which would lessen the feel.

[Tripp11]

This might be the first time, ever, that most of the country will be watching the Media Day coverage before the Superbowl.

Hell, TMZ might even be there. LOL

[azguy]

I'm tired of level playing field talk, how many guys are taking HGH or steroids in the NFL or my favorite adderall...how many other QB's mess with their balls, play with air pressure, scuff them up or receivers that have dab of stick-em on there finger tips.

People are just pissed about the ineligible receiver stuff against the Ravens and it snowballed into this past week.

I hope they throttle the Seahawks and laugh at everyone after the game...

In baseball, bats are corked, balls are doctored and signs are stolen, in hockey sticks are used with to much curve, goalies wear over sized jerseys...if you are cheating you're not trying, I don't condone or advocate a level playing field, it's about winning.

This isn't Pop Warner it's the NFL and a freakin $10 Billion industry, the NFL should put the refs in charge of the game day ball and when they teams come out for the opening kickoff they say "here are today's balls, good luck"

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by azguy

I'm tired of level playing field talk, how many guys are taking HGH or steroids...how many other QB's mess with their balls, play with air pressure, scuff them up or receivers that have dab of stick-em on there finger tips.

People are just pissed about the ineligible receiver stuff against the Ravens and it snowballed into this past week.

I hope they throttle the Seahawks and laugh at everyone after the game...

In baseball, bats are corked, balls are doctored and signs are stolen, in hockey sticks are used with to much curve, goalies wear over sized jerseys...if you are cheating you're not trying, I don't condone or advocate a level playing field...

I personally was not pissed about the ineligible receiver issue. They complied with the NFL rule, and did nothing wrong. Hell, even a week later, the Colts weren't entirely prepared for that play. Great coaching guys! LOL

We'll have to disagree with your last comment. You don't want a level playing field for any sport and you seem fine with people cheating. I simply disagree.

Where does it stop with some people? Does that carry into their occupation/business as well? Or their marriage?

And hopefully, such a mantra isn't taught to any children along the way. Or we'll be raising an entire populace of cheaters and unethical citizens.

[GradyPhilpott]

Originally Posted by azguy

I'm tired of level playing field talk, how many guys are taking HGH or steroids...how many other QB's mess with their balls, play with air pressure, scuff them up or receivers that have dab of stick-em on there finger tips.

People are just pissed about the ineligible receiver stuff against the Ravens and it snowballed into this past week.

I hope they throttle the Seahawks and laugh at everyone after the game...

In baseball, bats are corked, balls are doctored and signs are stolen, in hockey sticks are used with to much curve, goalies wear over sized jerseys...if you are cheating you're not trying, I don't condone or advocate a level playing field...

Wow! It's really something to hear someone brag about his lack of character.

I pity you, but I guess a lack of conscience is an anxiety-free way to go through life.

There's a clinical term for that, but I'll proffer that you're not interested and besides, there's little anyone can do to help.

[GradyPhilpott]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

.

don't you think the refs the refs should have noticed how "deflated" the ball was every time they touched it and put some pressure on it?

Yes, they should have noticed.

They handle the balls more than most football players and they do it week in and week out for years.

If you've ever handled any material that has consistent characteristics, you know it is very obvious when you encounter a specimen that is significantly out of spec.

The officials definitely should have noticed, but I think we all know that the quality of officiating over the years has declined dramatically.

The refs turn a blind eye to far too many infractions, to the point of making a farce of the game.

Originally Posted by Tripp11

A former NFL referee addressed this very question on ESPN yesterday. He said the referee is too concerned with spotting the ball and running back to his position before the ball is snapped - and that there's not much "squeezing" of the ball like a QB would do or like a WR or RB would do when catching and securing and carrying.

He also said it was wet and windy which would lessen the feel.

I'm not buying that.

[wantonebad]

This seems to be going well...

[Bulldog21]

Originally Posted by wantonebad

This seems to be going well...

Ok, Broncos fan here. So no dog in this fight, just my opinion. As stated above, I do not believe the ball pressure would have changed the outcome of the game what so ever. However, that is also saying Barry Bonds or Lance Armstrong would have still hit that many home runs or won that many races with or with out performance enhancing drugs. We will just never know, so in my book there will always be an * next to the Patriots win especially if they go on to win the Super bowl.

[Tripp11]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

I'm not buying that.

Seemed plausible to me, but I understand why you would have your doubts.

Lots of talking heads and ex-players teeing up Tom Brady now as the fall guy and suggesting he HAD to have known about the pressure of the balls. He's supposed to speak at 4:00 EST today.