Does Rolex really track re-sales?

[Gary.]

Originally Posted by Cigars&Watches

I believe Rolex cares. This current flipping craze cannot be good for the Rolex in the long term as a business model. Rolex doesn’t want to be associated with a side hustle image that will tarnish their brand. I believe Rolex truly wants their watches to go to the watch lovers and enthusiasts first and foremost. This philosophy is one of the reasons Rolex has been such a great brand for so long. There are too many stories about ADs being sanctioned for selling to flippers as well that illustrate their desire to do what they can.

That is also my understanding.

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by Cigars&Watches

I believe Rolex cares. This current flipping craze cannot be good for the Rolex in the long term as a business model. Rolex doesn’t want to be associated with a side hustle image that will tarnish their brand. I believe Rolex truly wants their watches to go to the watch lovers and enthusiasts first and foremost. This philosophy is one of the reasons Rolex has been such a great brand for so long. There are too many stories about ADs being sanctioned for selling to flippers as well that illustrate their desire to do what they can.

This

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by pierson

I’ve heard stories, especially with stuff like the stainless Daytona, but are they really true?

No. How would they know and why would they care?

My AD avoids flippers although the benefit of the doubt is always given in the first instance. Obvious flippers don't get repeat service because it can damage the AD's reputation. They are a long established local independent business with a customer base spanning generations. They don't want to be seen as flipper feeders. In the long term it could hurt them.

All these "Rolex policies" you hear about are usually AD policy hiding behind a Rolex shield, although there will be terms and conditions in their franchise agreements. Once they have paid Rolex for their consignment they can sell it to whoever they like. Same as you can once you have bought it from a dealer. It's your property.

They do get policed by Rolex (and others) to check on their professional conduct, standards, and to ensure that they fit the image of a Rolex AD. They get phone calls, emails and occasional walk ins.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by pierson

Hypothetically, I were to trade in a Rolex with another dealer, other than my AD, and they were to list it for sale, would that get back to my AD? Or, even worse, would Rolex track it back to them?

I’ve heard stories, especially with stuff like the stainless Daytona, but are they really true?

95% sure I’m not going to trade (I wouldn’t be selling), but more curious on everyone’s experience in this strange world where retail is so much less than market.


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Does Rolex really track re-sales?. Only in internet fantasy land.

[defmix]

I have it on very good authority that Rolex do take an extremely dim view of a 'hot' watch ending up being resold quickly after sale.
The reason AD's are becoming quite decerning when selling is for that very reason

[padi56]

Originally Posted by defmix

I have it on very good authority that Rolex do take an extremely dim view of a 'hot' watch ending up being resold quickly after sale.
The reason AD's are becoming quite decerning when selling is for that very reason

And I have it on very good authority that Rolex or any AD could not care less once any Rolex is sold to any Tom,Dick or Harry thats buys them.

[MrGoat]

.

[MrGoat]

Originally Posted by padi56

And I have it on very good authority that Rolex or any AD could not care less once any Rolex is sold to any Tom,Dick or Harry thats buys them.

Originally Posted by padi56

Does Rolex really track re-sales?. Only in internet fantasy land.

X2


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[1William]

I am familiar with a true whale of a consumer of watches/jewelry and other expensive items. He buys/sells/trades at will. He buys directly from AD's and has an amazing collection of PP watches. He rounds out a lot of deals with a Rolex or two and does not think anything of then selling those watches or gifting them to family or friends who many then sell. He paid either 200K or 300K on a limited PP and got a white dial Daytona-C to close out the deal, at retail. In speaking with him he does not flip the PP watches but for Rolex he told me he does what he wants. Point of the story is the AD is making so much money off this guy that they are willing to look the other way on the Rolex watches or just simply do not care. Mostly internet rumors or Sales Associates/Managers/Owners at AD's spreading false information intentionally. Just like most AD's do have inventory but it is not displayed and it is not for you or me. We give these AD's a lot of wiggle room on the statements they make because many hope to get into the good graces and buy a sought after watch at retail. I get it but I also do not like being consistently lied to and manipulated. I am fortunate that my finances and my watches experience lets me buy what I want from our Trusted Sellers without all of the drama at the AD's.

[dnuggett]

Originally Posted by padi56

And I have it on very good authority that Rolex or any AD could not care less once any Rolex is sold to any Tom,Dick or Harry thats buys them.

With many ADs your "very good authority" is wrong. Many ADs try not to sell to someone who they feel will flip the watch.

[1665fan]

I know of 1 AD that doesn’t sell to flippers or outta towners……..Rolex has caught them selling to flippers so they don’t take the chance anymore

[padi56]

Originally Posted by dnuggett

With many ADs your "very good authority" is wrong. Many ADs try not to sell to someone who they feel will flip the watch.

First how would any AD know anyone is going to flip any watch that anyone bought from there retail store. Yes there are most all Rolex so called hot modes on the grey market at crazy prices. So do these so called VIP or AD relationship customers then sell back to the grey market .Or do you think that the ADs sell direct out of the backdoor, thus putting there business and livelihood at risk. All ADs are in business for one thing only and thats to sell as many of there products to anyone who enters there retail store. Once its sold Rolex or the AD could not care what happens to it after, as both AD and Rolex have made a nice profit on the sale.

[MrGoat]

Originally Posted by dnuggett

With many ADs your "very good authority" is wrong. Many ADs try not to sell to someone who they feel will flip the watch.

I walked in to my “grey” dealer a while back. Got to talking watches and I told him about a watch I saw at the AD. His exact words were “we got a call about that a month or so ago, decided against it.” I seriously doubt in today’s market any men’s sports model would sit in an AD’s case for a month without being pounced on.


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[zengineer]

Originally Posted by MRBolton

If Rolex doesn’t care, then why does the AD?

It's important to the AD to know that some of their customers flip watches. This knowledge allows them to sleep at night when they sell half of every shipment out the back door to "trusted sellers".

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[77T]

I have one AD with whom I’ve had a conversation on the topic. He was co-owner and we were friends for years before the demand went through the roof across the board - right about the time the 116500 was launched.

The conversation was whether RUSA was actually difficult to deal with. He did share, among other retail practices, that the Daytona ushered in a new angle of “know your customer”. RUSA didn’t tell them how to do it, but the goal was to discourage a pattern of dealers buying up inventory.

He didn’t care for the “training” on fulfillment practices like holding the warranty card on file, or making all SA’s remove stickers before delivery at the counter. They complied in the same manner as keeping all display cases pure Rolex and Estate Sale Rolexes in a separate area.

It sounded like the systematic conversations US Federal Agencies had with banks about large cash transactions to avoid drug money laundering last Century.

In the end, the AD bought a CRM system for their own reasons - but it also fulfilled the RUSA request to “know your customer”…this hasn’t been a topic for many years with him since then.

So I do know a bit about RUSA sales policy of the past - can’t imagine they have loosened up since then.


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[dnuggett]

Originally Posted by padi56

First how would any AD know anyone is going to flip any watch that anyone bought from there retail store.

Because flippers get known.

Originally Posted by padi56

Yes there are most all Rolex so called hot modes on the grey market at crazy prices. So do these so called VIP or AD relationship customers then sell back to the grey market.

I don't know or care. But none of that invalidates what I said.

Originally Posted by padi56

Or do you think that the ADs sell direct out of the backdoor, thus putting there business and livelihood at risk.

Some folks sure think they do. I don't know. But what I do know is you can't say they don't care who they sell to and then turn around and say who they sell to can put their business or livelihood at risk.

Originally Posted by padi56

All ADs are in business for one thing only and thats to sell as many of there products to anyone who enters there retail store.

As I said, some care more than others who they sell to. The market is hot enough where they can be picky. And clearly they are. Your own posts (and the disdain) acknowledge that. You can't act like the practice disgusts you and then turn around and act like it doesn't exist.

Originally Posted by padi56

Once its sold Rolex or the AD could not care what happens to it after, as both AD and Rolex have made a nice profit on the sale.

In business, and especially in luxury goods, there is a thing called reputation. It matters. In fact it matters more than anything else. If you think Rolex or the better ADs don't understand that and they don't try to manage their reputation then well, ok. You just keep on thinking that.

[malba2366]

Historically Rolex has turned a blind eye to this and other bad actions by ADS (ie. requiring purchase of other items to get a Rolex), as it allowed for them to continue this system where they could produce whatever they wanted and the dealers would accept the inventory. The dealers needed an avenue to offload this inventory so the grey market worked for everyone. Rolex got the logistic ease of not having to match supply to demand, the dealers made money and the greys made money.

Now the situation has gotten completely out of hand where some the bigger Grey dealers have more inventory on hand than all the big sellers in Manhattan put together. Obviously many of the ADs have decided to sell large portions of their inventory to grey sellers. The current situation is a very bad look for Rolex, and I think they realize it is damaging their brand..hence their press release to yahoo news. Who knows how they will act, because they will eventually need the grey market again if they want to just keep making whatever they want and pushing it onto dealers who are obligated to buy what they are given. They have shown a historic unwillingness to tailor their output to demand, which is a bit difficult to understand as they are not in the business of making high horology models - seems to me that this is the only real way to get rid of the grey market if this is really what they want to do.

[teck21]

Originally Posted by malba2366

Historically Rolex has turned a blind eye to this and other bad actions by ADS (ie. requiring purchase of other items to get a Rolex), as it allowed for them to continue this system where they could produce whatever they wanted and the dealers would accept the inventory. The dealers needed an avenue to offload this inventory so the grey market worked for everyone. Rolex got the logistic ease of not having to match supply to demand, the dealers made money and the greys made money.

Now the situation has gotten completely out of hand where some the bigger Grey dealers have more inventory on hand than all the big sellers in Manhattan put together. Obviously many of the ADs have decided to sell large portions of their inventory to grey sellers. The current situation is a very bad look for Rolex, and I think they realize it is damaging their brand..hence their press release to yahoo news. Who knows how they will act, because they will eventually need the grey market again if they want to just keep making whatever they want and pushing it onto dealers who are obligated to buy what they are given. They have shown a historic unwillingness to tailor their output to demand, which is a bit difficult to understand as they are not in the business of making high horology models - seems to me that this is the only real way to get rid of the grey market if this is really what they want to do.

You have missed out the very important detail whereby this practice used to be condoned only because Rolex produced more watches than could be sold at MSRP at ADs.

The only way Rolex could sell its entire annual production was to allow ADs to sell old stock to greys at cost, or close to it in order to make room for new Rolex stock.

The situation has changed in recent years whereby greys are no longer needed to perform this function because ADs can move all product by themselves at zero discount.

Large scale AD to grey sales are nonsense today in most markets.

Grey market availability is still just a fraction of annual Rolex production.

Almost every Rolex watch produced today still finds its way to the end user directly from an AD.


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[smallcollector]

Originally Posted by padi56

.Or do you think that the ADs sell direct out of the backdoor, thus putting there business and livelihood at risk. All ADs are in business for one thing only and thats to sell as many of there products to anyone who enters there retail store.

CD Peacock -- busted for back door sales - still unclear if Rolex cares or not