Are you actually "getting your money back"?

[Brew]

Getting my $$ back? Not yet. I guess I'll have to sell one to do that. So far, it's been a total "loss" . . . .

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by SS Oyster

The only two options (choices) for voting don't make sense to me.

Exactly. People need to understand sunk cost. Impossible to vote in a poll that makes no sense.

Originally Posted by padi56

Have to agree gone are the days when you bought a Rolex watch to wear in good health hopefully for many years.With many of today's Rolex owners they are no longer watches bought to be worn and enjoyed, now to many Rolex are no longer watches just seen as little more than$$$$$$££££££.

As always Peter, spot on.

Very few here are actually interested in watches any longer.

[brandrea]

If I thought about “how much can I sell it for” or “what will this be worth” before buying a watch, I know it’s not the right watch for me.

[HiDive]

There are not enough choices on your poll. I almost always buy from the same authorized dealer and usually get a price at or below retail. I have never resold a Rolex for less than I paid for it. I normally keep them for quite a few years and I have always bought high demand watches - divers and GMT's - Submariners, Seadwellers, GMT's and a Deepsea. My first Seadweller cost $900 new and the first Sub was $250 used.

[Brew]

Originally Posted by brandrea

If I thought about “how much can I sell it for” or “what will this be worth” before buying a watch, I know it’s not the right watch for me.

I agree.

The other indicator for me is if I find myself asking, "Is it worth it?"

If I ask, it's not.

[zengineer]

I can't see the poll on my phone but sounds like it's got the typical issues. Designing a poll is an actual skill.

You have to separate out the case of hot SS Rolex sport models that you might be lucky enough to buy at an AD. When that happens, you are buying at a price artificially below market value and yes you will do fine if you sell. I think it's called flipping.

For any other watch from any brand it comes down to buying smart. If a brand, like Omega or Grand Seiko, sells in mint used condition for 75% or MSRP....then don't buy new and if you must don't pay MSRP. I have a few non Rolex watches that I could sell for right around what I paid 2, 5, 8 years ago but that's because I bought them used and they are fairly classic designs. If I sold them on a forum I might come out ahead, if I have to resort to Ebay it may push the net under what I paid. Think of it as cheap watch rental.

For the non white hot Rolex models most will hold value as well or better over time compared to most brands.

It's a lot like cars, you can't expect to sell a used car at the same price a dealer can sell at. A dealer offers financing, does all the paperwork, often has certain warranty basic minimum obligations and gets a lot more buyer traffic than an individual. Most buyers want that comfort and find a private sale intimidating.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[RolyMoly]

I’ve lost $ on every watch I’ve sold I think, except for a TT Bluesy, I came out ahead on that. But I’ve never tried to make $ on them either, I just buy them and wear them. You def lose the least on Rolexes in my exp. most everything else loses 30%+.

For one, this isn’t a poor man’s hobby.

For two, it IS a hobby.

For three, a guy above said watches are not true investments. He’s right. It’s just fun. Wait until the economy tanks or the stock market takes a dump. All of these crazy watch prices will disappear and every watch you’ve ever wanted will suddenly show up and be a good deal, store shelves will have inventory again...

And Four, I also agree with one of the guys above. Just sell to a nice dealer. It’s fast and easy even though it’s not as much as you may want to sell it for. But you’ll make more $ spending all that saved time at work making $ rather than hours and hours working on Ebay for a 10% cut, Chrono24, etc. etc. TRF’s classifieds is decent too.

[khalifam]

Originally Posted by RolyMoly

I’ve lost $ on every watch I’ve sold I think, except for a TT Bluesy, I came out ahead on that. But I’ve never tried to make $ on them either, I just buy them and wear them. You def lose the least on Rolexes in my exp. most everything else loses 30%+.

For one, this isn’t a poor man’s hobby.

For two, it IS a hobby.

For three, a guy above said watches are not true investments. He’s right. It’s just fun. Wait until the economy tanks or the stock market takes a dump. All of these crazy watch prices will disappear and every watch you’ve ever wanted will suddenly show up and be a good deal, store shelves will have inventory again...

And Four, I also agree with one of the guys above. Just sell to a nice dealer. It’s fast and easy even though it’s not as much as you may want to sell it for. But you’ll make more $ spending all that saved time at work making $ rather than hours and hours working on Ebay for a 10% cut, Chrono24, etc. etc. TRF’s classifieds is decent too.

Everyone does say 30% cut on other watches but I think that's Omega, Breitling etc... I've sold a Tudor previous and got what I paid for which was good. Also, the amount of time you end up wasting on eBay to time wasters and the level of uncertainty is not worth it... Deffo agree with selling to a trusted dealer

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[djtheot]

I don't look at them as an investment, but there is comfort in knowing if the worst happens you can get some money back if needed. It's a great attitude to say that a watch is a sunk cost, but for many that's not the reality. I don't want to judge those that love watches and can collect in the knowledge that its not completely writing off the amount you put into a piece. I have bought too many watches outside of Rolex over the years and flipped after getting bored with them with losses. As I get older my obsession with watches seems as strong as ever but I am more cautious about what I buy, I am less frivolous. I have to really love the watch and if its a hot piece then that's a nice upside (as long as I love it). It does cross my mind and helps justify the purchase, I intend to leave to my kids anyway. There are not many hobbies that you can indulge in big ticket purchase and know that certain pieces will retain the majority of what you put in. That's cool IMHO.

[Highlatitude]

Luxury goods nearly always depreciate heavily. Watches especially except Rolex which used to offer only small losses and for the last 10 years has actually made many people a very healthy profit because they went through a period of significant price rises and reestablished themselves in a much higher price sector, dragging used values up as well. It is clear that this trend cannot continue forever as they have now arrived at their new price segment, which is still just affordable but of questionable good value. The market is not there in the longer term should they go any higher. So if you did not buy 10 years ago and sell recently then you have missed the boat on making a profit but can still own a nice watch that may or may not hold it’s value.

[SilverFoxUK]

There does seem to be a lot of 'holier than thou' sentiment where people say watches are not to be thought of in terms of resale, and 'I've never bought a watch with the caveat that I might have to sell it' etc. etc. How nice for the super-rich who can drop tens of thousands on luxury items without considering resale value. Some of us mere mortals may need to sell watches to acquire other watches, rather than keep adding, or may have to sell to finance other life costs that may or may not have been predicted. Going into watch collecting knowing that Rolex and PP would hold value well, and some pieces may result in a profit is a big part of justifying the expense, so it is really not the same as luxury money gone for good on necklaces, earrings or other jewellery. Many of us would not spend large sums on watches unless they were a good bet financially AS WELL as being beautiful creations to treasure and enjoy.

[mjrchabot]

Originally Posted by SilverFoxUK

There does seem to be a lot of 'holier than thou' sentiment where people say watches are not to be thought of in terms of resale, and 'I've never bought a watch with the caveat that I might have to sell it' etc. etc. How nice for the super-rich who can drop tens of thousands on luxury items without considering resale value. Some of us mere mortals may need to sell watches to acquire other watches, rather than keep adding, or may have to sell to finance other life costs that may or may not have been predicted. Going into watch collecting knowing that Rolex and PP would hold value well, and some pieces may result in a profit is a big part of justifying the expense, so it is really not the same as luxury money gone for good on necklaces, earrings or other jewellery. Many of us would not spend large sums on watches unless they were a good bet financially AS WELL as being beautiful creations to treasure and enjoy.

Well said... it’s easy to forget our privilege sometimes ..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mobster600]

Why do people care to make money on a hobby/passion? I work, that’s how I pay for watches. Why do you need to make money on watches too?

Kinda feels like if your trying to get ahead, this hobby might not be for you

[3sheets86]

Originally Posted by SilverFoxUK

There does seem to be a lot of 'holier than thou' sentiment where people say watches are not to be thought of in terms of resale, and 'I've never bought a watch with the caveat that I might have to sell it' etc. etc. How nice for the super-rich who can drop tens of thousands on luxury items without considering resale value. Some of us mere mortals may need to sell watches to acquire other watches, rather than keep adding, or may have to sell to finance other life costs that may or may not have been predicted. Going into watch collecting knowing that Rolex and PP would hold value well, and some pieces may result in a profit is a big part of justifying the expense, so it is really not the same as luxury money gone for good on necklaces, earrings or other jewellery. Many of us would not spend large sums on watches unless they were a good bet financially AS WELL as being beautiful creations to treasure and enjoy.

Indeed, if a Rolex was an average priced family saloon everyone would be running one!

[djtheot]

Originally Posted by SilverFoxUK

There does seem to be a lot of 'holier than thou' sentiment where people say watches are not to be thought of in terms of resale, and 'I've never bought a watch with the caveat that I might have to sell it' etc. etc. How nice for the super-rich who can drop tens of thousands on luxury items without considering resale value. Some of us mere mortals may need to sell watches to acquire other watches, rather than keep adding, or may have to sell to finance other life costs that may or may not have been predicted. Going into watch collecting knowing that Rolex and PP would hold value well, and some pieces may result in a profit is a big part of justifying the expense, so it is really not the same as luxury money gone for good on necklaces, earrings or other jewellery. Many of us would not spend large sums on watches unless they were a good bet financially AS WELL as being beautiful creations to treasure and enjoy.

Spot on.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by 037

If your money is tied up in a watch rather than making money on a true investment, you're probably losing. The amount you spent on the GMT in 2007 would have purchased about 200 shares of AMZN, which today would be worth around $360,000.

The concept of watches as any kind of investment is an odd one to me.

Well it’s a good thing that’s not what his intentions were or what he stated.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by mobster600

Why do people care to make money on a hobby/passion? I work, that’s how I pay for watches. Why do you need to make money on watches too?

Kinda feels like if your trying to get ahead, this hobby might not be for you

Just out of curiosity did you actually read his post or just the title?

[037]

Originally Posted by Patton250

Well it’s a good thing that’s not what his intentions were or what he stated.

He also edited his post after I replied.

His two poll options don't quite match the premise of his question either, so it's not like this thread started smoothly.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by SilverFoxUK

There does seem to be a lot of 'holier than thou' sentiment where people say watches are not to be thought of in terms of resale, and 'I've never bought a watch with the caveat that I might have to sell it' etc. etc. How nice for the super-rich who can drop tens of thousands on luxury items without considering resale value. Some of us mere mortals may need to sell watches to acquire other watches, rather than keep adding, or may have to sell to finance other life costs that may or may not have been predicted. Going into watch collecting knowing that Rolex and PP would hold value well, and some pieces may result in a profit is a big part of justifying the expense, so it is really not the same as luxury money gone for good on necklaces, earrings or other jewellery. Many of us would not spend large sums on watches unless they were a good bet financially AS WELL as being beautiful creations to treasure and enjoy.

It does seem this concept is very difficult for some to grasp. Although in my opinion those with negative comments on the subject are ignoring the details of the argument purposefully for reasons you stated though maybe not intentionally.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by 037

He also edited his post after I replied.

His two poll options don't quite match the premise of his question either, so it's not like this thread started smoothly.

I wasn’t even referring to his edit. His original statement was quite clear as to what he meant. I honestly believe you knew that as well.

[037]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I wasn’t even referring to his edit. His original statement was quite clear as to what he meant. I honestly believe you knew that as well.

His poll options are 1) to overspend buying an in-demand model at a premium or 2) to resell to a dealer at a loss. Both options err on the side of loss. The premise of his question is whether or not it's possible to buy and sell a watch and "get your money back." Given that, where are the poll options to break even or profit if the question is about getting money back?

My answer was that if the goal is getting money back then the same money spent could actually gain far more money if one so chooses. I stand by what I wrote.

[lkngshrp]

The idea that these are considered “investments” is silly. The fact that most models hold a good chunk of value over time is a bonus and nothing more. To those that buy and flip move on to something else please and let those of us who actually enjoy wearing and owning these pieces enjoy them for what they really are- Haute Horlogerie.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by 037

If your money is tied up in a watch rather than making money on a true investment, you're probably losing. The amount you spent on the GMT in 2007 would have purchased about 200 shares of AMZN, which today would be worth around $360,000.

The concept of watches as any kind of investment is an odd one to me.

Originally Posted by 037

His poll options are 1) to lose money buying an in-demand model at a premium or 2) to sell to a dealer at a loss. Both options err on the side of loss. The premise of his question is whether or not it's possible to buy and sell a watch and "get your money back." Where are the poll options to break even or profit if the question is about getting money back?

My answer was that if the goal is getting money back then the same money spent could actually gain far more money if one so chooses. I stand by what I wrote.

His goal (a smart one IMO) was stated as to not lose too much money and in some cases make money in order to upgrade/ switch to a different timepiece when he interests change. NOT buying watches as investments like stocks or bonds.

This subject gets spun on this forum quite a bit and it’s become annoying. Mostly because IMO the spinning is being done purposely. It seems some like to lecture others. If I misunderstood your statement then I apologize.

[cerendigit]

Hello Guys, thanks for all your replies.

Sorry if my original post came off as "I'm trying to buy watches to make money", I think my story about the GMT was misleading. It wasn't my intention.

I buy watches because I like watches, but tastes evolve, and views on collecting evolve, and it's good to know that you can sell your watches if you ever decide to.

I wanted to discuss what can you _actually_ expect when selling your Rolexes as a private seller (Is it really like what people say: "oh, a rolex is like money in the bank", or do you guys have a different experience).

(i.e. your experience as a watch collector and occasional private watch seller).

Thanks for all your contributions.

[Nauti]

Some you win some you lose so long as it evens out and you get to enjoy them...

[037]

Originally Posted by Patton250

His goal (a smart one IMO) was stated as to not lose too much money and in some cases make money in order to upgrade/ switch to a different timepiece when he interests change. NOT buying watches as investments like stocks or bonds.

This subject gets spun on this forum quite a bit and it’s become annoying. Mostly because IMO the spinning is being done purposely. It seems some like to lecture others. If I misunderstood your statement then I apologize.

I completely understand where you're coming from and agree that the "investment" banter always spirals in the wrong direction. But, doesn't a watch therefore become an investment by definition if the primary goal is value retention or a profitable return? And, if it then becomes an investment by that premise, wouldn't stocks or bonds then be fair game as comparisons?

I don't fault anyone for wanting their purchase to hold value. That wasn't my intention. My only point is that if making money is one's goal, there are better ways to do it and potentially end up with even more watches in the end.

And I still think the poll options are flawed.

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by cerendigit

I wanted to discuss what can you _actually_ expect when selling your Rolexes as a private seller (Is it really like what people say: "oh, a rolex is like money in the bank", or do you guys have a different experience).

Over what period of time?

The question is impossible to answer which is why it generates so much chaos between people who actually love watches and people who do not.

[emtee]

Never sold but got offered £10K from a grey dealer for my late 2017 BLNR which does have a couple of battle scars. Was looking to trade into a Daytona but decided against it in the end. Either way if you buy a SS Sports Rolex at MSRP you will do better than any other watch at a comparable price.

I will admit it’s not that I don’t love these watches but knowing you will not take a bath if you decide to sell makes them much easier to justify than buying something that maybe you admire/love more but know you’ll lose thousands if you need to move them. It must be nice to not have to care about such things but for some of us it’s like throwing a new kitchen or bathroom down the toilet and it’s no joke! That said I love this hobby and feel very privileged to be a part of it :)

Ps I will add I have lost thousands of pounds when I sold Panerai, Zenith, Omega and VC and whilst it wasn’t pleasant I’m OK with that because I bought them because I loved them and never even considered resale. Unfortunately sometimes RL stuff happens that are more important than watches and you need to get rid of stuff to move forward. It’s all good in the end :)

[replicator]

There are much better investment vehicles than watches, but from a value retention perspective, resale value is part of the fun in collecting.

I do like that Rolex does hold its value so if I get bored, I can easily trade up or down and recoup most if not all of my initial cost. Nobody wants to buy a watch and have it lose bulk of the $ value when you walk out the door.

Bottom line, you get the pleasure of owning and wearing Rolex timepieces, and if you’re smart with buying and selling the cost of ownership is low, and perhaps even net positive.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by 037

I completely understand where you're coming from and agree that the "investment" banter always spirals in the wrong direction. But, doesn't a watch therefore become an investment by definition if the primary goal is value retention or a profitable return? And, if it then becomes an investment by that premise, wouldn't stocks or bonds then be fair game as comparisons?

I don't fault anyone for wanting their purchase to hold value. That wasn't my intention. My only point is that if making money is one's goal, there are better ways to do it and potentially end up with even more watches in the end.

I completely agree with everything you wrote except the highlighted. If you expect it to “make money” then IMO it is an investment.

Originally Posted by beshannon

Over what period of time?

The question is impossible to answer which is why it generates so much chaos between people who actually love watches and people who do not.

Nothing he wrote indicates he loves watches????