Eliminate the Grey Market

[Bizcut1]

All of this fantasy and speculation about "back door" sales of Rolex AD's
to the grey market is hilarious...I suppose it's some kind of pacifier to the
frustrated but no one here knows anything about this. I haven't seen one
real story about a specific AD doing that - please post it if you have.

Clue: You haven't.

The truth is, with Rolex now you pay to play. Or you wait and no guarantees.

Don't want to pay? No play. The rest is just running empty commentary...to put it politely.

I am so sick to death of these threads. Sorry, just am. I know, I know. My bad.

Will try to ignore and move on...blah, blah.

[77T]

Originally Posted by Jack T

Hello?? There is no supply problem.

The problem with supply is a manufacturer who doesn’t choose to increase production as higher demand occurs over time.

Granted, Rolex doesn’t hike their prices to ridiculous levels as some manufacturers might - but you can’t blame demand.


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[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Jack T

Hello?? There is no supply problem.

Can you walk into a store and buy one at MSRP? If Rolex put its entire production run for sale online for MSRP how long do you think the watches would last? Of course it’s a supply problem.

The issue is that most producers would deal with the supply problem by increasing production or price. Rolex refuses to do that.

[Megamoss]

It may not fix the supply problem.

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by SuinBruin

If you could point me to the part of the U.S. Code that defines "new" and "used" for purposes of buying and selling watches, I'd greatly appreciate it.

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...70&lawCode=CIV

From your state. See item 6. This is why online sellers refer to secondhand watches as BNIB, Unworn, in like new condition, etc. If the watch was previously sold to anyone and the warranty is running, representing it as "new" is a violation of law in every state. If the online seller will have the cards swiped by the AD when they sell the watch, that is a new watch. This would basically be a brokered sale by the online seller for an AD. You actually bought the watch from the AD in this instance.

[Eric-London]

Originally Posted by H25B

Pointless thread alert... but whatever.

Allow ADs to set prices wherever they want. All of a sudden there's no "grey market" and just "a market.."

Suddenly we find out what these things are truly worth.

The prices would shoot up further.

[Harry-57]

The supply is the same as it's ever been, give or take. The problem is the demand.

Destroy a market which has served millions in the watch collecting community for over a hundred years, so that a few thousand disgruntled people can buy a Rolex this month? I don't think some people know what the grey market actually is or how it works. You don't take a hammer to something just because you don't understand it.

[legacy404]

Meh. If the demand is high, there will always be flippers/scalpers selling it at markups. I guess the question you have to ask yourself is, is the watch really worth what they are charging? If not, there are plenty of other pieces that offer better timekeeping, durability, design (subjective), or rarity for the price.

Theres lots of great bargains out there, if you're willing to look past the brand, and thats part of the fun.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by legacy404

I guess the question you have to ask yourself is, is the watch really worth what they are charging?

Which will vary by watch and the person asking the question. For me, my Hulk and SS Sky Dweller were worth the grey premium that I paid for them. None of my other Rolex watches would be. They all came from my AD and if I could not have sourced them at MSRP I wouldn't own them.

The thing not to do is settle for something else in the hope that it will make a grail go away. It won't. Just keep the money, or trade if that's your preference, and be patient.

[rmwill]

This. Forum is full of Veruca Salt types who are frosted that they are not entitled to buy a watch a MSRP. I would love to buy a Porsche 911 at MSRP. #notgonnahappen

Originally Posted by Bizcut1

All of this fantasy and speculation about "back door" sales of Rolex AD's
to the grey market is hilarious...I suppose it's some kind of pacifier to the
frustrated but no one here knows anything about this. I haven't seen one
real story about a specific AD doing that - please post it if you have.

Clue: You haven't.

The truth is, with Rolex now you pay to play. Or you wait and no guarantees.

Don't want to pay? No play. The rest is just running empty commentary...to put it politely.

I am so sick to death of these threads. Sorry, just am. I know, I know. My bad.

Will try to ignore and move on...blah, blah.

[SuinBruin]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...70&lawCode=CIV

From your state. See item 6. This is why online sellers refer to secondhand watches as BNIB, Unworn, in like new condition, etc. If the watch was previously sold to anyone and the warranty is running, representing it as "new" is a violation of law in every state. If the online seller will have the cards swiped by the AD when they sell the watch, that is a new watch. This would basically be a brokered sale by the online seller for an AD. You actually bought the watch from the AD in this instance.

California unfair business practices have nothing to do with the swiping of cards or warranty coverage as the language of the statute itself reveals. Moreover, NIB watches sold by a grey market dealer are not "deteriorated unreasonably or are altered, reconditioned, reclaimed, used, or secondhand." An unused watch falls under none of these categories, irrespective of how many "owners" it has had. If it were otherwise, chrono24 would be in violation of the law by categorizing watches (including Rolexes) for sale on its site as "new/unworn" (and many of the listings explicitly include the word "new"). Likewise, the acronym "BNIB" includes the word "new" and so isn't a workaround under your definition.

Given the litigiousness of our society, surely some enterprising attorney would have sued chrono24 or jomashop or any of the other myriad grey market dealers for selling "new" watches if they are not legally "new." Why has no such lawsuit materialized?

[77T]

Originally Posted by Bizcut1

All of this fantasy and speculation about "back door" sales of Rolex AD's
to the grey market is hilarious...I suppose it's some kind of pacifier to the
frustrated but no one here knows anything about this. I haven't seen one
real story about a specific AD doing that - please post it if you have.

Clue: You haven't.

The truth is, with Rolex now you pay to play. Or you wait and no guarantees.

Don't want to pay? No play. The rest is just running empty commentary...to put it politely.

I am so sick to death of these threads. Sorry, just am. I know, I know. My bad.

Will try to ignore and move on...blah, blah.

Ben
Certainly agree about tiresome threads on the topic - I know of only 1 alleged case that made it into public view. It was the CD Peacock lawsuit a couple of years ago…

The plaintiff did withdraw the case last year without explanation. https://www.nationaljeweler.com/arti...been-dismissed

I believe nobody but an SA at an AD would know- and of course RUSA might - but neither source would be openly talk about it.


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[dwjez14]

There will always be a gray market. Prices will either go up or down.
Plus don’t they already kind of set the price by picking and choosing who gets want based of past spending , age of customer etc ?

[Bizcut1]

Originally Posted by 77T

Ben
Certainly agree about tiresome threads on the topic - I know of only 1 alleged case that made it into public view. It was the CD Peacock lawsuit a couple of years ago…

The plaintiff did withdraw the case last year without explanation. https://www.nationaljeweler.com/arti...been-dismissed

I believe nobody but an SA at an AD would know- and of course RUSA might - but neither source would be openly talk about it.


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Thanks for posting.

The thing is, why in the world would an AD risk his precious Rolex relationship to backdoor a few stainless steel watches...

Answer: He wouldn't.