Is there a brand that you think is superior to Patek Philippe?

[Tony64]

Originally Posted by HorologyK

Who's making popcorn.

And just when I thought this thread was winding down...

[Hollister]

As Patek owners, we should be holding them to account, rather than gratefully biting the pillow....

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by lapince

If you changed investments I suppose you have pics of the ones you had...

Yes, this is the not for sale 5110 wall clock a dealer friend, well... it was here for many years :)





Looked good in theory, yet was too heavy a timepiece and so did not balance well on the wrist.






Typical newer version of the 5167, changed this out for a ceramic Sub ND. Got the wife the smaller mechanical movement version, yet she was too scared to wear it so it got sold back quite fast.






This is actually the second time around with the 5110 RG. One of those things, you get it, eventually trade it, then want it again. So see, I;m a 'watch guy' LOL!





Ok, not a wrist shot yet the only remaining PP here for tux.





Third edition of the 3970er. It was one of my AD's personal timepiece for many years.




Also had the PP very limited edition Harrod's special edition RG that had, as I recall, the 215 manual wind movement, only 35 were made and most went to upper mgt of Harrods as I recall. One of my online friends received number 00 by 'mistake' from the factory. My # was a bit higher. Lovely dial that timepiece and probably the only one I'd want back. Stole the below image from http://www.cagi-due.co.jp/patek2/3316.htm





Old pic of watch box. Still have the LV box, the B&R, Omega and vintage PP. Simply grew tired of setting dates and moonphase and month and.... so ceramic Sub ND and ceramic Everose Daytona took their place.




Yeah, I'm an audio / video guy (and drummer /percussionist too). Pic from previous livingroom as we recently moved to a much larger home. Modded Dunlavy speakers that came out of a mastering studio, Pioneer Kuro plasma TV.... typical bits really and you can see the 5110 clock being put to good use in the livingroom.





(Sigh) And yes there are more, but hopefully you get the idea. Truly do wish PP finds the correct consultant, as I also work in the high-end luxury goods sector. They simply have some issues that can be worked out given the correct following of 'procedure' in the right direction. But for now, PPs are not my 'thing'. Perhaps in the future, we'll see. And lastly, the very kind David Jarrod did discuss with me a black dial 3939H RG as he was a go-between years ago for this rare item. Alas, the then owner was far too unrealistic with pricing. It happens. Other rare collection pieces still find my inbox from time to time yet at this point am holding off on Pateks.

Now if a really special enamel desk clock with a music theme is offered and the pricing is realistic, I'd be open for that. There are always exceptions to the rule

[subtona]

Originally Posted by Hollister

Jesus, how could you own a Bell & Ross?

that about sums up your contributions here.

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by subtona

that about sums up your contributions here.

Hi Gus, just asking the obvious question - a box of really good watches, plus a B&R? It just seemed a little incongruous. Maybe it was a present.

[lapince]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Yes, this is the not for sale 5110 wall clock a dealer friend, well... it was here for many years :)

Looked good in theory, yet was too heavy a timepiece and so did not balance well on the wrist.

Now if a really special enamel desk clock with a music theme is offered and the pricing is realistic, I'd be open for that. There are always exceptions to the rule

Nice pieces you had, does the clock also do WT or is it just time only? They are a little dressy for me, though the 3970r is a beauty, some prefer 5970/5270 pushers but there is something old style about these that I like, I would have kept it, but I've seen members here flipping other even more incredible pieces to be honest, what brands are you into now if this is not indiscreet?

I had 2 Patek, 5712 and 5726 on strap, flipped the second because I didn't love it and the first for a good investment, getting it back in 3 weeks, arrived 2 days ago, have a few other Patek on order, and one from an independent, that will be the pinacle of my watch days and the one I want to leave my kid

[Hollister]

Did two posts just get deleted?

[nyc2la]

Originally Posted by Hollister

I don't "stand" anywhere. I have two quite nice PPs, and a bunch of other watches. I have no particular brand affiliation. I think PP's standards have fallen, and there's only one way to get them back on their game. Threads like this are perfect for that purpose.

Quite reasonable, but I can't connect the fact that you think PP's standards have fallen yet one of them is your Exit Watch.

Regardless, a debate amongst members is good, so long as it's substantive, healthy, honest, and not toxic. 🍻

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by nyc2la

Quite reasonable, but I can't connect the fact that you think PP's standards have fallen yet one of them is your Exit Watch.

Regardless, a debate amongst members is good, so long as it's substantive, healthy, honest, and not toxic. 🍻

I completely agree, what seems quite difficult is making a reasonable point without having heavily-invested (emotionally and financially) guys shouting "Troll!"

[nyc2la]

Originally Posted by Hollister

I completely agree, what seems quite difficult is making a reasonable point without having heavily-invested (emotionally and financially) guys shouting "Troll!"

Cheers.

Following-up, why is a PP your Exit Watch considering your belief that their standards have fallen?

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by nyc2la

Cheers.

Following-up, why is a PP your Exit Watch considering your belief that their standards have fallen?

Er... I just happen to like that watch. Is it allowed to like a watch despite believing that standards in the manufacturer may well have dropped? I'm not sure anymore. Should I choose another?

I tell you what - you decide for me.

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by subtona

that about sums up your contributions here.

OK, so you quoted my post about B&R, so I didn't imagine it. Two follow-up posts were deleted as well. enjoythemusic explained why he had a B&R, and I replied to that post.

What is going on here? This is seriously seriously weird. Is there some crazy B&R mod prowling around?

[enjoythemusic]

Yes, quite weird indeed.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ymjp2uIBws

[nyc2la]

Originally Posted by Hollister

Er... I just happen to like that watch. Is it allowed to like a watch despite believing that standards in the manufacturer may well have dropped? I'm not sure anymore. Should I choose another?



I tell you what - you decide for me.

You take a reasonable question (asked twice since the first time was ignored) and respond in a confrontational manner. That was not necessary.

Your Exit Watch choice is nice, btw.

[Solicitor]

Sorry but I don't understand why people are quarelling and insulting each other bec of different perspectives on a brand forum?

Isn't this suppose to be a site where we can actually do that? (Hope I won't be flamed for this)

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by Solicitor

Sorry but I don't understand why people are quarelling and insulting each other bec of different perspectives on a brand forum?

Isn't this suppose to be a site where we can actually do that? (Hope I won't be flamed for this)

That is an excellent question. I am getting heat for apparantly ignoring an important question from an important person.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by lapince

Nice pieces you had, does the clock also do WT or is it just time only?

It works just like the WT watch, so it fluidly tells you the current time in 24 zones around the world. It also weighs around 30 lbs(!) so be sure to hang it securely to a wall stud.

[lapince]

Originally Posted by Hollister

I completely agree, what seems quite difficult is making a reasonable point without having heavily-invested (emotionally and financially) guys shouting "Troll!"

No there was clearly one who got banned, but apart him never saw any one here say troll on anyone

[lapince]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

It works just like the WT watch, so it fluidly tells you the current time in 24 zones around the world. It also weighs around 30 lbs(!) so be sure to hang it securely to a wall stud.

Very cool, but quite heavy indeed, do they sell them or is it reserved for AD's and you exceptionally can get one?

Originally Posted by Solicitor

Sorry but I don't understand why people are quarelling and insulting each other bec of different perspectives on a brand forum?

Isn't this suppose to be a site where we can actually do that? (Hope I won't be flamed for this)

Good question No I don't think you will

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Yes, quite weird indeed.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ymjp2uIBws

Yeah I remember the post of you explaining that you were racing cars with it, but yes it does seem to have disappeared...

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by lapince

Very cool, but quite heavy indeed, do they sell them or is it reserved for AD's and you exceptionally can get one?

They made only about 50 or so of them for dealers. Never for sale to public, but they do pop up for sale rarely.

Yeah I remember the post of you explaining that you were racing cars with it, but yes it does seem to have disappeared...

POOF, gone! Maybe they needed to recycle the electrons?

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

POOF, gone! Maybe they needed to recycle the electrons?

It's so strange, nothing remotely offensive in either of our posts.

[lapince]

Originally Posted by Hollister

It's so strange, nothing remotely offensive in either of our posts.

clearly

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by nilfire77

What for? I'm not a Patek hater. In fact I love Pateks, I just want to iterate my point that Patek's sublime hand finishing is only reserved for their high-end products.

Need more proof? There you go...

More macro photos showing the vertical machining marks on the bevels of entry level PP movements (Eg. Cal 240 and 215)..

Source: http://orologi.forumfree.it/?t=68631946&st=75





SteveG's close up on the Cal. 240 - Again, notice the presence of vertical machining marks on the bevels
Source: http://ninanet.net/watches/others04/Mediums/mpatek.html


I rest my case.

With that insurmountable evidence I felt that I am truly going mad and once again hauled the watches out and the loupes. Sadly only my be eked edges are highly, mirror polished. Then at a certain angle the mirror finish of the edges began to reflect the brushed steel of the bridge and these vertical lies appeared. When I tilted slightly downwards the same mirrored edges reflected the side of the bridge with similar refraction. So whilst I am definately not saying this is the case in your photographs as they all show appalling milling deficiencies I did notice the exact same retractions of light and reflections of brushed steel as shown in the pictures. So i am delighted that I have the only 6 good, entry level movements produced by PP

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by KarlS

With that insurmountable evidence I felt that I am truly going mad and once again hauled the watches out and the loupes. Sadly only my be eked edges are highly, mirror polished. Then at a certain angle the mirror finish of the edges began to reflect the brushed steel of the bridge and these vertical lies appeared. When I tilted slightly downwards the same mirrored edges reflected the side of the bridge with similar refraction. So whilst I am definately not saying this is the case in your photographs as they all show appalling milling deficiencies I did notice the exact same retractions of light and reflections of brushed steel as shown in the pictures. So i am delighted that I have the only 6 good, entry level movements produced by PP

Those bevelled edges are mostly angled upwards, away from the plane of rest of the machinery. So it's hard to understand that they are reflections from other parts of the same machine. It's also hard to see why they are not appearing on the Lange/Dufour photos if they are artefacts.

[KarlS]

Originally Posted by Hollister

Those bevelled edges are mostly angled upwards, away from the plane of rest of the machinery. So it's hard to understand that they are reflections from other parts of the same machine. It's also hard to see why they are not appearing on the Lange/Dufour photos if they are artefacts.

Flip I could give you at least 50 explanations but I think considering I have actually gone to the effort of buying a loupe, looked at them twice it kind of puts me at a slight advantage versus a bunch of photographs that were taken by others. A good example is that in macro some of the outside images become blurred when concentrating on a single point. I can't verify those photographs so I agreed that PP is rubbish - I also stated I am delighted that I didn't get those!!

[Hollister]

I need to get a loupe.

[RussW]

Originally Posted by nilfire77

What for? I'm not a Patek hater. In fact I love Pateks, I just want to iterate my point that Patek's sublime hand finishing is only reserved for their high-end products.

Need more proof? There you go...

More macro photos showing the vertical machining marks on the bevels of entry level PP movements (Eg. Cal 240 and 215)..

Source: http://orologi.forumfree.it/?t=68631946&st=75





SteveG's close up on the Cal. 240 - Again, notice the presence of vertical machining marks on the bevels
Source: http://ninanet.net/watches/others04/Mediums/mpatek.html


I rest my case.

Rather than recycling these photos can someone post an actual picture of their own watch? We don't know the full history of these watches and it doesn't seem like a sound basis for discussion.

I've checked my 5980 with a loupe and have zero concerns. I've attempted to photo it through a loupe (not with the greatest of success) but at least I can tell you I've seen the watch myself and the finishing is fine.

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by Hollister

Those bevelled edges are mostly angled upwards, away from the plane of rest of the machinery. So it's hard to understand that they are reflections from other parts of the same machine. It's also hard to see why they are not appearing on the Lange/Dufour photos if they are artefacts.

When was the watch in question, manufactured?
Is there a chance an unfinished movement was used, meaning that's a serious final QC failing?

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by PJ S

When was the watch in question, manufactured?
Is there a chance an unfinished movement was used, meaning that's a serious final QC failing?

I have no idea, they aren't my pictures.

[Peterandwatches]

The best watch brand? I say Rolex, for the same reason the Beatles are considered the best band- nothing else has enjoyed such commercial and critical success simultaneously.