Rolex has it exactly backward IMO

[racerx]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I think what gets confused here often is how we define “Rolex the company vs Rolex ADs”.

Rolex ADs most certainly pick and choose who they sell coveted references to, thereby fueling demand and (perceived) rarity.

Rolex the company, manufacture and ship watches to ADs, and except for some very rare references, don’t really care who they are sold to.

This exactly. Imagine if they were car dealers, everyone would be walking.

[amh]

Originally Posted by Afterglow

This is one of the best posts (OP) I have read on this forum. I agree 100%.

Yes, but....

Originally Posted by bluestreak

This forum is a literal compendiu of an incredible amount of watch knowledge. You must not have not read many posts.

.... and yes.

A version of this rant/experience has been posted at least monthly over the last 5 years. Sometimes weekly.

I don't really blame Rolex - this is on the ADs. Some people are able to walk into an AD even now and "Hey - I got a BLRO with no history!" Others will never get one unless they buy tons of jewelry.

Nice watches so that hasn't changed. The buying experience is a chore.

[KatGirl]

That was a bit dramatic, OP. We are all frustrated by the lack of available inventory, and waiting a whole year, or more, for the exact model we want. Let’s hope things get better, with the new factory and the acquisition of Bucherer. I’m fortunate to have a good AD, and also a relationship with a trusted Seller, here. It is what it is, and no amount of complaining will change things, anytime soon. Life is too short, to get frustrated over the difficulty of acquiring a new Rolex. As that annoying song says…”Let it go…”

Kat


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[Krash]

Originally Posted by racerx

This exactly. Imagine if they were car dealers, everyone would be walking.

Actually, the car industry isn’t much different. In recent history, some models have been impossible to acquire. Dealers were marking prices up and in many cases, you couldn’t walk into a dealer and get the car you wanted. I think that has subsided, but I’m not really sure because I’m not in the market for a new car right now.

And just like Rolex, there was no manufactured or artificial scarcity. The manufacturers could not keep up with the demand.


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[Peacon Lane]

If you look at places like Grailzee and see dozens of brand new watches under the same user name there is no way dealers arent moving watches out the back door to sell on the higher profit grey market.
If ADs are not allowed to price watches themselves, like a car dealer, to respond to demand, then there is way to much incentive to sell them outside the shop.
This is definitely hurting the brand. Its silly Rolex allows AD's shops to have empty shelves for 2 years. A friend of mine works at a AD that also sells several other watch brands as well as jewelry. He said he hasnt seen a single Rolex transaction in months. Where's the watches? Doubt they are in the safe. Doubt they are being sold in the private office.

[CarlOver]

Interesting view point. There are watches in the store’s safe. If someone walks in and the SA has what they are looking for, the customer might walk out with an incredible piece.

I don’t think there are hundreds of watches in the back but some are being held for the right occasion.

[Mccall86]

Originally Posted by Krash

Actually, the car industry isn’t much different. In recent history, some models have been impossible to acquire. Dealers were marking prices up and in many cases, you couldn’t walk into a dealer and get the car you wanted. I think that has subsided, but I’m not really sure because I’m not in the market for a new car right now.

And just like Rolex, there was no manufactured or artificial scarcity. The manufacturers could not keep up with the demand.


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Yes this definitely was the case with the new Bronco. I'm not sure if they're still this way but at one time people were paying waaay over MSRP to get their hands on one.

In the end it usually all comes down to supply and demand, and I think Rolex demand grew to insane levels in the last few years with all the money flowing around and supply simply couldn't keep up. My guess is that the Rolex market will shift in the coming years as it sounds like supply may increase while demand will likely decrease, but that may be a slow process. The harder it gets to sell a Rolex the better the AD experience will get for the buyer. Right now they're pretty easy to sell so the experience sucks.

[CarlOver]

Originally Posted by zengineer

Do you believe that Rolex is doing anything significant aimed at increasing supply to meet demand?

They really aren't and that is their choice, and in the long run it may be the right strategy. But it is a decision they've made and I don't see it as wrong to call it manufactured.

Originally Posted by rohada

Rolex is building a new plant. Does that count?

Yes they are. We don’t know what they intend to do in these plants. Will they manufacture 2million watches and flood the market? Will they produce new lines? Will they produce something and sell to other manufacturers? We will see.

[Watchguynyc8300]

Lot of defense of poor AD experience on this thread. It has become a pretty terrible buying experience. I’d say some folks haven’t been through enough economic cycles to realize that if you treat customers poor enough after a long enough time it comes back to bite you. A lot of the watch grey retailers are sitting on hung inventory with thin margins (and they are the biggest buyers from the ADs). Unless the brand has really reached escape velocity, these things tend to move in long term fashion trends.

I will say walking into a Rolex AD vs say Loro Piana is a vastly difference experience these days. As some have said Hermes is like the Rolex AD these days. Loro Piana however is all smiles and super high touch sales service with no arrogance and aim to get customer the best service possible (ie - sure I’ll messenger your jacket home, since you don’t feel like walking around with a huge shoppping bag all day)

[Patekfinder]

Originally Posted by Krash

I think we’re confusing Rolex with Disney.

Rolex sells every watch they make and demand far exceeds supply. Rolex is more popular than ever.

Disney, on the other hand, lost close to a billion dollars on the last ten movies they released.


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I dont think you understand the current situation at Disney. They are more profitable than ever and It is more popular than ever. Try take your kids to Disney World and you’ll pay in tickets at least $1,200, per day, on mere access to the parks. Want to go on a popular ride like space mountain or the tea cups? You need a highly competitive RESERVATION and to pay big bucks in advance just for one ride. It is absurd. Don’t get an advanced reservation for a ride? Then lines may exceed 6 hours, of people who already paid thousands for access to the park on just that one, random, Tuesday.

This is not Rolex, this is not the watch industry, this is pretty much everything that is either luxury or nonessential.

Btw, I hate Disney, I just offer this to correct the facts here.

[Patekfinder]

Originally Posted by seabreeze

I agree with most of this, but many people are missing the point of my post. It is not about scarcity, or about a surge in interest, and or how that happened - its about the dealer experience and how it should better match the watches themselves......you said it yourself "beautiful machines, technical questions" why not add "beautiful way of doing business" is really my ONLY point.

Rolex S.A controls everything (!!!!!!) with an iron fist, this can be changed if they wanted it to......this company has nothing but money and resources, and allegedly does alot of charity good with our billions, its a cool semi secret aspect of the company........

I read on another post about a guy here who flew his vintage piece to Geneva to have them work on it, ostensibly anything not available they will hand make and take up to 2 years to put it back into service. They took a $100 mil euro fine for sticking to a policy that doesn't allow online sales, yet many/most end user watches are being sold in precisely this way -

Their advertising budget is astronomical; they are a part of every significant global sporting event, in the arts, in every luxury hotel, in every upscale magazine.....does this sound like a company that wants its "end user experience" to be Bobs watches or DavidsSW without any disrespect to either, i dont know either its just 2 names i know as an example. I'm grateful that gray dealers exist but its very odd to me.

This is a company that will send back your watch if they discover someone else opened it and put a non rolex screw in - these are the behaviors of a company that cares and controls EVERYTHING.


the end user experience seems like precisely an aspect of the Rolex experience they would care about IMO.

Funny post and very true.

When you do a google search for Rolex and “Bobs” comes up before Rolex, it makes me not want another Rolex.


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[Patekfinder]

Originally Posted by Roger Lococco

I visited an AP dealer in a non-English speaking country recently. The SA was not at all fluent in English, which is fine. But I found it amusing that she stated the following phrase in perfect English syntax and accent. As if she had said it 50 thousand times...

"To purchase a watch from our Royal Oak line, we recommend you first purchase several watches from our Code line. This allows us to get to know you better and to build a relationship together. We would consider a purchase of a gold Code as a great first step in this journey."

A true joke. This allows us to get to know you better… what a joke.


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[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by Watchguynyc8300

Lot of defense of poor AD experience on this thread. It has become a pretty terrible buying experience. I’d say some folks haven’t been through enough economic cycles to realize that if you treat customers poor enough after a long enough time it comes back to bite you. A lot of the watch grey retailers are sitting on hung inventory with thin margins (and they are the biggest buyers from the ADs). Unless the brand has really reached escape velocity, these things tend to move in long term fashion trends.

I will say walking into a Rolex AD vs say Loro Piana is a vastly difference experience these days. As some have said Hermes is like the Rolex AD these days. Loro Piana however is all smiles and super high touch sales service with no arrogance and aim to get customer the best service possible (ie - sure I’ll messenger your jacket home, since you don’t feel like walking around with a huge shoppping bag all day)

I think people are “defending” it because they don’t see the experience as poor. I’m treated with respect and I like talking to the people about watches. I also understand that for the watch I want, there are likely 50 people in line for it too, so I don’t expect to walk in and get what I want and am willing to wait. So I don’t get mad when I can’t get something. I’ve gotten three steel Rolexes that way.

I guess I know if a bunch of other people want what I want, why should I expect them to sell to me over someone else? So I don’t feel slighted when I don’t always get what I want. It’s a good attitude to take to life in general. You’ll be happier.

[Krash]

Originally Posted by Patekfinder

I dont think you understand the current situation at Disney. They are more profitable than ever and It is more popular than ever. Try take your kids to Disney World and you’ll pay in tickets at least $1,200, per day, on mere access to the parks. Want to go on a popular ride like space mountain or the tea cups? You need a highly competitive RESERVATION and to pay big bucks in advance just for one ride. It is absurd. This is not Rolex, this is not the watch industry, this is pretty much everything that is a luxury and nonessential.

Btw, I hate Disney, I just offer this to correct the facts here.

Except they lost $85 billion in market capitalization in approximately one year and had to lay off about 7,000 people. Those are the facts. The stock price accurately reflects its current market value. And their last ten movies did in fact lose $1 billion combined. The parks are still a money maker for them, at least for now. That’s what keeps them afloat.





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[seabreeze]

Originally Posted by Watchguynyc8300

Lot of defense of poor AD experience on this thread. It has become a pretty terrible buying experience. I’d say some folks haven’t been through enough economic cycles to realize that if you treat customers poor enough after a long enough time it comes back to bite you. A lot of the watch grey retailers are sitting on hung inventory with thin margins (and they are the biggest buyers from the ADs). Unless the brand has really reached escape velocity, these things tend to move in long term fashion trends.

I will say walking into a Rolex AD vs say Loro Piana is a vastly difference experience these days. As some have said Hermes is like the Rolex AD these days. Loro Piana however is all smiles and super high touch sales service with no arrogance and aim to get customer the best service possible (ie - sure I’ll messenger your jacket home, since you don’t feel like walking around with a huge shoppping bag all day)

Thank you


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[Patekfinder]

I have spent six figures many times over on watches, namely with my Patek Philippe AD. If I walked in, and did NOT get what I wanted, I would not go back and they’d be dead to me that same day after the fortune I’ve spent.

With Rolex, it is similar but a hell of a lot better and the barrier for entry is a damn Datrjust 36 two tone or ladies 31mm? Please. Pay up, buy your wife a watch, and then get what you want.

Rolex is no where near as bad as other brands. Barrier of entry for a simple three hand Chronometre Bleu from FP Journe is $1 million… to get a $40k watch.

I, for one, APPRECIATE the direction Rolex has taken. In the early 2000s I divested myself from my large Rolex collection and sold all my pieces, at slight losses, because I detested the reputation of what Rolex had become: The watch if choice for a used car salesman. I associated Rolex for many decades as the watch worn by the guy driving a BMW 325 with a 96 month loan as a symbol that he “made it.” Rolex was by any account the watch of success as defined by the national American mediocrity, and it was a massive turn off. I then pivoted to a brand I more identified with, which was Patek Philippe. Only recently did I come back to Rolex after they have recovered their brand identity and used car salesman can no longer access their watches and are relegated to their five digit Subs that they bought at discount during the dark days of Rolex’s image when it was at the deepest depths not of the Marianas Trench, but the gutter of a Midwest city of a place like Cleveland.

Welcome back Rolex.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I think what gets confused here often is how we define “Rolex the company vs Rolex ADs”.

Rolex ADs most certainly pick and choose who they sell coveted references to, thereby fueling demand and (perceived) rarity.

Rolex the company, manufacture and ship watches to ADs, and except for some very rare references, don’t really care who they are sold to.

Nailed it.

[VictorGMT]

Originally Posted by Roger Lococco

I think that the Rolex brand has taken some damage in the past several years.

Yeah, they are not as highly thought of now that ten times as many people are willing to pay twice as much.

I live in Nashville, and a poster on another forum today said no one goes downtown anymore because it's always so busy. Everyone used to go when it wasn't packed shoulder to shoulder. And she was not being intentionally ironic!

[chiscott_29]

Originally Posted by bluestreak

Guy walks into a Rolex AD expecting to be fawned over because they have money. When they aren’t they come here and write a screed. Sometimes it’s saying Rolex is doomed because they are alienating all their customers. Some denigrate salespeople. Sometimes it’s just to announce to the world they will never buy a Rolex. But they all emanate from the same place: Entitlement.

Happens multiple times a week. Yawn

1000%

The issue is absolutely entitlement. A vast majority of Rolex customers simply aren’t used to being told no, or going without.

Posting the latest sob story isn’t going to change anything. It truly can’t be more simple:

If you don’t like it, move on. Rolex couldn’t care less, nor will they miss you. There are plenty of other watches out there to enjoy if it bothers you that much.

If you want to build a relationship and deal with what that means, you are free to do so. It’s no secret at this point how this works.

If you simply want a watch now and don’t want to play these games, there’s a way to do that too.


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[Roger Lococco]

Originally Posted by VictorGMT

Yeah, they are not as highly thought of now that ten times as many people are willing to pay twice as much.

I live in Nashville, and a poster on another forum today said no one goes downtown anymore because it's always so busy. Everyone used to go when it wasn't packed shoulder to shoulder. And she was not being intentionally ironic!

We will see how it plays out when the COVID years impact goes away…


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[iatacs19]

Just wait it out, it hasn't been that long since the prices became ridiculous - if you take a step back and look at the long term pricing.

I agree with those that stated it's just a watch, I don't need to "build a relationship" by being extorted to buy watches I don't want. I'll patiently wait until the fad wears off and people move to the next shiny "investment" and I'll buy at a discount as I always have before the madness.

[bluestreak]

Originally Posted by iatacs19

Just wait it out, it hasn't been that long since the prices became ridiculous - if you take a step back and look at the long term pricing.

I agree with those that stated it's just a watch, I don't need to "build a relationship" by being extorted to buy watches I don't want. I'll patiently wait until the fad wears off and people move to the next shiny "investment" and I'll buy at a discount as I always have before the madness.

It took 80 posts this time to calling this extortion, an actual crime that involves coercion.

People’s brains have been completely addled because they can’t get a watch.

[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Patekfinder

A true joke. This allows us to get to know you better… what a joke.


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If any AD, of any brand, of ANY product, said something similar to me, I would laugh and walk out. One thing I will NOT do, is buy something I don’t want or need, in order to buy what I DO want, but obviously, since we are talking luxury products, DON’T need.

Kat


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[VictorGMT]

Originally Posted by racerx

This exactly. Imagine if they were car dealers, everyone would be walking.

McLaren, Ferrari, Porsche... even Mercedes from E class up... are doing a more extreme version and seem to be more than thriving...

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Krash

Except they lost $85 billion in market capitalization in approximately one year and had to lay off about 7,000 people. Those are the facts. The stock price accurately reflects its current market value. And their last ten movies did in fact lose $1 billion combined. The parks are still a money maker for them, at least for now. That’s what keeps them afloat.





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Ya, wasn’t the old boss supposed to fix all that?

[Krash]

Originally Posted by brandrea

Ya, wasn’t the old boss supposed to fix all that?

Yeah, I’m a Disney shareholder. It’s been the worst performing stock I own, so I have some venom in me when it comes to this company.
The old boss was supposed to fix it. The new boss was supposed to fix it, but the stock has performed worse under him.

It is sort of ironic that this is a thread featuring people complaining about Rolex. Rolex and the ADs have been great to me. LOL! I’m bitching about Disney.


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[Little machines]

Totally understandable Ed . I have a good AD I deal with who is very fair. It's okay to have your opinion and express your views. That's what this forum is about in most cases. Thanks for sharing !

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Krash

Yeah, I’m a Disney shareholder. It’s been the worst performing stock I own, so I have some venom in me when it comes to this company.
The old boss was supposed to fix it. The new boss was supposed to fix it, but the stock has performed worse under him.

It is of ironic that this is a thread featuring people complaining about Rolex. Rolex and the ADs have been great to me. LOL! I’m bitching about Disney.


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Well I guess that’s right there is your karma.


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[KatGirl]

Originally Posted by Krash

Yeah, I’m a Disney shareholder. It’s been the worst performing stock I own, so I have some venom in me when it comes to this company.
The old boss was supposed to fix it. The new boss was supposed to fix it, but the stock has performed worse under him.

It is of ironic that this is a thread featuring people complaining about Rolex. Rolex and the ADs have been great to me. LOL! I’m bitching about Disney.


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Disney should have stayed out of politics, or at least political hotbed issues. Crucial mistake, and why many have boycotted them.

Kat


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[seabreeze]

Originally Posted by Little machines

Totally understandable Ed . I have a good AD I deal with who is very fair. It's okay to have your opinion and express your views. That's what this forum is about in most cases. Thanks for sharing !

Thank you.lots of misreading of my thoughts here but everyone has their own opinions -all good


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