1978 1680 Sub i'm thinking about buying

[xqsme]

Kinda beat up. Fellow wants $9000. for it. Yes it's a real Rolex. He's had it about 40 years. Any thoughts? Thanks.

[Wahlberg]

I see lume, so replaced hands?

[Nickn]

That’s around £6000 I would buy it
Hand would not be hard to sort out

[Goochy]

The box is quite cool, what’s it from?

[alwayshere]

Need better pics of the dial.

Clearly some navy affiliation - looks cool to me. Bezel insert needs a closer look as well

[1665fan]

Looks like all service parts more than likely….hard to tell about the dial….best part is the caseback lol

[harry in montreal]

Could that be the serial number and model number on the back exterior? Seems unusual. I know so,e Tudors and SDs had the serial number or partial on the inner caseback when the watch had special uses.

[zapokee]

Originally Posted by harry in montreal

Could that be the serial number and model number on the back exterior? Seems unusual. I know so,e Tudors and SDs had the serial number or partial on the inner caseback when the watch had special uses.

Gosh, I think you might be onto something there. 5097939 FSN 1680. SN would match the OP's rough specification of "about 40 years."

Anybody know what that shield/eagle insignia with the chain surround is? Can't find it on a Google image search.

The plot thickens...

[CTech]

Originally Posted by zapokee

Gosh, I think you might be onto something there. 5097939 FSN 1680. SN would match the OP's rough specification of "about 40 years."

Anybody know what that shield/eagle insignia with the chain surround is? Can't find it on a Google image search.

The plot thickens...

I think the insignia is some form of stylized Navy Seal emblem. It has some features that are correct but I'm very skeptical about it.

I've never seen one like this before and can't find any other examples or even comments that such engravings were put on Navy Seal watches.

Two questions bother me, and I can't find satisfactory answers at the moment:

1. Are there any documented examples of US Navy Seal Rolex watches with any case back engravings?

2. Are there any documented examples of any US Navy issued Rolex watches?

Unless there is some documentation to prove this was an official US Navy issue watch I'll believe the engravings have been added later to try and manufacture a false history.

If so, this watch seems to have a large number of service parts (as noted above) as well as a "customized" case back.

There are too many red flags about this one at the moment but maybe someone can provide some data to show it was a genuine US Navy Seal issued watch.

[Oyster Perp]

On the formation of Navy SEALS in 1962 they did adopt the sub as their timepiece of choice but there is no evidence of them being engraved as we see here. If its been 'enhanced' to that level I'd leave it.

[1675-David]

Originally Posted by CTech

I'll believe the engravings have been added later to try and manufacture a false history.

Could be, but could also be that some guys thought it was a cool thing to get done.

[zapokee]

Interesting puzzle. So... Authentic watch with service parts and customized caseback seems to be the early consensus. Seems feasible.

[xqsme]

It's the hands that were bugging me. He's retired US Navy. Not a SEAL guy. Anyway, is it worth the asking price? Restore it, or,? Geez, i remember my first Sub. $90.00 ships stores USS Jefferson 1968.

[mountainjogger]

Originally Posted by 1675-David

Could be, but could also be that some guys thought it was a cool thing to get done.

Agreed.

[zapokee]

Originally Posted by xqsme

It's the hands that were bugging me. He's retired US Navy. Not a SEAL guy. Anyway, is it worth the asking price? Restore it, or,? Geez, i remember my first Sub. $90.00 ships stores USS Jefferson 1968.

If something's bugging you before you buy it, it will bug you forever. Trying to restore it to "original" will be a massive PITA and a huge time/money/energy sink. Buy one that's already right if you must have one.

I'd thank the gentleman for his service and move along.

[xqsme]

Thanks. Good advise.

[Wing Zero]

Can you provide a better picture of the dial close up? Any shots of the engravings between the lugs?


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[Ulfberht]

Originally Posted by zapokee

Gosh, I think you might be onto something there. 5097939 FSN 1680. SN would match the OP's rough specification of "about 40 years."

Anybody know what that shield/eagle insignia with the chain surround is? Can't find it on a Google image search.

The plot thickens...

I'm pretty sure the chain around the US Navy emblem represents an anchor chain. I've seen it on other US Navy emblems. If it was USN Seals related it would have a Trident in there somewhere. That's my 2 cents worth.

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[xqsme]

best i can do.

[MrChamfers]

1680's with service dial and hands are selling for 11k or more these days, so if you like it, that's a pretty good price.
Also the engravings add a bit of vintage cool to the watch.

[1675-David]

Looks like an honest 1680, better pix of the dial would be good to give a true impression of the watch but from what is shown here, the only obvious service part is the insert. I'd happily pay the asking price. Inserts and hands are available if you know where to look and I would consider the casebook engraving a curio that is easily removed if need be.

this is a cheap entry ticket into the world of 4 digits

[yowlie]

What did the owner say about the caseback? Edit, this is a red flag. It is something that would generate huge interest in a watch. If that is factory or government engraving this is incredibly rare. Which means either this is a jackpot or a red flag. The idea that the owner stuck it on there doesn't sound too real to me; why add the SN and some issue/model number when you get a watch engraved, maybe because the stuff was rubbed off between the lugs? Polished off? Add the 9k price tag and you have concerns. If you hear hoofbeats, it's a horse, not a zebra . . . . .

[77T]

The watch is not unlike 90+% of surviving 1680’s - some parts have been replaced. One can niggle something or another about nearly any example.

You have a rare opportunity to get it and also document that seaman’s story to add provenance. I’d say do it if you have a plan to restore it.

If he’d sit down for an oral history, you could make that watch more memorable while documenting its provenance. The Navy is interested…https://www.history.navy.mil/researc...histories.html


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[ronricks]

I’d buy it and send the watch head to one of the Ridley’s to service and send the bracelet to Rolliworks to get restored. Like someone said period correct inserts and hands can be found. After that you would have one heck of a 40 year old watch.

[Dan S]

It has a few issues, but could be a nice watch with a modest investment and some TLC. In the OP's place, I would check it out in person and prepare to make an offer on the spot. In situations like this, cash talks.

[zapokee]

Originally Posted by ronricks

...period correct inserts and hands can be found.

More easily said than done. It's a massive investment of time and effort trying to find the correct stuff, not to mention the cost involved.

In terms of opportunity cost (especially for those lucky enough to be able to afford vintage Rolex), it's much better to just buy one that looks like you want it to in the first place.

[datejust24]

Where’s Jed ? If there is any legitimate military affiliation with this piece he’s the man to ask. As he’s likely to have seen it or maybe something similar.

[XavierM]

Without a clear picture of the dial, I would not do anything...
9k would be too much IMO for a piece with service insert, hands and dial (I think it is an MK2 dial here but would not bet anything on it)