A post-Craig Bond reflection

[AK797]

My fav 3 films are Casino Royale, Spy who loved me, Skyfall. I missed the SC years so they seemed a bit dated when I watched them in the 90s.

Lea Seydoux is the best Bond Girl of recent times, saw her in the Cannes winning Blue is the Warmest colour, and altho the 12 minute long lesbian sex scene is gratuitous, the director really got amazing performances out of the two leads who deserved their awards. It's on TV tonight I think.

Tom Hiddleston was excellent in Le Carre's Night Manager and is fav to be Bond, but I just read he is now going out with Taylor Swift and acting like a giddy schoolboy so that may be done.

[ref1655]

Originally Posted by Dr. Prunesquallor

And Diana Rigg (Teresa Draco-Bond - On Her Majesty's Secret Service) had a long TV career which continues with her role of (THIS will freak you out)... Olenna Tyrell in Game of Thrones.
Attachment 755272

it certainly does...I prefer to remember her as Mrs. Emma Peel.

[Dr. Prunesquallor]

While the films have certainly demonstrated that there is no obligation to be particularly faithful to Fleming's vision of Bond, it is interesting to go back and review it.

In the novel You Only Live Twice (1964), we learn that Bond's father was from Glencoe, Scotland and his mother from Canton de Vaud, Switzerland. He traveled abroad with them extensively until he was orphaned at age eleven. He lived with an Aunt in Pett Bottom, England, briefly attended Eton College (but left because of "alleged trouble with one of the boys' maids"), then Fettes College in Scotland.

So it's probably safe to call Bond Scottish.

In several novels, Bond was described as resembling American actor Hoagy Carmichael.
IMG_0516.JPG

Fleming also made a sketch of his concept of Bond.
IMG_0515.JPG

In "From Russia with Love" (1957) he is described as 6 feet tall, weighing 168 lbs. He was consistently described as mid- to late-thirties and apparently did not age during the 13 year span of the novels.

As far as lifestyle goes, in the novel Thunderball (1961), just before M sends Bond to "the Shrublands" to dry out, the MI6 medical officer's report states:
"Despite many previous warnings, he admits to smoking sixty cigarettes a day. These are of a Balkan mixture with a higher nicotine content than the cheaper varieties. When not engaged upon strenuous duty, the officer’s average daily consumption of alcohol is in the region of half a bottle of spirits of between sixty and seventy proof."

Fleming's lifestyle was reputedly similar. He died of a heart attack at age 56 in 1964.

[jmiicustomz]

Originally Posted by ref1655

in retrospect, the only problem with being a 'Bond Girl' is that you are doomed to being a 'starlet' for the rest of one's movie career...regardless of impending age and/or maturity. I can't think of one who cinematically rose above their trademark Bond role.

Jane Seymore did I think. To me, when I see her face or hear her name Dr. Quinn Medicine Woman comes to mind. She made quite the role for herself in that show.

[jmiicustomz]

As for bonds, I would put SC And DC neck and neck, followed by RM, TD, PB, and finally GL. SC set a standard and held the role well from scratch, DC carried that standard, made the role his own and raised the bar.

As to Bond Girls, Eva Is by far my favorite, Denise Richards was fun and hot, and Lea Seydoux definitely get a mention. There is always something sexy about Famke Janssen. Jane Seymore, Britt Ekland, and Caterina Murino get honorable mentions.

As for watches, submariner and seamaster are the top two in that order. Then some of RM seiko.

[J!m]

Originally Posted by The Libertine

I think Craig was second only to Sean Connery for Bond.

Thought that Craig's version of Bond brought a depth to the character that no other actor was able to capture.

I agree with that. Rather than coming off as some saville row haberdashed pseudo-superhero he seems like an actual human- faltable and not immune to death. He makes mistakes as anyone would under the pressure presented.

It's a good thing.

[GED]

Originally Posted by Dr. Prunesquallor

While the films have certainly demonstrated that there is no obligation to be particularly faithful to Fleming's vision of Bond, it is interesting to go back and review it.

In the novel You Only Live Twice (1964), we learn that Bond's father was from Glencoe, Scotland and his mother from Canton de Vaud, Switzerland. He traveled abroad with them extensively until he was orphaned at age eleven. He lived with an Aunt in Pett Bottom, England, briefly attended Eton College (but left because of "alleged trouble with one of the boys' maids"), then Fettes College in Scotland.

So it's probably safe to call Bond Scottish.

In several novels, Bond was described as resembling American actor Hoagy Carmichael.
Attachment 755778

Fleming also made a sketch of his concept of Bond.
Attachment 755779

In "From Russia with Love" (1957) he is described as 6 feet tall, weighing 168 lbs. He was consistently described as mid- to late-thirties and apparently did not age during the 13 year span of the novels.

As far as lifestyle goes, in the novel Thunderball (1961), just before M sends Bond to "the Shrublands" to dry out, the MI6 medical officer's report states:
"Despite many previous warnings, he admits to smoking sixty cigarettes a day. These are of a Balkan mixture with a higher nicotine content than the cheaper varieties. When not engaged upon strenuous duty, the officer’s average daily consumption of alcohol is in the region of half a bottle of spirits of between sixty and seventy proof."

Fleming's lifestyle was reputedly similar. He died of a heart attack at age 56 in 1964.

There's speculation that Fleming created James Bond/wrote Casino Royale
as a result of the betrayals of the "Cambridge Spies"-Burgess and Maclean had disappeared in May 1951-and not as a "lark", a need for cash, or to take his mind off his upcoming marriage(!!)but to prop up the SIS/British establishment(which were one in the same)after the Burgess-Maclean debacle.

More on this here:
http://jfkcountercoup.blogspot.com/2...eming-kim.html

The above also gets into the Fleming-Kim Philby connection(Philby was the most successful of the Cambridge spies-and arguably the most successful spy ever)during WWII.

Anyone interested in real life spies, SIS, intelligence, the CIA during the early Bond era, etc. should read up on the Cambridge Spy Ring which eventually included five exposed spies/traitors, and esp. Kim Philby(recommend Treason in the Blood by Anthony Cave Brown-best read before Macintyre's A Spy Among Friends). And of course there's also Le Carré's novel Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy-a must read.

\

[BLACKHORSE 6]

Craig was a great Bond, and I'll be sorry to see him go. I hope he has one more in him.

Connery was a great Bond, but everyone fails to mention that his later work in the series was horrible. You Only Live Twice wasn't a good movie and started the campy action that Moore became known for. Diamonds Are Forever was worse, and Connery looks as if he was napping between takes and annoyed that they woke him. That doesn't take anything away from the first four films, which were great.

[Dr. Prunesquallor]

Revived this thread for a funny story.

My wife always hated Bond movies. The gadgets, womanizing, hokey plots completely turned her off. But she really likes the Jason Bourne movies and is into stories about Seals, Delta Force, etc.

I told her the Daniel Craig films were more action/spy stories and most of the goofiness had been left behind. Still no interest.

Last Friday night, I wanted to go out, but she wasn't in the mood. She said if we stayed in, she'd watch the Bond movie of my choice. Around 9:00 pm I cued up Casino Royale.

After it was over, she was upset because there was no resolution concerning Mathis or Mr. White. The whole situation with Vesper upset her too ("The b!+<h is dead"). I let her know that there were resolutions to all those issues in Quantum, even though that wasn't as good a movie. I also let her know that all four films comprised an arc concerning Bond's character evolution.

We finished Spectre about 6:00 am.

[NewEnthusiast]

Originally Posted by ref1655

as I recall...George Lazenby (Australian) was the only non-English actor to portray 007.

curious...could any American actor have pulled it off?

Dangerous statement to make.... Connery was SCOTTISH (Dalton Welsh, Brosnan Irish). Sounds pedantic I know but they are all distinct countries with very strong national identities.

[toneafficianado]

Originally Posted by ref1655

not to drift off-topic but....who was the hottest Bond Girl?

Easier to answer would be "what was the hottest Bond WATCH!"

[Rock]

Damian Lewis was a guest on a recent episode of Top Gear.
Evans asks him if there is any truth to the rumour that he is being considered for the next Bond.
I think he could pull it off.
"Bond, Ginge Bond!"

[Cru Jones]

i heard rumors that tom hiddleston was being considered. he starred in the recent miniseries "the night manager" with hugh lawrie (of dr house fame).

as a fan of the more suave bond, i think he'd make a great choice, and infinitely better than damian lewis.

[Dr. Prunesquallor]

Originally Posted by ref1655

as I recall...George Lazenby (Australian) was the only non-English actor to portray 007.

curious...could any American actor have pulled it off?

I read that a number of American actors were in the running when Craig was selected. None could nail the accent.

Recall EON Productions although American owned, is a British film production. The premiers are (I believe) always in London, sometimes attended by the Queen.

An American actor with a dodgy accent just wouldn't do.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by ref1655

not to drift off-topic but....who was the hottest Bond Girl?

Sophie Marceau as Electra King.

[kultschar]

Originally Posted by The Joker

Sean is Scottish, Pierce Irish.

Sure an american could pull it off, but there are tons of good Brits to choose from.

Don't forget Dalton is Welsh!! There are more non english Bonds then English!!

[kultschar]

Thunderball
On Her Majestys Secret Service
Casino Royale
Goldfinger
From Russia With Love

[dba]

Originally Posted by Dr. Prunesquallor

Revived this thread for a funny story.

My wife always hated Bond movies. The gadgets, womanizing, hokey plots completely turned her off. But she really likes the Jason Bourne movies and is into stories about Seals, Delta Force, etc.

I told her the Daniel Craig films were more action/spy stories and most of the goofiness had been left behind. Still no interest.

Last Friday night, I wanted to go out, but she wasn't in the mood. She said if we stayed in, she'd watch the Bond movie of my choice. Around 9:00 pm I cued up Casino Royale.

After it was over, she was upset because there was no resolution concerning Mathis or Mr. White. The whole situation with Vesper upset her too ("The b!+<h is dead"). I let her know that there were resolutions to all those issues in Quantum, even though that wasn't as good a movie. I also let her know that all four films comprised an arc concerning Bond's character evolution.

We finished Spectre about 6:00 am.

That's awesome!! Changed her mind I guess?

[watchwatcher]

Originally Posted by Dr. Prunesquallor

Diamond are Forever (1971) – usually not high on anyone’s list, but I gotta tell you, puberty hit hard in 1971, and the sight of essentially naked Jill St. John (Tiffany Case), Lana Wood (Plenty O’Toole [“Named after your father, no doubt” –Bond)] and hot-pants gymnasts Bambi and Thumper made me feel funny.

I gotta tell you, Doc...as a fellow puberty hitter in 1971, that made quite an impact on me, too.

[Dr. Prunesquallor]

Originally Posted by dba

That's awesome!! Changed her mind I guess?

Yup. She's a bit of a motor-head, so when THE Aston Martin made it's appearance in Royale, she loved it. She has always wanted to visit Istanbul (not right now, perhaps), so we watched the chase through the Grand Bazaar in Skyfall several times. And the segment on the Desert Orient Express in Spectre may cost me a vacation by rail in the future.

[Dr. Prunesquallor]

Originally Posted by watchwatcher

I gotta tell you, Doc...as a fellow puberty hitter in 1971, that made quite an impact on me, too.

Let's not even TALK about Barbarella...

[Dr. Prunesquallor]

Originally Posted by kultschar

Thunderball
On Her Majestys Secret Service
Casino Royale
Goldfinger
From Russia With Love

Excellent choices all, IMHO. Probably NOT coincidentally, all are quite true to Fleming's novels.