All the new AP 2018 models!

[tng11]

Originally Posted by benlee

I think this model is actually selling poorly. My local AD got one sitting in their store for months. At almost 2X the price of 15400ST silver and sharing the same dial, its no surprise.

Yeah, I was not thrilled by it when I saw it in person especially at that price tag. In fact, one AD even offered me a discount on it, so that was a good litmus test of how well it is selling...

[AK797]

The 202IP will initially be marked up to close to double its retail by the likes of Chronext and WF here, they'll use the 5711 as a guide, but hopefully people won't bite, but famous last words...

Will be more pressure now the PC is not happening.

[tng11]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

The premium talk is overstated. It doesnt make any of the watches less desirable based on merit. I just dont think they are profit generating flip watches. Plus AP has released a lot of LE watches recently. Sort of devalues the concept of LE.

LE APs in general are priced so high that it eliminates profits from flipping. I remember back in the days when LEs were priced normally and there was a lot to made from flips, then AP raised prices on LEs and killed the flip market.

I must admit, that makes me a little hesitant on the 15202IP. I do want it, but I'm not sure I want it badly enough considering I have the ST. I probably have to make the call by tonight if I want to reasonably confirm a spot for one.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by tng11

LE APs in general are priced so high that it eliminates profits from flipping. I remember back in the days when LEs were priced normally and there was a lot to made from flips, then AP raised prices on LEs and killed the flip market.

I must admit, that makes me a little hesitant on the 15202IP. I do want it, but I'm not sure I want it badly enough considering I have the ST. I probably have to make the call by tonight if I want to reasonably confirm a spot for one.

Good point, as AP really want to control pricing and distribution, maybe this will be priced extra high to curb the initial grey profiteering so rampant this last year.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by tng11

LE APs in general are priced so high that it eliminates profits from flipping. I remember back in the days when LEs were priced normally and there was a lot to made from flips, then AP raised prices on LEs and killed the flip market.

I must admit, that makes me a little hesitant on the 15202IP. I do want it, but I'm not sure I want it badly enough considering I have the ST. I probably have to make the call by tonight if I want to reasonably confirm a spot for one.

would you really get rid of your SS 15202 for it? or just add it? No way i would do that swap

[benlee]

Overall, I think this year release disappoints much more than previous years... Reasons being

1) Still no promised and long overdue In-house Chrono
2) Ugly looking Coloured divers that have butchered this line
3) Vast majority of the new release are just cosmetic changes
4) The only innovation, the ultra-thin PPC is only a concept watch

some bright spots

1) 15202IP looks interesting
2) Finally ceramic bezel on standard 42mm ROOs

[tng11]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

would you really get rid of your SS 15202 for it? or just add it? No way i would do that swap

Nope, I would only add. The 15202ST will be a staple of my collection for the foreseeable future. And then I run into the question if I ever need multiples of the same watch... I always end up selling watches that are too similar or duplicates (e.g. I couldn't justify having a black SubC and LV at the same time in the collection.)

[AK797]

Originally Posted by benlee

Overall, I think this year release disappoints much more than previous years... Reasons being

1) Still no promised and long overdue In-house Chrono
2) Ugly looking Coloured divers that have butchered this line
3) Vast majority of the new release are just cosmetic changes
4) The only innovation, the ultra-thin PPC is only a concept watch

some bright spots

1) 15202IP looks interesting
2) Finally ceramic bezel on standard 42mm ROOs

I think 2 and 3 are basically the same negative, so overall 3 positives, one seminal if rolled out, and 2 negatives, so not a bad year imho.

[tng11]

Originally Posted by AK797

Good point, as AP really want to control pricing and distribution, maybe this will be priced extra high to curb the initial grey profiteering so rampant this last year.

At $34.8K USD I think it's priced high, but not egregiously so to kill all grey market profits. That said, I don't think the hype around APs except the 15407 is high enough to see these trading at double list. Even with the current 15202 shortage, they are not trading for any meaningful premiums on the grey market when compared to the Nautilus.

The 15202 seems to be a cult following on TRF, but I've found for many AP owners I know that don't post here, they prefer the bigger 15400, and think that my 15202 is a cheaper, "lite" version of their Royal Oak ("what, it doesn't have a seconds hand?")

[AK797]

Originally Posted by tng11

Nope, I would only add. The 15202ST will be a staple of my collection for the foreseeable future. And then I run into the question if I ever need multiples of the same watch... I always end up selling watches that are too similar or duplicates (e.g. I couldn't justify having a black SubC and LV at the same time in the collection.)

I would get the 5712 over having these two, and as I do like a sunburst dial I'd be leaning that way but def have to see that first before making any decisions.

[OH2004]

15202ST/5711A are iconic watches and can't be compared to 15400 or frosted gold. I myself was never interested in both 15202ST/5711A because they are just production watches. I know the demand is high but they will continue to make these for some time. I like watches that are a little more exclusive and 15202IP fits the bill. If this retails for $35 and if I can't get it from a boutique, I'm willing to pay $50K. They are making 250 and probably 100 will come to US. I saw 26331IP in flesh and I thought it was the best looking watch I ever saw.

[benlee]

Originally Posted by AK797

I think 2 and 3 are basically the same negative, so overall 3 positives, one seminal if rolled out, and 2 negatives, so not a bad year imho.

(1) is a huge minus. It just goes to show that AP is no longer on the same level playing field horologically speaking as PP, VC, Lange or even JLC despite being a member of the so called "trinity". Actually I think they have not been for quite some time.

(2) and (3) refers to different things. (2) is how AP wants to position the divers as a sort of entry level ROOs that appeal mostly to the young and fashionable crowd. From a business point of view, maybe that make sense but I find all these various colours vile and comical.

I am so critical of AP that if they read my posts here, I guess they are going to blacklist me. Oh well.. after owning so many APs, maybe it's finally time for me to move on to other brands.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by benlee

(1) is a huge minus. It just goes to show that AP is no longer on the same level playing field horologically speaking as PP, VC, Lange or even JLC despite being a member of the so called "trinity". Actually I think they have not been for quite some time.

(2) and (3) refers to different things. (2) is how AP wants to position the divers as a sort of entry level ROOs that appeal mostly to the young and fashionable crowd. From a business point of view, maybe that make sense but I find all these various colours vile and comical.

I am so critical of AP that if they read my posts here, I guess they are going to blacklist me. Oh well.. after owning so many APs, maybe it's finally time for me to move on to other brands.

Either they blacklist you or they get off their arses and make that ROC in house!

But yes you should def now get the 5711R.

[benlee]

Originally Posted by AK797

Either they blacklist you or they get off their arses and make that ROC in house!

The former is possibly the easier option. No need to master any rules to do so

[tng11]

Originally Posted by AK797

I would get the 5712 over having these two, and as I do like a sunburst dial I'd be leaning that way but def have to see that first before making any decisions.

That's my inclination - I'd much rather have the 5712 ten times over adding another 15202 to the collection. Part of me only wants the 15202IP because it's a limited edition.

Add that I'll be getting a FPJ CB, and should be getting a SS SkyD, SD43 and Daytona C this year, do I really need another piece for 2018?

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by benlee

I am so critical of AP that if they read my posts here, I guess they are going to blacklist me. Oh well.. after owning so many APs, maybe it's finally time for me to move on to other brands.

Thats where i was, now i've gone from 4 AP's to 1.

My take is we bash Hublot here a lot, but lets look at it another way. Hublot is aspiring to be more than they are and are punching above their weight. They are hungry and on the rise and you cant really fault them for that.

AP is being lazy and recycling too many ideas and calling it something new. They are declining.

Of the two brands and seeing their trajectories, I would rather be Hublot. I really would. Hublot is the one coming out with fresh ideas. I dont like a lot of them, but they are doing it. AP is getting by on reputation, not substance and that isnt going to last without some major shakeups. Im speaking to their mainstream pieces not their uber expensive complications.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by tng11

That's my inclination - I'd much rather have the 5712 ten times over adding another 15202 to the collection. Part of me only wants the 15202IP because it's a limited edition.

Add that I'll be getting a FPJ CB, and should be getting a SS SkyD, SD43 and Daytona C this year, do I really need another piece for 2018?

I don’t understand this mixing titanium and polished pt kick AP is on. The single best feature of the royal oak is the case finishing. Why mess with it?

If that watch was all white gold and had the same dial they could charge 50k and sell it like hot cakes.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by GB-man

I don’t understand this mixing titanium and polished pt kick AP is on. The single best feature of the royal oak is the case finishing. Why mess with it?

If that watch was all white gold and had the same dial they could charge 50k and sell it like hot cakes.

yep. Id be in for that.

[texasmade]

Originally Posted by benlee

Overall, I think this year release disappoints much more than previous years... Reasons being

1) Still no promised and long overdue In-house Chrono
2) Ugly looking Coloured divers that have butchered this line
3) Vast majority of the new release are just cosmetic changes
4) The only innovation, the ultra-thin PPC is only a concept watch

some bright spots

1) 15202IP looks interesting
2) Finally ceramic bezel on standard 42mm ROOs

AP just revamped the ROC line last year. I’ve been saying in this the AP sub forum since I joined that AP wasn’t going to release the in house right after a revamp. They would tank sales of the ROC.

My guess is they’re waiting for the ROC 25th anniversary before the next revamp with in house. This also gives them a few more years to let the movement run and test it for a servicing. Last thing AP wants to do is release it and then 3 years later a bunch come back for warranty service.

I will agree on the colored divers. 2 look ridiculous, while the other 2 look decent and somewhat wearable.

[Ss22525]

Am i color blind ? I cant see the colors that are written


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Ss22525

Am i color blind ? I cant see the colors that are written


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

looks about right for a color blind person. Its all grey

[rockonpeople]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

they took your order before the release was announced?

Which watch, the 15202 ti/pt?

Yes, 15202ip platinum-titanium, before christmas in switzland. i'm just new here, can not post url photol now

At first, I thought it would be grey or silver dial as QEII cup2017 model. But saw in the news today, blue dial s very stunning.

[SC11]

Originally Posted by GB-man

I don’t understand this mixing titanium and polished pt kick AP is on. The single best feature of the royal oak is the case finishing. Why mess with it?

If that watch was all white gold and had the same dial they could charge 50k and sell it like hot cakes.

I actually like the contrast on the bracelet but wish they had left the bezel in its normal brushed/polished contrast, it would of matched the bracelet better then it does fully brushed, ok maybe the needed to distinguish the model but the dial is a good enough cue.

Out of interest what is the US retail on the 15202st?

[SC11]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

Thats where i was, now i've gone from 4 AP's to 1.

I knew you had the RG44, Ti44 and 15400 silver dial what was the fourth and what did you cull?!

Remember you saying the Ti44 was going but thought the 15400 and RG44 were keepers, well at least the 15400 as you had concerns on longevity with the 44 but either way that’s a big AP cut

[AK797]

Originally Posted by texasmade

AP just revamped the ROC line last year. I’ve been saying in this the AP sub forum since I joined that AP wasn’t going to release the in house right after a revamp. They would tank sales of the ROC.

My guess is they’re waiting for the ROC 25th anniversary before the next revamp with in house. This also gives them a few more years to let the movement run and test it for a servicing. Last thing AP wants to do is release it and then 3 years later a bunch come back for warranty service.

I will agree on the colored divers. 2 look ridiculous, while the other 2 look decent and somewhat wearable.

Yes, that didn't augur well, esp as some of their colour combos were really cool on the new ROCs. As I said I thought the inhouse would have come out last year and with those new designs, but seems AP are behind the pace.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by SC11

I knew you had the RG44, Ti44 and 15400 silver dial what was the fourth and what did you cull?!

Remember you saying the Ti44 was going but thought the 15400 and RG44 were keepers, well at least the 15400 as you had concerns on longevity with the 44 but either way that’s a big AP cut

diver, RG 44, and Ti 44 all went since late Aug. RG just went yesterday. The new 44 with the green bezel and cammo strap sealed the deal when i saw the direction. The purple diver alleviated any sellers remorse. Still like the RO line a lot. The ROO has just gone too far off the deep end for me

[AK797]

Originally Posted by tng11

That's my inclination - I'd much rather have the 5712 ten times over adding another 15202 to the collection. Part of me only wants the 15202IP because it's a limited edition.

Add that I'll be getting a FPJ CB, and should be getting a SS SkyD, SD43 and Daytona C this year, do I really need another piece for 2018?

You're going to add 3 Rolexes? Didn't know you were going to be so heavy on them, I'm OK with Rolex now, pending Basel.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

diver, RG 44, and Ti 44 all went since late Aug. RG just went yesterday.

And PP is the main beneficiary here. I remember Roger doing something similar altho on a rather different scale.

[GB-man]

Originally Posted by SC11

I actually like the contrast on the bracelet but wish they had left the bezel in its normal brushed/polished contrast, it would of matched the bracelet better then it does fully brushed, ok maybe the needed to distinguish the model but the dial is a good enough cue.

Out of interest what is the US retail on the 15202st?

22,700 USD

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by AK797

And PP is the main beneficiary here. I remember Roger doing something similar altho on a rather different scale.

me and Roger in the same sentence. Ill take it.

Still undecided on what is taking the ROO's place but probably another PP.