Debt and quality of life.

[Knappo 1307]

Originally Posted by Blansky

Cool.

How much do I get because I have to pay off some credit card debt on my last 4 watch purchases.

Wait, you carry debt? Loser!

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by Knappo 1307

Wait, you carry debt? Loser!

It's now I've been able to consistently maintain my credit score in the high 400s.

[Knappo 1307]

Originally Posted by Blansky

It's now I've been able to consistently maintain my credit score in the high 400s.

Well, I'm glad things are on the up and up for you.

[huncho]

ironically you need to take on debt to get into the highest tier of credit scores (800+). when i got out of college i couldn't get a credit card anywhere so i got a secured card from citi which is basically a prepaid card and was able to get a regular card after. i never missed a single payment and even paid in full every month, not just the last statement balance. i couldn't break mid 700s for 5 years until i took a car loan out last year and then i jumped from mid-high 700s to 850 in 2 months lol

you don't get rewarded for being clean in the US. the best part is that on my income the car loan i took out would be considered stupid by most people (and it is), yet it lets you beat the credit score game. go figure

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBobo

Yet another thread where the high and mighty judge others for how they live differently from them.

Differently is good. If we all lived the same life would be boring.

Besides, we can always eat the rich

[Chewbacca]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Differently is good. If we all lived the same life would be boring.

Besides, we can always eat the rich

Hey!!!! Reported!!!!

[thejerseyrock]

well then... this has certainly been an interesting thread

[Krash]

Originally Posted by Blansky

Personally I don't equate money with happiness.

I do find that love of money (greed) makes for some very mean people. And some of the richest people I know are the most unhappy. And the constant need and consumption of luxury goods is a failed attempt at making themselves happy.

Most people on a forum like this are on a decent spectrum of wealth (probably nobody is starving), and whether they are happy/content or not is more about their character or mental health than anything to do with debt vs non debt.

It’s true that money can’t buy happiness, but if you have a lot of money and you’re miserable, then being poor isn’t going to cheer you up.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Krash

It’s true that money can’t buy happiness, but if you have a lot of money and you’re miserable, then being poor isn’t going to cheer you up.

Not necessarily (imho). Sometimes too much currency means more things, sure, yet do you own those things, or do they 'own' you? Have personally experienced a wide variety of lifestyles, some at the very extremes, and the middle ground too.

The goal is more happiness.

Thankfully and gratefully, i was very aware and attentive, so did not mess it up when i finally found my Muse. :smoking:

Ask Yourself: Have you found your Muse?

goal_happiness.jpg

[airchitect]

Originally Posted by huncho

ironically you need to take on debt to get into the highest tier of credit scores (800+). when i got out of college i couldn't get a credit card anywhere so i got a secured card from citi which is basically a prepaid card and was able to get a regular card after. i never missed a single payment and even paid in full every month, not just the last statement balance. i couldn't break mid 700s for 5 years until i took a car loan out last year and then i jumped from mid-high 700s to 850 in 2 months lol

you don't get rewarded for being clean in the US. the best part is that on my income the car loan i took out would be considered stupid by most people (and it is), yet it lets you beat the credit score game. go figure

Yup… whenever I pull my report I always get nailed for not having any installment loans. That system is so very broken.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Krash]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Not necessarily (imho). Sometimes too much currency means more things, sure, yet do you own those things, or do they 'own' you? Have personally experienced a wide variety of lifestyles, some at the very extremes, and the middle ground too.

The goal is more happiness.

Thankfully and gratefully, i was very aware and attentive, so did not mess it up when i finally found my Muse. :smoking:

Ask Yourself: Have you found your Muse?

Attachment 1335867

There are happy wealthy people and miserable wealthy people (often due to personal relationships), and then there are happy middle class folks and unhappy middle class folks. That is true.

However, if someone is rich and unhappy, and then they suddenly find themselves as being poor, that's not going to cheer them up.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Krash

There are happy wealthy people and miserable wealthy people (often due to personal relationships), and then there are happy middle class folks and unhappy middle class folks. That is true.

However, if someone is rich and unhappy, and then they suddenly find themselves as being poor, that's not going to cheer them up.

I literally laughed out loud at this. No, it most definitely will not cheer them up.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Krash

However, if someone is rich and unhappy, and then they suddenly find themselves as being poor, that's not going to cheer them up.

Imho they may become very happy... after they go through 'a process'. Sometimes less is more. Have less now than before and am the happiest i've ever been in life.

My Best Advice: Don't screw it up with your Muse.

Of course some have goals, perhaps overly-inflated egos, and in what 'makes them happy'. For some, mo' currency is their only thing in life. Sad, but true.

[Star Ferry]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Imho they may become very happy... after they go through 'a process'. Sometimes less is more. Have less now than before and am the happiest i've ever been in life.

My Best Advice: Don't screw it up with your Muse.

Of course some have goals, perhaps overly-inflated egos, and in what 'makes them happy'. For some, mo' currency is their only thing in life. Sad, but true.

Good point. My “muse” is quiet, very sweet, and seems innocent of all of today’s nastiness. It’s like she’s from a different era. She cares little about money and actually has no idea how much money I have. She thinks my net worth is the 50 grand I keep in my checking account.

There are very rich men in NYC who continue to make themselves miserable chasing bad quality girls. Maybe their moms were overly controlling and they’re trying to recreate that dynamic? There are places you can go for that fantasy, though, and they’re all cheaper than a divorce

[daveathall]

I think that the last two posters have summed it up perfectly, I could have 100 billion or owe a 100 billion, but without my wife, I have no quality of life whatsoever, absolutely none.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by daveathall

I think that the last two posters have summed it up perfectly, I could have 100 billion or owe a 100 billion, but without my wife, I have no quality of life whatsoever, absolutely none.

Again, another situation which depends on the individual.

While I love my ex very much, I’m currently living a happier, less stressed life.

And while I had a prenup, I essentially ripped it up and gave her significantly more. My thought process is that it was my responsibility to ensure she is living a good life. So I made certain that she would ultimately never have to worry about money again.

Now, I have less. Less “currency” and less a partner. But I’m happier than I’ve ever been. I’m also decluttering my of “stuff” which has been very fulfilling and rewarding.

I do hope the ex and I can somehow, someday figure it all out. But I realize I might just be happier alone, regardless of the person I’m with.

Some people just prefer to be alone.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Star Ferry

Good point. My “muse” is quiet, very sweet, and seems innocent of all of today’s nastiness. It’s like she’s from a different era. She cares little about money and actually has no idea how much money I have. She thinks my net worth is the 50 grand I keep in my checking account.

There are very rich men in NYC who continue to make themselves miserable chasing bad quality girls. Maybe their moms were overly controlling and they’re trying to recreate that dynamic? There are places you can go for that fantasy, though, and they’re all cheaper than a divorce

It’s possible those men just have a different definition of happiness than you do.

Doesn’t mean they are miserable. Or more accurately, doesn’t mean that if they settled down with a perfect woman, they would find themselves magically happy.

The hallmark movie just isn’t real for a great many. Dare I say the majority.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Imho they may become very happy... after they go through 'a process'. Sometimes less is more. Have less now than before and am the happiest i've ever been in life.

My Best Advice: Don't screw it up with your Muse.

Of course some have goals, perhaps overly-inflated egos, and in what 'makes them happy'. For some, mo' currency is their only thing in life. Sad, but true.

Not sure who you are trying to kid, I’ve seen pictures of your oasis backyard. It’s very likely the most beautiful backyard I’ve ever seen.

Maybe you have less. I certainly don’t know. But you’ve clearly got more than 99%.

And there is nothing wrong with that. You’ve earned it.

Go down to a 750 foot rented apartment, where you don’t know how you are paying rent and still tell me you are happier than you’ve ever been.

An unlikely scenario. Obviously. But that would actually be living with less.

[Star Ferry]

Originally Posted by superdog

It’s possible those men just have a different definition of happiness than you do.

Doesn’t mean they are miserable. Or more accurately, doesn’t mean that if they settled down with a perfect woman, they would find themselves magically happy.

The hallmark movie just isn’t real for a great many. Dare I say the majority.

Certainly different strokes for different folks, Seth. The behavior I'm talking about is more like hedonism than romance or companionship, i.e. going after more and more coveted and exclusive girls, with increasingly higher costs to keep, like chasing that high jumping from Rolex to Patek to Greubel Forsey.

They'd almost certainly tell me I'm a chump loser and that they're living their best life. But I've seen enough firsthand to believe that treating interactions with women, and relationships in general, as another competition to "win" is a negative-EV activity that mostly doesn't end well for the gentlemen involved.

[daveathall]

Originally Posted by superdog

It’s possible those men just have a different definition of happiness than you do.

Doesn’t mean they are miserable. Or more accurately, doesn’t mean that if they settled down with a perfect woman, they would find themselves magically happy.

The hallmark movie just isn’t real for a great many. Dare I say the majority.

Yes, very true my friend, I think I should have added "For me" when I typed the two posters above have summed it up perfectly. But I can definitely see where you're coming from Seth.

When you laughed about a phrase used above, I immediately thought of one that someone told me, they said; "if money can't buy you happiness, you are in the wrong store."

Hope you are doing well Seth and have a great Christmas.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Star Ferry

Certainly different strokes for different folks, Seth. The behavior I'm talking about is more like hedonism than romance or companionship, i.e. going after more and more coveted and exclusive girls, with increasingly higher costs to keep, like chasing that high jumping from Rolex to Patek to Greubel Forsey.

They'd almost certainly tell me I'm a chump loser and that they're living their best life. But I've seen enough firsthand to believe that treating interactions with women, and relationships in general, as another competition to "win" is a negative-EV activity that mostly doesn't end well for the gentlemen involved.

I don't disagree with you. And you said it very well. Thank you for expanding.

I actually went to dinner with a buddy the other night, he is a huge player. All the details you spoke about. And we talked about him wanting to settle down. I hope he does.

But I do wonder if he will be any happier.

I have always found that happiness truly is found within. And it is found in different ways. Yet, I do agree. Hopping in and out of bed can get old very fast and is often unfulfilling.

I believe that everyone pursues different things that make them happy. But that is simply a byproduct of what is going on internally.

I do agree with Steve above, if I am following him properly (sometimes he loses me) in that some folks just strive for more and more simply for the sake of having more. That can be women, money, status, power etc...

I stand by the power of knowing thyself and finding happiness inside before one can be happy by anything external, including a life partner.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by daveathall

Yes, very true my friend, I think I should have added "For me" when I typed the two posters above have summed it up perfectly. But I can definitely see where you're coming from Seth.

When you laughed about a phrase used above, I immediately thought of one that someone told me, they said; "if money can't buy you happiness, you are in the wrong store."

Hope you are doing well Seth and have a great Christmas.

Hard for me to describe truly how much I appreciate you. On so many levels I feel this amazing kinship with you and I love reading your posts, thank you.

And doing well brother. Enjoying the season and the changes of my "new" life. I miss my old life terribly, but life is filled with different stages, and I just find myself in a new stage. Not better or worse, but certainly different.

Hope you too are enjoying every day. I somehow know that you are and it makes me smile.

[Blansky]

There have been interesting things written about countries like Costa Rica constantly supposedly being a consistent number one country in the "happiness spectrum".

And one thing I've always argued is that in the US when the sky is the limit, it can create anxiety and unhappiness due to the keeping up with the jones's syndrome.

In a place like Costa Rica which is a relatively poor country, their internal index for happiness is centered around family and community and the surveys taken rate them at the top of the happiness heap.

In a country like the US with supposed unlimited opportunity and the myth that anyone can become rich, we have a culture of massive credit card debt, lack of pensions for most people, health care costs that have skyrocketed etc etc, and a lot of people are very afraid, which makes them unhappy.

Scandinavian countries also rate very highly on the "happiness index" partly for the same reason as Costa Rica due to a more socialized system with, healthcare, pensions, education etc included in their tax burden.

Obviously the US shuns these type of social programs, and one has to wonder if that's why we have so much hate, distrust, and rancor within the country with the haves vs have nots gap widening every day.

I get that this is not the personal happiness that this thread is addressing but people who are constantly stressed in their lives, their personal lives will be affected as well.

Even in our own lives when we make the conscious decision to jump of the consumer treadmill, trade down from the McMansion, and essentially, SIMPLIFY, we usually become much happier. The problem is that it's a pretty hard decision to make, with all the marketing that is done to keep us buying, and buying and buying.

[superdog]

Originally Posted by Blansky

There have been interesting things written about countries like Costa Rica constantly supposedly being a consistent number one country in the "happiness spectrum".

And one thing I've always argued is that in the US when the sky is the limit, it can create anxiety and unhappiness due to the keeping up with the jones's syndrome.

In a place like Costa Rica which is a relatively poor country, their internal index for happiness is centered around family and community and the surveys taken rate them at the top of the happiness heap.

In a country like the US with supposed unlimited opportunity and the myth that anyone can become rich, we have a culture of massive credit card debt, lack of pensions for most people, health care costs that have skyrocketed etc etc, and a lot of people are very afraid, which makes them unhappy.

Scandinavian countries also rate very highly on the "happiness index" partly for the same reason as Costa Rica due to a more socialized system with, healthcare, pensions, education etc included in their tax burden.

Obviously the US shuns these type of social programs, and one has to wonder if that's why we have so much hate, distrust, and rancor within the country with the haves vs have nots gap widening every day.

I get that this is not the personal happiness that this thread is addressing but people who are constantly stressed in their lives, their personal lives will be affected as well.

Even in our own lives when we make the conscious decision to jump of the consumer treadmill, trade down from the McMansion, and essentially, SIMPLIFY, we usually become much happier. The problem is is that it's a pretty hard decision to make, with all the marketing that is done to keep us buying, and buying and buying.

a very appropriate post for the thread, imho. and meaningful to read. thank you for sharing that. it really does make a lot of sense.

[Star Ferry]

Originally Posted by superdog

I don't disagree with you. And you said it very well. Thank you for expanding.

I actually went to dinner with a buddy the other night, he is a huge player. All the details you spoke about. And we talked about him wanting to settle down. I hope he does.

But I do wonder if he will be any happier.

I have always found that happiness truly is found within. And it is found in different ways. Yet, I do agree. Hopping in and out of bed can get old very fast and is often unfulfilling.

I believe that everyone pursues different things that make them happy. But that is simply a byproduct of what is going on internally.

I do agree with Steve above, if I am following him properly (sometimes he loses me) in that some folks just strive for more and more simply for the sake of having more. That can be women, money, status, power etc...

I stand by the power of knowing thyself and finding happiness inside before one can be happy by anything external, including a life partner.

I think being happy single is pretty similar to being happy in a relationship. Someone who can't be happy single is unlikely to be happy in a relationship, and vice versa. The way you feel single is the same headspace that I (and probably our friend Steven) were talking about.

The common thread is not having a hole inside that needs to be filled by the constant stimulation of dating new women. Your typical guy has close to zero options romantically and will stick to drugs, booze, or cigarettes. But for the guys who can swing it, a carousel of women can become yet another addiction. Addictions are corrosive and will inevitably harm the addict.

[Krash]

I definitely agree that love and relationships matter most. Money (or lack thereof) is on the periphery.

I still stubbornly say that if you're unhappy when you're rich, being poor isn't going to help. There might be some odd cases, but the odds are like 1 in a 1000.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by Star Ferry

I think being happy single is pretty similar to being happy in a relationship. Someone who can't be happy single is unlikely to be happy in a relationship, and vice versa. The way you feel single is the same headspace that I (and probably our friend Steven) were talking about.

The common thread is not having a hole inside that needs to be filled by the constant stimulation of dating new women. Your typical guy has close to zero options romantically and will stick to drugs, booze, or cigarettes. But for the guys who can swing it, a carousel of women can become yet another addiction. Addictions are corrosive and will inevitably harm the addict.

When I moved from a small city in Canada to LA I found a dynamic that was interesting and probably the same in a city like NY.

Women were always saying, what's wrong with men/dating, they just won't commit??? And men were probably saying the same thing.

And what I thought the problem was, was there are sooooo many people, that people might think a better one is right around the corner, whereas in a smaller place you have fewer choices, and you make a decision.

As I mentioned in the consumerism post, I wonder if humans don't respond well to so many choices, and are overwhelmed.

[Kinnakeet]

Originally Posted by Blansky

When I moved from a small city in Canada to LA I found a dynamic that was interesting and probably the same in a city like NY.

Women were always saying, what's wrong with men/dating, they just won't commit??? And men were probably saying the same thing.

And what I thought the problem was, was there are sooooo many people, that people might think a better one is right around the corner, whereas in a smaller place you have fewer choices, and you make a decision.

As I mentioned in the consumerism post, I wonder if humans don't respond well to so many choices, and are overwhelmed.

You bring up an interesting point that my Floridian husband has noticed, we actually have discussed this. While living in the very small village in Ontario, that I am from he says the Canadians meet someone and stay with them, especially once divorced and meeting someone new. They get introduced and just stay together. Now that we are mostly back in Florida I can see this difference. Doesn’t work that way here.

[BNA/LION]

I prefer to be debt free and have nice thing too. Personally I'm not buying anything I don't want and I can't afford to own.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by superdog

The hallmark movie just isn’t real for a great many. Dare I say the majority.

Do agree with you. Am almost embarrassed to say we get compliments from other couples 'quite often'. Basically, others seem to truly feel our... for lack of a better word, 'aura'. I dunno, call it a glow when we're together???? Then again we also talk sh__ now and then teasing one another, others seem to be 'amused' at our 'antics' together.

Originally Posted by superdog

Not sure who you are trying to kid, I’ve seen pictures of your oasis backyard. It’s very likely the most beautiful backyard I’ve ever seen.

Many, many thanks and my wife did an amazing effort style-wise, with some math / positioning assistance from me. While others here on TRF have far more extensive setups and larger properties, we did what we could given the (relatively) compact sq ft. Believe me, we are VERY appreciative... and I use the heck out of the kitchen. The cooking surface ability really opens up cooking possibilities

Go down to a 750 foot rented apartment, where you don’t know how you are paying rent and still tell me you are happier than you’ve ever been.

An unlikely scenario. Obviously. But that would actually be living with less.

Great points, and when I was homeless for months some days were better than others. Of course you're right it is 'easier' to feel positive today than it was during more challenging times. Yet those trying times have me more appreciating...

Besides, it all ebbs and flows so seize the day, today.

Right now.

(read the video)