New Main Spring is too hot?

[aurorakooba]

I own a ROLEX Stainless Oyster.
Serial 338XXX
Model 6480
Caliber 1210
My grandfather bought it in Switzerland in the 1970s, but it is from the 1950s.

I wear it daily. Swimming, cutting the grass. It is a workhorse. I don't abuse it, but it rarely comes off my wrist.

In August, the second hand stopped sweeping, so though I have had it overhauled (have records) in NYC before, I sent it to a repairman in Pennsylvania who my father-in-law recommended. This repairman has worked on my father-in-law's Submariner and other watches. He uses genuine Rolex parts and works quickly. I follow him on Instagram, and his work is impressive.

When the Rolex came back to me from this gentleman with a new Rolex mainspring and an overhaul, it looked awesome, but after 24 hours, I realized that my Rolex was running fast. In a 24 hour period, it runs, at least, an hour fast. So, I corresponded with the repairman and sent it back to him. He said, "At this point in time, I dont have a good solution to this problem. The issues is a strong mainspring in a worn watch. It is rebanking. No other spring is available for the watch, so this may be as good as it is going to go."....He said it was like putting a new engine in an old car...the new part it too hot for the old watch. He explained that when I take it off, I should lay it down dial up. Nothing worked. It still ran way too fast.
So I took it to a respected jeweler here in town who sends all watches back to Rolex NY for service. And yesterday after the watch went up to NYC, I got this message from my contact person here in town...."Dear John,
I received a phone call from Rolex last Friday.

They are returning the watch with “no work done”.

I have never had them return a watch….

Rolex says that they do not have the parts needed to repair your watch. It is simply too old. I asked them to send it to Switzerland and they said Switzerland doesn’t have the parts either. I asked what part was needed and they would not give me an answer. I was speaking to a customer service representative. The only advice they gave me was to find an authorized Rolex watchmaker who “might” have spare parts.

I have to believe that this is the case since the watch is over 50 years old."

Who has any advice for me...This seems so odd. A Rolex is a lifetime piece. I see all the time, guys wearing older watches than mine. Thank you for any help/directions/leads.

[Tools]

There are some old-time watchmakers who have been working on Rolex for decades that may have some advice for you.

Bob Ridley at Watchmakers International in Texas

Giovanni at the Old Rolex RSC on Post Road in San Fransisco.

And we have a couple that frequent the Forum

Give them a call.

[aurorakooba]

Thank you for these leads. I will follow up with them. I appreciate it.

[330ci]

Any watchmaker should be able to get a 1210 in proper working order. I'd just get a weaker mainspring installed. If we're being honest, I doubt it was a factory Rolex mainspring.

[George58]

Originally Posted by 330ci

Any watchmaker should be able to get a 1210 in proper working order. I'd just get a weaker mainspring installed. If we're being honest, I doubt it was a factory Rolex mainspring.

I agree since indys can't source rolex parts anymore

[TimeToGo]

.
Part number 7500
.
Plenty on Ebay..
.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/38427977730...0AAOSwJUFg8dHk

[330ci]

Originally Posted by TimeToGo

.
Part number 7500
.
Plenty on Ebay..
.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/38427977730...0AAOSwJUFg8dHk

Wasn't doubting they were out there, moreso doubting a modern factory Rolex main spring is the culprit of his issues. I have collected watches with 710,1210, and 1225 movements specifically and I have never heard of this issue in 10 years pertaining to one of these watches. If the wear is as excessive as stated, movement plates should've been replaced, pivots jeweled, etc.

I don't think any reasonable watchmaker would hand this back with this explanation. I most certainly hope OP didn't pay for the service

[Dan S]

Originally Posted by George58

I agree since indys can't source rolex parts anymore

A small number still have their parts accounts. But they are few and far between in the US. But Rolex doesn't necessarily provide parts for very old calibers anyway.

Anyway, I agree 100% with the comments above suggesting that the watchmaker should have been able to do what is necessary to eliminate the rebanking. He just didn't care enough to try IMO.

[Ashton_Horologist]

Independent watchmakers, even with a Rolex account, cannot get parts for these orders calibers anymore. You need to look for a watchmaker who specializes in vintage watches, specifically vintage Rolex. Watchmakers who service a lot of vintage watches will buy up parts from all sources.

Now, on to the watch. Re-banking or over banking is certainly a problem but it has nothing to do with hit being an old worn out watch. In fact, a watch that is old and worn out will never have the issue of over banking.

Over banking is, in its simplest form, too much amplitude at the balance, or too much power coming through the gear train from the mainspring.

The 1210 has two mainspring strengths 1210-7500 (regular) and 1210-7500-1 which is a weaker strength.

The reason an old worn out watch won't over bank is that an old worn out watch will have worn pivots, etc and the chances of that watch having too much amplitude is very slim as amplitude is taken form a watch via friction so his explanation makes not much sense.

There are things that can be done to take amplitude away from the watch such as adjusting the escapement by moving the depth of the pallet stones, or even increasing the tension slightly on the centres seconds friction spring. It sounds, however, like the watch needs to be serviced correctly and taken to an expert in vintage Rolex.

[Ashton_Horologist]

I forgot to add that - 'that's just the way it is' - is not the correct answer to the problem.

[214270Explorer]

Originally Posted by Tools

There are some old-time watchmakers who have been working on Rolex for decades that may have some advice for you.

Bob Ridley at Watchmakers International in Texas

Giovanni at the Old Rolex RSC on Post Road in San Fransisco.

And we have a couple that frequent the Forum

Give them a call.

I 'believe' Bob Ridley is retired?
But his son Phillip in AZ <a certified CW21 Watchmaker> is also a Vintage Rolex expert and highly regarded here at TRF. He has done outstanding work for many members, including me.

Phillip is located in Mesa, Arizona. Call him and discuss your issues.

Phillip@ridleywatchmakers.com
Ridleywatchmakers.com
817.821.2118

[Tools]

Originally Posted by 214270Explorer

I 'believe' Bob Ridley is retired?
But his son Phillip in AZ <a certified CW21 Watchmaker> is also a Vintage Rolex expert and highly regarded here at TRF. He has done outstanding work for many members, including me.

Phillip is located in Mesa, Arizona. Call him and discuss your issues.

Phillip@ridleywatchmakers.com
Ridleywatchmakers.com
817.821.2118

Let's not kick Bob to the curb too quickly, although Phillip does do good work too.

Bob Ridley
https://watchmakers.com/

[Styles Bitchley]

Originally Posted by Ashton_Horologist

I forgot to add that - 'that's just the way it is' - is not the correct answer to the problem.

Amen.

[R.W.T.]

I had a similar issue once on 12xx movement. Generally speaking a stiffer mainspring will cause the watch to have HIGHER amplitude which will render it running slow. I built the movement and put in a mainspring...and changed a LOT of parts...and still was getting low amps...but after it ran a while (mainspring less tension) the amps would come up. I put a weaker spring in it and voile'...it ran text book. It baffled my good CW21 watchmaker and former AWCI officer friend.

He started in 1965 and had never had a similar situation. It could be something particularly significant to the 12xx series movements. He also attributed it to wear but I have my doubts.

The 1220-1225 mainspring is different than the 1210-1215.
I can't remember which is stronger but they are different.

You may not have that exact scenario going on here but having a mainspring mismatched could be a problem. IF your watch is "re-banking" or has too HIGH of an amplitude there are ways to work with that. Either find a weaker spring to bring the amps down and see if that cures it, or make an adjustment in the pallet stones or at the banking pins. Heavier lubrication on the pallet stones. Making sure the mainspring has good lubrication so that it slips within itself very easily. Many things to check. Tension on the sweep pinion...you can add some to bring the amps down a bit. It just depends on what is going on and how much you can squeeze it down.



As for 710...the gamut exists in all of the above situations and invariably you have to try and match a spring to the watch if you have to replace it. They made the 700-710 for over 30 years...and they went through INNUMERABLE changes with what would seem zero consistency and unless you work on them all the time (same with 620-645) you'll never get a sense for it. I always love it when general watchmakers ask for a hairspring for a 700. It's like...you surely are dreaming....the chances of that hairspring working on your balance are one in 100.

Sorry that you are having trouble. It can be remedied...but it might take some hunt and peck. The problem is finding someone who is willing for a price that makes sense. The good thing is...the new mainsprings don't set and with proper maintenance...it will outlast you once you get it straightened out.

I'm torn down until I find a new residence right now or I'd take it.