32xx movement problem poll and data thread

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

Firstly, If you find this thread so tiresome why on earth do you keep on coming back and posting comments that are nothing to do with the subject. You are not forced to read or participate in this thread.

I do however comment on people who come to this thread purely to sidetrack it with nonsense, just as you have attempted with your post.

Originally Posted by Andad

X2

I couldn't agree more

It seems to me the right moment to share with all interested observers some of my NEW results comparing 3235 with 31xx movements.

[saxo3]

First Rolex Amplitude Breakdown Study - An Experimentalist View (part 4)

Comparison between 3235 and 31xx movements

Reference:
- Sea-Dweller 126600, 2017
- 3285 caliber, date model

Comparison:
- 3187 caliber, date model
- 3185 caliber, date model
- 3130 caliber, no date model

Data taking:
- Data points taken: every 10 seconds = 1440 data points in 4 hours
- Duration: 4 hours
- Start time for all graphs is 22:00:00


This Figure displays the measured AMPLITUDES during the first 4 hours after full caliber winding.
NOTE: The scale of the y-axis (Amplitude) is identical (280 - 315 degrees) for all 4 graphs, i.e. they are directly comparable.

Conclusion for 3187, 3185, 3130 calibers:
- High starting amplitudes after full winding.
- No amplitude breakdowns detectable

[Tommy125]

Well I just wanna share my experience with my datejust 36 (126200) bought overseas in London in July 2019. Since it was quite a while ago, I can’t remember the details, but I think my watch did slow down slightly initially (very early in the ownership). It was minor and remained pretty consistent at around -3 spd on the wrist (I don’t wear it 24/7 but if I did it may reach closer to -4). I brought it in recently this year in late March for regulation. I did not know about the 3235 issue then so I didn’t ask RSC to check, but I assume they did. My watch has been very precise and accurate ever since (less than 1s difference a day). I don’t have a timegrapher and won’t be interested in testing my watch, but I do check the gain/loss per day occasionally against my phone time.

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

Are you being serious ?

Firstly, If you find this thread so tiresome why on earth do you keep on coming back and posting comments that are nothing to do with the subject. You are not forced to read or participate in this thread.

I have not and would not marginalise anyone. No one is asked or required to have any equipment.

I do ask if anyone has a watchgrapher, however sophisticated, and it is clear that several people do have them, to, if possible please be forthcoming with more data. The more the better.

I also ask if people would like to download an app for their iPhone called WatchTracker as this can be helpful for getting some of the data we would like such as monitoring a consistant gain or loss.
It is noit a free app unfortunately but it is quite cheap. But, It is NOT compulsory to have nor is it a requirement to join in.

I am trying to draw people into this thread, If you read my post Number 1731, made only yesterday, I am asking people to join in, ask questions, participate and generally help us come to some conclusions.

I don't put people down for not participating or agreeing with my or other peoples findings.
I do however comment on people who come to this thread purely to sidetrack it with nonsense, just as you have attempted with your post.

Again, you are taking my comments out of context.
I never said I found the thread tiresome.
You are constantly twisting and turning the dialogue to suit your own narrative.

Again, it's the constant sniping at people and making disparaging comments about them which is tiresome.
Take the hint and do us all a favour and stop it if you can.

I understand you think you're in an elite group and should have special status bestowed upon you, but your conduct is appalling

[Dirt]

Originally Posted by Tommy125

Well I just wanna share my experience with my datejust 36 (126200) bought overseas in London in July 2019. Since it was quite a while ago, I can’t remember the details, but I think my watch did slow down slightly initially (very early in the ownership). It was minor and remained pretty consistent at around -3 spd on the wrist (I don’t wear it 24/7 but if I did it may reach closer to -4). I brought it in recently this year in late March for regulation. I did not know about the 3235 issue then so I didn’t ask RSC to check, but I assume they did. My watch has been very precise and accurate ever since (less than 1s difference a day). I don’t have a timegrapher and won’t be interested in testing my watch, but I do check the gain/loss per day occasionally against my phone time.

I hope your watch will run to your satisfaction going forward
It's always good when Rolex comes through as it's an essential part of the ownership experience from my experience over many decades of Rolex ownership.
Thanks for sharing

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by dirt

again, you are taking my comments out of context.
I never said i found the thread tiresome.
you are constantly twisting and turning the dialogue to suit your own narrative.

again, it's the constant sniping at people and making disparaging comments about them which is tiresome.
take the hint and do us all a favour and stop it if you can.

i understand you think you're in an elite group and should have special status bestowed upon you, but your conduct is appalling

stop posting these aggressions here !!! stop it !!!




******* TRF RULES ******** Read Before You Post


1. NO PERSONAL ATTACKS OR INAPPROPRIATE LANGUAGE (and WE MEAN IT). We love to joke around here but, the joking stops as soon as someone stops laughing. You must take the view that we are a worldwide forum and that an attitude of sensitivity and respect should be the order of the day.



2. RESPECT THE OPINION AND CHOICES OF OTHERS. Example: If someone puts their Sea Dweller on a Pink and baby blue nato strap, that's their business. Think first .... click the back button on your browser and avoid posting a comment that will insult others and earn yourself infraction points.

[HiBoost]

Originally Posted by Dirt

Again, you are taking my comments out of context.
I never said I found the thread tiresome.
You are constantly twisting and turning the dialogue to suit your own narrative.

Again, it's the constant sniping at people and making disparaging comments about them which is tiresome.
Take the hint and do us all a favour and stop it if you can.

I understand you think you're in an elite group and should have special status bestowed upon you, but your conduct is appalling

It is quite interesting how perspectives can differ. I agree 100% that the sniping is tiresome. I just feel that it is the opposite parties who are doing the sniping.

I know you are a car guy so allow me to propose an analogy. People own sports cars for all different reasons. Some to utilize their performance, some to appreciate their beauty, some to collect them for financial gains, some to attract women, etc (an oddly similar list to why people own watches btw). But now let's say you owned a 2010 Corvette and all you wanted to do was cruise. Great, no issues there. But why would you go to the Corvette forums, and then specifically into a dyno thread about the new 2020 Corvettes, and badger people in that thread for measuring their car's output? That would make zero sense right? And if the people in that thread pushed back on you and said "do you even own a 2020 Corvette?" or "have you ever even dynoed your car?" would you then think they were being the jerks? Wouldn't they just be calling you out for being out of line in the first place? Same exact deal here. We are in a thread specifically titled "32xx data thread". So yeah, it's kind of awkward to a) not have any data and b) ask the question "why do you guys care so much about data?".

Of course I don't expect this to change your mind at all. Just file it under "another snipe from an elitist" and we can both get back to our days ;)

[TheVTCGuy]

I wanted to add something I found out about my watch. Last month, I wore it practically every day, 24/7. This month, it has gotten a lot less wrist time for a multitude of reasons. When I am not wearing, it sits face up on a stand. I have heard, could be wrong, but I have heard that placing it face up at night for example, makes it run faster. That seems to be the case with mine. The month I wore it, the average deviation was - 1.5 seconds per day; this was very consistent. The month I didn’t wear it, sitting face up, it lost only 25 seconds for the entire month, a substantial improvement.

What this has to do with the price of Tea in Yugoslavia I have no idea, and Bas or anyone else can correct me on the dial up theory, but it seems to work for my watch, I found it an interesting observation.

[Brich436]

My 3230 in the 124270 is running at +1 second a week.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by HiBoost

It is quite interesting how perspectives can differ. I agree 100% that the sniping is tiresome. I just feel that it is the opposite parties who are doing the sniping.

I know you are a car guy so allow me to propose an analogy. People own sports cars for all different reasons. Some to utilize their performance, some to appreciate their beauty, some to collect them for financial gains, some to attract women, etc (an oddly similar list to why people own watches btw). But now let's say you owned a 2010 Corvette and all you wanted to do was cruise. Great, no issues there. But why would you go to the Corvette forums, and then specifically into a dyno thread about the new 2020 Corvettes, and badger people in that thread for measuring their car's output? That would make zero sense right? And if the people in that thread pushed back on you and said "do you even own a 2020 Corvette?" or "have you ever even dynoed your car?" would you then think they were being the jerks? Wouldn't they just be calling you out for being out of line in the first place? Same exact deal here. We are in a thread specifically titled "32xx data thread". So yeah, it's kind of awkward to a) not have any data and b) ask the question "why do you guys care so much about data?".

Of course I don't expect this to change your mind at all. Just file it under "another snipe from an elitist" and we can both get back to our days ;)

You’d have a point if this thread stayed in this thread, but it doesn’t. Any new thread that even hints at a 32XX movement having an issue is taken over by the regulars from this thread and is killed. It really is tiresome. You can call that a snipe or the truth. Makes no difference to me.

This thread is a big ball of pollution that never leaves the front page of the forum. Why isn’t it in the tech forum, anyway?

[HiBoost]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

You’d have a point if this thread stayed in this thread, but it doesn’t. Any new thread that even hints at a 32XX movement having an issue is taken over by the regulars from this thread and is killed. It really is tiresome. You can call that a snipe or the truth. Makes no difference to me.

This thread is a big ball of pollution that never leaves the front page of the forum. Why isn’t it in the tech forum, anyway?

I can't speak for others but I certainly don't do that. In fact, my primary purpose for creating this thread was to consolidate the information to a single location. As an owner with issues myself, I found it difficult to track down one comment here and one comment there spread across dozens of threads spanning several years. So the last thing I'd want to do at this point is start a conversation about this topic in a different thread. On the few occasions I've seen somebody asking something directly related to this topic I have PM'd them a link out of courtesy for the sensitive feelings of some of my TRF brothers.

As far as why it wasn't put in the tech forum, it's because the original purpose was to gauge how widespread of a problem this was. You don't have to be a watchmaker to realize your watch is running 5 minutes slow.
TRF is not by anyone's description a predominantly technical audience. Putting a poll in the tech forum would have drastically limited the responses. I'm sorry if the thread is like a needle in your eye, but are you equally bothered by the "how to post pictures" thread which is literally stuck on the front page for eternity? Seems like ignoring an uninteresting topic is oddly challenging for some people.

[goodolejr]

Originally Posted by HiBoost

I can't speak for others but I certainly don't do that. In fact, my primary purpose for creating this thread was to consolidate the information to a single location. As an owner with issues myself, I found it difficult to track down one comment here and one comment there spread across dozens of threads spanning several years. So the last thing I'd want to do at this point is start a conversation about this topic in a different thread. On the few occasions I've seen somebody asking something directly related to this topic I have PM'd them a link out of courtesy for the sensitive feelings of some of my TRF brothers.

As far as why it wasn't put in the tech forum, it's because the original purpose was to gauge how widespread of a problem this was. You don't have to be a watchmaker to realize your watch is running 5 minutes slow.
TRF is not by anyone's description a predominantly technical audience. Putting a poll in the tech forum would have drastically limited the responses. I'm sorry if the thread is like a needle in your eye, but are you equally bothered by the "how to post pictures" thread which is literally stuck on the front page for eternity? Seems like ignoring an uninteresting topic is oddly challenging for some people.

Well said, Jeff.

[Mal H.]

Originally Posted by HiBoost

I can't speak for others but I certainly don't do that. In fact, my primary purpose for creating this thread was to consolidate the information to a single location. As an owner with issues myself, I found it difficult to track down one comment here and one comment there spread across dozens of threads spanning several years. So the last thing I'd want to do at this point is start a conversation about this topic in a different thread. On the few occasions I've seen somebody asking something directly related to this topic I have PM'd them a link out of courtesy for the sensitive feelings of some of my TRF brothers.

As far as why it wasn't put in the tech forum, it's because the original purpose was to gauge how widespread of a problem this was. You don't have to be a watchmaker to realize your watch is running 5 minutes slow.
TRF is not by anyone's description a predominantly technical audience. Putting a poll in the tech forum would have drastically limited the responses. I'm sorry if the thread is like a needle in your eye, but are you equally bothered by the "how to post pictures" thread which is literally stuck on the front page for eternity? Seems like ignoring an uninteresting topic is oddly challenging for some people.

The "how to post pictures" thread is for everyone's benefit. This thread is to stroke your, CharlesN's, and Saxo's egos.

Go back over the last month and count how many times you three have posted. Ask yourself...honestly...is there really enough interest in this topic to keep it permanently on the first page?

Hell, you like experiments, you three take one day off from it and see if anyone cares enough to keep it going without you. I doubt you will, though. Seems like letting an uninteresting topic die is oddly challenging for some people.

[HiBoost]

Originally Posted by Mal H.

The "how to post pictures" thread is for everyone's benefit. This thread is to stroke your, CharlesN's, and Saxo's egos.



Go back over the last month and count how many times you three have posted. Ask yourself...honestly...is there really enough interest in this topic to keep it permanently on the first page?



Hell, you like experiments, you three take one day off from it and see if anyone cares enough to keep it going without you. I doubt you will, though. Seems like letting an uninteresting topic die is oddly challenging for some people.

Please quote one post I've made in this thread that can in any way be construed as boasting or having a big ego. I'm just a diehard Rolex fanboy who is more than a little bummed that the only new model he ever bought had to be a lemon. Hardly a position to boast about.

And I did my homework assignment. In the past month I've made 34 posts, 7 in this thread. Doesn't seem too excessive to me. I think 6 of those 7 were replying to this kind of bs. So here's a crazy idea, all you guys who wish this thread would fade away, maybe stop bumping it with your replies?

Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by HiBoost

Here's how it's looking for the 6 month check-up...

If the watch is fully wound, timekeeping is great. On the other hand, it already seems to have degraded in only 6 months wearing it only about 5 days a month. I will check again at 1 year. Why does any of this matter? Because clearly my watch has a problem. Given the quick decline of my specs I suspect I won't even make it to the 5 year mark before the thing must be sent in. But we shall see.

Something simple to understand and RELAX (or not) …

A visual update for the time development of your Submariner 126613.

Together with my Sea-Dweller 126600 as comparison.

I took your data from posts #1 and # 1583.

After full winding (t = 0), rates for all positions summed up, then averaged.



The Submariner rate error bars (after full winding) are large because this watch has a strong position dependency.

Later, the 3235 performance gets worse, the averaged Submariner rates:

- after 24 hours: -2.6 +/- 3.6 sec/day
- after 48 hours: -10.0 +/- 11.1. sec/day

Explanation: This caliber has a fast drop in amplitudes for all vertical positions, < 200 degrees after 24 hours.

Reminder: THIS is a NEW watch, purchased end December 2020.

This example demonstrates the usefulness of a timegrapher to monitor a watch every few months at least.

Originally Posted by Andad

I only have one Rolex with the 3235 movement and have only worn it a few times since it was purchased in November 2019.
I have more than a few watches and an issue with this watch may not be noticed until well after the warranty has expired.
If there is a problem I would be interested in finding out now.

So at the risk of antagonizing some on this thread I will post up my results.

I will leave it up to much smarter members to evaluate the results.

If you want to share more data, I could do the same trend analysis (very simple) for your DJ 41, which you tested on 21.01.2021.

[CharlesN]

EXP II WatchTracker

As some of you probably know I bought an Explorer II White dial 226570 which has a 3285 Movement a few days ago.

I have used an iPhone App to monitor its timekeeping over the last 3 days. (Actually 72H: 27M: 32S). I started at 22:00 Hours on 11 July 2021.

These readings were taken during a Power Reserve Test.
I wound the watch fully and then left it dial up and undisturbed until the power ran out.

The Stated, by Rolex, Power Reserve is 70 hours approximately.
The actual length of the Power reserve was 72 Hours: 27 Mins: 32 seconds.

I have attached a screenshot of the WatchTracker screen which shows the watch gaining time at the start only to loose time as the Power reserve ran down.

The error from the start peaked at +3 seconds after 49.5 hours

After about 69 Hours the watch “Redeemed” itself to come back to almost a Zero error.
It continued to loose time after 69 Hours until it finally stopped completely at 22:27:32 on 14 July 2021.

Before you say what a great watch this one is it shows that there is a problem in that the watch gained and then lost whilst unworn, So , What would happen when worn. I expect the timekeeping would be pretty good and constant but the 70 hour Rolex Power Reserve becomes a bit pointless if the error can just creep up or down at such a rate.

We often read on this forum that unless a picture is enclosed “It didn’t happen” so with pleasure, I have attached below a picture of the WatchTracker main results screen.

This really does show how useful the App can be for showing up errors and timekeeping qualities.




This is the “Stopped” watch in question ..




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sski]

For my Datejust 36 with the 3235, i've observed it over a week period; loses 5 - 7 secs per week, so about -1 per day.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by sski

For my Datejust 36 with the 3235, i've observed it over a week period; loses 5 - 7 secs per week, so about -1 per day.

Sounds excellent to me.

Which exact model do you have and when was it first purchased ?

[GMT Aviator]

I’m itching to contribute to this thread.

I’ve still got a BNIB unworn 2018 126711 CHNR in the safe at the bank.

Working overseas is seriously handicapping my ability to get it on the timegrapher but it’s time will come. I’m interested to see what it does.

My 126710 LN is my daily and I know it gains about 1.2s/day but it’s worn pretty much 24/7 even after 6 years.

From what I’m summarising here, the newer 32xx movements keep the accuracy if worn more or less as a daily, until they may or may not suffer a more serious deviation after some 15 months of use IF they suffer the internal wear issue related to a Pinion?

I know Rolex will quietly modify this problem out of the movement so long term it doesn’t bother me, but the watch geek inside me is interested in the data.

FWIW my 1997 Speedy Pro, has always gained in the first 24 hours and lost in the second 24 hours. By the end of the cycle it’s accurate just before it stops. Anywhere inbetween it was somewhere else. It’s never been serviced from new and still retains the same precise gain/loss over its power reserve cycle.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by GMT Aviator

I’m itching to contribute to this thread.

Welcome to the thread,
I hope your "itch" is feeling a bit releived.

I am looking forward to the day that it is known that Rolex have found the complete source of any priblems with the 32xx movements. They will, I am sure, and when the day comes I will send my Sub-Date (3235) and Exp II (3285) in for the updates.

Its almost like waiting for a software update for your favourite computer program.

In the meanwhile I will just carry on looking at 32xx movements and see what I can learn ... I have already learnt quite a bit with help from others also. (eg: saxo3).

[Chambers]

Quite Educating!!

[Oxfordian]

Contrary to the conspiracy theory that the 32** movement is about to implode in my watch at any given moment I would just like to reassure potential owners that I have no issues with my two watches containing 32** movements, both are running well and keeping good time.

I sometimes wonder if people are only happy when they are moaning about something, a watch is designed to be worn not sat still on a timing machine, but if sticking a timing app on your watch keeps you happy instead of getting the watch on your wrist and wearing it well that’s just fine, strange but fine.

Me I prefer to see the watch on my wrist doing what I bought it for, telling the time.

[sski]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

Sounds excellent to me.

Which exact model do you have and when was it first purchased ?

its a blue dial 126200, Dec. 2020.
-1 per day seems pretty consistent, i'll keep an eye on it again this week.

i would prefer it to go +1 per day but unlikely....i even keep it dial side up on the drawer at night. it's pretty consistent going about -1 daily.

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by sski

.i even keep it dial side up on the drawer at night.

I have to keep my watch dial DOWN at night to gain a little time.

Have you tried that ? It might do the trick.

[sski]

thanks....i'll try that this week

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

As some of you probably know I bought an Explorer II White dial 226570 which has a 3285 Movement a few days ago.
I have used an iPhone App to monitor its timekeeping over the last 3 days.
These readings were taken during a Power Reserve Test.

I have attached a screenshot of the WatchTracker screen which shows the watch gaining time at the start only to loose time as the Power reserve ran down.

Here are your Explorer II (226570) data visualized



My Conclusions:

- Excellent time keeping until 69 hours (see Watch Tracker curve).
- Amplitude rise (plus oscillations) starts rather early, i.e. after about 56 hours.
- Amplitude breakdowns are not existing as for your Submariner.

- Perfect watch, wear it now.
- But, you probably want to repeat the measurement to check reproducibility ;-)

[CharlesN]

Originally Posted by saxo3

- Perfect watch, wear it now.

Thank you for converting my data into a visual graph. Its so much easier to understsnd this way.

I am going to repeat the Power reserve test again, probably starting tonight at 22:00.
This will tell me if the patterns of breakdown are reproducible.

These results are similar but by no means the same as the 3235's etc that we have measured and displayed previously.
The lack of date change time and 6 hours later breakdowns is strange.

I will again do both at the same time ... TimeGrapher and WatchTracker.

I am wearing my Explorer II right now as i type this.

[saxo3]

Originally Posted by CharlesN

I am wearing my Explorer II right now as i type this.

In the following thread you can also learn how to further increase your wrist time

"Wear watch to bed? Yes or No?"

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=812158

At present 141 posts there, which is currently 8% of this thread.

I'm sure they will catch up on this important 'Wear watch to bad' topic

[goodolejr]

Originally Posted by Oxfordian

Contrary to the conspiracy theory that the 32** movement is about to implode in my watch at any given moment I would just like to reassure potential owners that I have no issues with my two watches containing 32** movements, both are running well and keeping good time.

I sometimes wonder if people are only happy when they are moaning about something, a watch is designed to be worn not sat still on a timing machine, but if sticking a timing app on your watch keeps you happy instead of getting the watch on your wrist and wearing it well that’s just fine, strange but fine.

Me I prefer to see the watch on my wrist doing what I bought it for, telling the time.

Forgive me if this sounds sarcastic or rhetorical (I'm not trying to be), but are you actually reading what others are posting here? Or do you just occasionally reiterate your same general comment when you see thread activity pick up?

[EEpro]

Originally Posted by Oxfordian

Contrary to the conspiracy theory that the 32** movement is about to implode in my watch at any given moment I would just like to reassure potential owners that I have no issues with my two watches containing 32** movements, both are running well and keeping good time.

I sometimes wonder if people are only happy when they are moaning about something, a watch is designed to be worn not sat still on a timing machine, but if sticking a timing app on your watch keeps you happy instead of getting the watch on your wrist and wearing it well that’s just fine, strange but fine.

Me I prefer to see the watch on my wrist doing what I bought it for, telling the time.

My watch was losing minutes per week. I was trying to wear and enjoy and be a cool kid but it kind of sucked. Thanks