Opening case to determine authenticity

[HarlyFan]

Did you ever get an answer to your question. I am wondering the same thing!

Originally Posted by tritium8

Can/will an AD run a serial number to confirm legitimacy of a watch and whether or not it is "missing" from someone's collection?

[Vanessa CW21]

Originally Posted by HarlyFan

Did you ever get an answer to your question. I am wondering the same thing!

No, they don't have access to that info. Only a RSC does.

Sent from my phone.

[Ccjacapital]

Let me throw in my 2 cents I have been a watch buyer for 12 years I always look for the small things first crowns pin hole cut outs dial and if I'm not satisfied I'll open the case. The good tools only run about 200.00 dollars the replicas are getting better the new clones do have rolex markings on the inside of the movement and they come with box ,warranty card here is a pic of a clone movement I was shocked to see it in person it would fool some people. If you are not a pro when it comes to spotting a fake take the watch to an AD I have seen pawn shops and some jewelry stores in my town be fooled by some of these clones. It's a shame seeing people be ripped off with these fake watches

[tritium8]

Originally Posted by Vanessa CW21

No, they don't have access to that info. Only a RSC does.

Sent from my phone.

Thanks

[Ccjacapital]

image.jpgI have been buying watches as a hobby for the past 12 years if you know what your looking for it's pretty easy but if you haven't seen a lot of rolex watches your better off going to an AD or a good watchmaker. I just ran a crossed one of the clone rolex watches I could tell from the get go it was a fake the crown on the dial was not right but was pretty close be very careful as the fakes are getting better here is a picture of the clone movement it's pretty close but does not fit the same in the case. There have been a couple of pawn shops in my town that have purchased them not knowing. So I'm showing this pic to hopefully help people from getting ripped off.

[Cabernet]

Could you upload a crisp high quality photo?

[badass09]

Originally Posted by Ccjacapital

Attachment 657286I have been buying watches as a hobby for the past 12 years if you know what your looking for it's pretty easy but if you haven't seen a lot of rolex watches your better off going to an AD or a good watchmaker. I just ran a crossed one of the clone rolex watches I could tell from the get go it was a fake the crown on the dial was not right but was pretty close be very careful as the fakes are getting better here is a picture of the clone movement it's pretty close but does not fit the same in the case. There have been a couple of pawn shops in my town that have purchased them not knowing. So I'm showing this pic to hopefully help people from getting ripped off.

Haha.. the moment i saw the 750 stamping on a steel case already tells me this watch is fake.. but the movement is quite convincing.. but under a loupe everything will come to light on that movement..

[firefisher]

Originally Posted by Vanessa CW21

I've seen fake cases with genuine Rolex movements and I've seen genuine Rolex cases with fake movements... You need a lot of experience to notice the difference in some cases. Buy from an AD if you want to be 100% sure.

Wow very impressive video. I wish I could do that.

[padi56]

Originally Posted by J!m

This is why original boxes and papers add so much value to a potential purhase. Assuming all the numbers and refrences match, it is another piece of the puzzle to assure you have a genuine watch.

But, if you can't tell for sure, either be happy with what you (think) you have, or get it checked by an expert. Most ADs (Authorized Dealers) will authenticate a watch, and sometimes set a value for insurance purposes. I use a custom jeweler for my Wife's jewelry and every time we visit they check all the stones and photograph the pieces and keep it on file forever. Not all ADs/jewelers do that sort of thing, but if you are not sure, always check!

In the real world boxes and bits of paper/plastic cards are far easier to fake than the actually watch.So never rely on these items to prove authenticity of any watch unless bought from a 100% reliable source.

[brandrea]

RSC Toronto will authenticate any Rolex for $125.00 (cdn funds).

[RichardF]

Over the years I have seen many Rolex watches that have been tampered with. in the late 80's and 90's you had to deal with stainless Rolex's being converted to SS/18kt with after market dials being applied. When I worked for an authorized Rolex Dealer I saw a lot of co workers taking in bad Rolex's for service because they did not know what they were doing or how to identify a compromised Rolex. The converted Rolex watches that were sent to the RSC usually ended up having Rolex seize the part and require the owner to purchase the authentic Rolex part in order to get the watch back. Especially if the Rolex had a counterfeit part such as a dial or band with Rolex markings on it. They were really enforcing the trademark infringement laws a while back.

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

If you can't recognise a fake without opening the caseback (no shame in that at all) then you should stick to Authorised and/or highly reputable sellers.

When buying a watch I 100% agree with you Adam but there are some seriously scary fakes.

We recently had a client come in with a ceramic sub, it had a broken stem and needed a quick fix. It went through my hands and the hands of several other watchmakers and knowledgable people and we discovered it was a fake when the caseback was opened.

The thing was 98% accurate on the outside but the movement was where it got obvious. Then when we were looking with a loupe and really checking the dial and case you could definitely see it was fake but only if you have a trained eye.

[MonBK]

Wow, a 2 page long thread about fakes!

[joli160]

Confirms number one rule; buy the seller

[Cabernet]

This is good advice in most pursuits!

Originally Posted by joli160

Confirms number one rule; buy the seller

[Richard Carver]

There are reasonably priced tools available for the casual user. This LG case opener has opened everything I've put in it but if I had any trouble at all I would take the job to a pro. I opened a 1976 Tudor 7020 I'm pretty sure hadn't been opened since new.

You need a couple of accessories to make it work properly. That round base is required unless you have a vise to stabilize it. And the plastic watch holder is much better than the metal one that comes with it.




This is a bezel remover that is quite reasonable and is easy to use and doesn't damage the watch or bezel. Of course, you'll need a bezel press to go with it. These are not professional quality tools but for a careful duffer they do just fine.







As always, use at your own risk.

[T. Ferguson]

Originally Posted by jvmartin

Always Always Always open the case back to check out the movement or have it opened by the dealer. Fake ETA movements exist that fit Rolex cases and you cannot always be sure that your seller has done this prior.

Why not just fake the Rolex movement?

[sitka39]

Regardless of whether I'd be buying from a guy on the street or a dealer I will always want to see the movement.

Would you buy a car without checking it out first ?

[Ccjacapital]

image.jpgI would recommend taking the watch to an expert. Now there are fakes going around that come with box and papers the movement it self would prabobly pass to some people I took a pic of the last clone Rolex to share on here.

[Harpo]

Bit of a noob question.....
If one opens the case does that mean the watertight seal is compromised?

[T. Ferguson]

Originally Posted by Harpo

Bit of a noob question.....
If one opens the case does that mean the watertight seal is compromised?

No, it doesn't. But it could. I would not submerge a watch if the case has been opened without a pressure test.

[Bill_H]

I looked a bit into how a Rolex can be authenticated before getting mine and did some "counterintelligence" on the fakes. Some fakes are using the Yuki 3135, A3135 and the SA3135 movements. They are getting close, but even in photos you can tell that the finish is rougher on the fakes.

Here is an A3135

[gabrielc]

fake vs original

[louisem]

Be very careful, there are some very good fakes out there selling as used Rolex. It comes with the box, paper with matching serial numbers. They even come with an insurance valuation report to trick you into thinking it's genuine. If you're not an expert, best to stay clear of used Rolex from auction sites and only buy from an authorised dealer.

[locutus49]

For a first poster you are giving advice that is not quite accurate. There are some Trusted Sellers on this site who sell BNIB watches that came from ADs.

Welcome.

Originally Posted by louisem

Be very careful, there are some very good fakes out there selling as used Rolex. It comes with the box, paper with matching serial numbers. They even come with an insurance valuation report to trick you into thinking it's genuine. If you're not an expert, best to stay clear of used Rolex from auction sites and only buy from an authorised dealer.

[stray_cat]

Originally Posted by Bill_H

I looked a bit into how a Rolex can be authenticated before getting mine and did some "counterintelligence" on the fakes. Some fakes are using the Yuki 3135, A3135 and the SA3135 movements. They are getting close, but even in photos you can tell that the finish is rougher on the fakes.

Do any of them come with the microstella weights on the balance to regulate timekeeping? Looks like this one does not.

Definitely buy the seller first, specially if he/she can tell you (and show) it came from an AD, otherwise taking it to an AD to open the case and verify authenticity is best. If a seller refuses to allow checking it, or refund if fake, pass!

I've acquired a few pieces and get a really good feel of authenticity by first talking and meeting with the seller. (knocks on wood) They have mostly been original owners who purchased from an AD. Couple of them I did not even open, no need when you know the seller is legit and purchased new from an AD. The ones I did open later for giggles were all authentic. Never a worry when dealing with great people. When I get evasive answers with excuses or hearsay provenance, I tell them goodbye and have a nice day. Why bother?

[Sweetswisssteel]

Originally Posted by tritium8

Can/will an AD run a serial number to confirm legitimacy of a watch and whether or not it is "missing" from someone's collection?

Yes before I bought my submariner I called Rolex Australia who confirmed serial etc

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[BravoOne]

About ten years ago my AD who I had bought several Rolex watches from, told me that Rolex was working close with a Silicon Valley company to develop a internal branding technique for identifying a genuine Rolex watch. Has anyone heard about this before?
I'm sure if this had been perfected we would have known about it by now?

[Rebel]

Originally Posted by Old Expat Beast

If you can't recognise a fake without opening the caseback (no shame in that at all) then you should stick to Authorised and/or highly reputable sellers.

This.

[Sweetswisssteel]

Originally Posted by Sweetswisssteel

Yes before I bought my submariner I called Rolex Australia who confirmed serial etc

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Quick update. Spoke to RSC, this only applies for watches sold with plastic swiped warranty cards. An older watch with the warranty certificate will only show in RSC datAbase if it's been serviced.

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