AD prices are like a 1000 USD more than trusted sellers?

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

Wow, you guys sure showed me!

Name-calling is always a great way your make a point. Who asked you to "defend" your purchase? You really don't get the whole warranty card thing, do you? There's no way you can print stuff on a blank warranty card, and that's why these cards are not readily available 'cause nobody wants them. So be it. Oh, and extra points for mentioning "conspiracy theory." It's always a good fallback when you can't refute anything somebody said. Crippling insecurity. Yeah, that's me. How will lI ever recover from these brilliant arguments?

Here's the thing: the OP (remember that post?) asked if they're missing anything by going the trusted seller route as opposed to buying from a legitimate AD. It is made to sound by such as you as it's the exact same watch/purchase, just cheaper. It isn't. There's a reason why it's cheaper, and it has to do with where the watches come from and whether it's a smart move. You seem to think it's a perfect legitimate purchase from an AD, just brokered by a third party. That's quite doubtful given the reasons I've outlined. You seem determined to support this way of doing business because it's cheaper and that is far more important to you than insuring you're buying a watch that's on the up and up. If you're spending a fortune on an item that could be in on your wrist in and in your family for decades, you might just want to make damn sure you get what you're really paying for. My response to this thread is based on that, and I don't give a horses's arse where YOU buy your watch. If you're so desperate to save a few bucks go ahead and buy a watch sight unseen from someone who somehow obtained the watch at a discount and then resells it. The point is, these sellers are not legit Rolex dealers and you open yourself up to a lot of potential problems thanks to your quest for a deal. Used watches are a whole different matter, and a lot of these dealers are quite respectable in how they sell used pieces and back them. But new watches are different beasts.

I would just like to mention that i have purchased watches from both an AD and trusted sellers. One of the subs that i purchased was from one of the sellers BNIB with my name on the "warranty card". It actually needed a regulation within the first few months and I brought it to the NY RSC with the "warranty card" from the seller with my name on it and the AD stamp. The women on the front desk took my watch and the warranty into the back, told me no problem and to come back in a day to pick up my watch (I was there on business).

The only reason why i am telling this story is because you seem to believe or at least keep stating how these trusted sellers can purchase fake warranty cards put in the information etc etc. If that was the case RSC would have informed me that the warranty was fake and that I had to pay for service or worse the watch would be confiscated from me if it was a stolen piece of property.

I have also discussed with many authorized dealers around me most have been very honest about rolex policy and the way they have to keep receipts or what not. I have also been told by a few people that Rolex does not say how much they can or can not discount a watch, they discourage it, but it lies solely on the person who owns the business. So in my opinion it is entirely reasonable to think that if someone comes in and wants to purchase 3-5 watches that they will get a decent discount, a lot more than the average guy could get walking into a store and purchasing 1 stainless steel piece.

Now if we also look at it and realize that these trusted sellers on the forum aren't solely purchasing stainless steel pieces, and also include gold/platinum. It could be very easy to assume that with that much cash on the line the AD will take a bit less of a margin and move those "slower" moving pieces.

that is just my take on the situation from my experience and from talking to both AD's and sellers. I do not disagree with the facts you say about fake warrantys being out there etc, this is just the other side of the book

[SMD]

It's not just about buying in bulk. Trusted sellers factor inventory for retailers. Anyone who knows how that works for other businesses know how expensive that money can be. Not all retailers can afford to continue to bring in their quotas if their inventory is not turning. At some point that dead money needs to be liquid to pay the bills. That is how Trf sellers help. Not all ADs have years of working capital sitting around to ride out slow moving inventory. Rolex knows all of this and accept that it is a necessary evil. If they wanted to shut this down they could easily do so. But it works for them because they keep pushing pieces out the door, and ADs take the inventory (and the risk) on their balance sheet. Margins dont mean a thing if you don't have cash to keep the lights on.

[Sublover2166]

Originally Posted by SMD

It's not just about buying in bulk. Trusted sellers factor inventory for retailers. Anyone who knows how that works for other businesses know how expensive that money can be. Not all retailers can afford to continue to bring in their quotas if their inventory is not turning. At some point that dead money needs to be liquid to pay the bills. That is how Trf sellers help. Not all ADs have years of working capital sitting around to ride out slow moving inventory. Rolex knows all of this and accept that it is a necessary evil. If they wanted to shut this down they could easily do so. But it works for them because they keep pushing pieces out the door, and ADs take the inventory (and the risk) on their balance sheet. Margins dont mean a thing if you don't have cash to keep the lights on.

X2. Agreed. Think of the invoice when Rolex sends an AD a watch shipment. It could be 100K-200K or more depending on the quantity of watches and how many precious metal pieces. If you are an AD who has a slow moving watch inventory or the time of the year sales are slow, such as right after the holiday season how do they pay the invoice, pay the employee payroll, pay the rent, the utility bill? Rolex expects payment for their watch delivery and as an AD you can't just refuse a shipment because of slow sales. So they have to move inventory one way or another. Out the front door or out the back. Or both.

[RollieVerde]

Your point is very well taken, but my point is this: You don't know where the watch actually came from, and when you buy from anybody other than an AD it could very easily be a bogus warranty card. It doesn't mean Rolex won't honor the warranty; it just means it could very easily be faked especially considering you probably won't need a real service in the first two years and you'll never know. And in one sense that's fine, if you have no problems. Even if a watch was stolen, you'd never know until Rolex has some reason to check the serial number. I think in case of regulating a clearly new, legitimate watch, they're not going be too vigilant. So does it matter where you got the watch? It does, if you care about the legitimacy of your purchase. In a worse case scenario the watch could be used, or a fake, or stolen, or returned, or just sourced under questionable circumstances.

What I object to in this whole mess is the claim that there's no difference between making a purchase from an authorized dealer and someone who just somehow got a new watch to sell below retail; as if you just saved money and are therefore smarter to do it this way. In that discount is the potential for all kinds of mischief, and no guarantee you got what you thought you did. If you go the AD route you have maximum assurance you got the real deal and the warranty and the knowledge it came straight from the manufacturer and onto your wrist. When you're making a big, expensive purchase that means something to you, I think it's worth paying more. I guess, when you get down to it, it's a matter of priorities. Save a few bucks, or make sure you get a rock-solid watch.

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

Your point is very well taken, but my point is this: You don't know where the watch actually came from, and when you buy from anybody other than an AD it could very easily be a bogus warranty card. It doesn't mean Rolex won't honor the warranty; it just means it could very easily be faked especially considering you probably won't need a real service in the first two years and you'll never know. And in one sense that's fine, if you have no problems. Even if a watch was stolen, you'd never know until Rolex has some reason to check the serial number. I think in case of regulating a clearly new, legitimate watch, they're not going be too vigilant. So does it matter where you got the watch? It does, if you care about the legitimacy of your purchase. In a worse case scenario the watch could be used, or a fake, or stolen, or returned, or just sourced under questionable circumstances.

What I object to in this whole mess is the claim that there's no difference between making a purchase from an authorized dealer and someone who just somehow got a new watch to sell below retail; as if you just saved money and are therefore smarter to do it this way. In that discount is the potential for all kinds of mischief, and no guarantee you got what you thought you did. If you go the AD route you have maximum assurance you got the real deal and the warranty and the knowledge it came straight from the manufacturer and onto your wrist. When you're making a big, expensive purchase that means something to you, I think it's worth paying more. I guess, when you get down to it, it's a matter of priorities. Save a few bucks, or make sure you get a rock-solid watch.

I also pose this question. If any of these trusted sellers on the forum every wronged and sold fake/false warranty stuff and watches, if something ever happened do you think we would still see them here? Would it not destroy their entire business? Would they lose their lively hood? If the answer is yes to any of those questions I don't think they would do it. this is how some of them feed their family and that would be pretty tough pill to swallow if they decided to do something like that and then could not supply for their families.

I must also say that the watch I purchased that needed to be regulated, had the ad stamp like I said. I called them and discussed the watch with them. So yes again trusted sellers can purchase the watch from an authorized dealer and the DEALER puts your name on the card. so no mischief had been managed, just at the time i got a better deal because of the leg work that one of the trusted sellers had already put in to form a relationship.

But hey I have no problem with you keeping your opinion on the sellers, and watches listed on the forum, and I will keep mine, as someone who has walked on both sides of the fence and see advantages both ways.

[RollieVerde]

Originally Posted by mannyv11

I also pose this question. If any of these trusted sellers on the forum every wronged and sold fake/false warranty stuff and watches, if something ever happened do you think we would still see them here? Would it not destroy their entire business? Would they lose their lively hood? If the answer is yes to any of those questions I don't think they would do it. this is how some of them feed their family and that would be pretty tough pill to swallow if they decided to do something like that and then could not supply for their families.

I must also say that the watch I purchased that needed to be regulated, had the ad stamp like I said. I called them and discussed the watch with them. So yes again trusted sellers can purchase the watch from an authorized dealer and the DEALER puts your name on the card. so no mischief had been managed, just at the time i got a better deal because of the leg work that one of the trusted sellers had already put in to form a relationship.

But hey I have no problem with you keeping your opinion on the sellers, and watches listed on the forum, and I will keep mine, as someone who has walked on both sides of the fence and see advantages both ways.

I've seen posting on other forums where people have had trouble with trusted sellers, so it's certainly not unheard of. Your experience is interesting, and does not adhere to the terms of service Rolex states in their warranty. Everybody's defense of the legitimacy of third party sellers seems to ride on the contention that they work in cooperation with the ADs. Maybe it works that way in this business, but that's pretty bizarre. It's like somebody buying a new car at a discount, selling it as new to a third party, and the dealer going along with the deal as if they were the ones that made the sale and doing all the paperwork. For every watch an AD sells to a trusted seller and endorsing the deal as their own, that's a watch they could have sold themselves at a higher margin without dicking around in the is gray area. Again, maybe that's how this business works these days. It sure doesn't make sense to me.

Speaking of which, in these other posts outlining how the trusted sellers help keep the ADs in business though solving problems with inventory and financing of same, are you saying Trusted Sellers have more capital on hand that a jeweler that has enough assets to be a Rolex AD? I don't think getting into the Rolex dealer family is exactly easy, and the company probably looks at every aspects of their business, their finances, track record, etc. before signing them on and reviews their business regularly. If they have to rely on this third party stuff to stay afloat that's kind of telling, but then again it's certainly possible. Businesses can thrive one day and crash the next, especially in the luxury market. I must say I've learned a lot in this discussion. I'm not saying you're not 100% right on how this works, but it really seems a bit cockeyed.

Thanks for your generosity at letting me keep my opinion. Oh, and I never believe anything I read on forums anyway. It's all absolute bilge. Every last bit of it. Especially my stuff.

[mannyv11]

Originally Posted by RollieVerde

I've seen posting on other forums where people have had trouble with trusted sellers, so it's certainly not unheard of. Your experience is interesting, and does not adhere to the terms of service Rolex states in their warranty. Everybody's defense of the legitimacy of third party sellers seems to ride on the contention that they work in cooperation with the ADs. Maybe it works that way in this business, but that's pretty bizarre. It's like somebody buying a new car at a discount, selling it as new to a third party, and the dealer going along with the deal as if they were the ones that made the sale and doing all the paperwork. For every watch an AD sells to a trusted seller and endorsing the deal as their own, that's a watch they could have sold themselves at a higher margin without dicking around in the is gray area. Again, maybe that's how this business works these days. It sure doesn't make sense to me.

Speaking of which, in these other posts outlining how the trusted sellers help keep the ADs in business though solving problems with inventory and financing of same, are you saying Trusted Sellers have more capital on hand that a jeweler that has enough assets to be a Rolex AD? I don't think getting into the Rolex dealer family is exactly easy, and the company probably looks at every aspects of their business, their finances, track record, etc. before signing them on and reviews their business regularly. If they have to rely on this third party stuff to stay afloat that's kind of telling, but then again it's certainly possible. Businesses can thrive one day and crash the next, especially in the luxury market. I must say I've learned a lot in this discussion. I'm not saying you're not 100% right on how this works, but it really seems a bit cockeyed.

Thanks for your generosity at letting me keep my opinion. Oh, and I never believe anything I read on forums anyway. It's all absolute bilge. Every last bit of it. Especially my stuff.

Dont really see the point of you making a random back handed comment, but hey to each their own

[Sublover2166]

This thread has really morphed from a constructive conversation into more of a pi$$ing contest. Do you know what makes America great? Freedom to buy what you want where you want. I believe in internet commerce. It has allowed me to obtain certain consumer goods that I cannot find in a retail store. It allows me to purchase my beloved Cuban cigars in a country that imposes an embargo. And it allows me to purchase a new Rolex without the AD B.S. and save some money that I can use elsewhere. 'Nuff said! IBTL.

[MonBK]

[QUOTE=RollieVerde;5553065]Your point is very well taken, but my point is this: You don't know where the watch actually came from, and when you buy from anybody other than an AD it could very easily be a bogus warranty card. It doesn't mean Rolex won't honor the warranty; it just means it could very easily be faked especially considering you probably won't need a real service in the first two years and you'll never know. And in one sense that's fine, if you have no problems. Even if a watch was stolen, you'd never know until Rolex has some reason to check the serial number. I think in case of regulating a clearly new, legitimate watch, they're not going be too vigilant. So does it matter where you got the watch? It does, if you care about the legitimacy of your purchase. In a worse case scenario the watch could be used, or a fake, or stolen, or returned, or just sourced under questionable circumstances.

QUOTE]

It's pretty obvious that your arguments are just that and have nothing to do with reality!