Is this legitimate? GMT Master II 16710

[foxy1moo]

Hi All

I’m looking at various GMT masters to buy. One I’ve come across, a 16710, seems in perfect condition and a full set. It’s advertised as a 2008 model and has the newer credit card style guarantee, instead of the older paper one.

However looking at the serial number/year there are a couple of discrepancies compared to information on several websites.

It’s a D serial (D6268xx), and firstly it seems to me that D serial should be around 2005-6, not 2008 as advertised. Secondly it seems the new credit card came in during the Z series - which was after D.

I’ve looked at Chrono24 trying to find either a 2008 D serial for sale, or a D serial from other years with the newer credit card guarantee, and cannot find a single example of either.

I suppose it’s possible that a D series from 2005/6 sat around and was sold in 2008, but does anyone know if its possible that a D series also had the credit card guarantee?

Many thanks

[Bladeshot]

I had a D serial 16610LV Kermit and it had paper warranty, not the plastic card. Yes, D is considered as being produced 2005/6. It could have sat around and been sold new, later. Or the plastic warranty card could be from a RSC Service, issued when it was returned after the service work. Photos always help.


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[foxy1moo]

Thanks for the reply. Here is the photo I was sent. It looks like the original plastic guarantee card, not a service card?

[Jason71]

The seller and their reputation / reliability is the best indicator of accurate information and a good transaction.

[foxy1moo]

That may well be the case, however I have not dealt with them before. Therefore it seems sensible to me to do a bit of research and flag any possible discrepancies. It may well be the case it’s all legitimate, hence why I’m asking if any of the knowledgeable folk on this forum can help me.

[glassdial]

I saw one similar on Bobs Watches.

[mineral]

Hi I have exactly the D serial Gmt 16710 coke which was bought new in 2005 or 2006 and it comes with punched paper.

The credit card warranty card is possible if the watch sold at later date, but I suppose it should come with warranty paper.


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[Colin10101]

I have a z serial, and it has punched papers. I’d be wary if I were you. A purchase this big you should have no doubts, I’d look elsewhere.

[THC]

Red flag for sure OP... if the card is not in keeping with the D serial (which is in doubt) then who knows what is inside the watch, as well...keep shopping imo

[BrazenC5]

Pass....not worth the risk. I purchased a D serial last year, and also did similar research (punched paper).

The top edge of the card in your pic also looks a bit rough.

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[Nikrnic]

I'm thinking plastic didn't come out until late Z serial numbers,

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[NoCokeNoHope]

D serials were born with paper warranty as other members noted here. The warranty holder in OP’s picture is for PAPER warranty and period correct. The credit card warranty started at Z serial reported as early as early Z.
However it is possible that a D serial to receive a plastic card warranty. There were some discussion here years ago about the same topic. The D Serial Rolex first came with a paper warranty certificate and the AD wrote the wrong info on the certificate and the AD sent the set back to Rolex. Rolex reissued the warranty in the new (at that time) plastic card format.

Depends on how you feel about the extra work to authenticate the card down the road. It definitely is a rare set with the reissued, if real, warranty. But if you decide to sell it one day, the next buyer may have the same questions about the provenance of this watch.


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[Nairn1980]

My wife has a D serial and it’s papers not card.
Beware.

[Dedot]

I used to have D serial Date 34mm with a plastic warranty card from AD.



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[RolexComplex]

Definitely need to question this. I have a Z serial (2006-2007), purchased from an AD, and it has paper. The D serial watch could have been sold in 2008, but it should still have the original paper warranty.

[foxy1moo]

Thanks all. It seems whilst there could be a reason for the plastic guarantee, the majority seem to think that it’s very unusual. And also pointed out is that the guarantee wallet in the picture is actually for the paper not plastic version, it’s a bit odd. I’ve asked the seller if they can explain this. If there isn’t a good reason, I think I’ll stay away as, even though the seller seems to be reputable and established, they also want a lot of money for the watch and I don’t want to take the chance.

Thanks again, I’ll post back once I have heard from the seller.

[Jason71]

Originally Posted by foxy1moo

Thanks all. It seems whilst there could be a reason for the plastic guarantee, the majority seem to think that it’s very unusual. And also pointed out is that the guarantee wallet in the picture is actually for the paper not plastic version, it’s a bit odd. I’ve asked the seller if they can explain this. If there isn’t a good reason, I think I’ll stay away as, even though the seller seems to be reputable and established, they also want a lot of money for the watch and I don’t want to take the chance.

Thanks again, I’ll post back once I have heard from the seller.

Are you questioning that the watch is authentic or just the warranty card? Are you buying the watch to wear or just an “investment”? Personally, if I felt comfortable that the seller is “reputable and established” as you have stated, and if I was buying the watch to wear.........I wouldn’t worry about the bits or the resale value as long as I was comfortable with the authenticity of the watch. A service with RSC will get you a proper warranty card in the future. It’s not like we are looking at a 16610LV where the only real authenticator is the warranty card.

Unfortunately, all too often these days Rolex watches are purchased as Veblen goods and trinkets for trading rather than their intended purpose.

It’s just a watch.

JMHO

[padi56]

D serials started around April 2005 and ran well into 2006, Z serials started to appear around May 2006 so its perfectly possible for a D serial to have a plastic card.

[foxy1moo]

I’m buying the watch to wear. However, I also want it to be authentic and complete, it is priced as such. Equally I wouldn’t buy a new Rolex from an AD at full price if the paperwork was incomplete, even though I would be very confident it’s authentic. And whilst I don’t plan to sell it, who knows what the future may bring.

The seller seems to be authentic, but as I have said before, I don’t know this for a fact, hence I prefer to play it safe. The last thing I want is to pay full price, send it to Rolex as you suggest, only to find out the watch is not legit. I realise having the guarantee doesnt ensure this, but it helps, and discrepancies in what’s being offered without a plausible explanation also help identify when things are not legit.

I have asked the seller if they have an explanation, if they do, and it all seems reasonable, likely I will buy it. But if not, I will look elsewhere, these watches can be found relatively frequently. Why would I take the risk.

I’m not quite sure why you seem to think this in an unreasonable approach to take?

[foxy1moo]

Originally Posted by padi56

D serials started around April 2005 and ran well into 2006, Z serials started to appear around May 2006 so its perfectly possible for a D serial to have a plastic card.

Thanks, that’s helpful to hear. Maybe just an unusual but possible occurance.

[Jason71]

Originally Posted by foxy1moo

I’m buying the watch to wear. However, I also want it to be authentic and complete, it is priced as such. Equally I wouldn’t buy a new Rolex from an AD at full price if the paperwork was incomplete, even though I would be very confident it’s authentic. And whilst I don’t plan to sell it, who knows what the future may bring.

The seller seems to be authentic, but as I have said before, I don’t know this for a fact, hence I prefer to play it safe. The last thing I want is to pay full price, send it to Rolex as you suggest, only to find out the watch is not legit. I realise having the guarantee doesnt ensure this, but it helps, and discrepancies in what’s being offered without a plausible explanation also help identify when things are not legit.

I have asked the seller if they have an explanation, if they do, and it all seems reasonable, likely I will buy it. But if not, I will look elsewhere, these watches can be found relatively frequently. Why would I take the risk.

I’m not quite sure why you seem to think this in an unreasonable approach to take?

I don't think what you are doing is unreasonable my friend

I often think that people get caught up with resale value, escalating prices, and unpolished showpieces and forget the fact that it's just a watch meant to be worn. Due diligence is of paramount importance. Since you are not comfortable with the warranty card that is included.......maybe the seller could adjust the price accordingly and you could place in the provisions of the transaction that you would like to take it by RSC to have it authenticated??

[springer]

I looked at a D serial Sub anniversary 16610LV lately and it had the credit card style warranty and not the paper document. My opinion is the D serials were a transition year for warranty documents.