The Chinese Are Coming! The Chinese Are Coming!

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

Bas:

I think it looks great!

How about some details! Like, how do you like it, was it a good value, and did you pay extra for the Chineses characters on the dial ?

I paid something like €200,- for it, which is not bad for a hand wound column wheel chrono. I went for the plexi instead of the sapphire because it would have more of a vintage feel which is obviously the goal of this watch.

It's not as well made as my Seiko's, just feels 'less', and gets pretty much no wrist time because I have other watches.



I did not pay extra for the chinese characters, this watch is a re-issue of an early 1960's Tianjin (now Sea-Gull) pilot's chronograph watch.
Story goes that they managed to buy blueprints from the Venus 175/Lemania 2310 and manufactured this movement ever since. They now call this movement the Sea-Gull ST19.

[JohnBaker3]

Bas:

Thanks for the reply/pictures. I really liked #3 which shows the movement. To me, the details and finish work are way above average.

My biggest complaint right now is that every one of my PARNIS's arrived needing some work on regulation. However, since I have a TImegrapher, I just open the case back and in less than 10 minutes they buttoned up and are running at COSC specs.



Photos courtesy of eBay.....

[SearChart]

I also had to regulate my SeaGull, beat error is 0.2 and it's running about 5sec a day fast, so pretty good time keeping I must admit!

[JohnBaker3]

Just as the dust starts to settle, I find this watch ad from JC Penny.....

Seems as they have teamed up with "Ingersoll" watches for their in-store watch sales...

Only problem is that Ingersoll simply re-badged many of the PARNIS watch lines AND tripled the asking prices!

http://www.jcpenney.com/ingersoll-st..._-pp5003070273

Life is good; just get a PARNIS.....

[lapince]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

Just as the dust starts to settle, I find this watch ad from JC Penny.....

Seems as they have teamed up with "Ingersoll" watches for their in-store watch sales...

Only problem is that Ingersoll simply re-badged many of the PARNIS watch lines AND tripled the asking prices!

Life is good; just get a PARNIS.....

Thanks but no thanks, I understand that not everyone can afford the watches I have but I didn't always have these, once I had a Omega seamaster purchased with 40% off, still more than a Parnis but affordable by most if you save some money for some time, at least with Omega you have a certain level of quality...

[Rockrolex]

I wore my Parnis for several days last week. My wife isn't overly fond of it. She thinks it wears too big. It's been on a winder for the past 5 days and it's still running fine, keeping good time.

[JohnBaker3]

Originally Posted by Rockrolex

It's been on a winder for the past 5 days and it's still running fine, keeping good time.

Hey Rock, thanks for the update. I still think that these watches are the best "bang for the buck" on the planet.

I still wear my Rolex and Omegas most of the time, but I have fun wearing these whenever I'm not real excited about exposing the good stuff....

With their price points so low, my collection is growing fast!

[Rockrolex]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

Hey Rock, thanks for the update. I still think that these watches are the best "bang for the buck" on the planet.

I still wear my Rolex and Omegas most of the time, but I have fun wearing these whenever I'm not real excited about exposing the good stuff....

With their price points so low, my collection is growing fast!

I'm wearing this one today, John:

[watchwatcher]

Interesting. Thanks,

[JohnBaker3]

Hey Guys:

Just found this video on YouTube about the Chinese vs Swiss ETA 2824 movements...

Be sure to watch the section at the end where the watchmaker puts them both on a TimeGrapher for a head to head comparison...



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I6cCGTVNTI

[T. Ferguson]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

Hey Guys:

Just found this video on YouTube about the Chinese vs Swiss ETA 2824 movements...

Be sure to watch the section at the end where the watchmaker puts them both on a TimeGrapher for a head to head comparison...

What's the point? It doesn't surprise me at all that the performance would be comparable seeing as one of them is, part for part, a complete and total copy of the other.

[El Cascarrabias]

Yeah, but can they get the cyclops consistent . . .

[DCheeta]

Originally Posted by El Cascarrabias

Yeah, but can they get the cyclops consistent . . .

[JohnBaker3]

Originally Posted by T. Ferguson

What's the point?

The point is, as pointed out in my op, that the Chinese are not going to be making junk copies of other watches much longer....

Very soon, they will be making unique designs with accurate movements that will compete head to head with the Swiss....

This big difference will be the price points; I suspect that a lot of people will be wearing some awesome watches without having to spend a small fortune...

[T. Ferguson]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

The point is, as pointed out in my op, that the Chinese are not going to be making junk copies of other watches much longer....

Very soon, they will be making unique designs with accurate movements that will compete head to head with the Swiss....

This big difference will be the price points; I suspect that a lot of people will be wearing some awesome watches without having to spend a small fortune...

I guess what I'm saying is pointing to a reverse engineered clone movement as the evidence they will be successful innovators of their own original creations doesn't quite convince me. Even if that day comes I think the threat is more towards the lower end and not so much to the upper tier Swiss firms. There are already well established companies making fine watches at lower price points. What will make a Chinese company any more successful than say Seiko in capturing the upper part of the market?

[lapince]

Originally Posted by GB-man

Seiko puts out products to compete on all levels of watchmaking. Swatch through Patek...imho
Not interested in these designs though...

Really? Can you tell me what Seiko models compete with brands like Patek? Not super interested in Seiko but am surprised that they have models more or less competing with the best brands...

[lapince]

Originally Posted by GB-man

Seiko puts out products to compete on all levels of watchmaking. Swatch through Patek...imho

Not interested in these designs though...

OK, so I looked at the models Seiko proposes, when you say they compete with Patek I completely disagree, their complications are a joke compared with Patek ones, they have chrono, GMT, moon phase and perpetual calendar, that's it, take a look on the Patek site for the list of complications, way, WAY MORE…

Plus you can see the look ad level of finishing is light years away from Patek, From what I see and have seen of Seiko models they at best compete with Tudor, they don't even come close to Omega IMO...

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by lapince

Really? Can you tell me what Seiko models compete with brands like Patek? Not super interested in Seiko but am surprised that they have models more or less competing with the best brands...

Regular Seiko's are just good quality low price watches, grand Seiko competes with Omega, Rolex etc in terms of quality. Seiko Credor is often seen as Philippe Dufour, FPJ, PP territory.

[JohnBaker3]

Originally Posted by SearChart

Regular Seiko's are just good quality low price watches, grand Seiko competes with Omega, Rolex etc in terms of quality. Seiko Credor is often seen as Philippe Dufour, FPJ, PP territory.

+1

Since the Japanese have a 25 year head-start on the Chinese, I still think we are in for some real fireworks in the world of watches....

Popcorn anyone?

[lapince]

Originally Posted by SearChart

Regular Seiko's are just good quality low price watches, grand Seiko competes with Omega, Rolex etc in terms of quality. Seiko Credor is often seen as Philippe Dufour, FPJ, PP territory.

Well Bas I saw that they made 1 minute repeater, but as far as I see they only make from time to time 1 special model which could be in the same league than PP and others, so for me it's not really competing, it's one shots, and I would NEVER put 400K, that's the price of their minute repeater, in a Seiko watch, but to each their own...

[jwpatt]

Definitely not for me

[SearChart]

Originally Posted by lapince

Well Bas I saw that they made 1 minute repeater, but as far as I see they only make from time to time 1 special model which could be in the same league than PP and others, so for me it's not really competing, it's one shots, and I would NEVER put 400K, that's the price of their minute repeater, in a Seiko watch, but to each their own...

Neither would I.

[JohnBaker3]

Hey Guys:

Here is something interesting; just yesterday I saw a note about the release of 2 new watch designs by Girard Perregaux....

Nice clean lines with good symmetry....no prices mentioned but I'm guessing $7K plus....

Second pic shows a couple of watches released by PARNIS sometime last year...amazing coincidence? Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

[threemonkeys]

I go out of my way to not (knowingly) purchase anything Chinese. Fake infant formula, Apple stores, 'homages', cyber activity...I'll shut up now.

[JohnBaker3]

Just picked up this 43mm Moonphase with the big date windows...

Put it on the Timegrapher and it was really close: 3 sec/day and 0.1 Beat Error...

Very nice finishing work on the movement (clear caseback)....

The Moonphase is large enough to actually see....blued hands have great visibility on the white dial....

Great value for $61.00 USD delivered....

[capote]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

Hey Guys:

Here is something interesting; just yesterday I saw a note about the release of 2 new watch designs by Girard Perregaux....

Nice clean lines with good symmetry....no prices mentioned but I'm guessing $7K plus....

Second pic shows a couple of watches released by PARNIS sometime last year...amazing coincidence? Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

Which came first? JLC has this design as well as Frederique Constant. Dig deep enough and you will probably find a vintage Patek with the same dial lay-out. Anyway the Chinese will not be a theat to the Swiss watch industry in the coming hundred years at least. I think it will take longer than that for them to come up with one good original design.

[JohnBaker3]

http://www.hqmilton.com/watches/1970...0-mark-4-dial1

Looks like I'm not the only one who thinks the Chinese are making inroads on the watch industry...

Nice looking tourbillion for $2560.....

[Rockrolex]

I've had this one($110 from Amazon) for over 3 months now and it still runs fine. In fact, I'm wearing it today.

[JohnBaker3]

Rock:

Any legibility issues with your watch having silver hands over a white dial?

[Rockrolex]

Originally Posted by JohnBaker3

Rock:

Any legibility issues with your watch having silver hands over a white dial?

None at all, John.