Appreciation of culture in this PP forum & stories of building relationships with ADs

[watchtabs]

I really appreciate the perspective shared in the PP boards, specially this recent thread (https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=909850) I think its full of golden nuggets. So instead of replying directly to the thread, I'd like to share my thoughts with the entire group and begin a conversation about this.



This thread has been a fantastic influence in pushing me to build a relationship with my AD. I have only bought PP from trusted dealers (before everything went crazy), and directly from other trusted collectors (currently own a 5164a and 5168g, at some point I owned a 5167 and a 5712 too, which I regret selling)



Truth is, its easy nowadays to get caught up in the frenzy of trying to hunt down scarce watches, especially highly coveted Patek Philippe models.



However, the “culture and approach” displayed in this thread - of taking a step back and prioritizing building a genuine relationship with their authorized dealer first is refreshing.



My main takeaway is that even amidst the current climate of high demand, investing time to establish rapport through open communication, shared passion, and realistic expectations will prove more rewarding in the long run than just chasing transactions.



In my case, I can say I have been pretty impulsive in my watch-collecting life; which contrasts with the rest of my life where I have been methodical, while still being fast-moving and fast-acting, but not with desperation or frenzy.



My relationship with PP, started because my grandparents one who was a doctor and the other was a lawyer wore their PP’s daily (I forget which models they were, as they are long-gone). So I have an emotional link with this brand, as these two men raised me, even more influential than my direct parents.



So my next step is to go visit one of the ADs here in Miami and see which one will share the values, and passion about watches with me.



How did you begin your relationship with your AD?

Can you share your history and experiences?

Any advise you might share?

[HMHM]

I have only bought watches from the AD since I started buying my first higher end watch back in 2014. Back then, grey dealers were giving steep discount for a Rolex 34mm Date, yet I still bought from the AD because authenticity was and still is the most important thing to me until today. Grey dealers can sing until the cows come home, but they can NEVER EVER guarantee authenticity despite all the nonsense of being a “trusted dealer”. The experience of buying from an AD back then and today are completely different. My advice for you would be to find an AD that is willing to engage with you, not just a monetarily, but also in terms of sharing your enthusiasm in building a collection. Some ADs are highly toxic as the Shreve and Co lawsuit has demonstrated. So I would say don’t commit into buying a piece from the AD yet, until you have found one that is genuine and honest in their dealings. Visit a few, see what their behaviour is like first. With the way the watch market is going, customers will gain more power gradually, so be patient and don’t rush for the sake of buying. Ultimately, the good ADs will survive and customers who were treated well will always remember that. Good luck!

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by HMHM

I have only bought watches from the AD since I started buying my first higher end watch back in 2014. Back then, grey dealers were giving steep discount for a Rolex 34mm Date, yet I still bought from the AD because authenticity was and still is the most important thing to me until today. Grey dealers can sing until the cows come home, but they can NEVER EVER guarantee authenticity despite all the nonsense of being a “trusted dealer”. The experience of buying from an AD back then and today are completely different. My advice for you would be to find an AD that is willing to engage with you, not just a monetarily, but also in terms of sharing your enthusiasm in building a collection. Some ADs are highly toxic as the Shreve and Co lawsuit has demonstrated. So I would say don’t commit into buying a piece from the AD yet, until you have found one that is genuine and honest in their dealings. Visit a few, see what their behaviour is like first. With the way the watch market is going, customers will gain more power gradually, so be patient and don’t rush for the sake of buying. Ultimately, the good ADs will survive and customers who were treated well will always remember that. Good luck!

If you deal with a trusted seller, they are much better at spotting fakes than you give them credit for. And, if a watch turns out to be a fake, when and if that is found out, a trusted seller will take the watch back for a full refund, no questions asked. There is a reason these dealers are referred to as trusted sellers.

[HMHM]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

If you deal with a trusted seller, they are much better at spotting fakes than you give them credit for. And, if a watch turns out to be a fake, when and if that is found out, a trusted seller will take the watch back for a full refund, no questions asked. There is a reason these dealers are referred to as trusted sellers.

Yes they can spot. Yes they can refund. Yes they can make it right for the customer. But are they an AD? Are they able to GUARANTEE the watch has not been tempered before? How many times have the watch switched hands before reaching the owner? For Patek maybe it’s possible to have a look at the movement through the transparent case back, but for Rolex - opening the case back voids the warranty and affects the WR. So how can a grey dealer guarantee that? The problem with greys is that they have to authenticate the watch, but that process itself void the manufacturer warranty.

Buying from AD - you cut the box yourself, you fill up the warranty card with your name. You are the first person that touches the watch the moment you unseal it. Double sealed watches are REALLY RARE these days on the grey market and cost a fortune on the grey market on top of an already obscene price that they are going for. There are challenges that one has to faced when wanting to buy from an AD which I won’t deny, but the long term benefits simply outweighs the cons, especially if one has the intention to build a collection, not just buying a piece or two and calling it a day.

Buying a Patek is an experience. Wear the gloves and unbox your prized possession proudly. Inspect your box. Unseal the box yourself. See your name being written down the warranty paper and hand it down to your children down the road. Your child will look at it one day and think of you when he sees the paper, not Mr XXXX that has nothing to do with him. And that is something a grey dealer can never provide, doesn’t matter what they say!

[codecow]

Can’t you just re-register the watch when you buy it? Patek will then have a record of who it changed hands to. An extract won’t have that info on it anyway as they don’t share it, so it’s on the original papers only AFAIK.

So Patek has the full record but it’s not accessible. Too bad.

[dauster]

Originally Posted by watchtabs

I really appreciate the perspective shared in the PP boards, specially this recent thread (https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=909850) I think its full of golden nuggets. So instead of replying directly to the thread, I'd like to share my thoughts with the entire group and begin a conversation about this.



This thread has been a fantastic influence in pushing me to build a relationship with my AD. I have only bought PP from trusted dealers (before everything went crazy), and directly from other trusted collectors (currently own a 5164a and 5168g, at some point I owned a 5167 and a 5712 too, which I regret selling)



Truth is, its easy nowadays to get caught up in the frenzy of trying to hunt down scarce watches, especially highly coveted Patek Philippe models.



However, the “culture and approach” displayed in this thread - of taking a step back and prioritizing building a genuine relationship with their authorized dealer first is refreshing.



My main takeaway is that even amidst the current climate of high demand, investing time to establish rapport through open communication, shared passion, and realistic expectations will prove more rewarding in the long run than just chasing transactions.



In my case, I can say I have been pretty impulsive in my watch-collecting life; which contrasts with the rest of my life where I have been methodical, while still being fast-moving and fast-acting, but not with desperation or frenzy.



My relationship with PP, started because my grandparents one who was a doctor and the other was a lawyer wore their PP’s daily (I forget which models they were, as they are long-gone). So I have an emotional link with this brand, as these two men raised me, even more influential than my direct parents.



So my next step is to go visit one of the ADs here in Miami and see which one will share the values, and passion about watches with me.



How did you begin your relationship with your AD?

Can you share your history and experiences?

Any advise you might share?

Nice post and I too (after many failed attempts) was able to build a solid AD relationship, if it works it's amazing but I can understand how some people that had theri AD lose their patek license are having trouble. Luck with who you connect with etc definitely plays a role. But I too want to own MR and rare hadncrafts and I am happy to build a relationship over many years so good luck in your journey. For me it took my like 3-4 ADs and actually 2 of these have lost their Patek license in the meantime. luckily I only bought stuff I wanted so it didnt matter but still a bummer when it does happen.

[westoque]

Originally Posted by HMHM

Yes they can spot. Yes they can refund. Yes they can make it right for the customer. But are they an AD? Are they able to GUARANTEE the watch has not been tempered before? How many times have the watch switched hands before reaching the owner? For Patek maybe it’s possible to have a look at the movement through the transparent case back, but for Rolex - opening the case back voids the warranty and affects the WR. So how can a grey dealer guarantee that? The problem with greys is that they have to authenticate the watch, but that process itself void the manufacturer warranty.

Buying from AD - you cut the box yourself, you fill up the warranty card with your name. You are the first person that touches the watch the moment you unseal it. Double sealed watches are REALLY RARE these days on the grey market and cost a fortune on the grey market on top of an already obscene price that they are going for. There are challenges that one has to faced when wanting to buy from an AD which I won’t deny, but the long term benefits simply outweighs the cons, especially if one has the intention to build a collection, not just buying a piece or two and calling it a day.

Buying a Patek is an experience. Wear the gloves and unbox your prized possession proudly. Inspect your box. Unseal the box yourself. See your name being written down the warranty paper and hand it down to your children down the road. Your child will look at it one day and think of you when he sees the paper, not Mr XXXX that has nothing to do with him. And that is something a grey dealer can never provide, doesn’t matter what they say!

Almost bought a 5205 at a steep discount. When I opened the box the experience was not as authentic, then I held it in my hand closely observing the piece that had scratches and inspecting the outside case just didn’t feel right to me. What sealed that I wasn’t going grey was then looking the papers, it said “ Mr XXX” so ultimately I didn’t feel like I owned the watch. I know other people would feel otherwise but that’s how I feel.


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[Bigsoftee]

I have been to 4 PP AD’s, and have found them obnoxious, arrogant and rude, and could not wait to get me out of the door. I was simply asking to go on a list for a basic Calatrava as I own AP and VC already, had hope to complete a piece from each of the holy trinity, and really have always admired Patek watches. Also I wanted my name on the papers, thus the reason not buying grey. The watch I wanted trades for considerable less too, it’s not like I was going in and asking for a 5811 or something like that. The AP boutique I buy from are fantastic, kind and welcoming. So sadly, I would never buy a PP watch based on my personal experiences, which is a shame for me as I love the watches they produce….

Rant over

[geoach]

Waked in PP AD looked a 5066 liked it forked over the cash. Got a great big thank you from them got some swag and walked out. 1999

[1William]

The PP customer and fan is truly a different type of person and collector. My experience is that while they will espouse the brand and engage others they do not tend to listen well and talking to them about anything other than what they have setup in their mind is typically useless. This is a broad statement but my experience. PP has cut the number of AD's in the U.S. and will continue to do so if they follow the current history. This leaves the customer AD less and then moving on to create a new relationship. In a perfect world we would all buy the models we want through AD's, when we want them and at retail or a discount. But that is not the world we live in. I have taken a stance that Trusted Sellers are a part of my buying/selling/trading experience as well as my AD. I always ask my self is it about the watches or the hunt/purchase/AD experience. It is all, but in the end, it is about the watches for me. OP, I would go into as many AD's as you can. Have honest and open conversations about why you are into the brand and discuss getting some watches. Some AD's will not be receptive, others, so/so, but you could find one or more that want you as a customer. Good luck.

[fsprow]

Personally, I don’t expect a dealer to sell me anything for less than market price. Market price could be above, at, or below MSRP. And I care not about the so-called dealer experience. I’m happy receiving my watch in the mail and enjoying it immediately. I’ve also found many AD’s much less likable to deal with than high-quality resellers.