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Old 23 March 2018, 10:04 AM   #61
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What's the new Tudor then?


Seiko.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:06 AM   #62
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The problem here is lack of serious competition for Rolex. In terms of quality for the price, there is no one. Omega? IWC? Panerai? Grand Seiko? Please. No one touches Rolex. If you can get your hands on a Rolex, it will outlive you. How many consumer products can you say that about? At the low end you have a million options, and at the high end you have Patek, AP, Journe, and a handful of independents. In the middle? Rolex.

Rolex is an effective monopoly without being a literal monopoly. Which is why we are completely at their mercy when it comes to choice and availability. How I wish there was a true alternative. 1) because I'd like to have some real choice as a consumer and 2) to keep Rolex at least the tiniest bit hungry when it comes to customers.

To their credit, they've continued to innovate even without any real need.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:06 AM   #63
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I wonder how many non-WIS people who buy new Tudor watches feel like they bought Rolex Lite.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:07 AM   #64
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800-900k but evenly distributed through the model line?
Obviously there’s no way for me to have real numbers but I’m 100% sure they’re not evenly distributed. Datejusts and Day-Dates definitely make up a large percentage of total production followed by the sports models and the Cellini line which is also not produced in crazy numbers.

You can observe this at almost any large AD. They will have many different configs of DJs and DDs (in every PM) and usually 2-3 configs of every sport model at any given time. 3-4 black Sub Dates, some TTs and maybe two gold subs, a couple of TT Daytonas, a couple of gold ones, a steel Yachmaster and YMII and a couple of gold ones, an LN GMT. This was what I usually saw before the shortage.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:07 AM   #65
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I wonder how many non-WIS people who buy new Tudor watches feel like they bought Rolex Lite.
Not many.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:13 AM   #66
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I wonder how many non-WIS people who buy new Tudor watches feel like they bought Rolex Lite.
Non-WIS might not know that Tudor belongs to Rolex. They may just see the Born to Dare ad campaign with cool looking watches and want one. The various Black Bays are all very, very appealing especially this new BB58 which looks somewhat similar to the original Sub except for the golden numbers on the bezel.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:16 AM   #67
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I love the old literature. And as you may remember also the Rose. Interesting that the bracelet in the photo is just like the ranger bracelet.
So do I. Recently I was watching Wild Wild Country on Netflix about the ‘80s Bhagwan Rajneesh cult in Oregon and they showed a couple of catalog style Rolex ads from the late ‘70s/early ‘80s. I immediately went back and hit pause to admire them and get a good look.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:18 AM   #68
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So do I. Recently I was watching Wild Wild Country on Netflix about the ‘80s Bhagwan Rajneesh cult in Oregon and they showed a couple of catalog style Rolex ADs from the late ‘70s/early ‘80s. I immediately went back and hit pause to admire them and get a good look.
Haha. I just started that show as we speak.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:22 AM   #69
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The problem here is lack of serious competition for Rolex. In terms of quality for the price, there is no one. Omega? IWC? Panerai? Grand Seiko? Please. No one touches Rolex. If you can get your hands on a Rolex, it will outlive you. How many consumer products can you say that about? At the low end you have a million options, and at the high end you have Patek, AP, Journe, and a handful of independents. In the middle? Rolex.

Rolex is an effective monopoly without being a literal monopoly. Which is why we are completely at their mercy when it comes to choice and availability. How I wish there was a true alternative. 1) because I'd like to have some real choice as a consumer and 2) to keep Rolex at least the tiniest bit hungry when it comes to customers.

To their credit, they've continued to innovate even without any real need.
well said.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:22 AM   #70
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Haha. I just started that show as we speak.
It’s actually pretty entertaining! I went in with no knowledge of what they were or what went down. It’s pretty wild!
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:23 AM   #71
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So do I. Recently I was watching Wild Wild Country on Netflix about the ‘80s Bhagwan Rajneesh cult in Oregon and they showed a couple of catalog style Rolex ADs from the late ‘70s/early ‘80s. I immediately went back and hit pause to admire them and get a good look.
Def going to look this up.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:26 AM   #72
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So do I. Recently I was watching Wild Wild Country on Netflix about the ‘80s Bhagwan Rajneesh cult in Oregon and they showed a couple of catalog style Rolex ads from the late ‘70s/early ‘80s. I immediately went back and hit pause to admire them and get a good look.
Just finished it. I spent a few months in Oregon in the '80s and that doc brought back a few memories.
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:29 AM   #73
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Def going to look this up.
If you want to see the Rolex stuff skip to Part 4 about 14:20 minutes in. Unbelievable this guy ended up having 96 Rolls Royces. Heck I may have to grow a long beard and become a guru myself!
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Old 23 March 2018, 10:51 AM   #74
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They don’t need one. They pump out enough Tudors that the used market is the affordable Tudor. That’s why I don’t understand purchasing Tudor at retail. You will lose $1000 or more. The only Tudor to retain or gain value has been the Black Bay ETA Rose Black Bezel but those had only a few thousand made so it’s not the typical Tudor.
im going to say this right now. the tudor pelagos blue will double the day they discontinue it.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:12 AM   #75
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It amazes me that Rolex releases one new reference and the whole world gets turned upside-down. I look at it from this perspective: with this one release (BLRO SS) coupled with the Tudor Pepsi, Rolex has offered something for everyone. We have options to buy in-house produced Pepsi GMT models ranging anywhere from $3,900 to $30K. Precious metal or stainless steel. Jubilee or Oyster style bracelet. Ceramic or aluminum bezel. We spend 11 months of the year speculating what will come each and every Basel, griping about lack of options. And when we finally get what we've been craving, somehow, Rolex is conspiring against us? Give me a break.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:16 AM   #76
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It amazes me that Rolex releases one new reference and the whole world gets turned upside-down. I look at it from this perspective: with this one release (BLRO SS) coupled with the Tudor Pepsi, Rolex has offered something for everyone. We have options to buy in-house produced Pepsi GMT models ranging anywhere from $3,900 to $30K. Precious metal or stainless steel. Jubilee or Oyster style bracelet. Ceramic or aluminum bezel. We spend 11 months of the year speculating what will come each and every Basel, griping about lack of options. And when we finally get what we've been craving, somehow, Rolex is conspiring against us? Give me a break.
Tell us when you get that Rolex Pepsi.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:25 AM   #77
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No this is a demand bubble, when demand falls off then we will know what Rolex's strategy is regarding supply and price. At the moment their strategy has been to watch and do nothing, other than try and stop flippers, until they see some sustained market changes.
I agree. Based on last week’s WSJ article on the Swiss watch industry, I think Rolex planned for a depressed market this year and was shocked that demand blew the doors off. It doesn’t fix anything and I’m in agreement with almost every comment on this thread, but at least it offers some explanation.

I do think a luxury goods business that can’t respond to changes in demand is weird but at the same time, as many have said, they’re also in the marketing and mystique business and it strikes me that they’re doing a very good job on that front.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:26 AM   #78
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It amazes me that Rolex releases one new reference and the whole world gets turned upside-down. I look at it from this perspective: with this one release (BLRO SS) coupled with the Tudor Pepsi, Rolex has offered something for everyone. We have options to buy in-house produced Pepsi GMT models ranging anywhere from $3,900 to $30K. Precious metal or stainless steel. Jubilee or Oyster style bracelet. Ceramic or aluminum bezel. We spend 11 months of the year speculating what will come each and every Basel, griping about lack of options. And when we finally get what we've been craving, somehow, Rolex is conspiring against us? Give me a break.
I hadn’t looked at it this way. Great point! Thanks for making it!!
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:27 AM   #79
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Also, am I the only TRF member who thinks the blue dial WM BLRO is a cool reference? I’ll never be able to afford it, but I think it’s beautiful.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:27 AM   #80
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The Tudor is a great watch. All kinds of bang for the buck.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:28 AM   #81
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Tell us when you get that Rolex Pepsi.
2nd in line at my AD (for whatever that is worth)

You can have my spot for a Tudor Pepsi :)
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:31 AM   #82
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I agree that Tudor is doing a lot of things right. But, are they the new Rolex? I don't think so.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:33 AM   #83
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2nd in line at my AD (for whatever that is worth)

You can have my spot for a Tudor Pepsi :)
I’ll take it!
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:34 AM   #84
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I wonder how many non-WIS people who buy new Tudor watches feel like they bought Rolex Lite.
I always thought that, too, but this forum has demonstrated to me the quality of Tudor. They’re not gonna be worn by Biance, Mayer, and Springsteen, but they’re solid, super-high quality watches.

When Tudor comes out with a cool moon-phase watch, I’m on it. I love the Cellini moon phase concept but think a more standard moon phase complication ‘reads’ better and is more clear. And even if I loved it, I can’t afford it. I’d love a Tudor moon phase — Rolex Cellinis will always be out of reach for me.

So, yeah, I’ll take a ‘Rolex Lite’ to go along with my BLNR Batman and much loved YM.
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:45 AM   #85
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I always thought that, too, but this forum has demonstrated to me the quality of Tudor. They’re not gonna be worn by Biance, Mayer, and Springsteen, but they’re solid, super-high quality watches.

When Tudor comes out with a cool moon-phase watch, I’m on it. I love the Cellini moon phase concept but think a more standard moon phase complication ‘reads’ better and is more clear. And even if I loved it, I can’t afford it. I’d love a Tudor moon phase — Rolex Cellinis will always be out of reach for me.

So, yeah, I’ll take a ‘Rolex Lite’ to go along with my BLNR Batman and much loved YM.
You mean John Mayer? https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/th...-by-john-mayer
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:49 AM   #86
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Tudor is not Rolex........Many here own both, as do I... Which would be on the chopping block first if you wanted to sell?

I'd be keeping my Rolex period. Tudor has enjoyed a resurgence. Rolex is timeless....
Tudors are nice watches, Rolex are supelative timepieces.


IMHO.....
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Old 23 March 2018, 11:58 AM   #87
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Ahhhhh The Black Rose. Every collector needs to take Johns advice and buy a Tudor Black Bay Black Bezel with 🌹. If you can find one. Money in the Bank.
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Old 23 March 2018, 12:00 PM   #88
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Ahhhhh The Black Rose. Every collector needs to take Johns advice and buy a Tudor Black Bay Black Bezel with 🌹. If you can find one. Money in the Bank.
So you've said, like a million times
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Old 23 March 2018, 12:05 PM   #89
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So you've said, like a million times
Definitely
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Old 23 March 2018, 12:07 PM   #90
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I always feel like Tudor products are holding back a bit though. Like they can’t upset the balance of the universe. Whereas Rolex you know you’re holding the absolute perfection or distillation to whatever purpose the watch was designed for sub/Explorer/gmt/datejust.

just my 2c.. I still love tudor watches though. And yes this lifestyle inflation is getting out of hand. 40,000 for a steel Patek Nautilus and 18,000 for a steel ceramic Rolex chronograph. You never can tell you’re in a bubble when you’re in it but when it pops it’ll be all ‘oh it was so obvious’ in hindsight. Especially the vintage market it’s crazy 10-20% increase y-o-y ultimately unsustainable just like the crypto bubble that popped recently. I blame central banker zirp policies. Too much easy money meant to boost the economy merely propping up asset price bubbles including vintage watches and modern Rolex/Patek.
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