Fake 1680 Red

[1665fan]

Just to let people know they are out there and dealers sell them too. And people often ask to look for, the 1680 print is correct but the 3.7 mill serial is indeed a reprint and fake....

https://www.chrono24.com/rolex/1680-...-id9871438.htm

[1665fan]

Title should read fake red 1680 sorry

[abs2010]

He offers an explanation in the details. I dunno if this is true or not, but I thought I'd read somewhere this indeed was the practice at one point:

Okay guys, this an honest Red Sub with two points to know. The watch has been at rolex for service before the mid of the 80's when it received an exchange case with the old serial number of the watch. How do we know that? Rolex startet to use the exchange cases with 4,4 million serial around 85 when registered design was also used on new watches. This case was used before and so you can be sure that the watch was born as a real Red Sub!

[1665fan]

I didn’t know there was English below all the German...if anybody believes that well I got beachfront property in Montana lol

[Hub6152]

The listing describes it as having a service replacement case. Is that what it really is or is it totally faked?

[Tools]

Once the case is replaced with a service case, absolute provenance about that change-out needs to be available and verified.

Still, it is not original, so Red dial or not, value is lost.

[Mr_A_Love_Rolex]

Any idea how much value is lost if it is a service replacement case?

Also, are there any photos of serial numbers' font when they were case replacements?

Is it even true that Rolex during a certain time period did engrave the original serial number on a service case?

Is this guy telling the truth or trying to trick someone?

I also noticed it was the cheapest Red Sub available on the open market ...

[thewatchguymuc]

Hey guys. A customer of mine informed me about this thread about my Red Sub here.

Sorry but some of you should do a proper research before stating something as a fake.

The case is a 100% original rolex service case and the engraving is 100% correct. Uncommon yes, but not a fake. It was checked by several Rolex experts and friends. One of them is for example Michael Klan (tswisst) which is for sure one of the guys with the most knowledge in Vintage Rolex. I for myself collect Rolex Vintage since 2006 and would never offer a watch with fake, aftermarket or made up parts.

Also i stated clear in my german and english descritpion the two points to know about the watch are the case and the chip on the dial. If you compare that with other offers from dealers i have to say my descriptions are fair and telling the watch in the condition it is.

Sorry about my english by the way.

Greetings

Christoph

[chows99]

Dear Christoph,

To further prove your point, can you show photos of the current serial engraving of the service case, and photos of similar engraving in similar time series?

Appreciate your comments.

[TimeToGo]

Originally Posted by thewatchguymuc

Hey guys. A customer of mine informed me about this thread about my Red Sub here.

Sorry but some of you should do a proper research before stating something as a fake.

The case is a 100% original rolex service case and the engraving is 100% correct. Uncommon yes, but not a fake. It was checked by several Rolex experts and friends. One of them is for example Michael Klan (tswisst) which is for sure one of the guys with the most knowledge in Vintage Rolex. I for myself collect Rolex Vintage since 2006 and would never offer a watch with fake, aftermarket or made up parts.

Also i stated clear in my german and english descritpion the two points to know about the watch are the case and the chip on the dial. If you compare that with other offers from dealers i have to say my descriptions are fair and telling the watch in the condition it is.

Sorry about my english by the way.

Greetings

Christoph

Just FYI

Only one person called it fake. Some of his comments on this and other topics are usually questionable.

..and now others are jumping on the band wagon.. LOL

Your english is fine..

[Kingface66]

Originally Posted by 1665fan

I didn’t know there was English below all the German...if anybody believes that well I got beachfront property in Montana lol

So, about this beachfront property...

[Hub6152]

Originally Posted by thewatchguymuc

Hey guys. A customer of mine informed me about this thread about my Red Sub here.

Sorry but some of you should do a proper research before stating something as a fake.

The case is a 100% original rolex service case and the engraving is 100% correct. Uncommon yes, but not a fake. It was checked by several Rolex experts and friends. One of them is for example Michael Klan (tswisst) which is for sure one of the guys with the most knowledge in Vintage Rolex. I for myself collect Rolex Vintage since 2006 and would never offer a watch with fake, aftermarket or made up parts.

Also i stated clear in my german and english descritpion the two points to know about the watch are the case and the chip on the dial. If you compare that with other offers from dealers i have to say my descriptions are fair and telling the watch in the condition it is.

Sorry about my english by the way.

Greetings

Christoph

Just realised I’m following you on IG - super impressive collection you have.

[andrewjb88]

Originally Posted by Hub6152

Just realised I’m following you on IG - super impressive collection you have.

I wasn't buy I am now

[exador]

I own a service cased 1016 with the original serial number. It is a thing.

[enginerd]

Any paperwork from Rolex on the replacement case? That would sure clear things up and someone could end up with a very nice watch if all checks out. Ironically I came across this exact watch last week, read the description and really didn't understand what the seller was trying to say, so I just moved on. My knowledge on replacement cases is quite lacking, but I didn't automatically think FAKE when I saw it. It's all in what you can prove and how the story adds up.

[Juhuatai]

This may be a naive question but how does one distinguish a service case with the original serial number from the original case?

[springer]

Originally Posted by Juhuatai

This may be a naive question but how does one distinguish a service case with the original serial number from the original case?

Watch cases were stamped Registered Design until sometime in 1979. (There were also cases from circa 1979 that were not stamped Registered Design or Orig Rolex Design during the transition to the Orig Rolex Design stamping). After the transition in 1979, the cases were stamped Orig Rolex Design.

Based on the serial number of this watch, which places it from the early 1970s, this would not be an original case for the red Sub era - it would have read Registered Design if original.

[enginerd]

Originally Posted by springer

Watch cases were stamped Registered Design until sometime in 1979. (There were also cases from circa 1979 that were not stamped Registered Design or Orig Rolex Design during the transition to the Orig Rolex Design stamping). After the transition in 1979, the cases were stamped Orig Rolex Design.

Based on the serial number of this watch, which places it from the early 1970s, this would not be an original case for the red Sub era - it would have read Registered Design if original.

It was never claimed to be an original case. It was claimed to be a service case with the original serial retained. Seller's claim is that this was done prior to 1985 (and I guess after 1979), but I've never read anything to support that.

[Juhuatai]

I believe springer was answering my question. Not asserting anything else.

[enginerd]

Originally Posted by Juhuatai

I believe springer was answering my question. Not asserting anything else.

Yes you're right. My reading comprehension has been a bit slow this morning.

Carry on, nothing to see here.

[thewatchguymuc]

Thanks guys. I have seen the engraving on my watch on two other watches before but didn't safe the picutres. I asked some friends and will get back to you asap

[Mansell92]

wow, that dial looks so familiar to me. I swear it was on another watch not that long ago.

[springer]

Quote:
Originally Posted by springer View Post
Watch cases were stamped Registered Design until sometime in 1979. (There were also cases from circa 1979 that were not stamped Registered Design or Orig Rolex Design during the transition to the Orig Rolex Design stamping). After the transition in 1979, the cases were stamped Orig Rolex Design.


enginerd:
Based on the serial number of this watch, which places it from the early 1970s, this would not be an original case for the red Sub era - it would have read Registered Design if original.
It was never claimed to be an original case. It was claimed to be a service case with the original serial retained. Seller's claim is that this was done prior to 1985 (and I guess after 1979), but I've never read anything to support that.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My response was for Juhuatai!!! Carry on.

[RobW]

To me, accusing a seller of offering fake Rolexes is a serious allegation. Too often I see on some threads someone shouting "fake!" followed by a chorus of "fake!" from other posters without a thorough explanation as to what makes the watch a fake (not all threads, but enough). Then cooler heads prevail and we may get that explanation -- or not. In this case the poster alleging "fake" apparently didn't bother to read the description of the watch with a service case. The description makes sense and is entirely plausible. It's not a fake. It's a watch with a service case. The description allows the potential buyer to decide whether he/she wants to take the risk of making a purchase.

Shouting fake without proper research and an explanation does a disservice to potential buyers and the seller. And for people like me who want to learn what defines a fake Rolex and how to spot them, it's posts like these that only muddy the waters.

[Tomas Eriksson]

Originally Posted by springer

Watch cases were stamped Registered Design until sometime in 1979. (There were also cases from circa 1979 that were not stamped Registered Design or Orig Rolex Design during the transition to the Orig Rolex Design stamping). After the transition in 1979, the cases were stamped Orig Rolex Design.

Based on the serial number of this watch, which places it from the early 1970s, this would not be an original case for the red Sub era - it would have read Registered Design if original.

I would like to refer to drsd and correct you a bit:

Until 1979-1980 6.2 million "REGISTERED DESIGN"
From 1980-1982 6.2 million to 7.0 million just the model number engraved.
From 1982 7.0 million onwards "ORIG ROLEX DESIGN"

[1665fan]

Yea let’s see this paperwork from the Rolex service