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Old 17 January 2019, 05:33 AM   #61
Pay M3
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By no means am I calling a Rolex a bad purchase it’s just not a good investment. We all need things that motivate us to work a little harder in life and cause us to earn more or get promoted, so there’s nothing wrong with it. I’m just saying this so that people enjoy the watch.
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Old 17 January 2019, 05:37 AM   #62
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Why do people continue asking this? All it takes is some simple math to realize it’s not a good investment and is in fact meant to be worn as a watch. This same argument gets made in other markets as well and it blows my mind.

8k over a 30 year period at a modest return of 7% with traditional investments will net you more of a return (roughly 55-60k) than your average Rolex unless you get lucky with a unicorn piece.

Stop worrying about this stuff and buy the thing.
Who on earth wants to wait 30 YEARS for a return? We only live properly for 50 years. So that’s waiting more than half of your entire life. My hulk has made me 50% in less than 4 months. Argument over.
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Old 17 January 2019, 05:45 AM   #63
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Why do people continue asking this? All it takes is some simple math to realize it’s not a good investment and is in fact meant to be worn as a watch. This same argument gets made in other markets as well and it blows my mind.

8k over a 30 year period at a modest return of 7% with traditional investments will net you more of a return (roughly 55-60k) than your average Rolex unless you get lucky with a unicorn piece.

Stop worrying about this stuff and buy the thing.
You lost me at a "modest return of 7%" (compounded over 30 years to boot)
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Old 17 January 2019, 05:49 AM   #64
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Why do people continue asking this? All it takes is some simple math to realize it’s not a good investment and is in fact meant to be worn as a watch. This same argument gets made in other markets as well and it blows my mind.

8k over a 30 year period at a modest return of 7% with traditional investments will net you more of a return (roughly 55-60k) than your average Rolex unless you get lucky with a unicorn piece.

Stop worrying about this stuff and buy the thing.

Yes, but that modest return for paper somewhere doesn’t adorn your wrist, tell you the time, or earn you respect in business. Rolex does the first two abd some say the last, so why not have tangible benefit while it appreciates even if at a more modest rate.

I agree though on your premise not to buy to place in a safe.


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Old 17 January 2019, 05:50 AM   #65
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Really? Not all investments require appreciation in the principal amount to be considered good investments. When you buy a bond for ££££, if you buy it at par, you expect to get exactly the ££££ that you paid for it when you sell it at maturity. No more, no less. The investment return in that case comes in the form of dividends (income) paid over the life of the bond.

Correlating this to Rolex ownership, one could view the enjoyment of owning and wearing the watch as the “dividends”, or return, and if they were to sell it one day for exactly what they paid (the par amount of “principal”), they might feel that was a good investment in much the same way as the bond investment.

Don’t be so quick to laugh at others, especially when you’re at risk of exposing your own ignorance of a topic.
That was a tongue in cheek reply but if your taking it seriously I wouldn't invest in bonds anyway. Why? Because that's not my specialty. Real estate is where the big money is for me. Goodluck with your Rolex investments.
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Old 17 January 2019, 05:59 AM   #66
Chilly Coconut
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That was a tongue in cheek reply but if your taking it seriously I wouldn't invest in bonds anyway. Why? Because that's not my specialty. Real estate is where the big money is for me. Goodluck with your Rolex investments.
Good to hear you’re staying clear of asset classes you know nothing about. By the way, Rolexes generally shouldn’t be bought as investments, even if they happen to turn out to be decent stores of value and a good hedge against inflation. You’re better off buying and wearing your watch for the enjoyment of it and to tell the time.
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Old 17 January 2019, 06:03 AM   #67
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not that I disagree with the OP, but as simply as the math the OP has stated, it's just as simple to understand why the question is raised.

Rolex has a long history of appreciation and value retention, that coupled with recent spikes of market value, the question raised is sure to increasingly arise.

Additionally I think the term word/term "investment" is often misrepresented. If you consider a luxury boat to be a "bad investment", along the same line how would you describe a rather ordinary SS Rolex like a 16710 or 116710? I for one certainly do not see it as the same liability as purchasing a boat for fun.

I've been around the watch game long enough to know that not only are watches bad (traditional) investments, but asking about a watch as an investment also does not go well. HOWEVER, I'm not a wealthy guy ( I do ok). But I don't have ridiculous amounts of excess money to play with and buy toys. I need to be a little bit calculated about what I buy.

this is just a hobby for me and I'm never in it for potential appreciation. The most important factor for me when buying a watch is to love it. But right up there is knowing what the market is like on the model I'm choosing. Of course I don't have a crystal ball, but you don't need one to avoid historically high risk/loss watches.

Hypothetical Example. When I buy a watch. My wife might ask, how much is the watch you're looking at? Answer: $10k Pre-owned. How much would you get after you wear it for a while? Answer: $9k. At a thousand dollar loss I can afford to play. But in reality most of the watches I've purchased have gone up in value (at least market value). So when the question and answer is buy for $10k and sell for at least $10k, it's a no brainer that for a hobbyist you're making a safe "investment".

Anyway, I get the frustration from members of why we don't want to keep seeing these threads, but to a certain extent there's almost a snobby elitist attitude that goes along with shaming someone for asking, and replying it's just a watch, choose the one you like the most. It's kind of another way of saying if you can't afford to take a loss you can't afford to play the game. I just disagree with that attitude. I think if you buy smart, you can have a lot of fun with this hobby, rarely lose money and sometimes watch your beloved watches appreciate even while using and enjoying them daily
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Old 17 January 2019, 06:04 AM   #68
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Yeah, it's a poor reason for buying a luxury wristwatch. Buy it because you want to wear it and enjoy it. I just got a CHNR and plan on owning it for the next 30 years (God willing). If I sell it one day after all those years and it's worth a little more than I paid, than good for me. If not, who cares. By then a new Rolex TT's cost will probably boggle the mind anyway.

I invest a lot of money annually into the market so what do I care about how well a wristwatch will appreciate?

I think there's a type of Rolex buyer that absolutely has to have an SS model (because they can't go TT or PM) and these same folks need "investment" potential to sooth their mind or to talk their spouse into getting something they really can't afford.

I'm not saying folks who prefer SS can't afford pricier watches - I'm just saying there are "stretch buyers" who really can't just plunk down $10,000 plus and being happy with their purchase.
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Old 17 January 2019, 06:11 AM   #69
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i look at it this way, If i ever need to sell a rolex it will always have some value. I buy it becuase i like it not to invest in. Taking my time with a blusey Wish i could find a way to smurf some more money to get the smurf 116619LB
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Old 17 January 2019, 06:20 AM   #70
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I think the investment angle is the thing that we watch men justify to ourselves (and our significant others) why we should buy Rolex. Much like the proclamation that says Rolex watches are indestructible, when they are actually not.

By saying investment, we are implying financial liquidity, which makes us feel safe and comfortable about spending > $10k on a watch.

This belief, once taken up by more and more people, turns into a self-fulfilling prophecy: more people are buying Rolexes, demand starts to exceed supply, people start to pay premium for them, etc.
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Old 17 January 2019, 06:57 AM   #71
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Sure there are always watches that go up in value faster than others just like stock. But you better have a real good hand on values if you invest in watches. The LV has done good the Daytona 6263 is another one with big gains but how many have stayed the same or declined? I would be very cautious .. But hey good luck and happy hunting ..
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Old 17 January 2019, 07:25 AM   #72
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I honestly suspect that there’s a misunderstanding sometimes with investment questions between those asking and those answering.

I imagine many “Rolex as investment” inquirers are perfectly well aware that Rolex is not going to get you a return on your money in the same way as stocks or property might.

However, a watch that costs x, gives 10 years of pleasure as a daily wearer and can be sold for say x+10% is a great overall investment if not a sound financial one.
Agree with this completely
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Old 17 January 2019, 07:34 AM   #73
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This is true if you dont know what your investing in or you really dont understand the market of your investment choice.

If you truly know what your doing investing in a single market can pay you shitloads. I've personally done this in housing and made a motsa.
And lots of people all in in housing got hosed in 2007.

IMHO a fair statement would be a Rolex holds its value very well in comparison to other consumer goods people blow money on. I wear my dad's DJ that he bought in 1985, it is by no means a collectible but still worth three times what he paid for it. Not adjusted for inflation but still.....

Even if you wear it for 10 years and sell it for what you paid for it, what's wrong with that?
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Old 17 January 2019, 07:39 AM   #74
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I think what people are really asking is am I going to lose most of the money I paid for this watch or will it hold its value and maybe then some. So many people, including me, have bought a watch we loved only to at some point realize its time to move on and sell it. Then we find out there is no real market for the watch and it is really worth only pennies on the dollar. So its more about smart buying on luxury items which are not cheap rather than comparing returns on real property or stocks which most watches will never achieve.
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Old 17 January 2019, 07:42 AM   #75
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Compare to buying a Breiting/omega/tag. Pay ££££ today for a new one, tomorrow used it’s worth ££.
Rolex pay ££££ today, tomorrow used is still ££££.
This is what folks are on about.
Well said!
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Old 17 January 2019, 07:46 AM   #76
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I think people here define investment differently. No, it’s not the same as putting the money into stocks.

I think what people mean is in relation to luxury goods.....it’s a good investment in that you can wear it for a few years and get most, if not all, of what you paid back....unlike a luxury item such as a car or another watch brand besides AP and Patek.

It doesn’t mean it’s going to appreciate in value.
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Old 17 January 2019, 07:52 AM   #77
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I think people here define investment differently. No, it’s not the same as putting the money into stocks.

I think what people mean is in relation to luxury goods.....it’s a good investment in that you can wear it for a few years and get most, if not all, of what you paid back....unlike a luxury item such as a car or another watch brand besides AP and Patek.

It doesn’t mean it’s going to appreciate in value.
How about saying it's a decent store of value, kind of like gold? Gold has never been worth zero, and I don't think a Rolex will either.
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:18 AM   #78
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I'll tell you what's a bad idea...posting a thread about Rolex as an investment.
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:20 AM   #79
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Anyway, I get the frustration from members of why we don't want to keep seeing these threads, but to a certain extent there's almost a snobby elitist attitude that goes along with shaming someone for asking, and replying it's just a watch, choose the one you like the most. It's kind of another way of saying if you can't afford to take a loss you can't afford to play the game. I just disagree with that attitude. I think if you buy smart, you can have a lot of fun with this hobby, rarely lose money and sometimes watch your beloved watches appreciate even while using and enjoying them daily
Well said! I think it's probably the annoyance with so many "flippers looking for a quick gain" instead of people who love and wear these watches asking investment questions that frustrates the OP. I can see the OP's point but I believe you put it beautifully sir.

Btw, I don't buy smart because I prefer PM pieces. :)
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:28 AM   #80
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It is not an investment, but a deposit in a checking account.
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:34 AM   #81
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By saying investment, we are implying financial liquidity, .....
This is not necessarily true. There are many types of illiquid investments, or investments with low liquidity (unlike public equities, which are highly liquid). In fact, one of the drawbacks of investing in collectibles as an asset class (including watches and other jewelry, as well as other hard assets lik art, stamps, comic books, baseball cards, etc) is their low liquidity and high transaction costs. Fortunately, though, there has proven to be a pretty liquid market for pre-owned Rolex watches, especially with the proliferation of online selling/trading options like TRF. Transaction costs can still be relatively high for the average Joe, who may be subject to a fairly wide bid-ask spread when trading his watches. One strength of collectibles as an investment class is they provide reasonable protection from inflation.
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:37 AM   #82
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It is not an investment, but a deposit in a checking account.
But a savings account IS a type of investment, albeit low risk/low return. I’d liken Rolex ownership to this type of investment in many cases, with preservation of principal and periodic interest earned in the form of the enjoyment and utility one gets from wearing their watch.
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:39 AM   #83
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I just want my watches to depreciate less than my car. If my watch collection is worth more than $2k in 10yrs, mission accomplished. Anything better than that is a bonus.


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Old 17 January 2019, 08:43 AM   #84
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But a savings account IS a type of investment, albeit low risk/low return. I’d liken Rolex ownership to this type of investment in many cases, with preservation of principal and periodic interest earned in the form of the enjoyment and utility one gets from wearing their watch.
That's why I am speaking about a checking account.. And let's keep in our mind, that many people do not have experience on selling precious items, thus they do not have the patience or the means to negotiate. They just rush to get rid of them. How many in that forum have tried to sell their car by themselves? Not as many as we may think.. They go to trade in...
A Rolex is not an investment. In my mind it is a purchase of a good watch, for those that they can afford it.
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:47 AM   #85
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You only triple your money if you sell it! And if you sell it you no longer have the watch to enjoy.


Yes. That is a true statement Sir..
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Old 17 January 2019, 08:48 AM   #86
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That's why I am speaking about a checking account.. And let's keep in our mind, that many people do not have experience on selling precious items, thus they do not have the patience or the means to negotiate.


Maybe true for the average Rolex owner, but you might be surprised about the TRF Rolex owners.

But I do think bank accounts are not investments either - they are hedges against loss of cash through theft, fire or windstorm


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Old 17 January 2019, 01:06 PM   #87
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You can't take your $$$ with you when you die -- or to a nursing home for that matter as they will drain your saving before accepting you. So, if you like it and can afford it then buy it. Consider it a life investment.
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Old 17 January 2019, 01:41 PM   #88
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where’s my dividends
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Old 17 January 2019, 01:59 PM   #89
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Why do people continue asking this? All it takes is some simple math to realize it’s not a good investment and is in fact meant to be worn as a watch. This same argument gets made in other markets as well and it blows my mind.

8k over a 30 year period at a modest return of 7% with traditional investments will net you more of a return (roughly 55-60k) than your average Rolex unless you get lucky with a unicorn piece.

Stop worrying about this stuff and buy the thing.
Ever heard of the Nikkei. Look at 1990 until now. People believe markets have to go up forever. It isnt true. So presuming rolex will go up can easily be a decent bet for a small sum. It can outpace a market. Now will it probably not. Are watches investments? Well they can be. It is all speculative. In 50 years people may think automatic watches are little more than junk.

I didn't buy a rolex because I thought it would dump in value. Holding its value or increasing was part of the equation. A very small part.
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Old 17 January 2019, 04:05 PM   #90
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Lets say my watch goes up 5k. Ok, so what. I can barely run my household for a month on that. The watch is going to need to go up 100k or more and that aint happening so who cares really.
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