UK Waiting Lists?

[drrd]

Interesting reading this thread.

Yep, UK is just tough and has been for a while.

I'd say the 'relationship' thing is overstated, and maybe gets misinterpreted by many.

Yes ADs like to know you're local and a bit of chit chat can also help reassure them about your intentions WRT the watch you're interested in. This is all for their benefit not yours; they're protective of their AD status and wary of selling to flippsers (even the ones who don't know they are flippers yet...).

Most ADs don't care about your special occasions and milestones. Like with everything else in the modern world if it cannot be measured and audited then it didn't happen. SAs need to move stock and 'charitable' sales of SS pieces are just giving away profit when it comes to the end of year figures.

The high prevalence of chains like WOS and Goldsmiths really changes the 'relationship' situation. Those SAs that people spend time trying to smooth-talk have less control of allocation than many would like to think. They will add you to the lists but all the stock is centralised and is allocated to the stores by a team that the punters have zero contact with. I doubt that the people who know what algorithms WOS Group use are prepared to divulge such information here but I would say it's more about £££ than shooting the breeze or that special occasion blah blah blah. This also explains why these WOSG SAs cannot give any indication of waiting time. Head office leverage control on the branches to maximise profit and the SAs do as they're told.

There is more sense in getting to know an independent AD. At the very least they can size you up and hopefully reassure themselves you won't undermine their business. You can also not be an @rse. Basically think of your situation with an AD that you're unknown to as entirely negative and by engaging with them you are trying to get them to cross all the negatives off their list to the point where they're prepared to deal with you. Obviously spending big speeds up this process. Independent also means the sales strategy is in-house so they'll usually give you a straight answer on waiting times or closed lists.

As some have said you can get lucky and just catch them on a day when they've had a few phone knock-backs so nothing to lose if you're walking by (pre-covid of course).

[od91]

Originally Posted by drrd

Interesting reading this thread.

Yep, UK is just tough and has been for a while.

I'd say the 'relationship' thing is overstated, and maybe gets misinterpreted by many.

Yes ADs like to know you're local and a bit of chit chat can also help reassure them about your intentions WRT the watch you're interested in. This is all for their benefit not yours; they're protective of their AD status and wary of selling to flippsers (even the ones who don't know they are flippers yet...).

Most ADs don't care about your special occasions and milestones. Like with everything else in the modern world if it cannot be measured and audited then it didn't happen. SAs need to move stock and 'charitable' sales of SS pieces are just giving away profit when it comes to the end of year figures.

The high prevalence of chains like WOS and Goldsmiths really changes the 'relationship' situation. Those SAs that people spend time trying to smooth-talk have less control of allocation than many would like to think. They will add you to the lists but all the stock is centralised and is allocated to the stores by a team that the punters have zero contact with. I doubt that the people who know what algorithms WOS Group use are prepared to divulge such information here but I would say it's more about £££ than shooting the breeze or that special occasion blah blah blah. This also explains why these WOSG SAs cannot give any indication of waiting time. Head office leverage control on the branches to maximise profit and the SAs do as they're told.

There is more sense in getting to know an independent AD. At the very least they can size you up and hopefully reassure themselves you won't undermine their business. You can also not be an @rse. Basically think of your situation with an AD that you're unknown to as entirely negative and by engaging with them you are trying to get them to cross all the negatives off their list to the point where they're prepared to deal with you. Obviously spending big speeds up this process. Independent also means the sales strategy is in-house so they'll usually give you a straight answer on waiting times or closed lists.

As some have said you can get lucky and just catch them on a day when they've had a few phone knock-backs so nothing to lose if you're walking by (pre-covid of course).

The guy who I spoke with at Mappin & Webb said they have no idea what is coming in and when it is coming in, they literally find out when they open the box, so there is no way of them giving any indication of timescales or availability - like you say, it is all done from their HQ.

[od91]

Originally Posted by JSolution

It's hard work in the UK. i'm on lists but i don't hold my breath. if its only 2000 or so above retail i just buy it elswhere. by the time rolex do a price increase then you will pay that anyway.

This is almost my view after all of my research. Do you have a specific place you trust where you buy from?

[Paulr1980]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

This is another facet of it, and depends on the dynamic of the relationship. As a rule of thumb, in a well developed relationship (not necessarily a friendship, although we may feel more comfortable thinking of it in these terms), they will know without you needing to specifically reminding them. And they will also know that speaking to them without reminding them, is you reminding them.

And just like that I get the call!

My 114060 is due in the next shipment and will be here within the next two weeks.



You couldn’t make it up!

[Kirsty87]

I don't even bother with AD's any more. I'm not playing silly games, or waiting indefinitely for a watch.

[Harry-57]

Originally Posted by Paulr1980

And just like that I get the call!

My 114060 is due in the next shipment and will be here within the next two weeks.



You couldn’t make it up!

LOL! See? It's good to talk.

Congratulations.

[drrd]

Originally Posted by Paulr1980

And just like that I get the call!

My 114060 is due in the next shipment and will be here within the next two weeks.



You couldn’t make it up!

Excellent! Congratulations.

[od91]

Originally Posted by Paulr1980

And just like that I get the call!

My 114060 is due in the next shipment and will be here within the next two weeks.



You couldn’t make it up!

Congrats! Not jealous at all

[JSolution]

Originally Posted by od91

This is almost my view after all of my research. Do you have a specific place you trust where you buy from?

Yes i buy everything from the same person. He's a personal friend of mine now. They have a bricks and mortar store, website etc. I usually ask what i want and he sources it for me, although he always has loads in stock. I live near London, i'd be happy to put you in touch if you send me a private message.

[JSolution]

Originally Posted by drrd

Interesting reading this thread.

Yep, UK is just tough and has been for a while.

I'd say the 'relationship' thing is overstated, and maybe gets misinterpreted by many.

Yes ADs like to know you're local and a bit of chit chat can also help reassure them about your intentions WRT the watch you're interested in. This is all for their benefit not yours; they're protective of their AD status and wary of selling to flippsers (even the ones who don't know they are flippers yet...).

Most ADs don't care about your special occasions and milestones. Like with everything else in the modern world if it cannot be measured and audited then it didn't happen. SAs need to move stock and 'charitable' sales of SS pieces are just giving away profit when it comes to the end of year figures.

The high prevalence of chains like WOS and Goldsmiths really changes the 'relationship' situation. Those SAs that people spend time trying to smooth-talk have less control of allocation than many would like to think. They will add you to the lists but all the stock is centralised and is allocated to the stores by a team that the punters have zero contact with. I doubt that the people who know what algorithms WOS Group use are prepared to divulge such information here but I would say it's more about £££ than shooting the breeze or that special occasion blah blah blah. This also explains why these WOSG SAs cannot give any indication of waiting time. Head office leverage control on the branches to maximise profit and the SAs do as they're told.

There is more sense in getting to know an independent AD. At the very least they can size you up and hopefully reassure themselves you won't undermine their business. You can also not be an @rse. Basically think of your situation with an AD that you're unknown to as entirely negative and by engaging with them you are trying to get them to cross all the negatives off their list to the point where they're prepared to deal with you. Obviously spending big speeds up this process. Independent also means the sales strategy is in-house so they'll usually give you a straight answer on waiting times or closed lists.

As some have said you can get lucky and just catch them on a day when they've had a few phone knock-backs so nothing to lose if you're walking by (pre-covid of course).

OP - this is as perfect and accurate an answer anyone could give you to your question. Nail on the head for the UK market.

[Shan77]

Excellent thread, a lot of good advice and honest opinion.

[Danny Fireblade]

I am trying to build a relationship with an AD at the moment. I am first on the list for my desired watch and have been told I will get the next one they receive in, however I am still attempting to build the relationship by phoning once a month and generally reminding him I am serious and eager.
Hopefully this pays off.
And when I do get the call and collect, I will be putting my name down for a Hulk, or a watch I dont mind waiting a few years for.

[Rolex fan 61]

Originally Posted by padi56

Well in the real world Rolex are no longer watches bought to be enjoyed as today by many they are just seen as little more than $$$$$£££££.Now on the grey market there are hundreds of them for sale all models at crazy prices where a lot end up.Hopefully this will end soon and then perhaps we could get back to normal and see watches for sale at ADs good luck in your search for your Rolex sub.

Very well said...........

[km23]

WOS (155 Regent St) has two tone SkyD (white dial) available on display and for sale. this was as of 6:30GMT yesterday

[AlanH]

I walked into my AD for the first time in late January to talk about an Explorer, my first Rolex. Left with a copy of the hardback Rolex "catalogue" and my name on the waitlist. I picked up my Explorer last week, around 7 months later. Not sure if I was lucky, or I said all the right things, but I can't complain.

[Paulr1980]

Just to wrap my side of the story up. Collection day today. Was like a kid at Christmas last night and hardly slept.

People have really well summarised it in this thread. Should be a sticky really.

Be kind. Be polite. Be specific. Be patient. Build a rapport and talk about why it means something to you and be ready to buy if you get a call.

These are just my tips from purchasing from a small independent. The same efforts failed miserably with a bigger chain store with high footfall.

[od91]

Originally Posted by Paulr1980

Just to wrap my side of the story up. Collection day today. Was like a kid at Christmas last night and hardly slept.

People have really well summarised it in this thread. Should be a sticky really.

Be kind. Be polite. Be specific. Be patient. Build a rapport and talk about why it means something to you and be ready to buy if you get a call.

These are just my tips from purchasing from a small independent. The same efforts failed miserably with a bigger chain store with high footfall.

Congrats again!

I agree with all the points stated by everyone. I am like that as a person anyway, I like to have conversations with people especially with common interests! It’s just about finding a smaller AD and not the big chains, even though they get the largest quantities of watches!

[Paulr1980]

What might also be useful is a recommendation to the store by a current, ongoing and good quality customer of theirs. The tough bit is re-assuring this contact that you won’t make them look stupid and flip or not follow through if they do phone.

[upandgo99]

Originally Posted by Harry-57

Look at watches, jewellery, accessories, sometimes buy something. Occasionally buy an Omega, Breitling, Tag etc with a huge discount, drink beverages, eat nibbles, chat about what's been happening professionally and personally (if appropriate), who's leaving, who's joining, who's been promoted, ask if they've got anything tasty in the safe that I can look at and possibly buy (was offered a BLNR last month), ask how far I've moved up whatever waiting list(s) I'm on, use the loo, be invited to pop back in whenever I'm passing.

Also applies to my HiFi dealer (2 minutes up the road) and car dealer (just round the corner). It's relationship building. It only works if the seller is the type of person/business who will accommodate it. It results in significant sums of money moving in their direction in the medium to long term and me recommending scores of people to them.

I've walked onto many premises selling many things and have never returned again because of the attitude of the staff. A comparatively small number of businesses have mutually clicked and been accommodating, and they have had a lot of my business..

If my wife and I are chewing the fat and it gets busy, we leave. If someone we are just casually chatting to is approached or the phone rings, we step away. If we walk in and it's busy, we walk out - unless we are visiting for something specific. I won't stand in the way of a potential sale or hold up a queue at a till. It's just judgement and common sense really.

And of course, none of the above applies in the post lock down appointments culture now in force. Although I've had a number of causal phone conversations with my usual contacts and spoken to my local AD's Rolex buyer twice to see how far I have moved up their long SS BLRO list, and to get a bit of September 1st gossip and speculation.

I'm not overly outward going although I have a long track record in sales, marketing, training and management, none of it in retail. When I lived in SE England and worked in London it was a fairly random scatter thing - most shop sellers would be brief and to the point, some would would be more friendly and engaging but this was the minority. I have lived in South West England for nearly 30 years now. It's different, even in the high end shops. Some people will always be snooty (they never have West Country accents) but for the most part you'd better have the time to stop and talk to people. It's expected.

Maybe I’m going into the wrong AD’s. Central London probably isn’t the best.
I can do similar I’m a car showroom but that because there are products to see. Perhaps I’m too late to the watch game. Didn’t want one when every person around me wore had a sub or GMT and they were about £3k. Fast forward 10 years and now I never see them and wouldn’t mind getting one.

[od91]

Hi everyone,
Thought I would update my thread with my findings!

I went to Mappin & Webb in Manchester (part of Watches of Switzerland group for anyone outside of UK) they were reluctant to add me to any “lists” as I did not have a specific buying history with the group, they weren’t particularly helpful or friendly but added me to the list after telling me I have almost 0% of ever getting one. I called up when the 41mm was announced to check that I was still on the list for the newer model to be told I needed to visit the store again - even though I’d given them all my details and met them in person already, I knew I didn’t need to go back in as they had proof of who I was. I then went into a more local store part of the same group who were much friendlier and more honest. They do look for a very specific history and they do not sell Subs to anyone unless they have this “history” (yet they’re flooded in the grey market lol) - the expected wait time is approx 5 years in the UK.

I have “re-added” my name on the list for the new 41mm model and I have been added to the list for a YM40 blue dial ( ref 126622) which I am told I can buy with my history.

I am honestly shocked by the way these ADs act.

[sutats]

One can only laugh at the situation. https://youtu.be/63eZ4xvsPA8?t=22

[gold&black]

Originally Posted by od91

Hi everyone,
Thought I would update my thread with my findings!

I went to Mappin & Webb in Manchester (part of Watches of Switzerland group for anyone outside of UK) they were reluctant to add me to any “lists” as I did not have a specific buying history with the group, they weren’t particularly helpful or friendly but added me to the list after telling me I have almost 0% of ever getting one. I called up when the 41mm was announced to check that I was still on the list for the newer model to be told I needed to visit the store again - even though I’d given them all my details and met them in person already, I knew I didn’t need to go back in as they had proof of who I was. I then went into a more local store part of the same group who were much friendlier and more honest. They do look for a very specific history and they do not sell Subs to anyone unless they have this “history” (yet they’re flooded in the grey market lol) - the expected wait time is approx 5 years in the UK.

I have “re-added” my name on the list for the new 41mm model and I have been added to the list for a YM40 blue dial ( ref 126622) which I am told I can buy with my history.

I am honestly shocked by the way these ADs act.

The model in the UK has changed. There are no waiting lists anymore.

It's much harder now just to walk in and buy any model other than what's already in the display cabinet.

It's all about your exisiting spend and history with the AD. They are also now looking at what 'other' brands you are buying to help get the Rolex watch of your choice. It is much harder now than it has ever been and I have already spent over £30k+ with mine.

[fgress3969]

Originally Posted by gold&black

The model in the UK has changed. There are no waiting lists anymore.

It's much harder now just to walk in and buy any model other than what's already in the display cabinet.

It's all about your exisiting spend and history with the AD. They are also now looking at what 'other' brands you are buying to help get the Rolex watch of your choice. It is much harder now than it has ever been and I have already spent over £30k+ with mine.

same thing at Montreal (Canada)

[od91]

Originally Posted by sutats

One can only laugh at the situation. https://youtu.be/63eZ4xvsPA8?t=22

This made me laugh!

[od91]

Originally Posted by gold&black

The model in the UK has changed. There are no waiting lists anymore.

It's much harder now just to walk in and buy any model other than what's already in the display cabinet.

It's all about your exisiting spend and history with the AD. They are also now looking at what 'other' brands you are buying to help get the Rolex watch of your choice. It is much harder now than it has ever been and I have already spent over £30k+ with mine.

Yep I understand the demand far outweighs the supply but my point was how the dealers treat their customers! Just because someone doesn’t have a specific buying history or X spend doesn’t mean they shouldn’t get the opportunity to purchase what they want. I have heard that ADs tell customers to buy specific Rolex’s eg DJs and they’ll be able to supply them the actual watch they want, it’s bribery. Then I go back to the flooded grey market of brand new unworn Rolex sports watches which have a 5 year wait................it’s an absolute joke.

[gold&black]

Originally Posted by od91

Yep I understand the demand far outweighs the supply but my point was how the dealers treat their customers! Just because someone doesn’t have a specific buying history or X spend doesn’t mean they shouldn’t get the opportunity to purchase what they want. I have heard that ADs tell customers to buy specific Rolex’s eg DJs and they’ll be able to supply them the actual watch they want, it’s bribery. Then I go back to the flooded grey market of brand new unworn Rolex sports watches which have a 5 year wait................it’s an absolute joke.

Even buying a DJ doesn't guarantee you anything these days! lol

[od91]

Originally Posted by gold&black

Even buying a DJ doesn't guarantee you anything these days! lol

Ha, I know. This person was told by AD they had a Sub in stock but they had to buy specific watches there and then and they could buy the Sub. It is shocking what the ADs do nowadays.

[kepler22]

The way I understand it now is that you get added to an interested list, which could have 100’s of names on and when a watch comes in it’s down to a senior person in the company to decide if you are worthy of the allocation based on your spend at the store. As Rolexes are so popular there are few models now that a SA can sell to you without authorisation


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[od91]

Originally Posted by kepler22

The way I understand it now is that you get added to an interested list, which could have 100’s of names on and when a watch comes in it’s down to a senior person in the company to decide if you are worthy of the allocation based on your spend at the store. As Rolexes are so popular there are few models now that a SA can sell to you without authorisation


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep this makes sense. Which means that you may never ever get a watch!

[Nairn1980]

Originally Posted by od91

Hi everyone,
Thought I would update my thread with my findings!

I went to Mappin & Webb in Manchester (part of Watches of Switzerland group for anyone outside of UK) they were reluctant to add me to any “lists” as I did not have a specific buying history with the group, they weren’t particularly helpful or friendly but added me to the list after telling me I have almost 0% of ever getting one. I called up when the 41mm was announced to check that I was still on the list for the newer model to be told I needed to visit the store again - even though I’d given them all my details and met them in person already, I knew I didn’t need to go back in as they had proof of who I was. I then went into a more local store part of the same group who were much friendlier and more honest. They do look for a very specific history and they do not sell Subs to anyone unless they have this “history” (yet they’re flooded in the grey market lol) - the expected wait time is approx 5 years in the UK.

I have “re-added” my name on the list for the new 41mm model and I have been added to the list for a YM40 blue dial ( ref 126622) which I am told I can buy with my history.

I am honestly shocked by the way these ADs act.

The grey market would be more suitable for someone with little history.

ADs have hundreds of people waving cash per 1 steel sports model delivered. It’s like having 1 sweetie and 100 kids....how do you choose who to give the sweetie to? It makes sense for ADs to allocate based on history.

Sounds harsh but true