History of changes to the 1675 GMT date wheel?

[ArcticMoose]

Any chance anyone has a documented history of the changes to the date wheel of the 1675 GMT Master?

I've found information about the switch from silver to white, but nothing conclusive about the font. Were there silver date wheels with closed sixes and nines? If so, which year did this transition happen? What about the flat threes? Was this change introduced independently?

Are there any differences other than color and font? I am specifically interested in what the correct date wheel for a 5.3 serial (1977, I assume) should look like.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!

[ArcticMoose]

Still interested, anyone?

[lupus]

silver is always open 6 and 1977 is white closed, imho that is...

[Submarino]

Originally Posted by ArcticMoose

Any chance anyone has a documented history of the changes to the date wheel of the 1675 GMT Master?

I've found information about the switch from silver to white, but nothing conclusive about the font. Were there silver date wheels with closed sixes and nines? If so, which year did this transition happen? What about the flat threes? Was this change introduced independently?

Are there any differences other than color and font? I am specifically interested in what the correct date wheel for a 5.3 serial (1977, I assume) should look like.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated!

I believe that the transition to white calendar wheels took place at the time the 16750 quick-set was launched around 1980. For a 5.3 million 1675 you should have a silver calendar wheel with open 6s and 9s and with flat top threes.

Some of the silver calendar wheels have the number 26 with the 6 closed and in others it appears to be open. As far as I know, both wheels are correct and authentic as long as that is the only variation.

[Keeperoftime]

My 16750 has white date wheel. Open 6. it is a 7.1 mill I think. Some early 16750s have silver date wheels.

[Submarino]

Originally Posted by Keeperoftime

My 16750 has white date wheel. Open 6. it is a 7.1 mill I think. Some early 16750s have silver date wheels.

Thanks for adding up great info.

[Phil Howard]

My 16750 came with a silver date wheel and black matte dial. Serial 8..

[ArcticMoose]

Great info guys, thanks!

I found this image in this post, but it doesn't say if the wheels are placed in any particular order. I assume not, since the flat three wheels appear to be placed out randomly. Also, I can't see which ones are white and which ones are not.



From what I have gathered so far it seems there are unpainted metal silver wheels as well as wheels that have been painted silver, is this true or is one or the other an "aftermarket" or modified part?

[Puffy]

mine is a 7.2m and has a white date wheel with open 6s and 9s

round 3

[Fredrik]

I am also curious about this, specifically the silver date wheels with closed 6:es that may or may not be painted silver.

Anyone knows anything about silver date wheels with closed 6:es? Service replacement?

[Puffy]

Originally Posted by Fredrik

I am also curious about this, specifically the silver date wheels with closed 6:es that may or may not be painted silver.

Anyone knows anything about silver date wheels with closed 6:es? Service replacement?

silver were used up till the early 80s

seen in early 16750s

[swish77]

Not to confuse matters even further, but there are definitely two different kinds of silver date wheels: one that is a brushed metallic wheel, and the other that is painted silver but not brushed. Not sure what years the two styles were used, though. The first two photos here are painted silver wheels with different fonts; the third photo is the brushed steel kind, which was also used on 1680s and perhaps Sea Dwellers.

[polarinda]

Originally Posted by swish77

Not to confuse matters even further, but there are definitely two different kinds of silver date wheels: one that is a brushed metallic wheel, and the other that is painted silver but not brushed. Not sure what years the two styles were used, though. The first two photos here are painted silver wheels with different fonts; the third photo is the brushed steel kind, which was also used on 1680s and perhaps Sea Dwellers.

my 16750 6.1mil has a datewheel like the first photo.

[Submarino]

Originally Posted by swish77

Not to confuse matters even further, but there are definitely two different kinds of silver date wheels: one that is a brushed metallic wheel, and the other that is painted silver but not brushed. Not sure what years the two styles were used, though. The first two photos here are painted silver wheels with different fonts; the third photo is the brushed steel kind, which was also used on 1680s and perhaps Sea Dwellers.

Let's revive this thread with some information I was able to gather lately. While being on the search for a good example of a 1675 I have stumbled upon many put together watches but also upon original owner watches and here's what I've seen thus far during my search. Remember, that with vintage Rolex there is a lot of hypothetical thinking and factual data is really hard to provide. To the best of my ability and knowledge here's what I think has happened.

After handling four very good examples of 1675s —three of them one-owner-watches, all of them with cases from the early 70s and all fitted with tritium service replacement dials— I've seen that all three of them had silver painted calendar wheels with open 6s and 9s and flat top 3s instead of the brushed silver calendar wheels and only one of this watcheshad a white calendar wheel with open 6s.

While the owners couldn't recall the date of service or when the dials were exactly replaced, it is fair to assume that the first three watches had dial and calendar wheels replaced at the same time perhaps during the mid to late 80s and the one with white calendar wheel, had its dial and calendar wheel replaced perhaps in the 90s once Rolex ran out of silver painted calendar wheels. Or perhaps that wheel could be an aftermarket wheel.

As many of you know, different sources have confirmed the authenticity of silver painted calendar wheels with open 6s and 9s but I think that now, is also fair to assume that the silver painted wheels could be service replacements.

Does anybody else have observations that could confirm my hypothesis?

[ArcticMoose]

Interesting observations, thanks!

[springer]

The silver paint date wheels are not service replacements.

[CrownMe]

Originally Posted by swish77

Not to confuse matters even further, but there are definitely two different kinds of silver date wheels: one that is a brushed metallic wheel, and the other that is painted silver but not brushed. Not sure what years the two styles were used, though. The first two photos here are painted silver wheels with different fonts; the third photo is the brushed steel kind, which was also used on 1680s and perhaps Sea Dwellers.

yup the 3rd picture down is exactly whats on my Red 1680. I like that one because its light enough to see the date clearly but still shines brighter then the white date wheels because its brushed.

[Beef]

Thanks, guys! Great information. I have often wondered about the difference in vintage date wheels. This clears up a lot!

[iclick]

My GMT (2.32m, 1969) date wheel has a white background with round 3's and closed 6's and 9's. If it has been changed out during service in the 43 years I've owned it (purchased new) I was neither told about it nor charged for it. That said, I can say that it might've been changed but if I were to bet I'd unhesitatingly favor the notion that it is the original. In the group photo above I would say the fonts on my dial looks closest to the one on the far left, second row. Due to the lighting I can't tell if that one has a silver or white background.

Here's the watch and a partial shot of the date wheel taken during the last service (late 2013).

[Submarino]

Originally Posted by springer

The silver paint date wheels are not service replacements.

Could you elaborate further why you say that they could not be replacements?


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[springer]

Let me clarify my previous comment. While the silver paint date wheels might have been used as service parts, they were also found on some models when new. Here are a few photos of date wheels removed during a service and a shot of an early 1970s Submariner with the painted date wheel. The brushed steel finish date wheels were used during the late 1970s in GMTs Subs and possibly other models. The 1960s though most of the 1970s, the GMTs will have white date wheels.

Date wheels are a serviceable part.

[RC2]

John interesting. I thought silver was in 60-70s models and white very late 70-80. I never thought white date wheels were in 60-70 models. Figured they were replacement for the silver ones.

Thanks again for your expert insight. I love the silver date wheel!! Here is my 78/79 1680 with awesome silver date wheel




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[springer]

Originally Posted by RC2

John interesting. I thought silver was in 60-70s models and white very late 70-80. I never thought white date wheels were in 60-70 models. Figured they were replacement for the silver ones.

Thanks again for your expert insight. I love the silver date wheel!! Here is my 78/79 1680 with awesome silver date wheel




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The 1960s until late to mid 1970s were white, at least based on my experience. Check the dial archives on TRF which is usually a good source for these watches.

[Submarino]

John, thanks for elaborating further. In my experience and based on most information I've found here on TRF and other vintage Rolex sources is that silver calendar wheels are correct for 60s, 70s and even on some 80s models. I've only seen the white calendar wheels on later models from 80s and up.

I think that what you explain regarding the brushed silver wheels vs. the silver painted wheels makes sense. As usual thanks for chiming in.

[springer]

Originally Posted by Submarino

John, thanks for elaborating further. In my experience and based on most information I've found here on TRF and other vintage Rolex sources is that silver calendar wheels are correct for 60s, 70s and even on some 80s models. I've only seen the white calendar wheels on later models from 80s and up.

I think that what you explain regarding the brushed silver wheels vs. the silver painted wheels makes sense. As usual thanks for chiming in.

Well, I would disagree and consider the source of your information. I never meant to infer in my last post that they all were white or all were silver during a certain period. I am no expert on date wheels and haven't found anyone that is. I guess all my GMTs had the incorrect date wheels, and all those on VRF archives are incorrect too. One thing I have learned from all this date wheel discussion is - there is a lot of incorrect information being put out there on date wheel - from colors, fonts, and the never ending "open vs closed" debates. Frankly, it is all rather inconsequential. I always feel fortunate that all mine operate properly.

Below in the first photo is a typical white date wheel from circa 1967 from a GMT. The "7" is very distinct on these date wheels. The second photo with "22" in the window is circa 1965. The third photo is circa 1970.

[Submarino]

Originally Posted by springer

Well, I would disagree and consider the source of your information. I never meant to infer in my last post that they all were white or all were silver during a certain period. I am no expert on date wheels and haven't found anyone that is. I guess all my GMTs had the incorrect date wheels, and all those on VRF archives are incorrect too. One thing I have learned from all this date wheel discussion is - there is a lot of incorrect information being put out there on date wheel - from colors, fonts, and the never ending "open vs closed" debates. Frankly, it is all rather inconsequential. I always feel fortunate that all mine operate properly.



Below in the first photo is a typical white date wheel from circa 1967 from a GMT. The "7" is very distinct on these date wheels. The second photo with "22" in the window is circa 1965. The third photo is circa 1970.

Actually a lot of the information I have regarding date wheels and other vintage Rolex topics comes from our mutual friend Manuel Chamosa whom as you know, worked for the Rolex Service Center in Dallas for 14 years. 👍👍


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[Arnold C]

Just come across to read this post... very interesting.

Here is one I found from a 1675 (I.63)... lucky 7? any idea??
http://i177.photobucket.com/albums/w...ear1963-02.jpg

[JohnRobie]

This is the same date wheel as my ‘67 1.7 mil.

[athom]

Does anyone has already seen a silver brushed with round 3?

[mabur]

Originally Posted by Submarino

Let's revive this thread with some information I was able to gather lately. While being on the search for a good example of a 1675 I have stumbled upon many put together watches but also upon original owner watches and here's what I've seen thus far during my search. Remember, that with vintage Rolex there is a lot of hypothetical thinking and factual data is really hard to provide. To the best of my ability and knowledge here's what I think has happened.

After handling four very good examples of 1675s —three of them one-owner-watches, all of them with cases from the early 70s and all fitted with tritium service replacement dials— I've seen that all three of them had silver painted calendar wheels with open 6s and 9s and flat top 3s instead of the brushed silver calendar wheels and only one of this watcheshad a white calendar wheel with open 6s.

While the owners couldn't recall the date of service or when the dials were exactly replaced, it is fair to assume that the first three watches had dial and calendar wheels replaced at the same time perhaps during the mid to late 80s and the one with white calendar wheel, had its dial and calendar wheel replaced perhaps in the 90s once Rolex ran out of silver painted calendar wheels. Or perhaps that wheel could be an aftermarket wheel.

As many of you know, different sources have confirmed the authenticity of silver painted calendar wheels with open 6s and 9s but I think that now, is also fair to assume that the silver painted wheels could be service replacements.

Does anybody else have observations that could confirm my hypothesis?

Dial might be replaced because it stopped shining in the dark but it doesn’t mean the date wheel was changed :)