potential 5513 purchase ....opinions needed !

[Hollywoodvillain]

here is a couple pics of a 5513 i may be getting my hands on . it is a 3.2 mill serial no. (1971) i basically would like to know if this appears to be original dial , insert, i believe the hands to be service hands so its possible the bezel and dial as well . that is why i am calling in the experts here . i can post a couple more pics if needed but these are about the best pics i have !

these are pics of the same watch . the lighting in the black background pic makes the patina on the watch much less noticeable the other pic with the white background is a different lighting and taken with a cell phone and shows more accurately the patina

[datejust24]

if the serial dates it to '71 it could be either a ft first dial or MF I believe...looks to be a nice example...others with much more knowledge will chime in

[wallasey runner]

Difficult to tell from the photos, but does the colour of those hands match the dial, they look a little brighter and could be service replacements. The bezal insert is definately a thin font service replacement - compare it to an original fat font insert that i bought this week for my DRSD.

[wallasey runner]

If you hunt for an original fat font insert, chances are the pearl (or dot or pip if you prefer) will almost certainly be missing. Finding original tritium pearls is extremely difficult, but worthwhile and better than non-original luminus pearls.

Try the link below, i have ordered one to go in the insert pictured below and the price is reasonable. I have seen people asking over £200.00 for a single pearl - get in quick !!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Ro...item1a011ffcb5

If the 5513 was late 70s the insert on it would have probably been okay, but in 1971 it would have definately been sold with a fat font insert (probably mark 3).

[Hollywoodvillain]

Ok I'm almost certain the hands are service hands and almost certain the insert is a service insert as well ! If the dial is legit original matte maxi dial and the case is in nice shape what is a great price and what is a not so great price ? I would be working a trade plus cash deal and just don't want to get clobbered on value ! I don't mind the sevice insert with patina'd pearl and the hands look close in color in one pic and off a bunch in the other pic so I'm up in the air there ! I would obviously prefer they match but not matching is quite common as well so I'm ok with it as long as they are only a shade or two off and not stark white and glowing !

[oldLeatherNeck]

Originally Posted by wallasey runner

If you hunt for an original fat font insert, chances are the pearl (or dot or pip if you prefer) will almost certainly be missing. Finding original tritium pearls is extremely difficult, but worthwhile and better than non-original luminus pearls.

Try the link below, i have ordered one to go in the insert pictured below and the price is reasonable. I have seen people asking over £200.00 for a single pearl - get in quick !!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Ro...item1a011ffcb5

If the 5513 was late 70s the insert on it would have probably been okay, but in 1971 it would have definately been sold with a fat font insert (probably mark 3).

This guy in AUS is known to sell fake Chinese pearl shell and injected them with household paint.

Look at the so called "tritium" it's full. Genuine tritium has sunken after all these years. This guy has them for sale everyday ...

Get yourself $3.00 supply of these shells from China/HongKong and fill them up yourself.

[wallasey runner]

Difficult to tell, but i saw some pearls on crono-shop.net that were also full and they were over 225 euros each and are all sold out. In an ideal world you would want to buy one from a Rolex dealer who knows where it has come from.

The pearl is so small anyway and even if put together as you suggest, they wouldn't be luminous - which is the effect that you are after on a vintage watch. The insert is the key thing here and e-bay is flooded with ones made yesterday, but at least they are very cheap and bear no resembelance to the mark 1 to 3 fat font inserts. A lot are clearly scratched or distressed to look old and faded, but they always seem to be the thinner font type rather than trying to fake the more desirable inserts.

My insert, pictured below is good, i sent a picture to one of the UK foremost authorities And he said it was a good catch. But even that causes issues, i think it is a mark 1 fat font, which pre-dates the DRSD by some years - most had a mark 3. Therefore, you could argue that i shouldn't use it - but i am going to.

[linesiders]

Originally Posted by oldLeatherNeck

This guy in AUS is known to sell fake Chinese pearl shell and injected them with household paint.

Look at the so called "tritium" it's full. Genuine tritium has sunken after all these years. This guy has them for sale everyday ...

Get yourself $3.00 supply of these shells from China/HongKong and fill them up yourself.

That is disappointing to hear. I have gotten one before - he assured me it was legit though I suspected even money it was not. For the price it was worth taking a shot. BTW - from some sleuthing here and elsewhere, I believe he was once a member here (last post 2013) and does post commonly on some other current watch forums more recently.

Originally Posted by wallasey runner

Difficult to tell, but i saw some pearls on crono-shop.net that were also full and they were over 225 euros each and are all sold out. In an ideal world you would want to buy one from a Rolex dealer who knows where it has come from.

The pearl is so small anyway and even if put together as you suggest, they wouldn't be luminous - which is the effect that you are after on a vintage watch. The insert is the key thing here and e-bay is flooded with ones made yesterday, but at least they are very cheap and bear no resembelance to the mark 1 to 3 fat font inserts. A lot are clearly scratched or distressed to look old and faded, but they always seem to be the thinner font type rather than trying to fake the more desirable inserts.

My insert, pictured below is good, i sent a picture to one of the UK foremost authorities And he said it was a good catch. But even that causes issues, i think it is a mark 1 fat font, which pre-dates the DRSD by some years - most had a mark 3. Therefore, you could argue that i shouldn't use it - but i am going to.

That insert is a fatter MK3 (40 almost but not quite kissing) though I believe - as do some others - the MK1 and MK3 inserts are really the same and the variances are a result of tool condition when originally made and how they faded / bloomed over time. But I am not a foremost authority, UK or otherwise ;)

And it would look spectacular in your watch

[wallasey runner]

Originally Posted by linesiders

That is disappointing to hear. I have gotten one before - he assured me it was legit though I suspected even money it was not. For the price it was worth taking a shot. BTW - from some sleuthing here and elsewhere, I believe he was once a member here (last post 2013) and does post commonly on some other current watch forums more recently.



That insert is a fatter MK3 (40 almost but not quite kissing) though I believe - as do some others - the MK1 and MK3 inserts are really the same and the variances are a result of tool condition when originally made and how they faded / bloomed over time. But I am not a foremost authority, UK or otherwise ;)

And it would look spectacular in your watch

Many thanks for that. A mark 3 would have been the correct insert for a 1974 DRSD - so I am happy with the outcome. Below is a photo of the watch with the insert just sitting on top of the existing service replacement - i am having it fitted this week - don't fancy taking a kitchen knife to a DRSD myself.

[roll9]

I purchased a pearl from that same ebay source and the Rolex service center on post st. in SF said it was the real deal.

[descartes]

Shouldn't the dial be a "serif dial" in that serial number range?

Perhaps one of the experts will opine.

[wallasey runner]

Originally Posted by descartes

Shouldn't the dial be a "serif dial" in that serial number range?

Perhaps one of the experts will opine.

It is if you zoom in on the feet of the 20 and 40. The mark 2 is easier to identify with the longer 5 in the 50, but as previously stated not a lot of difference between a 1 and a 3 unless you had one of each together and compared thinkness of font.

[descartes]

I am referring to the dial of the 5513 posted by the OP.

[wallasey runner]

Originally Posted by descartes

I am referring to the dial of the 5513 posted by the OP.

Apologies !!!!

[Wing Zero]

The Insert and Hands are service and would bother me personally. So getting the original Fat Font Insert and Hands could run you over 1k, so keep that in mind.

From the tiny little picture you posted... dial looks ok from the font ... but the I'd be more worried that the case was real (picture of the engravings between the lugs would help) and it has the proper 1520 cal installed.

There are many Frankens floating around so I would buy from a reputable seller who accepts returns.

[Xantiagib]

is 71 ok for a twin lock too?