Christopher Ward - The Twelve

[enjoythemusic]

Oooh, that's a good conspiracy theory. You could easily be right.

This new CW design gave me a thought. Has anyone designed a timepiece with easily interchangeable bezel types. Smooth, fluted, GMT-style, diving, Genta, etc? Bracelet, leather, and rubber straps too? Am guessing a very thin movement would be beneficial. With interchangeability you could easily copy, I mean hommage, many different watch brands.

[PBJ1925]

Looks good, I might have to order one of these.

[youthagainsttt]

This does look quite nice, tempted with the light blue dial.

Funnily enough I have 2 AP RO's but haven't been wearing them recently. I think practicality of owning/wearing those watches isn't so great sometimes

[INC]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Guys, on the plus side usually you have to go to AliExpress for 'homages' like this. Thankfully, with CW you get an original mashup of sorts with the added benefit of a nice SW300 movement.

To be honest, I think accepting this kind of intellectual property infringement could lead to losing interest in luxury watches.

For example, if someone will see such a watch on a waiter's hand, they will definitely not buy Czapek, because it will feel cheesy. The war against to the fake watches - now so-called "replicas" - has been lost. The war against watches that look almost identical but with different branding has been lost.

So in my opinion if the war against "homages" is lost, all the non-WIS will be wearing Apple watches even with their tuxedos. Because at least it will be original and it will look original. Of course, they will have the small version for a tuxedo, the larger for a suit, and the extreme for sports.

And, of course, always the newest types, possibly with a gold case version. In this way, they can constantly show off their trendyness, their money, and by the way, they will also realize how much more practical, comfortable, and reasonable to own these. And after they will realise this, no one will be able to convince them to wear a dumb watch again just because with that they can show up that it's expensive. In this case they will show them the homages' prices, and will tell them: "You were dumb to spend the money for such useless thing. Why don't you spent your money for something valuable, stocks, BTC or for an artwork?"

Are you sure we want this future?

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by INC

Are you sure we want this future?

Sure, produce a 'modular' watch that can relatively mimic a wide variety of timepieces. With the ability to 'customize' it, that's how you'll make it yours and never get bored... as it can be easily changed :)

We already have an abundance of 'homages' on AliExpress. Don't hear others really complaining much about these mashups, especially since they are not 1:1 fakes and of course that is not what I'm proposing.

Am sure CW will sell quite a few of their Twelve that looks like a Czapek minus the 12, also looks like a Zenith and other timepieces. At least they are using a good SW300 movement so there is some value there. Perhaps CW will be using AI next to develop their next watch? It'd be nice if their next product had the versatility of a truly modular watch. Depending on the bezels, bracelets, and strap options, it could be "10,000 watches in one".

[samson66]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Sure, produce a 'modular' watch that can relatively mimic a wide variety of timepieces. With the ability to 'customize' it, that's how you'll make it yours and never get bored... as it can be easily changed :)

We already have an abundance of 'homages' on AliExpress. Don't hear others really complaining much about these mashups, especially since they are not 1:1 fakes and of course that is not what I'm proposing.

Am sure CW will sell quite a few of their Twelve that looks like a Czapek minus the 12, also looks like a Zenith and other timepieces. At least they are using a good SW300 movement so there is some value there. Perhaps CW will be using AI next to develop their next watch? It'd be nice if their next product had the versatility of a truly modular watch. Depending on the bezels, bracelets, and strap options, it could be "10,000 watches in one".

I think they are only using the SW300 in the titanium models, which is unfortunate. The SS versions use the SW200 which CW seems to use in like a hundred different models. I really wish they'd use a different movement or go in-house. I'm so done with the same movement in every watch.

[INC]

If someone likes to wear homage, I have no problem with that, that's their business. I just find it unusual to hype this on TRF, but I'll get used to it. BTW, in this case I'm mostly surprised because I think the price is ridiculously high for a copy+paste watch that doesn't have any special knowledge or movement. You know, I think if someone wants to sell a homage, they should do it incredibly cheap, just like Tissot does with their PRX series :)

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Sure, produce a 'modular' watch that can relatively mimic a wide variety of timepieces. With the ability to 'customize' it, that's how you'll make it yours and never get bored... as it can be easily changed :)

Here is one solution from this manufacturer:

https://evolvens.com/product/evolvens-44-mm/

And they are even cheap. You can have your own watch or even you can design it for yourself.

[Bug04]

PRX deserves a special prize, it is an original Tissot creation back in 1978. It is a well aged concept. Long life to PRX and its excellent value for money!

CW Twelve in itself is a good looking watch, I believe price is not fully crazy (talking about today’s watch sector pricing) but its appeal is penalized by its evident similarities to something else.

Originally Posted by INC

If someone likes to wear homage, I have no problem with that, that's their business. I just find it unusual to hype this on TRF, but I'll get used to it. BTW, in this case I'm mostly surprised because I think the price is ridiculously high for a copy+paste watch that doesn't have any special knowledge or movement. You know, I think if someone wants to sell a homage, they should do it incredibly cheap, just like Tissot does with their PRX series :)



Here is one solution from this manufacturer:

https://evolvens.com/product/evolvens-44-mm/

And they are even cheap. You can have your own watch or even you can design it for yourself.

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by INC

Here is one solution from this manufacturer:

https://evolvens.com/product/evolvens-44-mm/

And they are even cheap. You can have your own watch or even you can design it for yourself.

Hard to tell, so you can buy multiple bezels, etc and easily interchangeable? Look more order custom and they build. I'm thinking more bezel type options, and 'case mods' to re-style.

[INC]

Originally Posted by Bug04

PRX deserves a special prize, it is an original Tissot creation back in 1978.

I don't think so

Oysterquartz 1977:

I believe price is not fully crazy

We are agree on this :)

[INC]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Hard to tell, so you can buy multiple bezels, etc and easily interchangeable? Look more order custom and they build. I'm thinking more bezel type options, and 'case mods' to re-style.

You are right, it was half a joke half a serious answer.

In a TLDR way I think, the idea to let you customise your own watch in just minutes is a great idea, but I'm not sure if there would be a real huge interst for this in the field of luxury watches?

For example, if they want to create a watch with a real water resistant casing, then they can't let the user modify the casing. This means, that they could let you change some external elements only, just like the bezel or ths strap/bracelet. However the latter was already invented. So the other user replacable part may be the the bezel or the insert of a bezel. But this will not make a watch more versatile in my opinion. But, despite this, I think I would be interested in to get an easy to repalce bezel type watch

[HogwldFLTR]

FWIW, I ordered the purple dial (Ti); looking forward to seeing it (and a lot earlier then the Bel Canto). Gerald Genta be dashed!!! I like the Czapek design; maybe someday I'll be moved to get an original Antarctique.

[HogwldFLTR]

Originally Posted by INC

I don't think so

Oysterquartz 1977:



We are agree on this :)

The timeline on Genta's AP goes to 1969 if what I've found online is correct. Rolex to 1976 for the OQ.

[HogwldFLTR]

Originally Posted by Bug04

Fair point.
Anyway, I am starting thinking that the CW is called Twelve because the key difference with the Antarctique 12 dial is exactly the 12!

Here I thought it was the dodecahedral shaped bezel and case back. There are Czopaks without the 12 at the top of the dial.

[INC]

Originally Posted by HogwldFLTR

The timeline on Genta's AP goes to 1969 if what I've found online is correct. Rolex to 1976 for the OQ.

Yes, at that time Genta designed several almost the same watches. And yes, as far as I know you are right, the RO was the first on the market.

[INC]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Sure, produce a 'modular' watch that can relatively mimic a wide variety of timepieces. With the ability to 'customize' it, that's how you'll make it yours and never get bored... as it can be easily changed :)

I know it will be offtopic a bit, but in some aspect for me a Casio Oceanus OCW-T5000-1AJF shown a possible way to do this. I almost forget to mention that, because it doesn't allows the change of extarnal parts of the watch, but the time display. On this model I can choose how I want to use the regular three hands and the subdials like a:

- 12 hrs display with Am/Pm indicator
- 24 hrs display
- World Time display
- GMT (with a perfect date adjustment +/-)
- Stopwatch

with a press of a button.



and this watch costs less then $1000 with a titanium case, a 100m water resistance and a Japan Premium Production Line Certificate.

[ypnadkar]

Originally Posted by PhilLynott

I ordered this one. I've not been a fan of titanium in the past and want to give another try and this is a great looking watch for the price and if I don't love it I'm sure my girlfriend

This dial is amazing.

[Werk782]

Czapek also have antarctique that don't have the 12 in the dial i guess... haha

Originally Posted by Bug04

Fair point.
Anyway, I am starting thinking that the CW is called Twelve because the key difference with the Antarctique 12 dial is exactly the 12!

[RolexSimon]

Mine arrived today: Pretty impressed thus far. Very comfortable.

[Bug04]

That I meant indeed, in my phrase play: “… the key difference with the Antarctique 12 dial is exactly the 12!… “
Instead, on the Antarctique double index dial, there are even less differences with the CW Twelve …

Originally Posted by Werk782

Czapek also have antarctique that don't have the 12 in the dial i guess... haha

[mayorleslieknope]

Genuine question for folks that have seen The Twelve in the metal: Do you like it entirely for its own merits as a well-made object, or mostly because it seems like a lot of value for a very reasonable price?

I ask because I had a chance to try it on at WindUp a couple of weeks back, and it didn't really do it for me. I totally see its value proposition, and I respect what CW is doing to get make good quality pieces accessible to enthusiasts from all walks of life. But I don't know if I truly felt it could punch above its own weight as an integrated bracelet watch in the ~$1K range. Having it on my wrist, it felt...accurately priced to me. Which is great, but maybe not the "wow what a steal" sentiment I've heard others share.

[PhilLynott]

Originally Posted by enjoythemusic

Cool! The Astral Blue dial looks great.

This one already says preorder for November. I think when I ordered it said late May but it's not in the My Account page still they said preorders don't show up there for awhile. Here's to it still being May and not November like my Bel Canto wait!

[RolexSimon]

I think the orders for the titanium have been pretty strong - hence the November delivery rather than May at first release. Same as Bel Canto - some of the unlimited ones already being built but 2024 for new orders.

[ap1]

Man, CW is a disrupter!

[uscmatt99]

Really a nice piece for the money. I am admittedly irked that it is an amalgamation of design cues from other popular pieces, but everything is derivative in the watch world. One thing I do like is that the dial pattern matches the CW branding so well, that's a nice touch.

[dchang81]

Originally Posted by samson66

I think they are only using the SW300 in the titanium models, which is unfortunate. The SS versions use the SW200 which CW seems to use in like a hundred different models. I really wish they'd use a different movement or go in-house. I'm so done with the same movement in every watch.

I'm prob in the minority but in the cheaper segment not sure I see the value in "in house" movements which just tend to be riffs on existing designs anyways. I'd rather have an easily serviceable movement that anyone could work on for cheap. it doesn't feel right to me when the cost of service is half the cost of a new watch.

[PBJ1925]

Originally Posted by dchang81

I'm prob in the minority but in the cheaper segment not sure I see the value in "in house" movements which just tend to be riffs on existing designs anyways. I'd rather have an easily serviceable movement that anyone could work on for cheap. it doesn't feel right to me when the cost of service is half the cost of a new watch.

Agree with this.

[enjoythemusic]

Obviously, a high-quality in-house movement would add to the price, and costs / complications in servicing. At this level of horology am fine with known-good movements. Plus servicing is easy, just put in a new movement and use the old one for decoration / fun.

[Yoda_Eating_Pizza]

Originally Posted by mayorleslieknope

Genuine question for folks that have seen The Twelve in the metal: Do you like it entirely for its own merits as a well-made object, or mostly because it seems like a lot of value for a very reasonable price?

I ask because I had a chance to try it on at WindUp a couple of weeks back, and it didn't really do it for me. I totally see its value proposition, and I respect what CW is doing to get make good quality pieces accessible to enthusiasts from all walks of life. But I don't know if I truly felt it could punch above its own weight as an integrated bracelet watch in the ~$1K range. Having it on my wrist, it felt...accurately priced to me. Which is great, but maybe not the "wow what a steal" sentiment I've heard others share.

The Twelve has really grown on me. I've seen much youtube content on it, but unfortunately none in person. That being said, I like watches for their own merits, regardless of who makes them or what other designs they may resemble.

The Twelve in titanium + fumé has piqued my interest, but sadly a watch of that dimension with an integrated bracelet will not fit my spindly wrist. And I'm not into rubber. So, no plans to get one anytime soon. If they come out with a 38mm, I'll revisit this watch.

[jjnd08]

Originally Posted by Yoda_Eating_Pizza

The Twelve has really grown on me. I've seen much youtube content on it, but unfortunately none in person. That being said, I like watches for their own merits, regardless of who makes them or what other designs they may resemble.

The Twelve in titanium + fumé has piqued my interest, but sadly a watch of that dimension with an integrated bracelet will not fit my spindly wrist. And I'm not into rubber. So, no plans to get one anytime soon. If they come out with a 38mm, I'll revisit this watch.

I think I heard they are coming out with a smaller version late summer. I have no idea what the size the smaller one will be.