Sensitive subject.. (divorce?)

[THC]

When couples are later in years and they argue every day, about everything, every day, when does one call time of death on a marriage?
Neither one of us are bad people, we both love each other’s kids. Fidelity is not an issue. She has grandkids that I adore, and she is great with my adult children. We both make a comfortable living and we got married 12 years ago, but have no kids together, biologically.

Counseling has been tried, please know, not looking for any wanderlust or mid life crisis, but just want a simple easy life with zero drama.

Cannot hurt to get advice from total strangers, right?

Thanks TRF family

[BisonHead]

Wow very honest and open. Its a shame when relationships get to that point. Top marks for trying counselling, maybe it is just time to call it a day.

I would rather be friends with somebody, then leave a relationship at the point of hating each other. The fallout with kids/grandkids, biological or not can be bad in divorces/separations.

Although continuing toxic relationships witnessed by the above are just as bad.

Can you change what yous argue about all the time? Is there something that can be changed to save your relationship?

Best of luck mate

[PJ S]

Are you fed up with the constant rowing over minuscule matters?
You’ve done counselling, so she’s aware of how you feel and knows there is a problem, but refuses to accept it needs resolving?
Has she checked with her MD if it’s just a hormonal thing that HRT could be prescribed or tweaked (if she can take or is already on it)?
Does she see the rows as a problem or simply a part of being older and less compromising?
Have you told her it’s getting to you and you’ve been thinking that maybe it's time to call it quits?
Would you prefer to be on your own, doing your own thing, or is the companionship something that’s keeping you from going solo?
Can you go somewhere for a short while (without raising any suspicion), and then see if things change upon returning or is exactly the same as it is now?

[Danny83]

After 3 years you just turn into roommates

[TheVTCGuy]

I am very sorry to hear this Tom, I hope it works out for the best, and if that is divorce then it is what it is. I am not one to offer advice, I have been divorced about 15 years and my marriage was a sham to begin with.

About the only thing I can offer is to send positive thoughts your way and hope.

[DJ TT 2002]

Life is too short to be unhappy everyday.
If you have honestly tried to get things back on track but have failed, it might be time to move on.
Could a trial separation be useful?
It could help better define the situation.

JMHO.

[77T]

Definitely an interesting topic as almost everyone will have an opinion or two. Brave move to open up on TRF.

If I may be allowed to proffer an opinion - I noted the absence of her feelings in your post. A dispassionate discussion would have included that point of view.

My first thought is that unconditional love may no longer be present - presuming it was in the beginning.

My conclusion (albeit based on incomplete input) is that you’re in more pain than you may realize - or are comfortable sharing.




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[Star Ferry]

Well it's easy for people online to say "break it off" but I know from experience that it's not an easy decision to make.

Personally I am divorced for about one year and I am infinitely happier now, even though staying with her would have made me much wealthier. Some questions I asked myself are: Does this person care how I feel? Do I look forward to seeing this person? Do I think they're generally a good person? My answer was probably "No" for all three. I have dated a lot since then and have been shocked by how many great women are out there -- that I'd been missing out on while being unhappily married -- but I'm pretty young so it was an easier transition to being single.

[antbkny]

What would happen if you made a decision to stop contributing to the arguments? If you can do that, maybe the arguments would subside.

[Daryl]

hoping for whatever is the best for both of you.

[yoniman]

Give it one more try.
Divorce could be both financially and emotionally draining
Consider moving out first.
Way out of her space. Get your your own "space".

Less talk less, less mistake, less hurtful things.
No talk, no mistake- but heck that's the point of a relationship, right?
Often, you just need someone to talk with.

But if it's toxic and hurtful, move on.

On a personal note, I am hoping that you'd miss each other after a long while of getting your own space.

Regards

[Flyinghunter]

I wish you both the very best possible outcome and happiness. I'd recommend writing down all the pros and cons of staying and then do the same for leaving. Give it some time to contemplate. Persistent inaction will insure that you both are miserable. Invest yourself into the solution...whichever direction that takes you both. Best wishes and good luck.

[yoniman]

Originally Posted by dj tt 2002

life is too short to be unhappy everyday.
If you have honestly tried to get things back on track but have failed, it might be time to move on.
Could a trial separation be useful?
It could help better define the situation.

Jmho.

+1

[M45]

If you're thinking about getting a divorce, get a divorce.

Spend the rest of your life with someone you want to be with.

[haven_seeker]

There is a lot of good information posted already. As mentioned, kudos for opening up in such a public manner.

As Paul brought up, this would be a great area for you to explore (either on your own or also in a follow-up post to the thread): How does she feel in all this?

Divorce is never easy. And since money will be lost either way, a trial separation, while it technically carries a "cost" so to speak, may help both parties rediscover what they like about each other and what they may otherwise be missing if ultimately the decision is made to divorce.

It's infinitely easier to go through a trial motion than to actually call it quits and attempt reconciliation.

One quote (I should add this to cop414's Sayings, Quotes, and Anecdotes!) that I learned years ago from my old breakup:

A broken relationship is like a broken mirror. Don't hurt yourself picking up the pieces trying to put it back together.

I'm not a counselor by any means but I sincerely empathize with you on this thread.

[swils8610]

I’m happily married so I’m not an expert. I feel life is short. Why be unhappy? Most people stay in a poor situation; work, relationships etc because they are afraid of change. Generally speaking, when a person removes themselves for the poor environment and a little time has passed they are much more happy. I don’t know anyone that has said man, I really screwed up and shouldn’t have got divorced or I wish I didn’t leave my lousy employer. It’s usually quite the opposite. I feel people who get a divorce feel as though they have failed and don’t want to let others know due to judgment. In the late 70’s my mother walked out on my dad and 4 kids. I was very young so I don’t recall much. No doubt my dad was devastated, he worked hard in a family business 50 to 60 hours a week and had 4 kids. The way she left him is totally disgusting. Worst of the worst. I’m assuming my dad thought life was over. He married my step mom who is my “mom” and it is the BEST thing that ever happened him. They’ve been married 40 years now. 40 great years. My dad flourished in life, business and as a person. I gained 2 step sisters and we became the Brady Bunch. My dad had custody thank god. We had an occasional your not my mom crap but it was all good. My real mother would have held him back. He wouldn’t be the man he is today. My real mother married the guy she ran away with. They have both died...I did have contact with her as kid, but hadn’t had any contact in the last 10 years. It was a bizarre situating. We got a call that she was dying in the hospital and I went. I went back to work after she passed.


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[kneedeep]

Very difficult situation, Tom, and wish the best outcome for you. I’ve always said that living together long-term with another human being is the hardest thing we humans attempt in this life. So it’s not easy and give yourselves credit for trying hard, going to counseling, etc. Seek happiness at any cost.

[JasoninDenver]

My divorce from my first wife was the second best decision I ever made.

My best decision was marrying my second wife.

Sometimes two great people can make an awful couple. If thats the case I think you both may be happier, and better friends, apart.

[dba]

I've had three cracks at marriage. So far the third time has worked quite well. We were friends and co workers for about 15 years before we took the plunge.

In my 63 years, I've found all partnerships require work. The total amount of work sometimes is not equal to each half. I'm not afraid of the work, and I don't mind the occasional inequity of the work.

My line in the sand is when it's too much work just to stay in the same house and fight.

Best of luck to you.

[DLRIDES]

Originally Posted by DJ TT 2002

Life is too short to be unhappy everyday.
If you have honestly tried to get things back on track but have failed, it might be time to move on.
Could a trial separation be useful?
It could help better define the situation.

JMHO.

This


Marriage is nothing more than an act of insecurity brought about by societal and religious teachings. Except for child rearing, it serves no logical purpose, only fulfills said teachings.

[Thatguy]

That is a bad position to be in. I’m on my second marriage and all is good. My first ended after dealing with what you described.
I agree with the life is short idea. If you feel like you have done everything you can then it may be time to separate.
How does she feel about divorce?


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[AzPaul]

Originally Posted by THC

When couples are later in years and they argue every day, about everything, every day . . . .

Not an encouraging first sentence.

[subtona]

the most significant thing I have identified is this,

Are you still communicating? If either of you has gotten to the point of disregard for the others feelings or opinions then in my experience this is the point of no return.

If you are not there then options are still available, one of which could be time away to reflect on what it is that is missing and what is important and hopefully how to prioritize those things together.

Never easy but time is known to heal.

[Old Geezer]

First, I hope whatever path your relationship takes, I wish you both end up in a happy space.
My 2 cents is to try to understand why you argue. The things that usually break up marriages like the infidelities are not an issue. Are the arguments really about something between the two of you or are they a response to other stresses and you each become each other’s outlet for venting anger ? If that’s the case and you still love each other, you can address those stresses and triggers and restore happiness. If the arguments are really about things between the two of you that for whatever reason have become worthy of arguing about, it might be time to start moving to amiably split or begin the divorce proceedings. Good luck sorting it out.

[Thatguy]

Originally Posted by DLRIDES

This


Marriage is nothing more than an act of insecurity brought about by societal and religious teachings. Except for child rearing, it serves no logical purpose, only fulfills said teachings.

It got me health insurance between jobs.


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[Hanze]

When my partner and I were thinking of breaking it off, we took a break from constantly being around each other giving each other some space to focus on ourselves. Fighting whether you like it or not is healthy for a relationship not all the time but sometimes, in my opinion if you guys love each other spend some time apart it will make you both realize how much you cherish one another. By time apart I do mean move out and have your own place. It has helped substantially for me and removed all the toxicity that was making us fight all the time.

[GB-man]

Can’t say I have an answer tom but wishing you all the best and happier days ahead

[colpol]

Originally Posted by DJ TT 2002

Life is too short to be unhappy everyday.
If you have honestly tried to get things back on track but have failed, it might be time to move on.
Could a trial separation be useful?
It could help better define the situation.

JMHO.

I’d agree with this

4-6 rent on a nice apartment but pencil in a few days each week for a meal/ drink/ something that is neutral group but can allow talking

Hope it works out either way

[timedate]

its always the lack of respect and consideration that kills marriages and relationships in my opinion, i find that you try to respect other peoples requests and sensitivities, but when its required back its all a joke to them, and you need 'to lighten up' or 'get over it'

you are very lucky indeed to be happily married, you are also very 'intelligent' in that aspect of life.

Some marriages only seem to be working because one person is too passive and easily dominated, but are these really marriages?

My parents marriage was lousy, their second marriages only worked because they chose partners to dominate.

i am starting to wonder if marriage and relationships are all one sided.

[Jojoshop]

Married for 20+ years. We went through ups and downs but divorce was never a question. You both care about each other which what matter the most. Not easy to find your soulmate. Counseling and give it your best or take sometime off by heading to vacation and change routine.
Best of luck