Thinking of buying a Service 1675 — a few questions:

[shedlock2000]

Here I am… again! I’m giving up, basically: I can’t seem to find the right modern watch (aesthetically), so I’m back considering a 1675. I love the vintage looks and proportions of the 16750/16750 (the 16710 loses them), but I’ve had bad luck with my last two with repeated stalling (despite RSC service on both). I gave up on the 1675 and tried to go with more modern watches (greater functionality, more resistance to life, but less aesthetic pleasure).

I’m all about functionality, so I’m actively seeking a service watch and I’ve the option to buy this:



There is an original box, no papers, a full and complete service from RSC (which changed most of the wheels, dial, handset, bracelet, bezel, and insert).



The dial is service, as is the handset and likely the date wheel. It’s a ‘72, but I though this year came with a silver date wheel (I had a ‘71 with a silver wheel once). Is white correct?



The bracelet is the correct one, but new from RSC. I’m not sure why they changed it. It also comes with the USA jubilee which was its original bracelet.



These photos aren’t the best, sorry, but the case doesn’t look overly polished to me. Can anyone advise on the lug shape and the crown guards? They seem quite rounded to me. Not that polishing is that much is an issue to me — I’m just wondering how much shape has been lost!




Do you think it’s a bit small on my wrist in the mirror shot? I’ve been wearing a 42mm Omega for a while so the 1675 looks small to me — though I have worn them for years. I’m beginning to wonder if I’m getting fatter!

By comparison, here are photo of a Polar Exp II from an AD last month:








The photo isn’t great due to compression, but all visible wheels are new and many of the screws have been replaced too.

The watch is not running at COSC specs, which surprises me. The seller (ex Rolex AD and Rolex Watchmaker) says that the older models are not fiddled with at RSC to get them to within COSC due to the effort that’s involved; is this the case?

It comes with 2 year warranty from RSC, and only came back last month. The watch isn’t far of COSC at -3 per day, but should RSC get them within COSC and could/should I send it back for regulation?



Given the amount of new wheels and other components in the movement, should the watch not be nearer to COSC rates, or is the deviance from wear elsewhere in the movement; if so, where?

Should I expect this movement to be more reliable/resistant to stalling due to jarring given its new wheels etc. than other 1570 movements of this vintage?



It’s six service marks in the caseback and the movement looks very good with new screws but marks on the rotor (all the wheels that can be seen without removing the movement are new).

Finally, the seller wants £9,225 for it; box, no papers, two bracelets, two year RSC warranty, on a service watch. Service watches are tricky to value, but is this a reasonable buy (given that I DO want a service watch and I really want one with a very reliable movement given my experiences with stalling).

Sorry for so many questions and thanks in advance!


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[Dan S]

I'm not sure why you really need our advice about the watch. It seems pretty cut and dried since you have paperwork for a recent service and it's under warranty. If you like it, and you're ok with the price, buy it. It seems to be exactly what you want. Yes, the case is polished (based on the indented lug holes), and yes the lugs and rotor are pretty beat up. But if those things didn't bother you before you posted, why should our opinions matter? You are the one buying the watch, and wearing it.

[Swiftneck]

-3 is within Cosc which is +6/-4. The -2/+2 is Rolex only. So I think it's fine.

I don't think its over polished.

It fit your wrist perfectly fine. And I think the price is fair..

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[dhknola]

What is the asking price on the service 1675's?

[swish77]

Wow, this is a lot. But addressing one of your questions ...

No, the 1675 is not too small (although that question alone presupposes that a bigger watch is somehow better, which it's not.) The 40mm size looks good on your wrist.

By comparison, the modern Explorer II looks clownishly big, IMHO. The proportions are off, especially the massive hands.

[Andjwhite]

It would be great if the case was not polished, but most of the service watches are. If you’re okay with the case I think the rest looks great, and I think the functionality added with a service dial and hands is actually pretty cool.


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[zapokee]

You don't really know what you want, which means you're not ready to buy. Spend a couple of years researching and learning.

[indianmachine]

Have you thought getting a 16710? You could probably get an all original package with working lume and a case profile closer to vintage for a reasonable price.

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by dhknola

What is the asking price on the service 1675's?

Buddy wants $9,225 for it with two bracelets. The price of service 1675s is very indeterminate, so I was hoping someone could let me know if it’s reasonable or not.


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[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by Andjwhite

It would be great if the case was not polished, but most of the service watches are. If you’re okay with the case I think the rest looks great, and I think the functionality added with a service dial and hands is actually pretty cool.


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I’ve had a closer look today and, judging from spring bar protrusion only, the top left lug is a bit more polished than the rest. That said, it doesn’t look terrible to me (though I’m no expert and not good with original lug dimensions/shapes):







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[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by zapokee

You don't really know what you want, which means you're not ready to buy. Spend a couple of years researching and learning.

Actually, it’s more like I’ve had many years of trying different things out to find the right thing and being disappointed for one reason or another.

If I pick this up, it’ll be my third 1675/16753. I’ve also tried a 116710, 16710, 2234.50, several subs, a sea dweller, several Omegas, two Bremont’s, and I’ve toyed with a 226750 (but I think it a bit big — and I can’t get one anyway). What I actually want, a 1675/16750 with the functionality and robustness of the calibre 3185 is not an option, so I have to try and date my preference sets with what is available.

I’ve tried most other comparable GMTs (a requisite), but they’ve not scratched the itch. I bailed on my previous 1675/16753 because they kept stalling on me. I’m uncertain if that is an innate problem with the 1570gmt or simply the watches I had.


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[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by indianmachine

Have you thought getting a 16710? You could probably get an all original package with working lume and a case profile closer to vintage for a reasonable price.

Yea, I’ve owned one, but I don’t like the bezel proportions nor sapphire crystal post 16700 (hence my focus on a 1675/16750). I do recognise the calibre improvements such as the full balance bridge and jumping hour hand, but the dimensions sort of let it down a bit.

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by Dan S

I'm not sure why you really need our advice about the watch. It seems pretty cut and dried since you have paperwork for a recent service and it's under warranty. If you like it, and you're ok with the price, buy it. It seems to be exactly what you want. Yes, the case is polished (based on the indented lug holes), and yes the lugs and rotor are pretty beat up. But if those things didn't bother you before you posted, why should our opinions matter? You are the one buying the watch, and wearing it.

Thanks, Dan. I’m mostly trying to determine if the price is suitable for the watch (given that its a service watch) and whether or not people can add any content to the post in terms of its condition compared to other service watches (oh, and whether or not people think it looks too small — as my wrist presence radar is off after wearing a 42mm for a bit).


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[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by swish77

Wow, this is a lot. But addressing one of your questions ...

No, the 1675 is not too small (although that question alone presupposes that a bigger watch is somehow better, which it's not.) The 40mm size looks good on your wrist.

By comparison, the modern Explorer II looks clownishly big, IMHO. The proportions are off, especially the massive hands.

Thanks! I was sort of leaning toward the EXP II being too large — even on my wrists (which are 7 3/4”).


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[springer]

There's almost enough material here to write a book!

Use your best judgement. That is all that really matters. It is your money.

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by springer

There's almost enough material here to write a book!

Use your best judgement. That is all that really matters. It is your money.

Thanks, Springer. I wa shooing you’d weigh-in. Is the price at least ball-park for the watch?


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[Dan S]

Originally Posted by shedlock2000

Thanks, Springer. I wa shooing you’d weigh-in. Is the price at least ball-park for the watch?

Which price, you've mentioned two: £9,225 (post #1) and $9,225 (post #9). Assuming it is referring to USD, based on other sales I've seen, the latter wouldn't be too bad given the RSC service/warranty and extra bracelet.

I will just say that I have found watches with 1570 (and other 15XX) movements to be extremely reliable, so I'm surprised to hear that you have had multiple bad experiences, unless you just happened to buy movements that were in very poor condition.

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by Dan S

Which price, you've mentioned two: £9,225 (post #1) and $9,225 (post #9). Assuming it is referring to USD, based on other sales I've seen, the latter wouldn't be too bad given the RSC service/warranty and extra bracelet.

I will just say that I have found watches with 1570 (and other 15XX) movements to be extremely reliable, so I'm surprised to hear that you have had multiple bad experiences, unless you just happened to buy movements that were in very poor condition.

Oh! Sorry! That is a typo (British keypad). The seller wants $9,225 USD.

My first, 16753, was sold to me by a dealer in Florida. I bought online and my review is here on TRF somewhere. The watch was not sold as stated, but I enjoyed it anyway. It remains the most stunning watch I’ve ever owned; the dial was almost purple in the daylight. However, the movement was tired despite ‘being serviced by their watchmaker — if it ever was.



The second watch, a 1675, I bought knowing that the movement wasn’t good and that it had a service case as well as a dial; I sent it directly to RSC for service, but the movement was very tired. It needed an hour wheel (amongst many other things); RSC serviced it, but it came back from them twice not terribly well serviced and without changing the hour wheel as specifically requested. That watch stalled every time it came back from RSC; I sold it in the end as I could never rely upon it.




I’m pleased to hear that your experience of the 15xx movements has been good. It is possible (perhaps even likely) that I’ve had two bad pieces — I admit that they were not in the best quality, which is why I had this movement inspected first and shared the content here (for thoughts). My watchmaker suggests that the older movements require a bit more experience to rebuild (due to the end float tolerances and the like) and that sometimes even RSC watchmakers don’t always get it right. I can only assume that’s what happened with my 1675. I should say that, before my 16753 stalled, it did 5 years of service. I sold it as a stalled watch (probably a very bad move, as it was a service dial and I got very little for it).


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[Dan S]

I'm surprised to hear that your cal 1570 was serviced by the RSC, TBH. Recently I have been hearing that they just refuse the 15XX movements and return the watch. My watchmaker told me that Rolex also recently stopped providing him with parts for those movements.

[77T]

Originally Posted by shedlock2000

I sent it directly to RSC for service, but the movement was very tired. It needed an hour wheel (amongst many other things); RSC serviced it, but it came back from them twice not terribly well serviced and without changing the hour wheel as specifically requested. That watch stalled every time it came back from RSC; I sold it in the end as I could never rely upon it.

Do you recall which RSC did the work for you?


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[dhknola]

Hard pass at 9.2k, hard hard hard; prices are trending down right now. Hold off.

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by 77T

Do you recall which RSC did the work for you?


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Funnily enough, I do! Mostly because I didn’t understand the codes on the card I received back with the watch and asked on here. The RSC centre was number 700 — which I think was in Toronto:




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[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by dhknola

Hard pass at 9.2k, hard hard hard; prices are trending down right now. Hold off.

Ok! That’s very good to know! Thanks! (That’s my corrected price in USD, right?)


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[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by Dan S

I'm surprised to hear that your cal 1570 was serviced by the RSC, TBH. Recently I have been hearing that they just refuse the 15XX movements and return the watch. My watchmaker told me that Rolex also recently stopped providing him with parts for those movements.

Oh! That’s news! This was a couple of years back now, but it did go in three times in total (all for the same stalling issue).

I believe that parts are hard to get, my watchmaker would do the work for me, but he’s no-longer an AD and I couldn’t find the hour wheel anywhere and so sent it to RSC in the end. I heard that Rolex made parts if they’d ran out of stock, but I didn’t know they were no-longer servicing early movements!

How does one get on serviced, then? The 1675 I’m looking at comes with a RSC card and is dated last month. I’ll have to check where did the service, though.


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[indianmachine]

Originally Posted by shedlock2000

Ok! That’s very good to know! Thanks! (That’s my corrected price in USD, right?)


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Really hard to say on price because collector interest in service pieces is not as high as original stuff. I would think it should be less than (maybe much less than?) 50% of the price of an good original 1675, which $9k is not, but I really can't say.

I'd say pay the price that you think is reasonable and are happy with, knowing that trying to sell the piece down the line may not be the easiest thing to do.

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by indianmachine

Really hard to say on price because collector interest in service pieces is not as high as original stuff. I would think it should be less than (maybe much less than?) 50% of the price of an good original 1675, which $9k is not, but I really can't say.

I'd say pay the price that you think is reasonable and are happy with, knowing that trying to sell the piece down the line may not be the easiest thing to do.

I know pricing these is very tricky, as you say most collectors want originality, where I am wanting the opposite. Thanks for your input; I was hoping he’d go down to $8, but he’s fairly firm.

I suppose it’s worth what it’s worth to the individual! Difficult to know what it’s worth to me, I lost massively on my 16753 (which went for $5k in 2016 and it took ages to sell; they’re now fetching $20k) so paying $9k some years later seems a bit sore. That said, things have gone up in the last 6 years!

Finding the right watch for the right price is always hard when you’re buying; selling for the right price is always hard when you’re selling! Lol


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[dennis999999]

I am the original owner of a 1971 1675 and it is still my daily wearer. The only time this watch stopped running was upon receipt back from service, it has never stopped while on my wrist. It has been routinely serviced the past 51 years by local watch makers or well known out of state craftsmen and has never been touched by any RSC. It currently and always has performed well within COSC specifications.

With a lot of vintage stock currently hitting the market at much more reasonable prices you should be able to find one in primo condition if you keep looking. Good luck

[shedlock2000]

Originally Posted by dennis999999

I am the original owner of a 1971 1675 and it is still my daily wearer. The only time this watch stopped running was upon receipt back from service, it has never stopped while on my wrist. It has been routinely serviced the past 51 years by local watch makers or well known out of state craftsmen and has never been touched by any RSC. It currently and always has performed well within COSC specifications.

With a lot of vintage stock currently hitting the market at much more reasonable prices you should be able to find one in primo condition if you keep looking. Good luck

I have often heard how good a watch they are, so I was surprised when I had tough luck with both mine. Do you baby it, or does it have a fairly hard life? This third time may be the charm, so they say!

I struggled for over a year to find the specific hour wheel for my last 1675 (it had an unusual height, and none were available anywhere). Additionally, my watchmaker can’t get parts now, so hopefully you’re right about parts-stock coming available (I’m assuming that’s what you mean about stick availability)?

Where is your watchmaker located?


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[Dan S]

Originally Posted by shedlock2000

Additionally, my watchmaker can’t get parts now, so hopefully you’re right about parts-stock coming available (I’m assuming that’s what you mean about stick availability)?

Nobody thinks that more vintage parts are going to become available. He was referring to vintage watches.

[dennis999999]

My wife and I have a small farm and I do wear it most of the time when working outside. I do not wear it when using a T-post driver nor when working with chicken fencing which can scratch the hell out of most anything. We have a pool and it goes swimming with the grandchildren all the time.
All my local craftsmen have retired or passed away so the past few years I have sent it to Luxury Watch Service in Miami Fl. run by Joe Roth. 2019 was the last time I sent it to him and he did a great job.

Bob and Philip Ridley are also very highly thought and have posted on this forum before.