5164R thoughts & Wait Times

[ap1]

Originally Posted by Murcielagoboy2

Entirely disagree with this comment...
It was "Old" archaic thinking which prevented PP going down the Quartz route for their premium offerings in the 80's.
It was their old thinking that gave rise to timeless classicism which means their watches command the very highest auction prices of all time.
Indeed it is their "old" thinking which is responsible for the dated 1970's design around which the Nautilus is based!!

I'm sorry but I believe your comment reveals as certain naivety as to how to safeguard long term Brand Equity.
For those getting the Nautilus/Aqua at list from their AD, these sports watches are on the periphery of the PP offering which is why AD's give them to such people.
If I think of myself, I could only bothered to take 5711 and 5980/1r after I'd purchased 7 other Pateks and needed a beater to scratch on the side of the holiday pool having got rid of my Rolexes....My AD knows I love the brand, he knows i don't flip, he knows I'll be buying PP's long after the gray market premiums and insta-fads have gone.
Indeed, Naut/Aqua is at the bottom rung of the PP brand association in my mind... as it is for so many PP collectors that sustain the business's revenues.


A lot of this depends who you talk to..... For the nouveau arrivistes, MMA fighters, Rihanna and Instagram set, yes PP is exactly as you describe - Naut and Aqua - (that's equivalent to associating Porsche with the Boxster btw).

But when the fad for showing off is over, when Instagram is as dated as Myspace, and the moment the premiums disappear, then I think a reversion to the underlying brand identity will take effect as long as Thierry Stern doesn't make the company a one-trick pony like AP.
And the way to do that is easy - don't expand Nautilus production.

You bang a 59801r on the pool? That is something I never thought I’d hear

[chiscott_29]

I agree this is the new normal and it isn't changing. The overall market will have its ups and downs for sure, just like the art market and other "markets". Most of the time this will be driven by the macroeconomic trends.

I just don't see anything that will drive away the trend towards sports and "do everything" watches that can dress up and dress down. I think a complete collection will always include a nice dress watch for sure, but they're going the way of the suit. They are for very rare and special occasions and they will never, ever be "on trend". As long as the supply remains restricted for these on trend do-everything models, this IS the watch market.

I am also going to pick on the "one trick pony" comment for AP. I do not view Royal Oaks and Offshores as the same. I feel those lines are different, but I only came to appreciate that after I added an Offshore to my collection.

And, I'll prepare for the arrows, but the CODE is going to be successful and will fill a current void. There isn't a snowball's chance in hell that AP is giving up on that line, and I firmly believe when we do get back to work there will be an interest in a watch that is a hybrid dress/sports model. I see the CODE able to fill that void and currently it is just a little bit ahead of it's time. As the models get better and better, it will become an established and popular AP model.

We'll see what happens!!

[Sinanamus]

Originally Posted by Murcielagoboy2

Entirely disagree with this comment...

It was "Old" archaic thinking which prevented PP going down the Quartz route for their premium offerings in the 80's.

It was their old thinking that gave rise to timeless classicism which means their watches command the very highest auction prices of all time.

Indeed it is their "old" thinking which is responsible for the dated 1970's design around which the Nautilus is based!!



I'm sorry but I believe your comment reveals as certain naivety as to how to safeguard long term Brand Equity.

For those getting the Nautilus/Aqua at list from their AD, these sports watches are on the periphery of the PP offering which is why AD's give them to such people.

If I think of myself, I could only bothered to take 5711 and 5980/1r after I'd purchased 7 other Pateks and needed a beater to scratch on the side of the holiday pool having got rid of my Rolexes....My AD knows I love the brand, he knows i don't flip, he knows I'll be buying PP's long after the gray market premiums and insta-fads have gone.

Indeed, Naut/Aqua is at the bottom rung of the PP brand association in my mind... as it is for so many PP collectors that sustain the business's revenues.





A lot of this depends who you talk to..... For the nouveau arrivistes, MMA fighters, Rihanna and Instagram set, yes PP is exactly as you describe - Naut and Aqua - (that's equivalent to associating Porsche with the Boxster btw).



But when the fad for showing off is over, when Instagram is as dated as Myspace, and the moment the premiums disappear, then I think a reversion to the underlying brand identity will take effect as long as Thierry Stern doesn't make the company a one-trick pony like AP.

And the way to do that is easy - don't expand Nautilus production.

Thanks for the thoughtful post. This interpretation of Patek makes sense to me.

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