Entry level Patek

[rollie_or_not]

Hi guys,

All you patek experts here, I’m looking to buy an entry level patek, I guess it’s the calatrava. Is this model similar to Rolex models that it’s quite hard to get? Or can you just walk into any store? If not, how long is the usual waiting time for this watch?

Cheers!

[Calatrava r]

My AD for a while had no men's Patek watches in stock. Have not checked lately. Many Patek ADs have websites showing their inventory such as Betteridge. If there is stock showing, just call and order one. I would not believe the wait is long if there is no stock, but who knows on that. It varies with the AD and the people they have in line.

[beshannon]

Welcome to the forum

[EUguy]

That would be a 6119R/G or a 5738R. Both absolutely gorgeous and refined time pieces in precious metal. Can’t go wrong with either of them and will remain classics and will not easily go out of fashion.

[Partekular]

Absurd to talk of an ‘entry level’ watch. That’s snobby sales nonsense. Entry into what? When are you finally ‘in’? A complication, grand complication, a minute repeater? How much does one have to spend to have ‘entered’? How many PP’s do you have to own?

Do not buy a PP just because it’s a PP. Buy one because you love it and can afford it. Don’t buy one thinking you have to upgrade a ‘level’ later. What would ‘upgrade’ a level mean exactly?

[rollie_or_not]

Originally Posted by Partekular

Absurd to talk of an ‘entry level’ watch. That’s snobby sales nonsense. Entry into what? When are you finally ‘in’? A complication, grand complication, a minute repeater? How much does one have to spend to have ‘entered’? How many PP’s do you have to own?

Do not buy a PP just because it’s a PP. Buy one because you love it and can afford it. Don’t buy one thinking you have to upgrade a ‘level’ later. What would ‘upgrade’ a level mean exactly?

Got you, makes sense actually.

How difficult is it to get any PP? Is it similar to Rolex these days that it’s quite impossible without “spend” history

[rollie_or_not]

And also by entry level, I mean cheapest, since the watches are extremely expensive

[Partekular]

Do not buy a watch just because it’s what you consider to be cheap.

If you do the maths you will soon see why they are hard to get.. 50-60,000 manufactured a year, 130 odd models, 450 odd dealers… Not all models are made in equal numbers…

A dealer who you have previously purchased from will be more friendly than if you just walk in. Small single outlet dealers can be snooty as they have no problem selling the handful they get in annually.

Do not get suckered into buying something you don’t want to get ‘on their list’. Lists are flexible and regulars may well move above you. They can also be used to keep you on the hook just in case they get one in and the intended customer changes their mind.

Unless you plan to buy another PP your ‘entry level’ watch will be the only one you own.

Remember, regular visits can be lucky as walk-ins at the right time - when the AD get their twice yearly stock in - can find you getting the one you want. It also reassures the AD you are serious.

Remember you are buying a Veblen Good so you have to be a little nuts or a watch fanatic or usually both - ask me how I know.

[FloridaBill]

Originally Posted by Partekular

Absurd to talk of an ‘entry level’ watch. That’s snobby sales nonsense. Entry into what? When are you finally ‘in’? A complication, grand complication, a minute repeater? How much does one have to spend to have ‘entered’? How many PP’s do you have to own?

Do not buy a PP just because it’s a PP. Buy one because you love it and can afford it. Don’t buy one thinking you have to upgrade a ‘level’ later. What would ‘upgrade’ a level mean exactly?

^^^ totally agree with this statement

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

And also by entry level, I mean cheapest, since the watches are extremely expensive

Entry Level or Cheapest does NOT mean the same thing as Easiest to purchase an the Aquanaut SS is much less expensive than a PM Calatrava, but MUCH harder to purchase.

That said, a ladies watch Calatrava or Twenty-4 series is the easiest to obtain and for men, it is generally a Calatrava then a Complications

Perhaps a Gondola

Forget the Aquanaut or Nautilus or Grand Complications

[gmuthu.tc]

Originally Posted by Calatrava r

My AD for a while had no men's Patek watches in stock. Have not checked lately. Many Patek ADs have websites showing their inventory such as Betteridge. If there is stock showing, just call and order one. I would not believe the wait is long if there is no stock, but who knows on that. It varies with the AD and the people they have in line.

Regarding Betteridge, I looked up their inventory after reading your post and having had visited them in person before. I saw 5205 so immediately called.

I spoke to their Vail store (no longer carries Patek) and their Aspen store. Per the 2 reps, their website is not reflective of their inventory but rather just examples.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[newonos]

i pop in my local ad once in awhile and his website is true to stock. 1 preowned 5196 and a gondolo at moment.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by beshannon

Welcome to the forum

X2

[mykii]

Calatrava's have become hard to get as of about 1.5-2yrs ago. There is no "entry level" - with a Calatrava, you're basically buying the finest pure dress watch that money can buy.

[Chute]

Cheapest and entry level would be a 5167 but they won’t sell you one.
The aquanaut is more like a third or fifth PP.
The newer Calatrava 6119 in R or G will likely be the easiest to obtain on the less expensive side.
I would spend lots of time looking through the catalog and see what you love.
You may be able to get an annual calendar or perpetual calendar easier than a time only or time and date.
But if you want to stay on the low end maybe look at the 5227 or 5205.
Those seem to be more available than other men watches.
I visited an AD recently and all they had for sale were three ladies models, one of which was the 7234R which could be a mens watch at 37.5mm but the sticker price is around $50k.

[rollie_or_not]

Originally Posted by Chute

Cheapest and entry level would be a 5167 but they won’t sell you one.
The aquanaut is more like a third or fifth PP.
The newer Calatrava 6119 in R or G will likely be the easiest to obtain on the less expensive side.
I would spend lots of time looking through the catalog and see what you love.
You may be able to get an annual calendar or perpetual calendar easier than a time only or time and date.
But if you want to stay on the low end maybe look at the 5227 or 5205.
Those seem to be more available than other men watches.
I visited an AD recently and all they had for sale were three ladies models, one of which was the 7234R which could be a mens watch at 37.5mm but the sticker price is around $50k.

Thanks for your details answer! Which one would be best for “investment” also :)?

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

Thanks for your details answer! Which one would be best for “investment” also :)?

When do you plan to sell?

[rollie_or_not]

Originally Posted by beshannon

When do you plan to sell?

I don’t plan to sell it, but I know that some models hold their retail value better then others

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

Thanks for your details answer! Which one would be best for “investment” also :)?

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

I don’t plan to sell it, but I know that some models hold their retail value better then others

It is impossible to answer if you do not know when you plan to sell your investment

[rollie_or_not]

Originally Posted by beshannon

It is impossible to answer if you do not know when you plan to sell your investment

Ok then let’s play with the thought that I wanted to sell it the same day? Which calatravas holds the best value if you look at the retail price compared to grey price

[beshannon]

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

Ok then let’s play with the thought that I wanted to sell it the same day? Which calatravas holds the best value if you look at the retail price compared to grey price

Sell it the same day? None.

And back to your original question, without any spend history with an AD you will never get your watch

[rollie_or_not]

Originally Posted by beshannon

Sell it the same day? None.

And back to your original question, without any spend history with an AD you will never get your watch

So there are no calatravas selling over retail price on Chrono24 etc?

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

Thanks for your details answer! Which one would be best for “investment” also :)?

Probably none that you could obtain in the short term. Watches are not investments in the financial sense just the emotional sense.

[Calatrava r]

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

So there are no calatravas selling over retail price on Chrono24 etc?

Maybe, but what you may not be seeing is the difference between used retail and used wholesale. Dealers who sell a watch for whatever paid much less for it to make their needed profit margin to pay overhead and staff, even though they may charge over retail. If you are not well known with numerous references, it is very hard to come close to obtaining the price an established dealer could obtain on the same watch.

[Rushne]

OP, you seem to be looking to make a profit out of this. Joining the forum this month and asking about which Daytona configurations could still be obtainable and which entry level Patek won't lose value.

If you are a genuine collector just wanting to get hold of these pieces, I really feel for you, as it's nearly impossible with out a connection in an AD that has known you for like a decade, a family member owns an AD or you have a massive wallet and can just help the AD off load unwanted stock.

If you are just in it to try and flip for profit, unfortunately the boat has sailed on that one a few years ago.

[Partekular]

Sadly you appear to be more interested in the ‘investment’ and price than the VALUE of the watch - that’s to say, how much you want to own it. The PP advertising slogan ought to give you a hint….. think about leaving it to your heirs!. There are some few models which have sparked off a craze and are in high demand which are therefore hard to get hold of. AD’s want to weed out flippers so they only sell those to customers they know. If they sniff out your seeming approach you would most likely be put on the ’wait’ (forever) list.

As I said above, PP’s are Veblen goods. PP don’t want to sell watches to dealers, their targets are owners and collectors. PP want to preserve a long term business not get on to a fashion or flipper roller coaster. Rarity and exclusivity is part of the appeal. It’s a tricky marketing problem for them.

[Benzsiam]

You can make good money if you can get Nautilus/Aquanaut at MSRP.

How will you be able to get? You need to find out by yourself.

[PT_91]

Originally Posted by Rushne

OP, you seem to be looking to make a profit out of this. Joining the forum this month and asking about which Daytona configurations could still be obtainable and which entry level Patek won't lose value.

This. It's also quite tiring to have people create the same threads over and over again instead of checking whether a topic has already been discussed.

[mykii]

Originally Posted by rollie_or_not

So there are no calatravas selling over retail price on Chrono24 etc?

Tiffany dials do, but they're unobtanium.

[kanwind]

Originally Posted by Benzsiam

You can make good money if you can get Nautilus/Aquanaut at MSRP.

How will you be able to get? You need to find out by yourself.

If it is that easy to get easy money, I will do it myself instead of tell others on forum for free

[Doc Olives]

If the OP is wanting to consider some of the more “undervalued” (i.e., haven’t had crazy price run ups), I would consider some of the vintage steel pieces (like a 3419) or neo-vintage (like some of the ellipse models). No bargains, but far less craziness. Also highly recommend spending some time on the collectability website if the OP wants some serious Patek knowledge. Cheers.