Yet another armed robbery targeting watches in Houston

[Tricolore66]

This is getting to be a weekly occurrence here and has happened to two people I know personally, one of which was beaten badly after thugs followed him home from one of the restaurants shown in the video clip. There is no question these criminals are staking out high-profile, trendy restaurants and targeting people with nice cars/watches. It has gotten to the point where I mostly wear my Apple watch when I'm not working and drive a pretty bland daily driver, mostly Uber to restaurants, and mostly drive my sports cars on Sunday mornings well outside of Houston. Are we seeing the social media culture that has surged demand come full-circle to the point where people want them (or their exaggerated market value) so badly that they'll kill to get it?

I'm curious if anyone else has changed their behavior after seeing these type events or just decided that the risk just isn't worth the reward of wearing some of these watches anymore.

https://www.click2houston.com/news/l...oaks-district/

[Wcdhtwn]

I didn't hear about this, but it is disturbing. As well reported by the news, the judicial system here has been releasing people arrested for theft and violence charges with little or no bond, and others with similar charges from incarceration. Increases in robberies and shootings like this are the suspected results. It certainly makes me not want to wear my watches out of my house.

For those not in Houston, River Oaks is Houston's Beverly Hills. There are several high end shopping centers, this maybe the highest and is where the Patek AD is (who were robbed a few years ago in a well publicized smash and grab), as well as Chopard, Cartier, LV, John Lobb, and others.

[Blansky]

I'd just add to the obvious about these robberies is that every day in the news is the fact that the income gap is widening between the haves and the have nots which creates an atmosphere of, I guess a word is hate. The rich keep getting richer and everyone else is not. An us-vs-them attitude gets ingrained.

Targeting so called rich people is probably a result of this.

We had a similar situation back a few years ago where people would damage Hummers and gas guzzlers and open displays of flaunting wealth.

[Tricolore66]

This is true, and the pandemic only seems to have widened the gap. The “haves” need to keep in mind that the “have-nots” have numbers on their side and everything in the world is worth nothing if you’re not safe.

Originally Posted by Blansky

I'd just add to the obvious about these robberies is that every day in the news is the fact that the income gap is widening between the haves and the have nots which creates an atmosphere of, I guess a word is hate. The rich keep getting richer and everyone else is not. An us-vs-them attitude gets ingrained.

Targeting so called rich people is probably a result of this.

We had a similar situation back a few years ago where people would damage Hummers and gas guzzlers and open displays of flaunting wealth.

[Wcdhtwn]

Originally Posted by Blansky

I'd just add to the obvious about these robberies is that every day in the news is the fact that the income gap is widening between the haves and the have nots which creates an atmosphere of, I guess a word is hate. The rich keep getting richer and everyone else is not. An us-vs-them attitude gets ingrained.

Targeting so called rich people is probably a result of this.

We had a similar situation back a few years ago where people would damage Hummers and gas guzzlers and open displays of flaunting wealth.

I'm not trying to get into a thing with you here, but income gaps, wealth disparity, rich getting richer and the envy and hate that people have, those who feel they are missing out, is not a justification or a good reason for armed robbery, attempted murder, for material possessions.

I'm not saying the disparities are not a problem, but crime to try to equalize things is not the solution. What is the defense? "that guy has stuff I want so I shot him to take it"? Come on, we're better than that. At least we used to be...

[GradyPhilpott]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

I'm not trying to get into a thing with you here, but income gaps, wealth disparity, rich getting richer and the envy and hate that people have, those who feel they are missing out, is not a justification or a good reason for armed robbery, attempted murder, for material possessions.

I'm not saying the disparities are not a problem, but crime to try to equalize things is not the solution. What is the defense? "that guy has stuff I want so I shot him to take it"? Come on, we're better than that. At least we used to be...

I agree with you 100%, but for too many people, it is reason enough.

Some don't need any reason at all, especially when the judicial system has a revolving door.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

I'm not trying to get into a thing with you here, but income gaps, wealth disparity, rich getting richer and the envy and hate that people have, those who feel they are missing out, is not a justification or a good reason for armed robbery, attempted murder, for material possessions.

I'm not saying the disparities are not a problem, but crime to try to equalize things is not the solution. What is the defense? "that guy has stuff I want so I shot him to take it"? Come on, we're better than that. At least we used to be...

Where did you get the idea that I was condoning it?

Merely an observation of the times.

When you have an us-vs-them environment there is in some people a tacit justification for acting out.

[betterwatchit]

Very unfortunate, but I suspect attacks like this will become more common all over the world. A combination of wealth disparity as discussed above, on top of a greater awareness of high price Rolex watches overall. More blingy designs and social media undoubtedly play a part.

[Etschell]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

I'm not trying to get into a thing with you here, but income gaps, wealth disparity, rich getting richer and the envy and hate that people have, those who feel they are missing out, is not a justification or a good reason for armed robbery, attempted murder, for material possessions.

I'm not saying the disparities are not a problem, but crime to try to equalize things is not the solution. What is the defense? "that guy has stuff I want so I shot him to take it"? Come on, we're better than that. At least we used to be...

there is no justification for you or i. there may be for the people committing the crime.

disagree strongly with we used to be better than that. this stuff has been happening since the beginning of man.

history repeats itself continually. humans dont improve and neither do their selective and biased memories.

[turkeysub93]

We are 96% chimpanzee...some maybe even more!

[pickettt]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

I'm not trying to get into a thing with you here, but income gaps, wealth disparity, rich getting richer and the envy and hate that people have, those who feel they are missing out, is not a justification or a good reason for armed robbery, attempted murder, for material possessions.

I'm not saying the disparities are not a problem, but crime to try to equalize things is not the solution. What is the defense? "that guy has stuff I want so I shot him to take it"? Come on, we're better than that. At least we used to be...

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

I agree with you 100%, but for too many people, it is reason enough.

Some don't need any reason at all, especially when the judicial system has a revolving door.

I don't think he was saying it's justified, just that it exists.

[Tricolore66]

I didn’t see anyone posting that income inequality is justification for violence and crime, but you’d be blind to not see that it’s a contributing factor. Desperate people and criminals aren’t playing by the same rules as the rest of us and will use their own value system to justify their behavior in their minds. As a political strategy, class warfare is clearly effective, but we’re seeing the human fallout.

[GradyPhilpott]

Originally Posted by pickettt

I don't think he was saying it's justified, just that it exists.

I know what he meant. That's why I said that I agreed with the post.



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[shredder]

Originally Posted by Blansky

I'd just add to the obvious about these robberies is that every day in the news is the fact that the income gap is widening between the haves and the have nots which creates an atmosphere of, I guess a word is hate. The rich keep getting richer and everyone else is not. An us-vs-them attitude gets ingrained.

.

That's ridiculous. Where is your evidence that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer?

Poor people in this country are among the wealthiest people in the world. Every poor person I know (excluding junkies) is walking around with a 1000 dollar phone, has a place to live, and is well fed. The USA pays people not to work in this country. Welfare pays good money. Free food. Free housing, free money, free healthcare, free phone, free cable tv.

Did you know our founding fathers used to have to share beds in hostels when they traveled when to various cities to perform their legislative duties? By those standards alone , poor people are hundreds of times wealthier than the governing elite were 200 years ago.

[joli160]

Not only in Houston, try to wear something nice in Amsterdam.

Rolex watches are easily sold everywhere, think that is the main reason for the surge in Rolex theft.
Thieves will be thieves, guess it’s more rewarding for those lowlife’s than finding a job.

[REQUIEMnJADED4U]

Originally Posted by turkeysub93

We are 96% chimpanzee...some maybe even more!

The chimpanzee community finds this comparison insulting.

[MrGoat]

Originally Posted by GradyPhilpott

I agree with you 100%, but for too many people, it is reason enough.

Some don't need any reason at all, especially when the judicial system has a revolving door.

Even worse these days many feel entitled to what we have simply because they want it. Almost to the point they feel justified.


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[GradyPhilpott]

Originally Posted by MrGoat

Even worse these days many feel entitled to what we have simply because they want it. Almost to the point they feel justified.


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Well, of course they feel justified. There's a word for that, but I'll leave it to your imagination and maybe a Google search.

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[Wcdhtwn]

Originally Posted by Blansky

Where did you get the idea that I was condoning it?

Merely an observation of the times.

When you have an us-vs-them environment there is in some people a tacit justification for acting out.

That's why I said I didn't want to get into a thing... I don't want to put words in your mouth. But when reasons are found, justifications are made, justifications lead to excuses, excuses lead to expectations, expectations lead to "it's OK to do". That isn't the world we want to live in, is it? Do you?

Originally Posted by betterwatchit

Very unfortunate, but I suspect attacks like this will become more common all over the world. A combination of wealth disparity as discussed above, on top of a greater awareness of high price Rolex watches overall. More blingy designs and social media undoubtedly play a part.

Here's a justification. And it's going to be more common and there's nothing we can do about it. It's not the criminal's fault, it's the fault of the rich guy with a blingy watch. Where is the "it not acceptable and I won't stand for it"? I guess nowhere... too bad.

Originally Posted by Etschell

there is no justification for you or i. there may be for the people committing the crime.

disagree strongly with we used to be better than that. this stuff has been happening since the beginning of man.

history repeats itself continually. humans dont improve and neither do their selective and biased memories.

More justification. Someone thinks it's OK. It's happened in the past so we should expect it to keep happening. Really?

Originally Posted by Tricolore66

I didn’t see anyone posting that income inequality is justification for violence and crime, but you’d be blind to not see that it’s a contributing factor. Desperate people and criminals aren’t playing by the same rules as the rest of us and will use their own value system to justify their behavior in their minds. As a political strategy, class warfare is clearly effective, but we’re seeing the human fallout.

Again, not the criminal's fault, they're just playing by different rules. Don't we all have to play by the rule of law? I guess not. By the way, if you watched the video none of these robbers are desperate. They could afford guns and a car, or had the capability to steal them. They are seen running away, in new looking clothes and shoes. And they are running fast, so they must have access to food and some level of physical fitness. None of that sounds like someone living in desperation and abject poverty.

Originally Posted by shredder

That's ridiculous. Where is your evidence that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer?

Poor people in this country are among the wealthiest people in the world. Every poor person I know (excluding junkies) is walking around with a 1000 dollar phone, has a place to live, and is well fed. The USA pays people not to work in this country. Welfare pays good money. Free food. Free housing, free money, free healthcare, free phone, free cable tv.

Did you know our founding fathers used to have to share beds in hostels when they traveled when to various cities to perform their legislative duties? By those standards alone , poor people are hundreds of times wealthier than the governing elite were 200 years ago.

You're new here, but you're post is right on target.

I'm not trying to start fights and make enemies, but there is a distinct mindset in the US, and maybe other countries, wanting to justify and explain these acts, and not punish them. In the Houston case, these are not people who are stealing a loaf of bread to feed their children, these are not desperate people, all of their basic necessities are provided, or they can afford them. We can't rationalize this violence and theft... it is not acceptable. And it's not about protecting my watches, it's about finding fault in criminal behavior and punishing it, not excusing it and letting people out with no bond or responsibility to reappear in front of a judge.

OK, enough of this. I like and value you all and your input on this forum. If I'm ranting thanks for going with the flow. Now, back to your weekend and hopefully drink of choice.

[golftime]

Income gaps and wealth disparity have always existed in this country. The difference today is that instead of aspiring to become wealthy through work and success, the lower socio-economic class totally resents the wealthy and has decided to take the wealth by what ever force is necessary. This if further fueled by the lack of respect for property or life.

[teck21]

It’s two fold, like the issue of demand and supply with Rolex watches.

A lot of people grow up in a culture where it is okay to relieve people of their material belongings by force. They justify it as ‘us versus them’.

And police can’t stop enough of these incidents to end the culture in the above group

So the culture gets stronger, and police action gets harder. Vicious cycle.

It probably takes years, if not decades for this sort of culture to take root.


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[Chester01]

Originally Posted by shredder

That's ridiculous. Where is your evidence that the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer?

Poor people in this country are among the wealthiest people in the world. Every poor person I know (excluding junkies) is walking around with a 1000 dollar phone, has a place to live, and is well fed. The USA pays people not to work in this country. Welfare pays good money. Free food. Free housing, free money, free healthcare, free phone, free cable tv.

Did you know our founding fathers used to have to share beds in hostels when they traveled when to various cities to perform their legislative duties? By those standards alone , poor people are hundreds of times wealthier than the governing elite were 200 years ago.

Many like to play fast and loose with the facts but data are data. See anything by Piketty et al. Get through that 1000 pages and we will talk. It’s not a debate among even elementary economists. The idea of this massive handout as you mention is fed to folks at night by talking heads to folks that don’t think. I have worked with many people (so I don’t get my info from talking heads but by doing) and can tell you, you try living on what a few hundred a month. Yes standard of living has crept up, but just enough to keep folks from a revolt.
I don’t know what you read and while the founding fathers stayed at hotels, most came from $$ with Alexander Hamilton being an exception. Land was passed down generation to generation and inherited wealth common during that time and in an agricultural society was capital. I suggest you get out of your zip code, gain knowledge through experience (not talking points handed down from paid talking heads) and then let’s talk.

[brandrea]

To the OP’s question have I changed my behavior ... Yes and no.

No, I wear my watches everywhere.

Yes, I’m increasingly and situationally even more aware than before, especially when traveling.

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

That's why I said I didn't want to get into a thing... I don't want to put words in your mouth. But when reasons are found, justifications are made, justifications lead to excuses, excuses lead to expectations, expectations lead to "it's OK to do". That isn't the world we want to live in, is it? Do you?

Your logic from questioning behavior to approval for behavior seems tenuous.

Everything humans do is for a reason. Whether we understand the reason or not, it's done for a reason.

And it's also human behavior to ask WHY. Why is something happening. And in some cases the why can lead to things that can change behavior.

Not always. But questioning something is not the same as approving something.

As a society we can keep building more jails, hiring more police, but does that solve the problem. The simple fact is when people have no hope, they act out. And when you create underclasses with no hope, you get more crime.

But I agree some people are beyond logic and are sociopaths and beyond redemption. But they exist at the top of the economic ladder as well.

Don't forget in our last "gilded age" the people that prospored the most were called robber barons for a reason.

[MDMH]

Originally Posted by Wcdhtwn

That's why I said I didn't want to get into a thing... I don't want to put words in your mouth. But when reasons are found, justifications are made, justifications lead to excuses, excuses lead to expectations, expectations lead to "it's OK to do". That isn't the world we want to live in, is it? Do you?



Here's a justification. And it's going to be more common and there's nothing we can do about it. It's not the criminal's fault, it's the fault of the rich guy with a blingy watch. Where is the "it not acceptable and I won't stand for it"? I guess nowhere... too bad.



More justification. Someone thinks it's OK. It's happened in the past so we should expect it to keep happening. Really?



Again, not the criminal's fault, they're just playing by different rules. Don't we all have to play by the rule of law? I guess not. By the way, if you watched the video none of these robbers are desperate. They could afford guns and a car, or had the capability to steal them. They are seen running away, in new looking clothes and shoes. And they are running fast, so they must have access to food and some level of physical fitness. None of that sounds like someone living in desperation and abject poverty.



You're new here, but you're post is right on target.

I'm not trying to start fights and make enemies, but there is a distinct mindset in the US, and maybe other countries, wanting to justify and explain these acts, and not punish them. In the Houston case, these are not people who are stealing a loaf of bread to feed their children, these are not desperate people, all of their basic necessities are provided, or they can afford them. We can't rationalize this violence and theft... it is not acceptable. And it's not about protecting my watches, it's about finding fault in criminal behavior and punishing it, not excusing it and letting people out with no bond or responsibility to reappear in front of a judge.

OK, enough of this. I like and value you all and your input on this forum. If I'm ranting thanks for going with the flow. Now, back to your weekend and hopefully drink of choice.

Eeeek..Cringe worthy.. that’s kinda Victim blaming isn’t it?

[Wcdhtwn]

Originally Posted by MDMH

Eeeek..Cringe worthy.. that’s kinda Victim blaming isn’t it?

I guess that depends on who you consider the victim... the robber or the robbed.


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[MDMH]

Not when it’s blamed on wearing the watch. Isn’t that the same as a sexual assault for “what she was wearing”....

This is far from a “Robinhood” scenario on the other side

[Wcdhtwn]

Originally Posted by MDMH

Not when it’s blamed on wearing the watch. Isn’t that the same as a sexual assault for “what she was wearing”....

This is far from a “Robinhood” scenario on the other side

It seems like we are saying the same thing with different words. No one should be robbed for wearing a nice watch.

Robin Hood stole from the government and gave money back to the people. He didn’t steal from the rich, those not in government anyway, and give to the poor.


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[MDMH]

Yes I think we are ... I agree

However all societal issues aside. There is no “side” (eg. victim blaming)for the Robber. Illegal is illegal ... you might not agree with the laws but it’s the only thing we have from any degree of order in society. I do see what your saying though and it’s quite “deep” especially for a criminal defence attorney.

[MDMH]

And then I’ll be a complete hypocrite and say that I don’t condone violence in any way and I’m not a ghoul. But..... I do smile just a tad when the Kardashians and other fellow “Social Media Show Off’s” have their stuff stolen. Kind of Karmic in a sick way.