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Old 4 November 2019, 10:53 AM   #31
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Old 4 November 2019, 11:07 AM   #32
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The dial screams aftermarket or fake. Fonts (too much serif) seem all wrong for the era and no swiss (service dial) nor swiss T (oem). The whole dial could have been refinished as the lume plots, especially at 6pm, seem unevenly placed. Hands, especially GMT also aren’t the shape for that era.
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Old 4 November 2019, 12:00 PM   #33
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Hmmm, so what you are suggesting is ROLEX put a fake case on the watch when it was sent in for repairs...
Good to know.
not keen to hear other people's thoughts despite providing you with some evidence of reason?

You have at the minimum:
- repainted dial (not even a "swiss" at the bottom)
- question crown (shape doesn't look right)
- case etchings that don't look consistent with the watch of that era or a watch that has been on a bracelet for 50+ years

Not enough red flags to at least get it looked at by an expert in person?
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Old 4 November 2019, 12:51 PM   #34
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not keen to hear other people's thoughts despite providing you with some evidence of reason?

You have at the minimum:
- repainted dial (not even a "swiss" at the bottom)
- question crown (shape doesn't look right)
- case etchings that don't look consistent with the watch of that era or a watch that has been on a bracelet for 50+ years
Not enough red flags to at least get it looked at by an expert in person?
First off my dad is still alive. He bought the ROLEX from a reputable certified ROLEX dealer with all paperwork. Unfortunately the box and paperwork is in storage somewhere. He sent it to ROLEX for major repairs in the early 60s. He gave it to me 20 years ago. The only other thing that was done to it was a simple service (cleaning) at a certified Rolex dealer in Denver. So we know exactly where it has been. So if there are fake parts they came from ROLEX. I have no clue thats why I thought i would get advice.

Everyone here have given great input and things to think about. Because of the damage in the past I know there are service parts and a few things not consistent. I did have an experienced vintage watch dealer look at it four years ago. He mainly deals with vintage ROLEX watches. He inspected it inside and out. On my way out of his shop he offered me a fair amount of money for the watch. Enough to where I stopped because i thought I didnt hear him clearly. Im not selling the watch. Its way too sentimental. I dont care if its worth $50 or 50k. I just want to know what I have.

Now with all the mostly great advice I can take it for a second opinion and ask specific questions.

Thanks all for the input.
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Old 4 November 2019, 10:38 PM   #35
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It’s a funny world, here. For decades, Rolex has been making incredibly well designed watches, and their quality has inspired a lot of collectors. The watches are so well made, that even 60 year old watches can be worn daily, if cared for. This has inspired a large number of vintage enthusiasts.

But, since there are literally millions of old Rolexes out there, the enthusiasts have choices and have decided that originality is king, not appearance. Collectors will pay a premium for a 60 years old Rolex with original hands, even with open spaces where the lume used to be. In this light, a worn out and faded original dial is more desirable than a pristine, new replacement dial (even though the replacement dial is far more legible).

There is also a sub-culture of scammers, trying to profit from these collectors, creating replica parts and trying to pass them off as “old”. The community here is adept at spotting fakes, and is attuned to even the slightest difference.

I am in a similar situation. I have my father’s old Explorer. I value it for sentiment, and for function. Others would value it for originality of the hands (lume cracking) and dial (blemishes at 2 and 10 o’clock). I have thought about replacing the dial and hands so it would look fresh, and have been strongly cautioned against it (but it’s my watch!).

I get it. To this collector’s market, my old Explorer is worth far more than seems reasonable to me. I just wrote this to try to explain the range of opinions and why feelings are so strong. Enjoy your watch! It is a very well made, accurate and useful watch, especially if you are traveling.
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Old 4 November 2019, 10:55 PM   #36
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Noob question but.. Is it even realistic to expect a 50 year old watch to be running without replacement parts?

In the vintage porsche and ferrari world we never advertised them or even deduct them for ďreplacement partsĒ.. heck itís a plus in a lot of cases of a vintage ferrari has had several color changes lol..

Please explain..

Is the thought process that these were made in their 100,000s so you can wait for the right one?

In vintage porsche or fearri market itís rare for a given model year to ever exceed 800 for one model year.. A given model would never exceed 18,000 made and that would take nearly 20 years of production..

Attrition is also MUCH higher on vintage cars I would think..

Attrition meaning itís easier to restore a vintage timepiece than a vintage automobile.

Simply do collectors feel these vintage Rolex were made in such large numbers that they can discount those that have ďservice partsĒ because there are too many to sift through that will be original due to the large production numbers of vintage time pieces vs vintage automobiles?

Please explain to a novice watch enthusiast.


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Old 4 November 2019, 11:42 PM   #37
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First off my dad is still alive. He bought the ROLEX from a reputable certified ROLEX dealer with all paperwork. Unfortunately the box and paperwork is in storage somewhere. He sent it to ROLEX for major repairs in the early 60s. He gave it to me 20 years ago. The only other thing that was done to it was a simple service (cleaning) at a certified Rolex dealer in Denver. So we know exactly where it has been. So if there are fake parts they came from ROLEX. I have no clue thats why I thought i would get advice.

Everyone here have given great input and things to think about. Because of the damage in the past I know there are service parts and a few things not consistent. I did have an experienced vintage watch dealer look at it four years ago. He mainly deals with vintage ROLEX watches. He inspected it inside and out. On my way out of his shop he offered me a fair amount of money for the watch. Enough to where I stopped because i thought I didnt hear him clearly. Im not selling the watch. Its way too sentimental. I dont care if its worth $50 or 50k. I just want to know what I have.

Now with all the mostly great advice I can take it for a second opinion and ask specific questions.

Thanks all for the input.
I want to be kind here, since this is an heirloom, but I think that people are having trouble with the story because the facts just don't add up.

To be concrete, let me pick one specific very obvious example ... the bezel insert. That insert is from the 1980s or later (inserts in the 1960s and 1970s looked very different). So it couldn't have been installed by Rolex in the 60s. And you claim that the only thing done by the dealer in Denver was a movement service. So the story doesn't add up on that count, which puts everything into doubt.

To us, it is obvious that things were replaced in the watch much later than the 1960s (and not by Rolex), e.g. the crown (which is not authentic Rolex), the dial (which is repainted), etc. So perhaps someone's memory is not quite accurate about what has been done to the watch over the years, which is understandable and often happens. I think you should at least be open to this possibility, because the facts are absolutely clear to us. A lot of people who sell Rolex watches or who claim to be experts, may not actually be aware of all these details, but you are getting the truth from people on this forum.
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Old 4 November 2019, 11:49 PM   #38
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I doubt the OP is familiar with how common a story this is since he joined the forum just recently and has only posted in this thread.

Itís super common to have someone spin a yarn about a relative handing down a watch, only for it to be a guy testing the waters to see how his fake is going to be evaluated.

I have no knowledge of the OPís intentions and Iím not accusing him of falsely representing himself. Iím simply pointing out why so many are quick to pick apart his watch and why skepticism is the default here.


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Old 5 November 2019, 12:19 AM   #39
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This discussion would be a lot easier with proper pics of both sides of the case in between the lugs. Show us the engravings of both the serial and reference number. After that there is no doubt regarding the autenticity of the case.
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Old 5 November 2019, 12:56 AM   #40
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An interesting tale.. would love to know its true history.
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Old 5 November 2019, 01:08 AM   #41
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I doubt the OP is familiar with how common a story this is since he joined the forum just recently and has only posted in this thread.

Itís super common to have someone spin a yarn about a relative handing down a watch, only for it to be a guy testing the waters to see how his fake is going to be evaluated.

I have no knowledge of the OPís intentions and Iím not accusing him of falsely representing himself. Iím simply pointing out why so many are quick to pick apart his watch and why skepticism is the default here.


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Interesting, I can assure you thats not the case. Im not a expensive or classic watch guy nor am I a collector. Im the $100 to $200 watch guy. That may change though. Im already thinking about how to restore this watch.
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Old 5 November 2019, 01:35 AM   #42
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This discussion would be a lot easier with proper pics of both sides of the case in between the lugs. Show us the engravings of both the serial and reference number. After that there is no doubt regarding the autenticity of the case.
The only engravings that I saw was the 6542. Ill take more pics of all sides. Maybe I missed something.
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Old 5 November 2019, 01:56 AM   #43
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The only engravings that I saw was the 6542. Ill take more pics of all sides. Maybe I missed something.
Karl, the opposite side of the case from the 6542 reference number, between the other lugs, has (let's hope!) a serial number.
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Old 5 November 2019, 02:08 AM   #44
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Bracelet looks to be an oval link. If you have pics of the clasp and clasp markings then those would be good to see as well.

Kinda curious how this turns out.
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Old 5 November 2019, 03:08 AM   #45
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Bracelet looks to be an oval link. If you have pics of the clasp and clasp markings then those would be good to see as well.

Kinda curious how this turns out.
Will do
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Old 5 November 2019, 03:09 AM   #46
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Just to add something here: not saying that this was the case, but it certainly happens. Every now and then you really think that a repairer is trustworthy, but at the end of the day....it is not. I've seen parts be replaced for fakes when sent to repair. An uncle of mine had some jewelry sent to his "trusted" repair shop, only to find out later that they swapped diamonds on 3 of his rings. He could actually prove it on the courts when he sued the shop. People are greedy and sometimes if they realize you don't know the difference between a fake part and an original one...well, that's when shit happens.
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Old 5 November 2019, 03:34 AM   #47
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Just to add something here: not saying that this was the case, but it certainly happens. Every now and then you really think that a repairer is trustworthy, but at the end of the day....it is not. I've seen parts be replaced for fakes when sent to repair. An uncle of mine had some jewelry sent to his "trusted" repair shop, only to find out later that they swapped diamonds on 3 of his rings. He could actually prove it on the courts when he sued the shop. People are greedy and sometimes if they realize you don't know the difference between a fake part and an original one...well, that's when shit happens.
I thought about that also
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Old 5 November 2019, 04:06 AM   #48
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I doubt the OP is familiar with how common a story this is since he joined the forum just recently and has only posted in this thread.

Itís super common to have someone spin a yarn about a relative handing down a watch, only for it to be a guy testing the waters to see how his fake is going to be evaluated.

I have no knowledge of the OPís intentions and Iím not accusing him of falsely representing himself. Iím simply pointing out why so many are quick to pick apart his watch and why skepticism is the default here.


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I can assure you Im not. All my watches are $100 to $200 watches. Im not a collector or classic watch guy. That may change though. Im loving some of the watches I see in this group. I definitely see some of the issues after reading all the posts. Its maddening that other parts (not ROLEX) were possibly used during repairs. I am thinking about looking into restoring it now if it is possible. We shall see....
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Old 5 November 2019, 04:13 AM   #49
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I can assure you Im not. All my watches are $100 to $200 watches. Im not a collector or classic watch guy. That may change though. Im loving some of the watches I see in this group. I definitely see some of the issues after reading all the posts. Its maddening that other parts (not ROLEX) were possibly used during repairs. I am thinking about looking into restoring it now if it is possible. We shall see....
The only problem is that for this model of watch, restoring with original parts could cost you 10s of thousands of dollars just for parts. The other issue would be finding the original parts.

An original bakelite insert in usable condition may cost $20 grand as an example.

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthre...highlight=6542
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Old 5 November 2019, 04:17 AM   #50
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The only problem is that for this model of watch, restoring with original parts could cost you 10s of thousands of dollars just for parts. The other issue would be finding the original parts.
This might be worth sending to RSC NY and getting a quote on a full service. Their price on a service dial might be reasonable, assuming they'll still service a 6542. Even if a new case is needed the whole bill might be south of $3k.

Original, period-correct parts would be astronomical. A watch made from service parts would be affordable.
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Old 5 November 2019, 05:31 AM   #51
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$20,000 for a plastic bezel insert is insanity. Iím sorry.


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Old 5 November 2019, 12:02 PM   #52
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This discussion would be a lot easier with proper pics of both sides of the case in between the lugs. Show us the engravings of both the serial and reference number. After that there is no doubt regarding the autenticity of the case.
More pics...

Looks like a serial number above the etched numbers but it is too worn to make out. I tried various angles.
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Old 5 November 2019, 12:53 PM   #53
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More pics...

Looks like a serial number above the etched numbers but it is too worn to make out. I tried various angles.
Couple more
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Old 5 November 2019, 12:56 PM   #54
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Never seen a serial number handwritten or with a J in it.....
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Old 5 November 2019, 12:58 PM   #55
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Also weird how one side Between the lugs has 60 years of wear and one side with the 6542 is mint.....
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Old 5 November 2019, 12:59 PM   #56
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Never seen a serial number handwritten or with a J in it.....
Im not sure what that is. Have to ask my dad if he did it.

Above the handwritten numbers is the serial number I think. Its hard to make out.
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Old 5 November 2019, 01:11 PM   #57
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Weíre all so different and no one here but you knows your relationship to your dad and to his (now your) watch.

But here are my thoughts...

If this watch just ďfell into your lapĒ with no personal history attached, then perhaps it might be a good ďfixer-upper.Ē And if that option were unreasonable financially, then perhaps you might sell it to fund the watch you want.

However, as a watch that was worn by your father on adventures, subsequently damaged, repaired and gifted to you, his son, I feel the watch now has itís own personality, you might say.

The watch looks great to my untrained eye, and probably to most average people, as well. If it were damaged, malfunctioning or unsightly, I could see having work done. But it isnít. Your watch is a great piece with loads of personality and memories.

Iíd leave it as is.

And if I still wanted a more ďproperĒ Rolex, Iíd pursue that separately.

Iíd love to have a watch like this, gifted from my dad, who passed many years ago. What a fine keepsake this would be!

Just my thoughts...

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Old 5 November 2019, 01:20 PM   #58
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We’re all so different and no one here but you knows your relationship to your dad and to his (now your) watch.

But here are my thoughts...

If this watch just “fell into your lap” with no personal history attached, then perhaps it might be a good “fixer-upper.” And if that option were unreasonable financially, then perhaps you might sell it to fund the watch you want.

However, as a watch that was worn by your father on adventures, subsequently damaged, repaired and gifted to you, his son, I feel the watch now has it’s own personality, you might say.

The watch looks great to my untrained eye, and probably to most average people, as well. If it were damaged, malfunctioning or unsightly, I could see having work done. But it isn’t. Your watch is a great piece with loads of personality and memories.

I’d leave it as is.

And if I still wanted a more “proper” Rolex, I’d pursue that separately.

I’d love to have a watch like this, gifted from my dad, who passed many years ago. What a fine keepsake this would be!

Just my thoughts...

Michael
Thank you!!!!!!

Awesome thoughts.

Im keeping it. Way too sentimental. Im digging a little because after inheriting the watch 20 years ago I just found out the value of some of them. Im just curious and trying to educate myself.

My dad turned 89 yesterday. Im 55 and as a kid I still remember traveling through europe with him. Sleeping beside him in the hotels and seeing the ROLEX glowing on his wrist at night. Going swimming at the beach with him while admiring the watch. I look at his old navy pictures and in almost every picture he is wearing the watch.
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Old 5 November 2019, 01:38 PM   #59
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Those pictures make it even more interesting. 1033 on the movement and I. 67 on the caseback? hmmm.
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Old 5 November 2019, 01:48 PM   #60
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Definitely an odd mix of parts, especially if this was once new in 1958.
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