Any Electricians in the house?

[TheVTCGuy]

Yeah... well, I am not blowing up my home or anything (surprising) but trouble-shooting a friends house. The porch light is 12V DC, which shocked (pun intended) me, but figured it out. Now, I am working on the walkway lights, they all run to a junction box, plug (three prong) in to a digital timer, (three prong receptacle) which plugs (again three prong) in to the box/wall of the house. This plug is 12V DC as well, I guess powered by the same transformer. My friend kept plugging in new bulbs but nothing worked. Of course they were all 120V AC bulbs, I put in 12V DC bulbs and magic! They all came on.

The problem is the timer, it never turned the lights on/off. Bypassing the timer and plugging it straight in to the wall the lights work fine. I checked out the timer and discovered it is a 120V AC, no wonder it does nothing. The model is a Westek TE05W. It hasn’t worked in years and my friend can’t remember what work was done on it (ex husband) but this is the weirdest set up I have ever seen. Here is the bottom line:

Everything works, I just need to install a programmable timer. The problem is, it is all 12V DC and the only DC timers I find are cable-connect, in and out. Since the receptacle in the house wall and the cable for the lights are three-prong, I need a 12V DC THREE PRONG in and out timer. Any of you smart electricians ever hear of such an animal? I haven’t, and my internet searches are proving fruitless.

I thought of somehow coming from the transformer with another cable, but that’s getting a little too in depth for me, if I could just find a 12V DC programable timer that has a three prong plug and receptacle I’m all set.

If anyone in Southern California notices a lot of fire engines going by you will all know I tried the transformer-cable solution... The rest of you will probably see it on the national evening news.

[superdog]

Oh boy....

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by superdog

Oh boy....

Oh yee of little faith!!!

[TheVTCGuy]

Spoke with an electrician buddy, he said I would be better off putting the 120V AC timer on the AC side in the transformer box. He is probably right, but if there are not receptacles in that box (which I would doubt) I will have to add one... ... ...

OK...NOW everyone can get concerned.

[ZOOK]

Wasn't there a previous project with a photo of a junction box that looked like a garda knot.


Good luck.

[BNA/LION]

A few RULES for doing electrical work you need to follow:

1. Never turn off the power when working on electrical projects.
2. If possible always stand in water with bare feet while connecting wires.
3. If you don't feel a little shock then there is no power, keep trying.
4. Electrical tape is Awesome stuff.

[crew]

This doesn’t sound that complicated Paul.
But, without actually seeing the components described I can’t propose a solution. What I would suggest, however, is that you visit the counter at an electrical wholesale supply house. They should be able to direct you to the appropriate products. You could also try the electrical aisle at one of the “big box” stores but that can be hit or miss.
Good luck and let us know how this works out for you!

[Tools]

There should not be a 12V DC receptacle that would accept a 120v plug, and there should never be a 120v plug on the end of a 12vDC device.

[crew]

Originally Posted by Tools

There should not be a 12V DC receptacle that would accept a 120v plug, and there should never be a 120v plug on the end of a 12vDC device. .

Exactly this. See someone that knows something about this.
The solution probably isn’t that complicated.

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by Tools

There should not be a 12V DC receptacle that would accept a 120v plug, and there should never be a 120v plug on the end of a 12vDC device.

Originally Posted by crew

Exactly this. See someone that knows something about this.
The solution probably isn’t that complicated.

Completely agree... yet there is. I’ll show you guys pictures. There is a three-prong receptacle that outputs 12VDC, mounted in the junction box/wall of the house. Don’t ask me why or how... but it’s there.

[Tools]

Nothing wrong with 12vDC at a junction box, it just should never have a 120v receptacle wired in.

I would put a photocell there, with a couple of DC lugs, then any 12vDC device could be set under the lugs and it would work dusk-to-dawn.

The device probably has a 120v pigtail that was added aftermarket.

[swils8610]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Spoke with an electrician buddy, he said I would be better off putting the 120V AC timer on the AC side in the transformer box. He is probably right, but if there are not receptacles in that box (which I would doubt) I will have to add one... ... ...



OK...NOW everyone can get concerned.

That’s how mine is Paul


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[swils8610]

Originally Posted by BNA/LION

A few RULES for doing electrical work you need to follow:

1. Never turn off the power when working on electrical projects.
2. If possible always stand in water with bare feet while connecting wires.
3. If you don't feel a little shock then there is no power, keep trying.
4. Electrical tape is Awesome stuff.

My dad had an electrician in the 1960’s and 1970’s. He would lick his thumb and pointer finger and pinch the electric line to see if it was live...he did the same with a 220 line and could tell the diff between 120 and 220! He said it’s safe as long as you’re not grounded! Old plumber also taught me how to check for a gas leak...with a match! I actually do it that way...we recently had the gas company come to one of our rental properties to turn the gas on...my wife asked him how do you check for a leak?? The guy said well...with a match or a lighter! I was smiling from ear to ear!


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[AzPaul]

I'd make it 220, 221, whatever it takes.

[DJ TT 2002]

Originally Posted by AzPaul

I'd make it 220, 221, whatever it takes.

Great Mr Mom reference

[GB-man]

I would also shoot for a photocell sensor. I have two outdoor lamp posts at my driveway that are 24V and run on them. Works great. A timer is unnecessary and I wouldn’t want a 3 prong plug wired onto a 12V circuit that can’t be code compliant.

I’d listen to your buddy the electrician or hire a pro if unsure.

[TheVTCGuy]

Maybe I’ll just buy her a new house

[77T]

Since you already said there is a hardwired 12v transformer working just fine, then you’d want to use the manufacturer’s module. The timer or photocell you’d want is typically for landscape lighting low voltage systems.

But if you can’t find the oem switch module you want, then a diy is your next option.

Yes there should be 3 wires used on the dc side but you first need to calculate your amp load. Once you get that, go to Amazon and type in: 12 volt photocell switch. Pick one that is rated 25% or more amps than your load to be safe.

Here’s what a 10amp Chinese model looks like.




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[GB-man]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

Maybe I’ll just buy her a new house

worked with my wife

[77T]

Originally Posted by 77T

Pick one that is rated 25% or more amps than your load to be safe.

Whoops that should have said 125% or more than your load to be safe.


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[Too Old]

I would get a qualified electrician to sort it.
If you do it and by some chance she gets a shock it'll be down to you.

[V25V]

"3 prong" is a 20A receptacle. I have never seen a 20A timer receptacle and not sure why one would ever be used (besides your application of course). Why don't you just put it on a circuit (switch) which has a timer built in? Why do you need the receptacle?

We use Leviton programmable light switches for our front lights to come on at dusk and off at dawn.

[sparky]

A NEMA 6-20 is a 20A 120VAC outlet, a NEMA 6-15 is a 15A 120 VAC outlet. Against the Nat. Ele. code to put a 20A outlet on a 15A circuit, but allowed to put a 15A outlet on a 20A circuit. Just a thought.

[crew]

Originally Posted by sparky

A NEMA 6-20 is a 20A 120VAC outlet, a NEMA 6-15 is a 15A 120 VAC outlet. Against the Nat. Ele. code to put a 20A outlet on a 15A circuit, but allowed to put a 15A outlet on a 20A circuit. Just a thought.

Anyone called “Sparky” must know something about electricity!

[dba]

Best of luck. What I know about electricity is that when the switch is up, the light is on; unless it's the switch at the other end of the hall.

[SearChart]

Electricity is too complicated and dangerous for me. Have fun Paul

[TheVTCGuy]

OK, found this mechanical timer, DC! WITH the plugs. Put it in and so far, it looks like it might work! Didn’t have time to test it but set the lights to come on at 7:00. On the old timer, they were on continuously, so them being off right now is a good thing! Check back with me after 7:00 tonight.

[othertbone]

ohhhh its a question for a friend! lol

[TheVTCGuy]

Success!

[SearChart]

Nice