Will Panerai become mainstream?

[JMarty9]

PAMs are obviously a very hot with watch lovers, but it doesnt seem like many people who arent watch enthusiasts know about them. They've obviously been around for quite some time, but it seems like their popularity has increased significantly over the past few years. Do you think they'll ever become a mainstream watch like Rolex (ok, maybe not that mainstream), Omega, Breitling, etc...? Think PAM is a fad (I dont, but curious what others think)?

Oh yea, I'm new here. Nice to meet everyone.

[Thani]

IMO i think panerai will become a mainstream and is not a fad, they just started making inhouse movements too..

dont forget that they have a lot of history too

[mfer]

Welcome to TRF! I'm on several forums and this is the place to be IMO.

I love Pams. I don't think they photograph well. I kind of thought they were ugly until I saw one in the flesh. Then, I was hooked.

Are Pams mainstream? Nope and it isn't because people don't like them. I think it is because of the low number produced by Panerai. I mean how can a watch before mainstream if you can't get enough of them out there?!?!

If they would go mainstream, the would also need significant work on their anti-counter fitting measures. Right now, they are relatively easy to fake from what I have read online, but like I said, they need more production to become mainstream. Not sure if they are willing to do that!

[MikeyDe]

I think you love em or you dont. I agree that as long as they keep production #s down then they cant really become mainstream. Alot of my friends have no idea what Im talking about when I say Panerai. And I like it like that. Alot of people like to go with what everyone else has. Hence the Rolex etc.(nothing against Rollie cause I want one someday). I think Panerai are for people who dont want what everyone else has. And believe me when you're wearing one people notice. They ooze quality bad ass watch.

[JMarty9]

Agreed. Part of my attraction to Panerai is that most dont know about the brand.

Originally Posted by MikeyDe

And believe me when you're wearing one people notice. They ooze quality bad ass watch.

When people notice the watch, do they comment (or do you just catch them taking a look)?

[hienpham04]

Panerai do like nicer in person. Pictures don't justify the PAMs. Become like Rolex where everyone in the world knows about it? Probably not soon, but there's potential to grow at a fast rate than other brands. I love the history and the look of a nice big watch. Hope it will someday!

[Lol-x]

Panerai are part of the mainstream watch industry as I understand it they are owned by Richmont, but they enjoy a unique identity and appearance.
They are not mass produced so they are more of a boutique brand connoted by their limited numbers, marketing and perceived exclusivity.
Panerai use both in house and off the shelf movements which seems pretty mainstream to me.

[edodo]

I think it is difficult. Although more people is wearing the brand. But the yearly production is too small to meet the demand all over the world. Every time entering the watch store, you will see at least two glass display for rolex. But Panerai, just 2 small box which total about 10 watch.

[The Dude]

In a lot of ways Panerai is now mainstream, you see it on so many television and movie personalities that it is mainstream. Can most people afford a Panerai, no... Could the supply meet the demand? At those prices, it seems they are meeting the demand. You see Panerai watches more and more, it is mainstream - all it took was to see it in a few major movies and television shows and voila! But most regular folks simply can't afford a Panerai and it is not the best watch to wear with a suit as such will you see more of them on the street, yes... There are more of them out there already, and there will be more in the future. Will it become, no... it already is mainstream.

[pwrslider]

Originally Posted by The Dude

In a lot of ways Panerai is now mainstream, you see it on so many television and movie personalities that it is mainstream. Can most people afford a Panerai, no... Could the supply meet the demand? At those prices, it seems they are meeting the demand. You see Panerai watches more and more, it is mainstream - all it took was to see it in a few major movies and television shows and voila! But most regular folks simply can't afford a Panerai and it is not the best watch to wear with a suit as such will you see more of them on the street, yes... There are more of them out there already, and there will be more in the future. Will it become, no... it already is mainstream.

I agree.....it's as mainstream as any limited edition item can get. For the most part...they sell everything they make. It's kind of like asking if Ferrari is mainstream....well not in the sense of everyone's got one....but if you start looking and watching for Ferrari's...suddenly every now and then you see one.

Ok......bad example...but you know what I mean. There is not one month that goes by that someone doesn't call me out with my pam. Was at a neighborhood party a few months ago....when the host asked about mine..then showed me his...then introduced me to 4 other guys wearing 44's.

They're out there..............

[boa2]

They already are:http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...685662,00.html

As for available stock, I've been seeing ADs with much more of it lately.

[fikko]

If they stick with their direction, they will never become a mainstream. Panerai is too ugly for the mainstream. That is why it will never become a mainstream.

[JMarty9]

Originally Posted by fikko

If they stick with their direction, they will never become a mainstream. Panerai is too ugly for the mainstream. That is why it will never become a mainstream.

I'd venture to say that there is plenty of "ugly" in mainstream (not just watches). "Ugly" to some is "unique" to others. A lot of times, I'd say "unique" is what helps to set something apart and bring it to the mainstream.

[JJ Irani]

Dunno nuthin' about no MAINSTREAM; but as things stand on this forum, Panny seems to be following in ROLEX's SLIPSTREAM!!

[rulessapt]

Panerai in time will become more well known amongst watch aficionados.
Companies like Bell & Ross, who used to make aircraft instruments are the trendies.

Personally I think Panerai have their own distinctive style, which polarises opinion.
I like 'em !

cheers
richard

[Lol-x]

Originally Posted by JJ Irani

Dunno nuthin' about no MAINSTREAM; but as things stand on this forum, Panny seems to be following in ROLEX's SLIPSTREAM!!

I don't think Panerai is following Rolex, they have their own identity. If anything Rolex is following Panerai, namely look at the larger case sizes now being produced by Rolex

You need to do some homework to understand the Panerai brand. If you haven't experienced the brand you owe it to yourself to give Panerai a chance before you judge.

[BigHat]

Originally Posted by Lol-x

I don't think Panerai is following Rolex, they have their own identity. If anything Rolex is following Panerai, namely look at the larger case sizes now being produced by Rolex

You need to do some homework to understand the Panerai brand. If you haven't experienced the brand you owe it to yourself to give Panerai a chance before you judge.

X2

[mfer]

Originally Posted by Lol-x

I don't think Panerai is following Rolex, they have their own identity. If anything Rolex is following Panerai, namely look at the larger case sizes now being produced by Rolex

You need to do some homework to understand the Panerai brand. If you haven't experienced the brand you owe it to yourself to give Panerai a chance before you judge.

X3.

Another thought however. In order for Panerai to grow more (or become mainstream) imHo (capital H for very humble), they need to use ONLY their in-house movements and quit using those modified ETA/Unitas movements. Their styling is beautiful and I LOVE them, but I've changed my mind and I cannot drop $5500 for a Pam 183 which is a Unitas based watch. I've been studying movements more and more and I compared the UNITAS movement to Pam's, they look VERY similar. The main difference I see is they used different plates on the back of the movement.

I would get a Pam 268 which has their own movement with an 8 day power reserve (P.2002), but that is out of my reach right now.

I guess it must be very expensive to make their in-house movements. I don't really know as I don't mass manufacture watches.

[boa2]

Originally Posted by mfer

X3.

Another thought however. In order for Panerai to grow more (or become mainstream) imHo (capital H for very humble), they need to use ONLY their in-house movements and quit using those modified ETA/Unitas movements. Their styling is beautiful and I LOVE them, but I've changed my mind and I cannot drop $5500 for a Pam 183 which is a Unitas based watch.

The last two SIHH watch shows indicate that they are moving--or at least, expanding--in that direction. With three new in-house movements introduced last year, the 10-day movement & Tourbillon (I'm sure I'm forgetting something), they are by their own admission positioning themselves to be a more exclusive, boutique brand. This has produced a lot of complaints on behalf of many current Panerai owners, who suggest that the brand is now becoming too expensive for the core demographic that powered Panerai's recent growth. I believe that $9000US was the lowest priced new release at this year's SIHH. Only time will tell if buyers will see the value beyond that of the competition in the respective price ranges. Changes in the company's posture are certainly afoot.

[hienpham04]

No doubt, Panerai is getting expensive but so do other brands.

[boa2]

Originally Posted by hienpham04

No doubt, Panerai is getting expensive but so do other brands.

True, but there is a lot more to it than higher pricing.

I'm pretty sure that no other brands have introduced as many in-house movements in the past two years as Panerai has. The result is that unlike other brands, Panerai has recently introduced a number of new models that are priced well above its counterparts in the same metals. It's not so much about pricing as it is about a watch brand redefining itself. Patek, Lange, Rolex, and all other brands have released new models, but none has claimed an attempt to re-invent itself in the manner that Panerai is doing now.

[JJ Irani]

Originally Posted by Lol-x

I don't think Panerai is following Rolex, they have their own identity. If anything Rolex is following Panerai, namely look at the larger case sizes now being produced by Rolex

You need to do some homework to understand the Panerai brand. If you haven't experienced the brand you owe it to yourself to give Panerai a chance before you judge.

Don't take my reply too seriously, Steve. I certainly wasn't bashing the brand. You know I love and respect most of the Swiss brands out there.

Just that for me Rolex will always be Rolex!!

Cheers - JJ

[Tools]

Speaking of Rolex JJ;

In 1935 Officine Panerai was comissioned by the Italian Navy to construct watches for use underwater, specifically ones that could be read underwater.
After some inital prototypes Officine Panerai delivered it's first production diving watches in 1938.
These were fitted with Rolex movements (and Rolex crowns and Rolex casebacks).

[Widows Son]

My buddy has one and the thing I noticed first was just how heavy it was!!! Once some of the current models hit the used market they will be more popular. Iwill buy a pre-loved Rollie or Omega for about 1/2 the cost of a brand new one, and will probably do the same with a Pam at some point.

[MAC4130]

Been out of the forum for a while traveling like crazy so I'm just catching up!

IMHO

Panerai is becoming or has become one of the hotest brands arround, just this month Revolution Magazine dedicated a full booklet to Panerai which talks about the evolution of panerai from an unknown Italian military watch to a high profile watch used by stars and politicians!
Their watches are different from anything else, you can recognize a Panerai a mile away and as mentioned before photos do not show how nice they really are!
What Panerai needed was in house movements to become a true manufacture and with the addition of their 4 In house movements including 8 and 10 day power reserve, automatic or handwound as well as a tourbillon they will hold position and become even more coveted. You can see how well they hold their value mainly for 3 reazons: 1) Low production numbers where demand far exceed production, 2) Absolutely no discount from authorized dealers as they might lose the brand, 3) The Paneristi cumunity which not necesarily from the paneristi web site but all panerai fan base which seems to have one of the most loyal followers.
Expensive? well entry Rolex expensive starting from 5k and as high as 107k for the tourbillon which by the way can't be seen from the front of the watch because Panerai says it is for accuracy sakes and not for show! So you see they seem to have a very solid way of thinking and conserving the values of their brand and legacy. More and more people will like to have one and as it seems production will remain the same, their Directives have already assured so, so this only means that the preowned and grey market will take some nice profits on them. Right now you can see that used watches sell for almost the same as the new ones and on some models price can be twice as much of course there are some very limited models that are selling for incredible ammounts as they are scarce and coveted. Rolex makes arround 900,000 to a million watches a year while Panerai should be arround 40 thousand!

[Trurolexer]

Originally Posted by hienpham04

No doubt, Panerai is getting expensive but so do other brands.

I think global Brand is more and more expensive.
Oh yeah...WELCOME TO TRF, Newbie!!! Hope you enjoy your stay here!!!

[ral]

I don't think Officine Panerai is looking to become a Rolex or Omega. With the new movements they have created, and with their manifattura line, it looks more like they have their sites set on Patek Philippe and Vacheron Constantin.

[leopardprey]

Panerais are mainstream. Brand is popular and they have large displays at ADs. Their production numbers are actually about average, below Rolex, Brietling and OMega, but above many others.

To me companies like Kobold and Glashutte are more of the less mainstream barnds. Especially Kobold which limits its production to 2500 watch a year compared to Panerai with 40,000+ watches a year.

As for ETA or Unitas movements that Panerai uses, well that is pretty standard for most watch brands. Panerai does modify and well finish the movements. Plus, that is actually one of the things that people like about panerai, using a well proven workhourse movement that can be serviced/repaired by any competent watchmaker. Though the new in house movements by Panerai are very well engineered. I do see Panerai moving towards the luxury higher end watch market, as some other makers under the parent company already are.

[ral]

I do see Panerai moving towards the luxury higher end watch market, as some other makers under the parent company already are.

Those US$100K Tourbillon's are definitely in the higher end market. Question is, will they stop producing their US$6K watches at some point in time? Hope not. I am fine with ETA inside as long as it says Panerai on the face. Entry level in-house movement is about US$10K.

[boa2]

Originally Posted by ral

I don't think Officine Panerai is looking to become a Rolex or Omega. With the new movements they have created, and with their manifattura line, it looks more like they have their sites set on Patek Philippe and Vacheron Constantin.

Panerai produces nothing within miles of the degree of finish or level of complication that either Patek or Vacheron currently have. AP, FPJ, Lange, Nardin, etc...they all make far more elaborate watches than Panerai does. A $100K tourbillon is not a pass into the upper echelon of haute horology, not by a longshot.