Advice for Patek newbie

[rw2008]

Hello all,

My apologies for asking a question I'm sure has been addressed.

I'm very interested in a 5712, and this being my first Patek, I'm looking for advice.

1) I have no existing relationship with the only Patek AD in my state. So am I going to be laughed out of the store if I ask about a 5712 list (a la DaytonaC)?

2) If my lack of a relationship with local Patek AD means getting one is going to be extremely difficult, I am open to going gray market. My hesitation here is with the papers. How does one get the piece serviced without having your name on the papers? If I go to the same AD (who don't know me) to get it sized, is that going to be an issue?

At the end of the day, I'd love to go the AD route, but not if it's going to be a Rolex Daytona-esque runaround with a mythical list and waiting time while I "build up" my status buying other watches I only half want.

Thanks in advance to anyone who answers.

[heng51]

Check out different ADs. See what they have to offer, and what they don't. THEN make your decision dependent on your experience.

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by rw2008

Hello all,

My apologies for asking a question I'm sure has been addressed.

I'm very interested in a 5712, and this being my first Patek, I'm looking for advice.

1) I have no existing relationship with the only Patek AD in my state. So am I going to be laughed out of the store if I ask about a 5712 list (a la DaytonaC)?

2) If my lack of a relationship with local Patek AD means getting one is going to be extremely difficult, I am open to going gray market. My hesitation here is with the papers. How does one get the piece serviced without having your name on the papers? If I go to the same AD (who don't know me) to get it sized, is that going to be an issue?

At the end of the day, I'd love to go the AD route, but not if it's going to be a Rolex Daytona-esque runaround with a mythical list and waiting time while I "build up" my status buying other watches I only half want.

Thanks in advance to anyone who answers.

Hi,

I am probably not going to be any great help, but the last thing I would do is to start buying watches you don't want. I bought my 5712 some years ago before the supply dwindled, and I'm very happy with it.

If I was in your shoes right now, I think I'd give PP a miss altogether, and go for something better like a Laurent Ferrier, Moser or FP Journe. PP's crown seems to me to be slipping somewhat under TS's stewardship, with some questionable recent watches, and lengthy service turnaround.

Before I get flamed once more by the PP faithful, these are just my opinions!

[spiker]

I really don't know about the papers question but I would think that if it's a legitimate buy any AD would service the watch. As far as the 5712 I recently received mine after waiting a month. I was pretty fortunate the person that was #1 backed out, I was #2. I did call a few AD's & most did not want to bother or they wanted to sell me a used one. I wanted a new one. Well the AD that I bought my watch from did require a deposit which I negotiated but they assured me that it was coming in "shortly" - which it did. GL with your venture.

[Socal to az]

Originally Posted by Hollister

PP's crown seems to me to be slipping somewhat under TS's stewardship, with some questionable recent watches, and lengthy service turnaround.

You mean like the 5522 that retails for 20k but people are asking 80k on the secondary market? Right utter fail by PP to create such a non desirable watch.


To the OP- just call around and ask the ads. You will find one to your liking. As far as grey market- if it's a "legit" grey dealer, you should have no issues.

Good luck and I agree- don't buy watches you don't want just to get the watch you do want. Lots and lots of good watches out there in the Patek family.

[tng11]

Don't waste money buying watches you only half like. You'll lose more than paying a premium buying on the grey market. Others around here have had luck calling ADs and getting a 5712 quickly, especially at ADs outside of major centres in the US.

As far as service goes, I wouldn't worry about it. PP's service centre won't care whose name is on the papers (there was some hoopla recently about the name having to match for warranty service, but it was ironed out), and it's up to the AD whether they'll do stuff like sizing for you for free. Even if they decided to charge you for sizing the bracelet, it can't be that much.

Good luck with your hunt - I'm also keeping my eyes peeled for one. I've pretty much given up on the prospect of being able to get one from a Canadian AD - none of them were willing to let me on their list.

[Vipes]

My advice is to visit your local Patek AD and tell them you are serious about buying the 5712. Maybe offer to put a deposit down to be on the list. Let them know you are a local customer since this tells them you may be a repeat customer. Good luck.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by rw2008

Hello all,

My apologies for asking a question I'm sure has been addressed.

I'm very interested in a 5712, and this being my first Patek, I'm looking for advice.

1) I have no existing relationship with the only Patek AD in my state. So am I going to be laughed out of the store if I ask about a 5712 list (a la DaytonaC)?

2) If my lack of a relationship with local Patek AD means getting one is going to be extremely difficult, I am open to going gray market. My hesitation here is with the papers. How does one get the piece serviced without having your name on the papers? If I go to the same AD (who don't know me) to get it sized, is that going to be an issue?

At the end of the day, I'd love to go the AD route, but not if it's going to be a Rolex Daytona-esque runaround with a mythical list and waiting time while I "build up" my status buying other watches I only half want.

Thanks in advance to anyone who answers.

Personally i would start building up a relationship with the AD. Get on the list for the 5712 and while you are waiting there may be another watch that you also like too (SIHH is just around the corner and Basel is not far off). Its amazing how fast you move up the list when you end up making repeat purchases. But don't buy ones you only "half want". You have to start somewhere and going grey just delays the process of building that relationship which you may need in the future.

If you haven't yet decided on an AD, pick one who carries a wide range of brands you are also interested in.

With PP, if my name isn't on the certificate of origin I'm not buying it. It might not matter to some but its a big deal for me especially if its a watch I'm keeping forever.

[DeeTee]

Call every AD in the country one by one. Start with smaller markets first.
It's easier to get than the 116500 and 5711.
Also let them know your serious, offer to pay in full as a deposit.

Worst comes to worst, just buy new from grey market.

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by Socal to az

You mean like the 5522 that retails for 20k but people are asking 80k on the secondary market? Right utter fail by PP to create such a non desirable watch.

McDonald's make desirable hamburgers, if "the market" is to be trusted on such matters. Please note that I did not mention any specific PP reference numbers.

I think I'll put you on "ignore" to save any further angst. We both know one another's opinion by now and are going round in circles.

Cheers.

[Socal to az]

Originally Posted by Hollister

McDonald's make desirable hamburgers, if "the market" is to be trusted on such matters. Please note that I did not mention any specific PP reference numbers.

I think I'll put you on "ignore" to save any further angst. We both know one another's opinion by now and are going round in circles.

Cheers.

Please do, this is a Patek enthusiasts forum and you are recommending the OP to buy a Moser. SMH!

[jon_jon]

Originally Posted by rw2008

Hello all,

My apologies for asking a question I'm sure has been addressed.

I'm very interested in a 5712, and this being my first Patek, I'm looking for advice.

1) I have no existing relationship with the only Patek AD in my state. So am I going to be laughed out of the store if I ask about a 5712 list (a la DaytonaC)?

2) If my lack of a relationship with local Patek AD means getting one is going to be extremely difficult, I am open to going gray market. My hesitation here is with the papers. How does one get the piece serviced without having your name on the papers? If I go to the same AD (who don't know me) to get it sized, is that going to be an issue?

At the end of the day, I'd love to go the AD route, but not if it's going to be a Rolex Daytona-esque runaround with a mythical list and waiting time while I "build up" my status buying other watches I only half want.

Thanks in advance to anyone who answers.

The 5712/1A is a nice watch. However I would make sure it is a watch that you will really like and you are not overly influenced by the "hype" and the supply/demand ratio of this watch at the moment.

It would be best to see the watch and try it on before paying the market rate from gray dealers, especially if this will be your first Patek. You don't want to pay a premium for the watch and realize it is a watch that you are not crazy about. Even if you decide to sell it back to the gray seller, you will lose a chunk of change unless you buy a more expensive watch from the same seller.

As others have mentioned, call a few out of state ADs. You may be surprised that one is available sooner than you think.

[heng51]

Tell your local AD about it.

[KarlS]

James I think every brand has some outliers and FPJ is one of them. The 5711 /12 has a lot of hype that I don't fully understand but the FPJ CB was probably one of the most underwhelming watches I owned! Driven purely by hype and the dial that is meant to be so difficult to make! Plastic looking hands etc etc. The sports line pretty blah as well but yes I am a fan of the CS, Zodiaque and QP ....despite only making 800 watches a year the resale sucks and it's a toss between them and Lange as to whose sucks the most! Generally all brands have good and bad models with PP and FPJ being no different

[Hollister]

Originally Posted by KarlS

James I think every brand has some outliers and FPJ is one of them. The 5711 /12 has a lot of hype that I don't fully understand but the FPJ CB was probably one of the most underwhelming watches I owned! Driven purely by hype and the dial that is meant to be so difficult to make! Plastic looking hands etc etc. The sports line pretty blah as well but yes I am a fan of the CS, Zodiaque and QP ....despite only making 800 watches a year the resale sucks and it's a toss between them and Lange as to whose sucks the most! Generally all brands have good and bad models with PP and FPJ being no different

Hi Karl,

One man's trash is another man's treasure, as they say. And diversity of opinion is what discussion forums are all about, n'est-ce pas?

For the avoidance of doubt, I am a huge fan of the 5712A, it's my second-favourite watch in my humble collection. I'm merely questioning PP's general direction of travel, and loads of professional and amateur watch pundits feel similarly.

I've been eyeing Laurent Ferrier recently, and I note that William & Son do these. I feel a trip to London coming on....

[Socal to az]

FJP and Moser. Yeah- let me sell all my Patek's to buy these.

[AK797]

Originally Posted by Hollister

I've been eyeing Laurent Ferrier recently, and I note that William & Son do these. I feel a trip to London coming on....

They have an extensive range, I tried on the Mosers there as well, very impressed with both brands, and good attentive service, well it's usually empty in there.

Originally Posted by DeeTee

Call every AD in the country one by one. Start with smaller markets first.
It's easier to get than the 116500 and 5711.
Also let them know your serious, offer to pay in full as a deposit.

Worst comes to worst, just buy new from grey market.

I agree, its not as hard to get as the 5711 so I'd get on a few ADs lists and think it won't be too long a wait in the US.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by AK797

I agree, its not as hard to get as the 5711 so I'd get on a few ADs lists and think it won't be too long a wait in the US.

Just don't call Tiffany and Co. They wanted me to buy several other watches first to be considered for a 5712. Understandably, those are more desirable to some as they are even more rare so that's probably going to be an AD to avoid.

[Peterandwatches]

1) McDonald's EggMcMuffin is fantastic.

2) I am all for brand diversity, but generally these "boutique" brands don't make luxury steel sports watches. It would be near impossible to find an apples to apples 5712 competitor amongst a Moser or FPJ lineup. In fact, most of these brands seem to actively shun that particular market.

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by Socal to az

FJP and Moser. Yeah- let me sell all my Patek's to buy these.

Could you possibly be any more of a Weapons Grade tit, if you tried?
This is a DISCUSSION forum, which means people DISCUSS things, irrespective of whether they see eye-to-eye or not.
Just because it’s the Patek sub-forum doesn’t mean other brands are banned from being mentioned or suggested.

[PJ S]

Originally Posted by Peterandwatches

1) McDonald's EggMcMuffin is fantastic.

2) I am all for brand diversity, but generally these "boutique" brands don't make luxury steel sports watches. It would be near impossible to find an apples to apples 5712 competitor amongst a Moser or FPJ lineup. In fact, most of these brands seem to actively shun that particular market.

What does stainless steel have to do with sports watches? Plenty of other materials are available.
In FPJ’s case, they went with titanium & aluminium alloy, and Moser does have a steel Pioneer, which is their take on a sports watch.

https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/fp...sport-titanium
http://watchesbysjx.com/2017/03/h-mo...-in-steel.html

[Socal to az]

Originally Posted by PJ S

Could you possibly be any more of a Weapons Grade tit, if you tried?
This is a DISCUSSION forum, which means people DISCUSS things, irrespective of whether they see eye-to-eye or not.
Just because it’s the Patek sub-forum doesn’t mean other brands are banned from being mentioned or suggested.

touchy touchy. someone pee in your cheerios this morning?

So let me get this straight- when I DISCUSS and offer an opinion, Im a "Weapons Grade Tit" - not sure what that is but hey, Ill play along.

No where did the op say - hey what other brands in addition to Patek can I buy - especially brands that you can buy for pennies on the dollar on the secondary market. Yeah- thats exactly what the OP wanted.

Feel free to discuss all you want. Ill do the same. Im not offended by your opinion, so dont get your panties in a wad when you dont like mine.

Have a super fantastic day. I wish we had more people like you on the PATEK forum discussing and promoting other brands. Now that would be super fun.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by PJ S

This is a DISCUSSION forum, which means people DISCUSS things, irrespective of whether they see eye-to-eye or not.
Just because it’s the Patek sub-forum doesn’t mean other brands are banned from being mentioned or suggested.

i agree but in his defense he was responding to other suggestions questioning the "direction of PP" which has been noted many times already and on many other threads. This was not a discussion on the direction of PP it was about a 5712.

Why this argument needs to spread into every thread is beyond me

[Socal to az]

Originally Posted by tyler1980

Why this argument needs to spread into every thread is beyond me

because some people want attention being the contrarian. Discussing non patek watches in every thread in a patek forum.

[tyler1980]

Originally Posted by Socal to az

because some people want attention being the contrarian. Discussing non patek watches in every thread in a patek forum.

i wasn't agreeing with the first part of PJ's comment, just so were clear

[Hollister]

If you want an out-and-out steel sports watch, then I think the Rolex Submariner is about as good as anyone makes. Far more fit for purpose than anything PP have ever made, or will ever make.

As for this being the PP forum where dissenting voices are seemingly not allowed, have a look at this poll, right here, where a Rolex is walking all over a PP. Call the moderators, pronto!

https://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=549751

Finally, Neil, yes I agree the Mosers are an intriguing niche brand, ideal for a contrarian like me.

It's like trying to deal with a bunch of tired toddlers, all of whom seem to think that their toy is the best. Grow up!

My honest opinion is that, whilst I acquired two PPs about six or seven years ago, and am happy with both, if I were setting out right now, I would be looking elsewhere, and particularly so given the inflated prices now being demanded for the Nautilus. Why is that so hard to accept?

[Socal to az]

Originally Posted by Hollister

It's like trying to deal with a bunch of tired toddlers, all of whom seem to think that their toy is the best. Grow up!




My honest opinion is that, whilst I acquired two PPs about six or seven years ago, and am happy with both, if I were setting out right now, I would be looking elsewhere, and particularly so given the inflated prices now being demanded for the Nautilus.

What would be a tired toddler to me is someone who acquired two PPs about six or seven years ago but is now looking elsewhere, yet still spends all his time on the Patek forum.

[Peterandwatches]

Originally Posted by PJ S

What does stainless steel have to do with sports watches? Plenty of other materials are available.
In FPJ’s case, they went with titanium & aluminium alloy, and Moser does have a steel Pioneer, which is their take on a sports watch.

https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/fp...sport-titanium
http://watchesbysjx.com/2017/03/h-mo...-in-steel.html

Thanks for sharing. I stand corrected that these brands shun sports watches, especially as it's reported that Moser is actively taking steps to enter this market.

Perhaps in a few years, there will be more watches in non-precious metal, on metal bracelets, from these companies.

[PJ S]

^
No problem, Peter – that’s what sensible adults who understand the art of conversation and its fluidity, do. We have no problem following its ebb and flow between the central topic and related tangental ones, discussing the merits of what is brought forth.

[Socal to az]

Originally Posted by rw2008

Hello all,

My apologies for asking a question I'm sure has been addressed.

I'm very interested in a 5712, and this being my first Patek, I'm looking for advice.

Lets get this thread back on track as the OPs interest is in Patek and not other random brands.

My suggestion would be to get a relationship with your in state AD. While you currently love the 5712, there may be other watches to get. If this is the one and only Patek you have interest in, then grey market is not such a bad thing. I would not worry regarding the papers. You can register the watch in your name so service is not an issue. Likely by the time you need service, the watch will be out of warranty so you will have to pay for service anyways.

Good luck and let us know if there is other help we can provide.