The Rolex Forums   The Rolex Watch

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX


Go Back   Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum > Other (non-Rolex) Watch Topics > Breitling Discussion Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11 November 2018, 01:42 AM   #1
karasus
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: N/A
Watch: Royal Oak
Posts: 345
Unexpected Incoming Breitling Rattrapante - Split Seconds Chrono

I wasn't expecting to pick up a Breitling Navitimer but I am glad I did and have a fun story tell too.

I was with a friend visiting a local multi brand Authorized Dealer that was closing to check if anything was on discount. At first we were shown only a few really shitty watches that nobody wanted at any discount price. I mentioned to the dealer that I was considering a Navitimer and if they were also on discount. I was shown a 48mm Navitimer 1 B04 GMT on discount, awesome watch but it simply didn't fit my 6.5 inch wrist.

I told the the dealer that I would most likely go for a vintage watch since the new Navitimers are huge. He then proceeded to tell me how expensive repairs are on vintage, how they are not as reliable to current models etc etc etc. Then he tells me how they have a vintage Breitling model out in the back, that was not up for the current closure sale and the revision cost for the watch was over 4'000 dollars by Breitling.

That made me go WTF , ETAs or Venus movements used in earlier Breitlings don't cost that much to service, even a whole rework would be maximum 2k. I asked him if I could have a look at the watch, he went to the back and took it and then I noticed something odd.

First the watch had 3 chrono pushers at 2-4-10 o'clock, had three subdails all at the bottom, and a date window between 4 and 5 o'clock. No ETA or Venus movement has that dial configuration with that pusher configuration. When I picked up the watch, could hear/feel a rotor whirl so it was an automatic. The watch was thin, definitely less than 15mm but a bit more than 10mm and 38-40mm large. I ran the chrono pushed the 2 O'clock pusher then after a few seconds activated the 10 O'Clock pusher to see if I was ; OMG it was a rattrapante splits seconds chrono. When the watch passed the minute mark, the minutes jumped...

It was a bit puzzling, it clearly wasn't a manual wound Venus and was not an ETA. The dealer had no idea about the reference or when it was made what was the movement. However the dial layout, thinness of the chronograph, jumping minutes, and chronograph beat reminded me of another watch I own an AP Royal Oak Chrono which uses the F.Piguet 1185 Chronograph Movement that AP then decorates in house.

The F.Piguet 1185 isn't a splits seconds chrono but F.Piguet is the only manufacturer is one of the only movement makers to make high end ultra thin chronographs. They hold the record for the thinnest automatic movement and are the chronograph movement supplier to two of the three Holy Trinity, for the VC overseas chrono and AP royal oak chrono. If it was an F.Piguet movement in a Breitling Navitimer, then the dealer had no idea what he was offering. Just the assembled movement itself without the rest of the watch was worth 3'000 dollars. I look at the caseback, the watch is has the following numbers engraved: 32/100.

Then it all made sense, the costly service bill for replacing the parts, the dial layout, the watch dimensions, chronograph functions/behaviour, and finally the engraving. Based upon the dial and chronograph behaviour I was almost sure that it was an F.Piguet movement, but the engraving told me the final piece of the story. At some point Breitling must have issued a special edition to try and compete on the very high end with AP and VC. They bought a few of the high end F.Piguet movements and cased them in Navitimers hoping to appeal to the same buyer of a high end AP chrono or Overseas. It probably didn't work and the watch reference was forgotten over time.

If that was the case then this watch was special, I asked if they would sell and their best price. The dealer after some talking/convincing gave me a price. The owner's wife (not the dealer who was an employee) walked over, she didn't seem happy. It was "her" watch that she put in the back to keep once the sale would be done. She didn't seem happy I was buying "her" watch, I asked her if she knew the reference she didn't seem to know, but she thought the watch was nice and had already ordered a custom croco strap sized to her wrist. She was quite hostile, and wanted to get rid of me told me that it was the only strap available and that it was a women's size. Luckily I have thin wrists so it fit perfectly. I told the dealer that the price was ok with me and bought it. Then I was promptly kicked out by the owner's wife.

I went home and did a lot of research... After a few hours, I found the reference: H34030. It was a limited edition 100 piece run of the Navitimer made in 1996. It had the F.Piguet 1186 Rattrapante splits seconds movement, the world's first automatic split seconds movement and to date the thinnest automatic split seconds movement. It is an integrated vertical clutch column wheel chronograph, with an F.Piguet developed rattrapante modification.

Two other Breitlings used this movement: 25 pieces special edition 69 Avenger and a 1 year(1997-1998) run of the Navitimer Rattrapante. I wouldn't expect more than 300 pieces from Breitiling with the F.Piguet movements were ever produced. That is considering that the movement is high end, expensive to get for the manufacturer, and costly for Breitling if you don't put it into a watch that sells over 20k. I checked the recent auction prices for the piece which were very few, but they were are about 30-50% higher than what I paid for at the dealer.

Its a typical story of getting a bit of luck, having the right knowledge about watches, and looking at pieces that are not part of the trend (Stainless Steel Sports). Despite being a fraction of the price of its White Gold Royal Oak Chrono brother, its one of the pieces that is up there in terms of complication, value and looks.

Finally even though it is made of yellow gold, its surprisingly not flashy and almost looks toned down due to the large crystal/dial to case ratio. Fits not too large or small at 38.5mm and is just a looker :)
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 20181110_133752.jpg (266.3 KB, 263 views)
File Type: jpg 20181110_133730.jpg (228.8 KB, 259 views)
File Type: jpg 20181110_133759.jpg (221.8 KB, 254 views)
File Type: jpg 20181110_133829.jpg (251.8 KB, 254 views)
karasus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11 November 2018, 01:47 AM   #2
karasus
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: N/A
Watch: Royal Oak
Posts: 345
Next to its AP chrono cousin with the F.Piguet 1185 base movement.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg brothers.jpg (236.1 KB, 250 views)
karasus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12 November 2018, 02:50 PM   #3
BBL
"TRF" Member
 
BBL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Real Name: DM
Location: USA
Watch: DD-YG/DJ/Breitling
Posts: 8,795
Looks fantastic! Very cool.
__________________
.
People of integrity expect to be believed and when they are not they let time prove them right.
A best friend is like a four leaf clover - hard to find and lucky to have. SJP
BBL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 November 2018, 09:39 AM   #4
Mad Hatter
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 268
:c lap:
Awesome! Love it!
Mad Hatter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13 November 2018, 05:23 PM   #5
Justindo
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: California
Posts: 2,176
Nice looking watch and a great acquisition story.
Justindo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 November 2018, 01:48 PM   #6
ltmgeller
2024 Pledge Member
 
ltmgeller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Real Name: Mike
Location: New York
Watch: Rolex
Posts: 21,230
__________________
Oh, look at the time...
Official Member: 'WIS-CON' Las Vegas International GTG 2019
ltmgeller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14 November 2018, 11:04 PM   #7
nick c
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 26,846
Very nice!
nick c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17 November 2018, 02:21 AM   #8
breitlings
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Bethesda
Watch: Apple TV
Posts: 5,744
its interesting you posted this. just yesterday i was looking at an ebay auction of an avenger that had a double chrono movement like you said 25 piece limited edition. ask was very high.
breitlings is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19 November 2018, 04:34 AM   #9
Swiss Mad!
"TRF" Member
 
Swiss Mad!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Real Name: Max
Location: UK
Watch: Various
Posts: 3,722
Blimey!

The owners wife will be REALLY p*****d of if she reads this..

Congratulations on an awesome pick up & fair play to you for knowing your stuff...not your fault the AD didn't have a clue as to the watches true worth.



Sent from my Moto G (5) using Tapatalk
__________________

instagram: max.parkin
Swiss Mad! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21 November 2018, 08:24 AM   #10
karasus
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: N/A
Watch: Royal Oak
Posts: 345
Quote:
Originally Posted by breitlings View Post
its interesting you posted this. just yesterday i was looking at an ebay auction of an avenger that had a double chrono movement like you said 25 piece limited edition. ask was very high.
You mean this: https://www.ebay.com/p/Breitling-Ave...60/21012627749

Listed at 106,920.00$ USD?

You can take 100'000 USD off that number and I still paid less than that for the rattrapante

But damn the Chrono Rattrapante Avenger is a nice looking watch, just don't know if its worth 100k...
karasus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 November 2018, 12:50 AM   #11
Chester01
"TRF" Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: East Coast
Watch: 16610
Posts: 4,933
Nice find. I personally think all this Rolex SS madness has obsecured the fact that there are really great finds out there and that Rolex is not the only brand making watches. Enjoy a great piece.
Chester01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22 November 2018, 05:33 AM   #12
rootbeer7
"TRF" Member
 
rootbeer7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: london
Posts: 5,934
Beautiful watch. Congratulations on a great deal.
__________________
@imrootbeer7
rootbeer7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Takuya Watches

Bobs Watches

My Watch LLC

OCWatches

DavidSW Watches

Coronet


*Banners Of The Month*
This space is provided to horological resources.





Copyright ©2004-2024, The Rolex Forums. All Rights Reserved.

ROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEXROLEX

Rolex is a registered trademark of ROLEX USA. The Rolex Forums is not affiliated with ROLEX USA in any way.