Plastic Recycling Down to 5%....

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by Ruddiger

Howdy,

I know this sounds awful to say, but I’m quite sick of recycling. It’s such a colossal scam knowing that the vast majority of it goes right into a landfill anyways.

I think the biggest salt in the wounds for me is 50 years of guilt tripping the consumer, basically saying that if only I did better as a consumer, the problem would go away. Meanwhile, corporations gleefully produced products we have no choice but to buy with plastic that they have no intention of recycling in the first place.

Then, to add insult to injury, they expect me to sort it so they can cherry pick the items they can turn a quick buck on before dumping the rest in Mother Earth. It’s all so ridiculous.

Take care,

Ruddiger

So with the greatest of respect, what’s the answer?

I agree that encouraging corporations to produce products with less plastic and more recyclable content is a good thing but that still means that we as consumers have to do our part.

[daveathall]

We have 3 wheelie bins (Household waste (black) Plastic, paper and cardboard (Blue lid) and lastly, garden waste (Green)) we also have a blue box for glass and bottles, known as the box of shame.

[uscmatt99]

Originally Posted by brandrea

So with the greatest of respect, what’s the answer?

I agree that encouraging corporations to produce products with less plastic and more recyclable content is a good thing but that still means that we as consumers have to do our part.

I think that consumers always vote with their wallets, in aggregate. Companies in capitalist countries do as well and who is to blame them? Sure, you have folks who will attempt to recycle every item possible, choose alternatives when available that are more costly, but they are making only the tiniest dent in the problem. Similarly you've got companies like Patagonia that place a high value on environmentalism, supported by their customer base. (This is a textile issue rather than single use plastic issue, but under the same umbrella). Overall we generate too much waste unnecessarily because it is cheaper in the short term to do so and inconvenient and expensive in the short term to change. The only answer is to price these types of plastic out of the market and make alternatives more economically viable. But this will result in winners and losers and upset the status quo. Recycling can never be better than reusing, or just never using at all

[Blansky]

Originally Posted by brandrea

So with the greatest of respect, what’s the answer?

I agree that encouraging corporations to produce products with less plastic and more recyclable content is a good thing but that still means that we as consumers have to do our part.

From my point of view, the consumers HAVE been doing our part. It's the manufacturers that haven't. They haven't been forced to.

And the public have been led to believe that recycling has been somewhat successful, and meanwhile their recycled garbage has just been taken to the sorting centers and dumped into landfills.

We tackled styrofoam to some extent, but we need to do the same with plastic.

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by uscmatt99

I think that consumers always vote with their wallets, in aggregate. Companies in capitalist countries do as well and who is to blame them? Sure, you have folks who will attempt to recycle every item possible, choose alternatives when available that are more costly, but they are making only the tiniest dent in the problem. Similarly you've got companies like Patagonia that place a high value on environmentalism, supported by their customer base. (This is a textile issue rather than single use plastic issue, but under the same umbrella). Overall we generate too much waste unnecessarily because it is cheaper in the short term to do so and inconvenient and expensive in the short term to change. The only answer is to price these types of plastic out of the market and make alternatives more economically viable. But this will result in winners and losers and upset the status quo. Recycling can never be better than reusing, or just never using at all

Originally Posted by Blansky

From my point of view, the consumers HAVE been doing our part. It's the manufacturers that haven't. They haven't been forced to.

And the public have been led to believe that recycling has been somewhat successful, and meanwhile their recycled garbage has just been taken to the sorting centers and dumped into landfills.

We tackled styrofoam to some extent, but we need to do the same with plastic.

And that was the point of my original post …. Money and will whether it be consumer will, corporate will or political will.

[Toxicant]

The guy at my transfer station said the #1 and #2 plastic are the only ones recycled, all the rest goes into a land fill. They just have the dumpsters for all the crap plastic to make people feel better.

[DLRIDES]

Originally Posted by brandrea

As with most things, it’s possible with money and will.

Unfortunate and (agree with Dan) unconscionable.

I’ve been in the recycling industry for twenty years, plastic recycling is not (currently) monetarily feasible. New plastics can be manufactured for less than recycling, and I see nothing revolutionary on the horizon, nor does the industry.

BTW - The plastic recycling issue is going to be environmentally minuscule compared to EV battery component mining/recycling, unless something groundbreaking is discovered !

[TheVTCGuy]

Originally Posted by TheVTCGuy

I saw this article the other day, a little bit of hope.

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...tists-discover

IMHO, this, or something like it, is the answer. The Big problem with plastic is it will not degrade for (something like) 1,000 years. When a plastic bag is floating in the ocean, it is trash and a danger to marine life for thousands(?) of years. Now take the bamboo cutlery I use as an example. When exposed to the elements, in a landfill for example, bacteria or anaerobic activity or whatever (I don’t pretend to know exactly how it works) breaks down the wood in to elements and returns them to the Earth, I guess it will end up as dirt particles? It is kind of the Planet’s recycling system. Cardboard dumped in to the ocean will disappear in a matter of days, hardwood will probably take several years but it will be broken down and returned to the Earth as elements. Even metal will eventually be broken down in to elements. Plastic, does not. I think the solution is to come up with a “plastic” or like substitute that WILL decompose. I know part of the allure of plastic is that it will last “forever,” but the majority of uses, like grocery bags for example, are short-term use. I think the key is to manufacture a plastic for grocery bags and similar one-time or short time uses, that will degrade.

Secondly, to deal with the millions of tons of plastics we have already produced, we need to come up with a clean method of disposal. Hear me out on this, but those worms that eat plastic mentioned in the above article. What if we were to create centers where recovered waste plastic could be transported to, a sort of plastic-only landfill, and introduce billions or trillions of these worms to eat it. I know it sounds outlandish but why not? It would be a self-sustaining recycling plant.

Come to think of it, why not introduce Billions of these worms in to present landfills? They can eat the plastic already there.

I don’t pretend to have knowledge on any of these topics, so go ahead and laugh at me if you want, but these worms are a natural way to dispose of plastic, why don’t we use them?

[brandrea]

Originally Posted by DLRIDES

I’ve been in the recycling industry for twenty years, plastic recycling is not (currently) monetarily feasible. New plastics can be manufactured for less than recycling, and I see nothing revolutionary on the horizon, nor does the industry.

BTW - The plastic recycling issue is going to be environmentally minuscule compared to EV battery component mining/recycling, unless something groundbreaking is discovered !

I've been in the plastics manufacturing business for 35 years.

We can most certainly regrind and reuse our LLDPE more cheaply than buying virgin material. I'd consider this recycling

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

[austinp]

Originally Posted by Blansky

From my point of view, the consumers HAVE been doing our part. It's the manufacturers that haven't. They haven't been forced to.

And the public have been led to believe that recycling has been somewhat successful, and meanwhile their recycled garbage has just been taken to the sorting centers and dumped into landfills.

We tackled styrofoam to some extent, but we need to do the same with plastic.

Agree with this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[enjoythemusic]

Originally Posted by Dan Pierce

Not only sad but unconscionable.

^^^ this

[DLRIDES]

Originally Posted by brandrea

I've been in the plastics manufacturing business for 35 years.

We can most certainly regrind and reuse our LLDPE more cheaply than buying virgin material. I'd consider this recycling

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

Concur ………….. but there are hundreds of types, with thousands of formulations under the umbrella of “plastics”. Most of which can’t be mixed, and many can’t be remelted.

I don’t have a clue where it’s headed, but since the beginning of time, there are a constants that drives progress, necessity and money.

Approximately 60% of copper currently in use is recycled, and approximately 34% of all new copper comes from recycling. This is due to copper being more cost effective to recycle than mined and processed. IMO, when plastics are cost effective to recycle on a mass scale, it will happen.

[mountainjogger]

Current state of affairs or what actually gets recycled is truly sad.

[dddrees]

Illuminating, but as I mentioned in my particular location separating trash doesn’t much occur here with the exception of paper products.

From some of the comments some even doubt it’s really possible with plastic. Makes me wonder how good other countries do at this.

The one thing I thought that made the US great is that I was taught we used to take people from other countries as well as ideas from other countries as well. Personally I don’t get the impression that we do that so well or even hardly at all anymore.

Really does make me wonder how other countries fare at this sort of thing?

[Star Ferry]

In NYC recycling is the law, and people generally make an effort into sorting it. If you live in a modern high rise building, part of the issue is metal/wood/glass allegedly can damage the building’s trash compactor. So the building’s ownership wouldn’t want those materials going down the trash chute and would prefer they go in a recycling bin.

Do things actually get recycled? Most city government here is a complete grift. We have cops and janitors making 300K with (probably fabricated) overtime. So my best guess is it all gets dumped in a body of water or a hole somewhere, but only after countless environmental consultants and recycling contractors have been paid their millions for doing nothing.

[brandrea]

I understand why many are cynical. Change involving shifts in human behavior take time and are seldom met with enthusiasm.

If there’s any good news in the article, it’s that there is room for mankind to improve. I believe that if we can “put men on the moon” way back in the 60’s, we can figure out this.

[Ruddiger]

Originally Posted by brandrea

So with the greatest of respect, what’s the answer?

I agree that encouraging corporations to produce products with less plastic and more recyclable content is a good thing but that still means that we as consumers have to do our part.

Howdy,

Recycling is like clean water. All the profits are in pollution. Businesses needed to be forced to stop dumping sewage into rivers and they need to be forced to use recycled plastics and shift away from non-biodegradable packaging even if it increases cost. To me, that’s the only way to do it.

Obviously, that will increase consumer cost, however, we’re either serious about it or we’re not. To quote Anakin Skywalker, “well then, they should be made to.”

Take care,

Ruddiger