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16 February 2021, 03:02 PM | #91 |
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I read all 52 pages of the legal document and claims by the plaintiff.
Incredible, we do live in a time of fraud and deception. The entire document read like a soap opera. Most of the questions about how Rolex does its' business and the conspiracy theories about backdoor flipping to grey markets has been well documented in this claim. Rolex USA being a VERY private company will not like any of this getting out into the public. Although Rolex USA played NO part in any of this dirty business does not mean they won't be subpoenaed to come to court and answer to questions surrounding Rolex Corporate policy where contracts with AD's are concerned. CDP will lose their AD status obviously. Was CDP the only AD doing this? Well, this opens up pandora's box for any other employees from other AD's to come forward with information about what their AD's were doing at their respective locations. I think over the next few months there will be more lawsuits similar to the CDP fiasco. I think this may be just the push that Rolex SA needs to get them to create their own corporate owned Rolex Boutiques around the globe. I think to this point they were thinking about it, but now it looks like a certainty. I think any AD that signed a Rolex contract should be made aware that once it ends, there will be NO renewal. I would be interested to know if "Ms. Duan" is still in the Continental USA or has fled back to China with her bag of cash. My own observation from what I read in that legal document is that CDP hired Duan and used her for her connections with the Asian community and her precarious immigration status. I figure they figured that if things went sour, she'd bear the brunt of it all as it was her name all over the paperwork and that she'd be immediately deported the everything swept under the rug. Time will tell, but this court case could take a couple of years to sort out if not longer. That is unless Rolex gives her a settlement on behalf of CDP. Problem is, if they do that, they'll have to settle with anyone else who comes forward with their story in the future from other AD's. |
16 February 2021, 03:03 PM | #92 |
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16 February 2021, 03:22 PM | #93 | |
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16 February 2021, 06:33 PM | #94 |
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Lawsuit against AD for grey market dealing
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16 February 2021, 06:35 PM | #95 |
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It’s all over the forum and is a load of tosh anyway
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16 February 2021, 08:32 PM | #96 |
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Yes, you missed the bus on this one.
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16 February 2021, 08:38 PM | #97 |
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The concept of an AD taking advantage of the opportunity to make $15K on Daytona 116500 rather than $5K can't be a surprise to anyone. Imagine the temptation to sell a stainless 5711 for $80K rather than $35K. Any AD whose suppliers include AP, PP or Rolex can turn a watch store into a gold mine.
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16 February 2021, 10:43 PM | #98 |
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Does a high grey market price help brand sales?
Disturbing how many new unworn PPs are available in the grey market..... How hard would it be with a mere 60,000 sales a year to offer a model ID checking App to avoid being sold a stolen watch, for example? This could serve more than one purpose.... |
16 February 2021, 10:47 PM | #99 |
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The lawsuit doesn’t change anything as long as it benefits PP/AP/Rolex. Watches are briskly sold once they reached the AD. In the manufacturer’s record that is considered a watch sold, irrespective of which client it goes to. If they wanted to take action it would have been done a long time ago. Just like how Rolex completely stopped one of the companies that modded DJs with colourful dials so quickly even though the OP 36/41 were not introduced to the market yet. So don’t expect anything to change as long as sales continue to soar despite the lawsuit. At most a ‘stern’ warning letter to the AD lol
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16 February 2021, 11:21 PM | #100 |
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After spending billions on marketing, I'm pretty sure Rolex does not want to be associated with all the negativity surrounding this alleged practice.
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16 February 2021, 11:47 PM | #101 |
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As a long time buyer of Rolex watches all over the USA, I’ve been introduced several times to the owner of CDP. We have attended private social functions in Chicago, New York and Los Angeles. This man always struck me as a braggart and loved to exclaim how big a Rolex AD he was. The top management of this company also acted entitled.
"The Rolex Way? Hardly. Rolex could care less. Purely hypocritical. I feel sorry for the ADs with honor who are punished by the arrogance of Holtzman and Co. He originally owned credit jewelry stores and bought Gruen’s assets. Can’t buy class or honor. |
16 February 2021, 11:48 PM | #102 |
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Then A LOT of AD's should. Oh and if you guys think that Rolex has no clue this is going on, you live under a rock. While they will distance themselves they absolutely know the back door BS going on with grays. You don't have that many "brand new" watches at grays and not know this crap is and has been going on for years.
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16 February 2021, 11:51 PM | #103 |
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Lol, shocker! I mean seriously, is this a surprise to anyone. I mean all the business about demand, and all the folks in Asia buying up all the goods. About time people wake up to the fact they are being played, and it happened because so many viewed things through emotion and did not apply simple reason when there were so many facts out there. I mean I contested the so called “Asian market” demand just last week with facts and people here couldn’t handle it. Well now we will see what’s what.
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17 February 2021, 12:14 AM | #104 | |
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And PP????????? |
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17 February 2021, 12:14 AM | #105 | |
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17 February 2021, 01:28 AM | #106 | |
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I wish that more watch enthusiasts realized how we have the potential to contribute to situations like this. The irony of having "trusted sellers", meaning scalpers, who profit from similar efforts is not lost on me. Their lack of transparency regarding how they acquire their products is significant. Rolex and PP play a part in it and we all have the potential to do so, too. If true, CDP really screwed up and crossed many lines. Yet, there are likely similar efforts going on that are technically legal, but just immoral. |
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17 February 2021, 03:26 AM | #107 |
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A few thoughts...
1. This isn't really about being a "whistleblower" in a meaningful way; this is about being mad that watches were being unfairly allocated, compromising plaintiffs' ability to make sales themselves. They just backed into that in order to justify the suit. 2. There is a huge difference between violating company policy, violating a commercial contract with Rolex and violating state/federal law. There are suggestions of the latter, but only really solid evidence of the former. 3. We're assuming that Rolex was the victim of some kind of fraud here. However, I've seen speculation that the company knows darn well about ADs moving large volumes of PM pieces at discount to the grey market, and relies on this to avoid publicly "discounting" those watches. 4. Not sure what the overseas angle adds to this... 5. Most interesting to this forum: the assertion that all "scarce" (read: stainless) Rolexes are special order, and that the "waiting for one to come in" is just a line that customers are fed... |
17 February 2021, 03:28 AM | #108 |
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Just jumping in to say I've never had a good experience in CD (multiple locations) over the years..
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17 February 2021, 03:56 AM | #109 |
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Not surprised ADs resort to shenanigans to peddle watches that are 2-3x their profit potential. They are selling stock at $10k knowing they can actually get away with 2-3x profit... all you need is a pansy to take the fall when discovered!
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17 February 2021, 05:55 AM | #110 |
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I think there are some criminal issues here. I guess it would come down to taxes like the ferrari NA CEO.
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17 February 2021, 06:38 AM | #111 |
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For those of you that say “There is not enough here for a conviction.... no criminal element.. will be settled before it reaches court blah blah blah..” Are all probably right, I doubt we will see anything in court, but you’re missing the point. This practice (IMHO) is widespread amongst ADs. FINALLY, it is being placed in the public arena with this lawsuit. Again IMHO, I think there has been significant damage to this AD’s reputation, (which I think it should and am glad for) but MAYBE, this will curtail other ADs from using this practice to such a great extent. MAYBE, it will have some effect and offer us poor schleps that walk in to an AD with a hope of buying a SS sports at MSRP MORE of a chance.
It might not have any effect at all, but at least this is now out in the public and MIGHT have a positive impact (albeit very slight) on the average Rolex fan that would like to buy from ADs at MSRP. Maybe |
17 February 2021, 07:01 AM | #112 | |
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That all depends on whether there are actual laws broken. And it's still not clear if there were. We don't know that, for example, the store wasn't recording the sale at "full price, no tax" for a Rolex audit and "discount price + tax" for reporting sales tax to the state. The latter would seem to avoid violating any laws (I recall buying a Miele vacuum this way; store "paid the tax" since Miele doesn't allow discounting). So, once again, it all depends on whether they were doing anything that would actually piss anybody off (besides the salespeople set up for failure because they didn't have an outlet for large numbers of watches under this "system"). |
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17 February 2021, 07:04 AM | #113 |
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I found and started watching the Time Piece Gentleman on YT and he basically states that all his "new" watches have been back-door'd by AD's and they can't call him fast enough.
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17 February 2021, 07:04 AM | #114 | |
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Now, there is the issue of the sought-after stainless watches... But all we've learned here is that they can be ordered (for the right person), and the assertion that "you have to wait til one comes in" is bullshit. Ultimately, though, I don't see how any customers actually lost out, or would have had their difficulty of purchasing a watch increased. |
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17 February 2021, 07:11 AM | #115 | |
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17 February 2021, 09:21 AM | #116 |
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It might dissuade a few ADs to think twice. There's nothing wrong with making a good or even great living, but whe you bite the hand that feeds you, you have to pay the price. Rolex has a set of rules the ADs agree to abide by and if they don't (and especially if they are caught) they deserve to lose AD status, IMO.
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17 February 2021, 09:31 AM | #117 | |
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17 February 2021, 12:37 PM | #118 | |
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Your average jury or judge isn't going to have sympathy for someone who is selling luxury goods from a retail location for additional, untaxed profit, akin to scalping. Furthermore, the defendant can claim that Rolex puts unfair demands on his business as an AD and this requires him/her to bend/break the rules in what is a rampant practice anyway, this makes Rolex look bad. Obviously this is all a stretch but it does have the potential to go bad for all parties involved. |
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17 February 2021, 12:40 PM | #119 |
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I actually enjoyed reading all 50-some pages. Need to get outside more. Only one ceramic SS Daytona was mentioned (by price). Lots of 16610LV references and 1-2 116710 BLNRs.
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17 February 2021, 12:55 PM | #120 | ||
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cd peacock , illinois , lawsuit , patek phillippe , rolex |
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