I Was Robbed Monday Night in Valrico, FL

[tbonesteak]

Good luck OP, sorry to hear...

Craigslist is unfortunately a very shady place.

[dera]

Originally Posted by rr-nyc

It's also posted on the Hillsborough County Sheriff facebook page.

This was not a very smart move from the Sheriff's Department. Imagine this scenario;

The person is found, and unless he is found with the original watch in his possession, he will walk. And to pull a stunt like this, I assume he's not that stupid that he will walk around with your Sub in his wrist.

After that, he would have every Floridian "Feelings hurt? Call Kurt!"-lawyer calling him wanting to sue the Sheriff's Department for some astronomical amount for slander, libel, breaking the just process of the law etc, because they posted that, portraying him as guilty of something he did not end up being convicted for.

[tbonesteak]

Originally Posted by dera

This was not a very smart move from the Sheriff's Department. Imagine this scenario;

The person is found, and unless he is found with the original watch in his possession, he will walk. And to pull a stunt like this, I assume he's not that stupid that he will walk around with your Sub in his wrist.

After that, he would have every Floridian "Feelings hurt? Call Kurt!"-lawyer calling him wanting to sue the Sheriff's Department for some astronomical amount for slander, libel, breaking the just process of the law etc, because they posted that, portraying him as guilty of something he did not end up being convicted for.

I disagree.

OP still has his word against the crook, still has a video of the meeting happening with the crook, & maybe the crook did the communications from an email address that can be traced back to a device found on his person or in his home.

Without help from the public, good chance they'd never identify the scumbag.

What really sucks in this story is that the OP will most likely not recover his watch.

[dera]

Originally Posted by tbonesteak

I disagree.

OP still has his word against the crook, still has a video of the meeting happening with the crook, & maybe the crook did the communications from an email address that can be traced back to a device found on his person or in his home.

Without help from the public, good chance they'd never identify the scumbag.

What really sucks in this story is that the OP will most likely not recover his watch.

Obviously the crook will say the meeting happened, he did not like the watch(or even says he thought it was a fake), he drove away, end of story.

Unless the exchange is on tape (this is why it happened outside) that he swapped the watches, or if he has the original watch (that the OP can obviously prove ownership to) in his possession, there is absolutely nothing apart from OPs word to prosecute him. So he would walk, very likely not even go to trial for it.

What I'm just saying, is that the Sheriff's wording could've been more discreet.

[rr-nyc]

Originally Posted by dera

This was not a very smart move from the Sheriff's Department. Imagine this scenario;

The person is found, and unless he is found with the original watch in his possession, he will walk. And to pull a stunt like this, I assume he's not that stupid that he will walk around with your Sub in his wrist.

After that, he would have every Floridian "Feelings hurt? Call Kurt!"-lawyer calling him wanting to sue the Sheriff's Department for some astronomical amount for slander, libel, breaking the just process of the law etc, because they posted that, portraying him as guilty of something he did not end up being convicted for.

Huh? No

According to this logic, someone can purse snatch an old woman and spend all the cash before the cops arrest and it's like it never happened. Sorry but that could be the most illogical reasoning; second only to the other post suggesting DNA evidence not being present on the watch(es). lol. This is a grand larceny case, not capital murder.

[tbonesteak]

Originally Posted by dera

Obviously the crook will say the meeting happened, he did not like the watch(or even says he thought it was a fake), he drove away, end of story.

Unless the exchange is on tape (this is why it happened outside) that he swapped the watches, or if he has the original watch (that the OP can obviously prove ownership to) in his possession, there is absolutely nothing apart from OPs word to prosecute him. So he would walk, very likely not even go to trial for it.

What I'm just saying, is that the Sheriff's wording could've been more discreet.

Are you a lawyer in the state of Florida?

[rr-nyc]

Originally Posted by tbonesteak

Are you a lawyer in the state of Florida?

Is there a Seoul, FL?

[tbonesteak]

Originally Posted by rr-nyc

Is there a Seoul, FL?

None that I am aware of.

[dera]

Originally Posted by rr-nyc

Huh? No

According to this logic, someone can purse snatch an old woman and spend all the cash before the cops arrest and it's like it never happened. Sorry but that could be the most illogical reasoning; second only to the other post suggesting DNA evidence not being present on the watch(es). lol. This is a grand larceny case, not capital murder.

I'm sorry but that's exactly the case. Unless there is any evidence of that snatching happening, apart from the old woman saying that's what happened, there would be no conviction. No proof, no evidence, no case.

I'll turn it the other way around.
If I meet someone, no matter for what, and afterwards say he stole my wallet - would he be convicted for grand larceny? According to your logic yes he would.

DNA evidence means nothing, like I said, the crook would very likely say he went to see the watch, did not like it (but handled it = DNA evidence transferred to the watch in question), and said good bye. There is already proof the meeting happened, but there is no evidence the claimed swap/crime took place then. (this is an assumption, OP hasn't told if there is CCTV tape showing this happening).

(And no, IANAL, but this is common sense. Suspect has no stolen merchandise in his possession, there is no evidence of the swap happening, I'd love to see the prosecutor who goes to court with this case. Or more like - I'd love to see the lawyer who would lose this defense.)

The best way to make sure this crook gets what he deserves is to find the watch. Local pawn shops, Craigslist listings and so on and so on. If they can find the watch and connect that to the person in the pictures, then it's game over for him. Without that link, he walks.

[rr-nyc]

Originally Posted by dera

I'm sorry but that's exactly the case. Unless there is any evidence of that snatching happening, apart from the old woman saying that's what happened, there would be no conviction. No proof, no evidence, no case.

I'll turn it the other way around.
If I meet someone, no matter for what, and afterwards say he stole my wallet - would he be convicted for grand larceny? According to your logic yes he would.

DNA evidence means nothing, like I said, the crook would very likely say he went to see the watch, did not like it (but handled it = DNA evidence transferred to the watch in question), and said good bye. There is already proof the meeting happened, but there is no evidence the claimed swap/crime took place then. (this is an assumption, OP hasn't told if there is CCTV tape showing this happening).

(And no, IANAL, but this is common sense. Suspect has no stolen merchandise in his possession, there is no evidence of the swap happening, I'd love to see the prosecutor who goes to court with this case. Or more like - I'd love to see the lawyer who would lose this defense.)

No, witnesses to a purse snatching and circumstantial evidence that ties someone to the time and place of the theft can get you charged and even convicted.

The thief in this case doesn't need to be in possession of the watch to be prosecuted or convicted. In fact, if he sold it, it only helps the prosecuted case if and when its located. I don't know what your example of a wallet means so I won't try to answer it.

If the thief is caught, what would his defense be? That he changed his mind because the Op was trying to sell a fake? Sure that makes a lot of sense. What would the motivation be? The OP has proof that the watch in question was legally his at the time the crime occurred. Furthermore, do you think the girl in the car wasn't in on it? Don't be naive to think she wasn't... and if she knew, is she wiling to purger herself to corroborate the guys story? I doubt it.

[tbonesteak]

So according to the legal opinion of someone who hasn't established their credentials, unless caught red handed or on videotape doing the deed, convicting (yet alone even prosecuting) is basically impossible.

[dera]

Originally Posted by rr-nyc

No, witnesses to a purse snatching and circumstantial evidence that ties someone to the time and place of the theft can get you charged and even convicted.

The thief in this case doesn't need to be in possession of the watch to be prosecuted or convicted. In fact, if he sold it, it only helps the prosecuted case if and when its located.

If the thief is caught, what would his defense be? That he changed his mind because the Op was trying to sell a fake? Sure that makes a lot of sense. What would the motivation be? The OP has proof that the watch in question was legally his at the time the crime occurred. Furthermore, do you think the girl in the car wasn't in on it? Don't be naive to think she wasn't... and if she knew, is she wiling to purger herself to corroborate the guys story? I doubt it.

In this case there are no witnesses to the actual event, which is the watch swap to the fake one. Obviously if there is an eyewitness of the swap happening or if you can see it on the tapes, or some other supporting evidence, then situation is completely different. But when going solely on the facts presented by the OP, there is no eyewitness/other evidence of the swap taking place. This is the problem. It turns it into a he-said-she-said case.

So, his defense would be that he went to see a watch, didn't like it, and walked away. Nothing, apart from owners story, ties him with the disappearance of the Sub.

Obviously the girl was part of the plan, that goes without saying. I'm guessing they have done this before (or - they will do it again if this was the first time), it's quite an elaborate plan and needs some serious cojones to do it.

I'm not saying finding these people is pointless, obviously there is a chance when you find him, he's sitting on 50 watches stolen this way. Then he's dead meat, again. But if there are a) no eyewitnesses, b) no other supporting evidence, c) no pattern of previous events with the same scheme and suspect or d) no original watch found, it will be tricky.

If the police are already looking for him for 50 other things of similar nature, then obviously none of the above apply.

[rr-nyc]

Originally Posted by tbonesteak

So according to the legal opinion of someone who hasn't established their credentials, unless caught red handed or on videotape doing the deed, convicting (yet alone even prosecuting) is basically impossible.

Apparently

[dera]

Rather than argue, we'll just wait and see what happens.

[gwozhog]

You might want to hit a few trendy bars and night clubs in the area on the weekend to see if you can find him yourself.

[520Matt]

Following.

[improviz]

Originally Posted by dera

Rather than argue, we'll just wait and see what happens.

Are you an attorney? Please answer.

[tbonesteak]

Any update here OP?

[Levelpar1]

I wish I had some good new about my case. I have not heard one thing from the Sheriffs office since about 2 weeks after the crime happened. There was not a single lead with all of the media coverage that we received. I have resigned myself to the fact that I will never see this watch again or the scumbag getting arrested.

[cop414]

Sorry to hear Joe, thanks for the update.

[Cajunmustang]

Don't give up that fast. Sometimes it takes time. If you gave the S/O the serial number they will put it in ncic.Goes nationwide the info on the watch. I'm sure some CI will give him up. That's a damn good photo of him. If the S/O or P.D. Has a pawn shop Detail they will cross check on records. Just hang in there!

[RW16610]

Also sorry to hear this even happened. Like the others I'm hoping they're able to find him and bring him in soon.

[Relyt]

Send me the watch info in a PM. I'll look through our national PAWN database. I've got a thread about this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jrs146]

Man this is a bummer... So sorry for the situation that you are in. These types of things really make me think about this entire buying/selling thing. I've sold many watches F2F and I do realize there is a big risk. I think I'll be doing it less in the future unless the person has a known history. Was your watch insured?

[Cajunmustang]

Originally Posted by jrs146

Man this is a bummer... So sorry for the situation that you are in. These types of things really make me think about this entire buying/selling thing. I've sold many watches F2F and I do realize there is a big risk. I think I'll be doing it less in the future unless the person has a known history. Was your watch insured?

Do it at a police dept. parking lot. I've have read a lot of departments have a safe zone at their office for ftf transactions. Not trying to scare you off I worked a case where a victim who was selling knock off movado watches in another jurisdiction was robbed and kidnapped. He was put in the trunk and driven to a remote area when one of our units drove up. As he went to to check them out they attempted to run him down with their vehicle. He fired his weapon several times hitting the vehicle, one of which hit the trunk,by the luck of God victim wasn't hit. Deputy didnt know anyone was in trunk. Long story short both suspects were arrested and sent to prison. The victim was safe no injuries but was shaken up to say the least. He told me that he was going to find a legitimate job.
People just need to be aware before jumping into something. Sometimes people get blinded by easy cash. There are plenty of predators out there.

[Desibaba]

This is exactly why I like to lose money by going to a reputable brick and mortar jeweler than getting more by selling privately. Yes, I lose money but the peace of mind and my safety make up for it and I dont have to deal with random people wanting to meet me.