Vintage Daytona Service

[HMHM]

Just wondering, does anyone have a vintage Daytona that was fully serviced by RSC recently? If yes, how did the watch turn out and how was the experience like?

I know it destroys the value of the vintage piece, but just curious if the watch was restored to factory new condition

[ELLimon]

Vintage Daytona’s have valjoux 72, most likely will not be serviced by Rolex.

Go with a special vintage Rolex watchmaker.
…
If el primero or newer, just tell Rolex to not swap hands and dial. I ask not to polish too.

[HMHM]

Originally Posted by ELLimon

Vintage Daytona’s have valjoux 72, most likely will not be serviced by Rolex.

Go with a special vintage Rolex watchmaker.
…
If el primero or newer, just tell Rolex to not swap hands and dial. I ask not to polish too.

Yes I'm aware of the independents, but just looking for any reviews from people who had their vintage Daytona refurbished by Rolex themselves

[ELLimon]

Originally Posted by HMHM

Yes I'm aware of the independents, but just looking for any reviews from people who had their vintage Daytona refurbished by Rolex themselves

I tried servicing my Tudor Montecarlo by Dallas service center, it has a Valjoux 234 , same family as valjoux 72, just 2 registers and date.

They said, nope we don’t have no parts for it. It needed a new mainspring.

[HMHM]

Originally Posted by ELLimon

I tried servicing my Tudor Montecarlo by Dallas service center, it has a Valjoux 234 , same family as valjoux 72, just 2 registers and date.

They said, nope we don’t have no parts for it. It needed a new mainspring.

Oh god. That not very good... I thought Rolex would handle the repair if everything is genuine with the watch. I'm trying to assess the path towards a vintage watch and see if it can be restored to factory new condition following service by RSC.

thanks for the reply. appreciate it.

[zapokee]

RSC also wouldn't service my Tudor Snowflake, saying they didn't have the parts for it.

Obvously Rolex are capable of making the parts, having made them in the first place. I guess they just want you to buy a new Rolex rather than having your old one fixed.

[ELLimon]

First of all, can you tell us what vintage Daytona model ?

As I mentioned El Primero based should be ok with RSC.

[HMHM]

Originally Posted by ELLimon

First of all, can you tell us what vintage Daytona model ?

As I mentioned El Primero based should be ok with RSC.

I’m looking towards 6263 or 6265. Preferably Big Red black dial. Keen to have it clean, new bracelet, re-lumed with luminova but maintaining the same dial. Also to have RSC service to confirm authenticity.

[ELLimon]

Originally Posted by HMHM

I’m looking towards 6263 or 6265. Preferably Big Red black dial. Keen to have it clean, new bracelet, re-lumed with luminova but maintaining the same dial. Also to have RSC service to confirm authenticity.

Hands for a 6293 tritium are $6000, might not be good idea to have them relume/replaced with service. Replacing the bracelet is easy and might be done by RSC.

I recommend you looking at the new Tudor BB chronograph. I just got one yesterday .

Is what you want minus the crown, the price tag, plus waterproof and 5 years warranty from Rolex.

[HMHM]

3FBB72B1-9C88-49CD-B29A-7E4B05F1ADBD.jpeg

Haha I have one too! But in black dial of course! Just that recently I have been reading about the Franken ‘Oyster sotto’ watch on Perezscope and was wondering if I should plan ahead regarding acquiring a vintage piece to complement all my black dial chronographs.

Congrats on your new BB chrono!

[ELLimon]

Originally Posted by HMHM

Attachment 1247858

Haha I have one too! But in black dial of course! Just that recently I have been reading about the Franken ‘Oyster sotto’ watch on Perezscope and was wondering if I should plan ahead regarding acquiring a vintage piece to complement all black dial chronographs.

Nice piece!

I think, some one like Giovanni at The dependent in San Francisco

or the good people at VRF can help you authenticate the case, dial, hands and movement.

There’s lots of money to be made on fake Daytona’s, people willing to destroy a $3000 dollar watch to make fake Daytona’s.

[BDII]

Sorry… I’m a little confused? You are wanting to find a 6263, and then re-lume it?

As almost all of the value in these things is in the dial, I wonder if there is another route that might be more cost effective? Seems like spending a lot of money just to immediately destroy the value of the watch…

[HMHM]

Originally Posted by BDII

Sorry… I’m a little confused? You are wanting to find a 6263, and then re-lume it?

As almost all of the value in these things is in the dial, I wonder if there is another route that might be more cost effective? Seems like spending a lot of money just to immediately destroy the value of the watch…

Yeah I’m a little torn about it as well about this tbh…. The ‘Big Red’ Daytona has always caught my eye and has led me to buy new pieces that look like it such as the Tudor BB chrono and the Daytona (black dial). What I’m thinking about is essentially something along the lines of Ferrari Classiche or Singer type of restoration but for watches if you get what I mean. Buying such an expensive watch with stretch bracelet, dust and dirt around the case and non-functioning lume takes away the joy of getting a new watch. I want to feel like I’m buying the watch itself in 1970.

I certainly think this is an area Rolex could explore? Restoration of classic watches for an appropriate amount (translate as higher than average cost). It could be done with cars, why not watches?

[swish77]

Originally Posted by HMHM

Just wondering, does anyone have a vintage Daytona that was fully serviced by RSC recently? If yes, how did the watch turn out and how was the experience like?

I know it destroys the value of the vintage piece, but just curious if the watch was restored to factory new condition

I had my 16520 Daytona at the RSC in NYC not too long ago for a movement-only service and all was good. Cost me about $1500.

I've also had my 6263 at the RSC for minor stuff, and contrary to what you might have read, they will indeed service vintage Daytonas. However, nowadays it's an ordeal.

They send the watch to what they describe as a special vintage-only service center in Pennsylvania. (Not sure what they do overseas, but presumably there's a similar procedure. There's also a vintage-only RSC in Geneva.) They require a deposit for an "authentication" process on the watch, the cost of which can go to the service fees if you decide to proceed. They'll make recommendations, including any replacement parts. I don't think they relume but instead will just swap out the dial. Still, if the dial and hands are in good shape, there's no obligation to change them.

All in all, not a good route to go for high-end vintage Rolexes.

[FrenchBigCrown]

Originally Posted by swish77

They send the watch to what they describe as a special vintage-only service center in Pennsylvania. (Not sure what they do overseas, but presumably there's a similar procedure. There's also a vintage-only RSC in Geneva.) They require a deposit for an "authentication" process on the watch, the cost of which can go to the service fees if you decide to proceed. They'll make recommendations, including any replacement parts.

This is the procedure in the UK too... they send it to Geneve. I just did this exercise with a Milsub and paid the 2k 'authentication' quotation - but not the five-figure service.

I just wanted it verifying/authenticating.

I still need to collect it (next time I'm in the UK) - as it's pretty much impossible to get shipping insurance for anything over £50k.

[roh123]

Might be different in different part of the world but as far as I know manual daytonas now go to Geneva. I would estimate a five digit quote from them for a normal service. Go to a reputable independant instead.

[Dan S]

I personally don't feel that it's a great idea to buy a $50k-$100k watch and then immediately cut the value in half by replacing or ruining the parts that make it desirable and valuable. There are only a certain number of these watches left, and I think it would be nice to preserve them for people who appreciate their originality and history.

Perhaps the OP could consider a vintage-style modern watch, or he could use service parts purchased on the secondary market, and hold onto the original parts without modifying them.

[lee fowler]

Rolex 6241 serviced in Geneva and at a cost of £12k! Not my watch either.

[roh123]

Just to be clear.. It’s not really a great idea to give any expensive vintage Rolex to RSC. No matter if it is a vintage Daytona, a gilt sports watch, Comex diver or a Milsub. You service them through vintage specialists that understand what you have.

Only real reason to pass a watch through RSC or Rolex Geneva is if you have a questionable watch and want a service to verify authenticity.

[mrarchiegoodwin]

This notion interests me. If cars, why not watches? Is it due to tradition that influences present day sensitivities? Throughout Rolex Forums (and elsewhere in the watch world) there are posts that disdain "inauthentic Franken-watches", but amongst car enthusiasts modified vehicles may be praised as restomod, or custom, or special. Could it be because modified cars have always been with us--including coach built town cars in the 1920s+ to souped up cars for competition in the 1950s+--and therefore acceptable as well as admired? Nowadays, Singer "reimagines" Porsche 964s and DK Engineering "reimagines" Ferrari 250GTs. No one complains that they are Franken-cars--and old 250GTs are relatively uncommon. I was amazed when Artisans de Geneve were praised for skeletonizing Rolex watches and Bamford for their dark Rolexes. But these are elite companies. Would the Carroll Shelby of the watch world be as welcome? The watch world does not seem ready to embrace what you have in mind. And why not? Destroying a work of art? Even Michelangelo's Sistine Chapel ceiling was repainted. I am hoping vintage watch collectors on this forum will enlighten us.

Originally Posted by HMHM

Yeah I’m a little torn about it as well about this tbh…. The ‘Big Red’ Daytona has always caught my eye and has led me to buy new pieces that look like it such as the Tudor BB chrono and the Daytona (black dial). What I’m thinking about is essentially something along the lines of Ferrari Classiche or Singer type of restoration but for watches if you get what I mean. Buying such an expensive watch with stretch bracelet, dust and dirt around the case and non-functioning lume takes away the joy of getting a new watch. I want to feel like I’m buying the watch itself in 1970.

I certainly think this is an area Rolex could explore? Restoration of classic watches for an appropriate amount (translate as higher than average cost). It could be done with cars, why not watches?

[FrenchBigCrown]

Originally Posted by mrarchiegoodwin

This notion interests me. If cars, why not watches? Is it due to tradition that influences present day sensitivities? Throughout Rolex Forums (and elsewhere in the watch world) there are posts that disdain "inauthentic Franken-watches", but amongst car enthusiasts modified vehicles may be praised as restomod, or custom, or special. Could it be because modified cars have always been with us--including coach built town cars in the 1920s+ to souped up cars for competition in the 1950s+--and therefore acceptable as well as admired? Nowadays, Singer "reimagines" Porsche 964s and DK Engineering "reimagines" Ferrari 250GTs. No one complains that they are Franken-cars--and old 250GTs are relatively uncommon. I was amazed when Artisans de Geneve were praised for skeletonizing Rolex watches and Bamford for their dark Rolexes. But these are elite companies. Would the Carroll Shelby of the watch world be as welcome? The watch world does not seem ready to embrace what you have in mind. And why not? Destroying a work of art? Even Michelangelo's Sistine Chapel ceiling was repainted. I am hoping vintage watch collectors on this forum will enlighten us.

Art is subjective. Like architecture, cars or even clothing... we all 'like what we like'.

I have no issue with Hot Rods or 'customised' cars - I spent a fortune creating a 'McQueen' 911 2.4S in Slate Grey while I was being told that I was devaluing the car - I didn't care, I wanted a McQueen clone.

I can also appreciate the beauty of a factory stock automobile too - like a Ferrari 308 - they just got the look so right (in my opinion, of course. I'm sure there are plenty who just don't like that look).

I also had Ivan The Dark Lord create a dial (using a service dial) for my vintage 6538 - because I didn't like the original 'patina'd' dial and I wanted it to look sharp. I know that might be seen as sacrilege to some, but it's my watch and I wear it.

So, I guess it depends on where one finds the 'beauty' - A factory stock Aston Martin DB5? Or one that's been modified with newer technology?

I can't speak for anyone else, but I find beauty in an 'original' preserved (or even sympathetically refurbished) Big Red Daytona - I wouldn't change a thing.

However, I can also appreciate a modern Submariner given the Bamford treatment. I probably wouldn't do it to a 1680 or 5512 though.

It's a matter of choice. And it always will be.

[HMHM]

I don't have a problem with restoration as long as it is done by the manufacturer or a recognised partner of the manufacturer. Singer and DK engineering 250 SWB revival are probably as far as I would consider legit (if I have the money, which I don't). The same principle applies to watches for me. If RSC is willing to service a legit vintage 6263 Daytona and provide full service papers to assure the authenticity and function of the watch, I'm fine with it. The question/dilemma for me is - is it the right thing to do? Seeing so many experts here on VRF suggest that it is not the right thing to do as they rather have an independent refurbish their watch. I have never bought a pre-owned watch ever so buying a 40 y/o watch is something new to me, and it comes with a high cost which is daunting on its own, let alone for a used watch.

The choice would be between a 5172G or a 6263 vintage Daytona for me after much consideration as both are around the same price point, but one is a new watch with provenance and authenticity guaranteed while the other depends a lot on the seller hence the information gathering process and learning about both.

[Chester01]

Originally Posted by ELLimon

Hands for a 6293 tritium are $6000, might not be good idea to have them relume/replaced with service. Replacing the bracelet is easy and might be done by RSC.

I recommend you looking at the new Tudor BB chronograph. I just got one yesterday .

Is what you want minus the crown, the price tag, plus waterproof and 5 years warranty from Rolex.

Thats a great watch. I only wish they would put a rotating bezel on it.

[FrenchBigCrown]

Originally Posted by Chester01

Thats a great watch. I only wish they would put a rotating bezel on it.

Most Chronos have fixed bezels though dude.

Unless they're doubling as a dive watch - like the Monte Carlo above. Then they tend to have a 'diver' bezel rather than a 'tach'.

[ELLimon]

Originally Posted by FrenchBigCrown

Most Chronos have fixed bezels though dude.

Unless they're doubling as a dive watch - like the Monte Carlo above. Then they tend to have a 'diver' bezel rather than a 'tach'.

Small correction my Monty has a 12 hour GMT bezel.

[FrenchBigCrown]

Originally Posted by ELLimon

Small correction my Monty has a 12 hour GMT bezel.

My apologies. Yes it has.

[1watch]

Originally Posted by roh123

Just to be clear.. It’s not really a great idea to give any expensive vintage Rolex to RSC. No matter if it is a vintage Daytona, a gilt sports watch, Comex diver or a Milsub. You service them through vintage specialists that understand what you have.

Only real reason to pass a watch through RSC or Rolex Geneva is if you have a questionable watch and want a service to verify authenticity.

Deserves emphasis once again...

[zapokee]

Originally Posted by 1watch

Deserves emphasis once again...

And again.

[BDII]

You know, the route I would go would be to find one with an already relumed dial, that isn’t in great shape, and get it fully restored. Laser welding and the works.

Send it to Rolliworks and give it the all around treatment. You’d be bringing something back to life that way and not destroying a great piece.

[joli160]

Originally Posted by HMHM

Yeah I’m a little torn about it as well about this tbh…. The ‘Big Red’ Daytona has always caught my eye and has led me to buy new pieces that look like it such as the Tudor BB chrono and the Daytona (black dial). What I’m thinking about is essentially something along the lines of Ferrari Classiche or Singer type of restoration but for watches if you get what I mean. Buying such an expensive watch with stretch bracelet, dust and dirt around the case and non-functioning lume takes away the joy of getting a new watch. I want to feel like I’m buying the watch itself in 1970.

I certainly think this is an area Rolex could explore? Restoration of classic watches for an appropriate amount (translate as higher than average cost). It could be done with cars, why not watches?

They do that in Geneva, Rolex heritage department.