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Old 21 February 2019, 12:01 AM   #91
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Im trying to diffuse the situation before everyone gets banned ....

I chuckle reading me writing SAVAGE
It is making me laugh as well.

Thanks for lightening it all up.
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Old 21 February 2019, 12:34 AM   #92
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I was a summer associate at the law firm where her sister works. Brilliant and beautiful woman.
Ah, the good old days. For those who know, you know what I am talking about.
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Old 21 February 2019, 12:45 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by Ichiran View Post
You are oblivious to other VIPs also spending a lot of money on the slow-moving pieces/or "done good deeds" at the AD. The selection process at the AD is so opaque, we don't even know if that 5740 landed in a sort of meritocratic way to the right person to begin with.

By way of conversation (you may confirm with your own AD and the regional Patek agent), it is my understanding that both Patek and the AD have policies not to sell to flippers, especially of the day-1 variant. I am very happy with these policies and I will gladly do my part to help them out. You are right in saying flipping is not a crime - I never said it is a crime.

By the way, making a phone call and reporting to Patek is not a crime too.



Why do you care I make a call to Patek to inform them of a day-1 flipper? What business is it of yours?

I got a massive high from calling Patek, and will do so every time I see a flip.



I have so much time on my hand that I will report every single flip to Patek when I see one. Why does it matter to you I have so much time?
You did the right thing, it very much helped the AD otherwise serious issues for them.
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Old 21 February 2019, 12:53 AM   #94
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Patek and AD’s don’t want to sell to flippers? They have a policy against it? BS.
Show me in writing, I’m from Missouri.
Hey ichi, when you call Patek I wonder if the laugh their ass off after your call?
It is a fact that AD's go to some length to avoid selling to flippers - clearly there is a balance to strike between new and existing customers for any AD that can never 100% be perfect to avoid issues with in demand pieces getting flipped.
Patek does take flipping seriously I can assure you.
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Old 21 February 2019, 12:57 AM   #95
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What word is better, savage or lit

Oh and google Jamie Powell, winner?
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:04 AM   #96
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Just for the record, one of the AD’s I did business with just had their Patek franchise pulled. This is a family owned business and had been selling Patek for 25 years. I was told by the owner that there was no advance notice and no explanation. Patek does not give a hoot about AD’s.
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:09 AM   #97
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FWIW, before I was given the opportunity to buy from my Patek AD he asked that I would never flip one of their watches. IT IS apparently a serious issue for them.

Because of this request, and the answer I provided, I would never do this.

I also love my Rolex AD, but I had bought more watches than I can remember from them over the last decade. Jewelry for my wife, wedding ring for myself etc. While I do feel badly that I sold off some of the Rolex watches I bought and will not longer wear, I did not buy them to make money. I did not use my relationship to make money. I simply wanted the money to buy something else.

In regards to the Patek watches, I won't do that because I made a promise as part of the bargain.

If I had spent hundreds of thousands (inflating because Patek, not Rolex) over the last decade at my Patek AD, BEFORE, the current gray price increase situation, I would likely feel similarly. My watch, I can do with it what I want. I would feel that I paid my dues. And if I can make a quick 100k off it, I just might do that.

It is in some way irresponsible not to. I would have likely just sold quietly to a gray though.

But, If I had spend a lot of money in an AD and they sold a watch to someone that just turned it for a profit, I would be annoyed too. No doubt.

As it stands, there are a lot of gray areas. And I can relate to everyones feelings on the matter. After all, we are all coming from a different perspective based on our own history.

All of this said, I do think Patek is trying their hardest to fight the flipping game. I just don't think there is anything they can do about it.

Actually, no. There is one thing. Provide more product to the market. Make them easier to get. But that takes away some of their status. And I am assuming that many of you, myself included, would not like to see the value of their watches tank because the market was flooded simply to disrupt the flippers.

No easy answer here.
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:12 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by ap1 View Post
What word is better, savage or lit

Oh and google Jamie Powell, winner?
I prefer SAVAGE.

I wish we had an emoticon for that.
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:15 AM   #99
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FWIW, before I was given the opportunity to buy from my Patek AD he asked that I would never flip one of their watches. IT IS apparently a serious issue for them.

Because of this request, and the answer I provided, I would never do this.

I also love my Rolex AD, but I had bought more watches than I can remember from them over the last decade. Jewelry for my wife, wedding ring for myself etc. While I do feel badly that I sold off some of the Rolex watches I bought and will not longer wear, I did not buy them to make money. I did not use my relationship to make money. I simply wanted the money to buy something else.

In regards to the Patek watches, I won't do that because I made a promise as part of the bargain.

If I had spent hundreds of thousands (inflating because Patek, not Rolex) over the last decade at my Patek AD, BEFORE, the current gray price increase situation, I would likely feel similarly. My watch, I can do with it what I want. I would feel that I paid my dues. And if I can make a quick 100k off it, I just might do that.

It is in some way irresponsible not to. I would have likely just sold quietly to a gray though.

But, If I had spend a lot of money in an AD and they sold a watch to someone that just turned it for a profit, I would be annoyed too. No doubt.

As it stands, there are a lot of gray areas. And I can relate to everyones feelings on the matter. After all, we are all coming from a different perspective based on our own history.

All of this said, I do think Patek is trying their hardest to fight the flipping game. I just don't think there is anything they can do about it.

Actually, no. There is one thing. Provide more product to the market. Make them easier to get. But that takes away some of their status. And I am assuming that many of you, myself included, would not like to see the value of their watches tank because the market was flooded simply to disrupt the flippers.

No easy answer here.
A good post, doggie
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:19 AM   #100
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A good post, doggie
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:45 AM   #101
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Well that's partly my point. This forum is filled with questions on value retention, collectability, good investment or not, most of the times I feel like people care more about if the watch will make them money than they care about the watch itself.

Who are we to question why a person decided to sell a watch. He bought it, he can do whatever he want with it, there could be many reasons why he sold it right away. Maybe he drove by a Porsche dealer and saw a brand new Turbo S and decided to sell the watch and get the car instead. Or maybe making a quick 100k is just too tempting to pass up.

I understand some people are frustrated with certain watches so difficult to get and seeing it for sale right away upsets them, but those who got them, they must have done good deeds with the AD to get them, it's not like they stole it. So reporting to Patek trying to cause ramifications for the seller and AD is going a bit too far in my opinion.
100% agree
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:47 AM   #102
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+1. How can one not have better things to do with their time.
Finally we agree on something! Amen
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:48 AM   #103
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Finally we agree on something! Amen


It was inevitable.


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Old 21 February 2019, 01:48 AM   #104
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What word is better, savage or lit

Oh and google Jamie Powell, winner?
Both quality terms.

'Russell996 is a savage with the timepieces, that 5370 is lit AF "
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:51 AM   #105
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Both quality terms.

'Russell996 is a savage with the timepieces, that 5370 is lit AF "
I'm getting too old for this forum.
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:52 AM   #106
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Whoah.

It took you not even 10 minutes to respond. Settle down.

And you mixed up who you are taking to. I didn’t report anyone. I simply created a thread about what my gray told me. Although I don’t disparage the poster that did.

I’d say take a few deep breaths. Calm down. And yeah, sure, keep doing you. Call it as negatively as you see it. I will continue to wonder what type of person sees everything in such a light.

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Old 21 February 2019, 01:52 AM   #107
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I prefer SAVAGE.

I wish we had an emoticon for that.
Ben or Fred?
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Old 21 February 2019, 01:56 AM   #108
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Punky was smoking when she was on Saved by the Bell for that one episode. She was loaded up top too. +1 for punky.

But nobody beats Kelly Kapowski. I’ll fight anyone who tells me otherwise.


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Old 21 February 2019, 02:05 AM   #109
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I wonder how this whole perception would change if the AD was also involved.

For instance if you bought a 918 from the local porsche dealer, then turned it back into the same dealer on consignment after the waiting period. They sell it on the open market and collect a 10% consignment fee (dealer realizing 6 figure commission). Meanwhile you're able to skip the line and get any GT's, R's, and get another 918 at MSRP. Potentially keeping or selling as many as you want, after the waiting period.

Opposed to this AD, selling a 5740. Client realizing all the upside. Regardless of HSWA/Patek Philippe SA's internal policy.
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Old 21 February 2019, 02:07 AM   #110
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As it stands, there are a lot of gray areas.
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Old 21 February 2019, 02:13 AM   #111
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I have bought 2 PPs from 2 different AD’s and flipped them both. Did not have to list them on the forum because 2 of the TS bought them same day in fact. Happy to say I made a good buck. And happy to say I probably made another PP enthusiast very happy because they did not mind paying a premium. It is not my business what others do with their money.

I hope you do not report me to Patek, would not want to be tar and feathered

I must admit this thread is very funny.
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Just for the record, one of the AD’s I did business with just had their Patek franchise pulled. This is a family owned business and had been selling Patek for 25 years. I was told by the owner that there was no advance notice and no explanation. Patek does not give a hoot about AD’s.
Do you think it's possible the watch you sold after acquiring them had any effect on that AD's loss of their franchise? Assuming you weren't the only one? I know my AD has mentioned Patek keeps an eye on the secondary market. I am not sure if that's a soft warning or an accurate assessment.

I'm not in either camp, there are scenarios that mean people need/want to move recently acquired large purchases. Not my business why.
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Old 21 February 2019, 02:13 AM   #112
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Originally Posted by superdog View Post
FWIW, before I was given the opportunity to buy from my Patek AD he asked that I would never flip one of their watches. IT IS apparently a serious issue for them.

Because of this request, and the answer I provided, I would never do this.

I also love my Rolex AD, but I had bought more watches than I can remember from them over the last decade. Jewelry for my wife, wedding ring for myself etc. While I do feel badly that I sold off some of the Rolex watches I bought and will not longer wear, I did not buy them to make money. I did not use my relationship to make money. I simply wanted the money to buy something else.

In regards to the Patek watches, I won't do that because I made a promise as part of the bargain.

If I had spent hundreds of thousands (inflating because Patek, not Rolex) over the last decade at my Patek AD, BEFORE, the current gray price increase situation, I would likely feel similarly. My watch, I can do with it what I want. I would feel that I paid my dues. And if I can make a quick 100k off it, I just might do that.

It is in some way irresponsible not to. I would have likely just sold quietly to a gray though.

But, If I had spend a lot of money in an AD and they sold a watch to someone that just turned it for a profit, I would be annoyed too. No doubt.


As it stands, there are a lot of gray areas. And I can relate to everyones feelings on the matter. After all, we are all coming from a different perspective based on our own history.

All of this said, I do think Patek is trying their hardest to fight the flipping game. I just don't think there is anything they can do about it.

Actually, no. There is one thing. Provide more product to the market. Make them easier to get. But that takes away some of their status. And I am assuming that many of you, myself included, would not like to see the value of their watches tank because the market was flooded simply to disrupt the flippers.

No easy answer here.
Great post -- this about sums up the conundrum in my head. Unfortunately the AD that I was loyal to before the boom is no longer (Shreve in Portland), so I'm really feeling the burn from both sides. It's a really tough climate to begin a new AD relationship in.
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Old 21 February 2019, 02:17 AM   #113
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Do you think it's possible the watches you sold after acquiring them had any effect on that AD's loss of their franchise? Assuming you weren't the only one? I know my AD has mentioned Patek keeps an eye on the secondary market. I am not sure if that's a soft warning or an accurate assessment.

I'm not in either camp, there are scenarios that mean people need/want to move recently acquired large purchases. Not my business why.
Doubtful
One watch Registered in my name, the other one in sons name
Neither AD has questioned me afterwards.
In fact one AD I asked for another Patek, no balking on their side
In fact he asked me if I wanted another one.
This is why I am skeptical of ADs caring about flippers
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Old 21 February 2019, 02:36 AM   #114
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This is why I am skeptical of ADs caring about flippers
Rolex AD's also care very much about flippers on hard to get pieces - can't comment whether it is the same in the States but in the UK it is a fact.

Just for the record I am defining a flipper as someone who buys a piece with no intention of wearing it and immediately on receipt advertises it for sale and unworn. There are many reasons for a quick and legitimate sale that wouldn't qualify as being a flip.
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Old 21 February 2019, 02:45 AM   #115
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Rolex AD's also care very much about flippers on hard to get pieces - can't comment whether it is the same in the States but in the UK it is a fact.

Just for the record I am defining a flipper as someone who buys a piece with no intention of wearing it and immediately on receipt advertises it for sale and unworn. There are many reasons for a quick and legitimate sale that wouldn't qualify as being a flip.

Rolex AD's here, at least some, bundle hard to get watches with PM models. That's against Rolex "rules" as well yet they do it. I tend to agree with Bill for the most part but sure some AD's take it more seriously, or at least pretend to.



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Old 21 February 2019, 03:08 AM   #116
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Can you imagine any other business that has this insane ridiculous no flipping rule? Go to Starbucks buy the last croissant and the guy in line in back of you says I’ll give you double what you paid for it. Starbucks then tells you we aren’t going to let you buy another croissant or muffin ever. And to respond to Russell’s last post, using the word intention as in no intention to sell is crazy also, who decides what someone’s intention is, the intention police.
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Old 21 February 2019, 03:22 AM   #117
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I saw Kelly first


I’ll fight you!


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Old 21 February 2019, 03:29 AM   #118
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Can you imagine any other business that has this insane ridiculous no flipping rule? Go to Starbucks buy the last croissant and the guy in line in back of you says I’ll give you double what you paid for it. Starbucks then tells you we aren’t going to let you buy another croissant or muffin ever. And to respond to Russell’s last post, using the word intention as in no intention to sell is crazy also, who decides what someone’s intention is, the intention police.
We live in a crazy world :')

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Old 21 February 2019, 03:34 AM   #119
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I’ll fight you!


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Old 21 February 2019, 03:34 AM   #120
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Jokes aside, I too have flipped watches due to boredom and to make way for new pieces. Who decides which pieces we are allowed or not to move?

I have had a watch* for a few weeks and decided that it wasn't to my liking (despite drooling over this piece for months) and ended up flipping it within a month. Was I in the wrong? Would I get blacklisted by PP and their AD if this was a 5711/5712?

*AP Schumacher Ti

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