Offshore Is Now Broken, An Ongoing Debacle

[surrounded21]

I've found that both APs (1990s Royal Oak and 1990 RO Perpetual Calendar) I've owned were a lot more "delicate" than any of my vintage or modern Rolex. I had to send both to get serviced shortly after purchase (date wheel issue on the royal oak and the perpetual Calendar wouldn't even keep time), whereas I've never had to send in any of my Rolex in for repair of stopped or slow movements or any issue. Go figure.

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[Gent675]

Originally Posted by mickyd329

It's surprising to me that the 1 PP I own keeps better time than the 6 Rolex's I have that are supposed to be more accurate. Hope that's ok with you.

No problem at all as both are supposed to be guaranteed to solid accuracy. Wish AP would do the same.

[vliberman]

Originally Posted by Commandopat

That’s why there are several threads about people contacting AP to get their watches serviced due to a lack of accuracy…because they don’t care.

These are not AP people, mostly Rolex people who made a mistake

[DonLee]

Originally Posted by messikens

I call BS. I don't think you'd refuse a green or blue ROC if offered just because you heard some bad things about the movement...

Wow, talk about being shallow. I have a blue 50th anniversary RO already. So my SA wouldn't offer a blue. I'm not a fan of the green on steel and my SA knows that. I've turned down my SA on a couple occasions already, because I want to own watches that I actually like and am comfortable owning for many years to come. It also doesn't help that the watch looks oversized on my wrist. So I see no reason to buy a watch only for the sake of holding onto it to sell later.

[Henrimontgomery]

So strange, I think it's probably user error. You must have done something to the watch, there is no other possible reason.

Is what I would say if I was one of those kool-aid drinking AP fan.

AP has got massive issues recently, especially for the premium they ask.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by Henrimontgomery

AP has got massive issues recently, especially for the premium they ask.

I still say its isolated if you look at how many they produce and how few actually have issues. I have several AP's and only one ever had an issue, which was quickly fixed by AP.

[m3tek44]

look forward to outcome what AP has to say.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by m3tek44

look forward to outcome what AP has to say.

The only resolution I’ve been offered today, is to send to Clearwater for a ‘diagnosis’ and verification of the issue.

I’ve flat out said I will refuse this watch in any capacity, and want a refund with a new allocation. Quite frankly, under lemon law and the due diligence already completed to rectify problems 3x over in 90 days and it still malfunctioning, I’d legally be entitled to this anyhow. It’s somehow a silver lining all this has happened so quickly as I’m within my 6 months with Amex as a fallback.

So I guess I have to send in for ‘official’ confirmation of it being broken and *then* AP corporate/higher ups can offer their resolution.

This honestly doesn’t even sit right with me and I feel I’m jumping through extra hoops. It’s not an opinion, it’s quite obviously broken and doesn’t work…..the boutique ownership can easily verify this and just take it back. It’s in *pristine* condition with not even so much as a hairline on the entire watch (which I’ve videoed for evidence), so if they try to claim anything pertaining to user error I’m going to blow my top.

I just expected a better level of customer service all considered as this was first brought up, now more than 72 hours ago. And nobody can relay anything from higher ups, nor any potential rectification. Just ‘we’ll have to see, but first it needs to go to Clearwater’.




Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

[Rickkk]

Originally Posted by dmash

The only resolution I’ve been offered today, is to send to Clearwater for a ‘diagnosis’ and verification of the issue.

I’ve flat out said I will refuse this watch in any capacity, and want a refund with a new allocation. Quite frankly, under lemon law and the due diligence already completed to rectify problems 3x over in 90 days and it still malfunctioning, I’d legally be entitled to this anyhow. It’s somehow a silver lining all this has happened so quickly as I’m within my 6 months with Amex as a fallback.

So I guess I have to send in for ‘official’ confirmation of it being broken and *then* AP corporate/higher ups can offer their resolution.

This honestly doesn’t even sit right with me and I feel I’m jumping through extra hoops. It’s not an opinion, it’s quite obviously broken and doesn’t work…..the boutique ownership can easily verify this and just take it back. It’s in *pristine* condition with not even so much as a hairline on the entire watch (which I’ve videoed for evidence), so if they try to claim anything pertaining to user error I’m going to blow my top.

I just expected a better level of customer service all considered as this was first brought up, now more than 72 hours ago. And nobody can relay anything from higher ups, nor any potential rectification. Just ‘we’ll have to see, but first it needs to go to Clearwater’.




Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

Sorry to hear about your experience and you’re absolutely entitled to feel this way. Have some faith though. I’m sure it will be corrected and should be accompanied by a goodwill gesture

[In-N-Out]

Originally Posted by dmash

The only resolution I’ve been offered today, is to send to Clearwater for a ‘diagnosis’ and verification of the issue.

I’ve flat out said I will refuse this watch in any capacity, and want a refund with a new allocation. Quite frankly, under lemon law and the due diligence already completed to rectify problems 3x over in 90 days and it still malfunctioning, I’d legally be entitled to this anyhow. It’s somehow a silver lining all this has happened so quickly as I’m within my 6 months with Amex as a fallback.

So I guess I have to send in for ‘official’ confirmation of it being broken and *then* AP corporate/higher ups can offer their resolution.

This honestly doesn’t even sit right with me and I feel I’m jumping through extra hoops. It’s not an opinion, it’s quite obviously broken and doesn’t work…..the boutique ownership can easily verify this and just take it back. It’s in *pristine* condition with not even so much as a hairline on the entire watch (which I’ve videoed for evidence), so if they try to claim anything pertaining to user error I’m going to blow my top.

I just expected a better level of customer service all considered as this was first brought up, now more than 72 hours ago. And nobody can relay anything from higher ups, nor any potential rectification. Just ‘we’ll have to see, but first it needs to go to Clearwater’.




Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

What’s your IG?

[messikens]

Originally Posted by dmash

The only resolution I’ve been offered today, is to send to Clearwater for a ‘diagnosis’ and verification of the issue.

I’ve flat out said I will refuse this watch in any capacity, and want a refund with a new allocation. Quite frankly, under lemon law and the due diligence already completed to rectify problems 3x over in 90 days and it still malfunctioning, I’d legally be entitled to this anyhow. It’s somehow a silver lining all this has happened so quickly as I’m within my 6 months with Amex as a fallback.

So I guess I have to send in for ‘official’ confirmation of it being broken and *then* AP corporate/higher ups can offer their resolution.

This honestly doesn’t even sit right with me and I feel I’m jumping through extra hoops. It’s not an opinion, it’s quite obviously broken and doesn’t work…..the boutique ownership can easily verify this and just take it back. It’s in *pristine* condition with not even so much as a hairline on the entire watch (which I’ve videoed for evidence), so if they try to claim anything pertaining to user error I’m going to blow my top.

I just expected a better level of customer service all considered as this was first brought up, now more than 72 hours ago. And nobody can relay anything from higher ups, nor any potential rectification. Just ‘we’ll have to see, but first it needs to go to Clearwater’.




Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

I think patience is your best option. They are probably having their specialists look at it to check the underlying reason.

I know not ideal but you've made your displeasure know clearly enough that boutique management should know what to do...

Further antagonizing them at this point may just have the opposite of the intended effect. Let it play out and circle back in a week - I'm sure this case has some priority from Clearwater now


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[dmash]

Originally Posted by messikens

I think patience is your best option. They are probably having their specialists look at it to check the underlying reason.

I know not ideal but you've made your displeasure know clearly enough that boutique management should know what to do...

Further antagonizing them at this point may just have the opposite of the intended effect. Let it play out and circle back in a week - I'm sure this case has some priority from Clearwater now


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This is my plan. I’m waiting until next week, after the ‘confirmation’ can be made, and go from there after a proper resolution is offered. I’m by no means trying to blow this situation up, if anything, the exact opposite, by diffuse it and have a positive storybook ending! But if the official resolution offered is a repair, I’m not going to stand idly by.

It’s just getting tiresome at this point that I’m the one who had to follow up this morning to even get this ball rolling.and quite frankly on Friday, there was zero urgency it seemed (quite frankly even caring), after I brought it up.

I hope after today things are more proactive (and positive). Fingers crossed, watch will be back with AP on Wednesday and we can go from there.

[m3tek44]

Originally Posted by dmash

The only resolution I’ve been offered today, is to send to Clearwater for a ‘diagnosis’ and verification of the issue.

I’ve flat out said I will refuse this watch in any capacity, and want a refund with a new allocation. Quite frankly, under lemon law and the due diligence already completed to rectify problems 3x over in 90 days and it still malfunctioning, I’d legally be entitled to this anyhow. It’s somehow a silver lining all this has happened so quickly as I’m within my 6 months with Amex as a fallback.

So I guess I have to send in for ‘official’ confirmation of it being broken and *then* AP corporate/higher ups can offer their resolution.

This honestly doesn’t even sit right with me and I feel I’m jumping through extra hoops. It’s not an opinion, it’s quite obviously broken and doesn’t work…..the boutique ownership can easily verify this and just take it back. It’s in *pristine* condition with not even so much as a hairline on the entire watch (which I’ve videoed for evidence), so if they try to claim anything pertaining to user error I’m going to blow my top.

I just expected a better level of customer service all considered as this was first brought up, now more than 72 hours ago. And nobody can relay anything from higher ups, nor any potential rectification. Just ‘we’ll have to see, but first it needs to go to Clearwater’.




Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

I can only imagine all frustration/roller coaster ride you're going through. I'm very sorry for that. I'm optimistic thing will turn around in your favor and AP will make this right for you/wife.

Please keep us up-to-date we're all eager to find out the outcome.

[RTG]

Originally Posted by dmash

The only resolution I’ve been offered today, is to send to Clearwater for a ‘diagnosis’ and verification of the issue.

I’ve flat out said I will refuse this watch in any capacity, and want a refund with a new allocation. Quite frankly, under lemon law and the due diligence already completed to rectify problems 3x over in 90 days and it still malfunctioning, I’d legally be entitled to this anyhow. It’s somehow a silver lining all this has happened so quickly as I’m within my 6 months with Amex as a fallback.

So I guess I have to send in for ‘official’ confirmation of it being broken and *then* AP corporate/higher ups can offer their resolution.

This honestly doesn’t even sit right with me and I feel I’m jumping through extra hoops. It’s not an opinion, it’s quite obviously broken and doesn’t work…..the boutique ownership can easily verify this and just take it back. It’s in *pristine* condition with not even so much as a hairline on the entire watch (which I’ve videoed for evidence), so if they try to claim anything pertaining to user error I’m going to blow my top.

I just expected a better level of customer service all considered as this was first brought up, now more than 72 hours ago. And nobody can relay anything from higher ups, nor any potential rectification. Just ‘we’ll have to see, but first it needs to go to Clearwater’.




Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

Just don’t let them string you along past your AMEX fallback plan. Set an alarm, phone beeps and you chargeback.

[messikens]

Just purely out of interest... How does the Amex thing work? I thought it's up to $10k/claim on a Plat...?

[dmash]

Originally Posted by RTG

Just don’t let them string you along past your AMEX fallback plan. Set an alarm, phone beeps and you chargeback.

I'm really glad you mentioned this. I just realized I am running out of time, as Amex time frame is actually 120 days, not 6 months.....I was completely unaware. This is due to the fact that I've never charged back a *single thing* in my entire life. and I say that as someone who processes millions annually across my Amex accounts.

Originally Posted by messikens

Just purely out of interest... How does the Amex thing work? I thought it's up to $10k/claim on a Plat...?

There's a difference between purchase protection and a chargeback. You're referring to the former which is like if you buy a pair of headphones and 2 months later you break them. This instance is entirely different.




But let's not continue on with this subject, as it's an absolute last resort, albeit an available option considering the circumstances. I have faith in AP to do the right thing, as has every other merchant I've ever dealt with, on a personal or business level, when the facts of a situation are presented fairly.

[DonLee]

Originally Posted by dmash

Honestly, my wife and I have ~10x more followers than the ‘RYG Man’ and his debacle made worldwide news just for getting blacklisted…….so while I really hope it doesn’t come to that, I’m not going to get tossed around on this matter for much longer. If you’re out there reading AP, this is a customer with a true, mechanical issue with your timepiece, not just somebody complaining about allocations. Stand by your products as most of us always thought you would.

You and your wife have like 15 million followers? Wow, you should be rolling in much more expensive pieces, not some regular offshore

[V25V]

Originally Posted by DonLee

You and your wife have like 15 million followers? Wow, you should be rolling in much more expensive pieces, not some regular offshore

And "who processes millions annually across my Amex accounts". Cringe.

One would think if all of these things were true, OP would have some sort of ability to navigate this to a good result. I do not have millions of followers or spend millions across my credit cards and fairly certain I could work this out with AP to a good result for myself.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by DonLee

You and your wife have like 15 million followers? Wow, you should be rolling in much more expensive pieces, not some regular offshore

Originally Posted by V25V

And "who processes millions annually across my Amex accounts". Cringe.

One would think if all of these things were true, OP would have some sort of ability to navigate this to a good result. I do not have millions of followers or spend millions across my credit cards and fairly certain I could work this out with AP to a good result for myself.

You guys are taking those things completely the wrong way. Neither were brags or something bizarre.

-I said that about the following because as everyone knows, social media outlets are the best way to garner some type of response nowadays if you feel you’re getting ignored. Whether this is posting a YouTube video, or simply reaching out to a company on Twitter, this is our modern day society. I’ve never once in my history of TRF mentioned this outside of this scenario. And I never play that card for free items/experiences/etc, quite frankly, I can’t stand people like that. However, when I feel I’m getting jipped out of ~$50k, things are potentially different.

-The Amex tidbit was to showcase that I never ever revert to chargebacks despite tons of purchasing for myself and business over the last 15 years. You’re trying to latch onto something which isn’t there. Who brags about that, large project contractors might spend more than me in one WEEK on supplies. And I’m currently in progress with AP, I am simply preparing for worst case scenario.


I appreciate you guys both trying to poke at me for something which wasn’t there to begin, whilst I’m obviously flustered and experiencing an incredibly lackluster AP experience. A+ gentleman, I appreciate the professionalism, bravo.

[vliberman]

What is really crazy is that u want another allocation with this brand??? Like on one-hand you are summoning gods to help you right the wrongs and on the other u asking to repeat the experience? Or u simply saying u will choose better in terms of resale value and if similar occurs u just sell for a profit?

[dmash]

Originally Posted by vliberman

What is really crazy is that u want another allocation with this brand??? Like on one-hand you are summoning gods to help you right the wrongs and on the other u asking to repeat the experience? Or u simply saying u will choose better in terms of resale value and if similar occurs u just sell for a profit?

I want out of this chrono movement which is obviously chock full of issues. I’m not coming to AP with some absurdity such as requesting an open work. Quite frankly, I’m requesting exactly what they alluded would be my next allocation anyways. Just something different so we completely avoid a potential repeat experience of this in any way. Because in all likelihood, I could get a new ROO43 and it has subdial creep within a few weeks, like we’ve seen with dozens of others. And then once again I’m off to Clearwater, albeit perhaps only once, but that would just be horrid.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by dmash

You guys are taking those things completely the wrong way. Neither were brags or something bizarre.

-I said that about the following because as everyone knows, social media outlets are the best way to garner some type of response nowadays if you feel you’re getting ignored. Whether this is posting a YouTube video, or simply reaching out to a company on Twitter, this is our modern day society. I’ve never once in my history of TRF mentioned this outside of this scenario.

-The Amex tidbit was to showcase that I never ever revert to chargebacks despite tons of purchasing for myself and business over the last 15 years. You’re trying to latch onto something which isn’t there. Who brags about that, large project contractors might spend more than me in one WEEK on supplies. And I’m currently in progress with AP, I am simply preparing for worst case scenario.


I appreciate you guys both trying to poke at me for something which wasn’t there to begin, whilst I’m obviously flustered and experiencing an incredibly lackluster AP experience. A+ gentleman, bravo.

I get the context in which you were trying to put it in, just that neither of those things were really necessary to highlight for what you are seeking support on. I think everyone agrees that several times back to Clearwater for a repair, without a good result, would have us all upset. Have you thought to escalate this to someone at AP Americas in NYC? If this were me and I was not getting a satisfactory resolution, I would be looking outside of Clearwater at this stage. Just my .02.

[dmash]

Originally Posted by V25V

I get the context in which you were trying to put it in, just that neither of those things were really necessary to highlight for what you are seeking support on. I think everyone agrees that several times back to Clearwater for a repair, without a good result, would have us all upset. Have you thought to escalate this to someone at AP Americas in NYC? If this were me and I was not getting a satisfactory resolution, I would be looking outside of Clearwater at this stage. Just my .02.

That’s exactly why I’m so flustered. To this point in time, I’ve not got a SINGLE message or call from the boutique manager. Not a peep! When he’s the one who should be immediately on this and my point of contact. And apparently because my location is a joint venture/partly owned by Material Good, I can’t talk to certain people for resolution, and Clearwater is saying for internal purposes they want the watch in hand to verify the problem exists.

If anybody can get me in contact with a higher up I’m all ears and would be eternally grateful, but again, apparently the situation is a bit different seeing the Material Good joint venture.

[V25V]

Originally Posted by dmash

That’s exactly why I’m so flustered. To this point in time, I’ve not got a SINGLE message or call from the boutique manager. Not a peep! When he’s the one who should be immediately on this and my point of contact. And apparently because my location is a joint venture/partly owned by Material Good, I can’t talk to certain people for resolution, and Clearwater is saying for internal purposes they want the watch in hand to verify the problem exists.

If anybody can get me in contact with a higher up I’m all ears and would be eternally grateful, but again, apparently the situation is a bit different seeing the Material Good joint venture.

Are you on Linkedin? I would recommend searching for higher ups at AP either in NYC or LeBrassus, figure out their email addresses and start sending off emails to people who would care about this story and can push it along. I have been in sales my entire life, so tracking down decision makers is what I have always done, this is nothing new for me and exactly what I would do if I were in your shoes. I think relying on Clearwater or the boutique is a mistake, I also think using AMEX to try to claw back your money is also a mistake. Same for making this a legal matter. But thats me....

[dmash]

Originally Posted by V25V

Are you on Linkedin? I would recommend searching for higher ups at AP either in NYC or LeBrassus, figure out their email addresses and start sending off emails to people who would care about this story and can push it along. I have been in sales my entire life, so tracking down decision makers is what I have always done, this is nothing new for me and exactly what I would do if I were in your shoes. I think relying on Clearwater or the boutique is a mistake, I also think using AMEX to try to claw back your money is also a mistake. Same for making this a legal matter. But thats me....

100% agree with you on the latter portion, it was and always has been just a fallback if I continued getting ignored. I just shot off quite a few emails, hopefully it garners some attention and isn’t dismissed. Appreciate it



And as an aside, again, I’m really not trying to sound like an a** or argue with any of you guys. I’m just up to my ears with this situation and simply want a good AP experience after waiting so long to put my feet in the water with the brand. It’s just disheartening, as quite frankly, it’s not even so much about the $ (although considerable), it’s more that I was looking forward to this for a decade now. It’s a bit of an emotional roller coaster if being honest. :/

[DonLee]

Originally Posted by dmash

That’s exactly why I’m so flustered. To this point in time, I’ve not got a SINGLE message or call from the boutique manager. Not a peep! When he’s the one who should be immediately on this and my point of contact. And apparently because my location is a joint venture/partly owned by Material Good, I can’t talk to certain people for resolution, and Clearwater is saying for internal purposes they want the watch in hand to verify the problem exists.

If anybody can get me in contact with a higher up I’m all ears and would be eternally grateful, but again, apparently the situation is a bit different seeing the Material Good joint venture.

imo, if what you said is true, there's little left to be said. Boutiques should be working directly in the brands interest. They should be making it up for you. AP and VC very much do care of how many followers you have and if you are a celebrity. They'd much want to please someone who has a following than someone who doesn't. If I were you, I would expect them to give me something in return or else I'm just going to document the AP experience as it was.

It would be absurd for them to NOT know or not care that you and your wife have a big following and are treated this way. I can guarantee that my SA and AP wouldn't do that to me, even if I don't have millions of followers.

[rcwatchcollector]

I get it. 50k is a chunk of change for anyone. The more money I have the less I am willing to part with it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Salmanaman]

Is there no lemon law for items of this much value like we have with new cars

[dmash]

Originally Posted by Salmanaman

Is there no lemon law for items of this much value like we have with new cars

There is, and is a fallback, but it is easier and less messy if I can just get AP to hop on board to rectify this situation (not to mention, it's the right thing to do by them, as a luxury brand).

I'm allowing a bit more time for things to possibly get worked out, as I'm sure this is not a simple solution. I've reached out to various people within AP and Material Good today, at the advice of other members, as it seems my boutique isn't really rectifying appropriately. As at this point, it's 4 days of essentially radio silence.......I'm not going to continue chasing *them* and calling when I'm the client in this situation.

Will update here as news comes forth.

[NB614]

Originally Posted by dmash

That’s exactly why I’m so flustered. To this point in time, I’ve not got a SINGLE message or call from the boutique manager. Not a peep! When he’s the one who should be immediately on this and my point of contact. And apparently because my location is a joint venture/partly owned by Material Good, I can’t talk to certain people for resolution, and Clearwater is saying for internal purposes they want the watch in hand to verify the problem exists.

If anybody can get me in contact with a higher up I’m all ears and would be eternally grateful, but again, apparently the situation is a bit different seeing the Material Good joint venture.

Ah, a Material Good joint venture boutique— makes me want to say a certain 4 letter word that is a noun, adjective, adverb, and verb. Now I understand why your post purchase experience has been so unfortunate.

I am extremely sorry that you must deal with a JV boutique. However, once your watch is at Clearwater, I believe you can just call them directly and speak to any representative who will update you about the watch. At least that was the case for me.

The Clearwater service center and its staff are simply fantastic. If something is truly wrong or defective with the watch, I’m sure they will do their best to fix it or report the issue to a higher up who can rectify the situation.

It is both unfortunate and surprising that your watch has had to go back and forth so many times, but I would send it to Clearwater so they can verify the problem does indeed exist and then just maintain contact with a representative at Clearwater. Forget about depending on your JV boutique, I can almost guarantee they will give you the run around or leave you in the dark.

Once the watch has been analyzed and they recognize there is a major issue with the movement, whoever you speak to at Clearwater should be able to guide you and most likely put you in touch with the right people.