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goog53 · 6 November 2019, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bearxj86

2nd chance before it goes to $100k. Just watch.

Jin, you know I love ya but didn’t you say what a high ceiling the 5522 had when you bought one?

Bearxj86 · 6 November 2019, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goog53

Jin, you know I love ya but didn’t you say what a high ceiling the 5522 had when you bought one?

Touché Mike.

KennyS · 6 November 2019, 05:45 PM

Nautilus, I mean is very speculative....
the buyer that pays the current market price is like skating on thin ice ... I mean stainless steel for US $65,000 to $70,000 with simple 3 hands movements.
Time will tell how many people that have access $70,000 allowed by his dear wife to purchase stainless steel, machine made, 3 hand timepieces with 330 movements that existed since 1970s with some minor changes at cost of a decent house or a luxury cars such as BMW or Mercedes.

Simon.DGV · 6 November 2019, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SL BRABUS

Everything is softening right now....

If it ain’t soft it doesn’t sell

Token74 · 6 November 2019, 07:42 PM

Yep, my collection has dropped £10k in the last few months according to C24. But...here’s the beauty of that, if I’m never going to sell, then all this means is I’m paying less insurance! Happy days!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

MilesB · 12 November 2019, 08:11 AM

Factory sealed 2015 5711 coming up at auction with an estimate of $20,000 - $40,000:

https://www.phillips.com/detail/pate...ppe/NY080119/1

Am I missing something, or is this estimate way off?

brockburst · 12 November 2019, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MilesB

Factory sealed 2015 5711 coming up at auction with an estimate of $20,000 - $40,000:

https://www.phillips.com/detail/pate...ppe/NY080119/1

Am I missing something, or is this estimate way off?

The estimates are always way off.

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 09:34 AM

The estimate for the Only Watch Grandmaster Chime was only CHF2m to 3m, less than 10% of the final hammer price.

Fat_ninja · 12 November 2019, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

The estimate for the Only Watch Grandmaster Chime was only CHF2m to 3m, less than 10% of the final hammer price.

The nautilus is going to sell for 200k + Sweet. Back to being rich

jcoltrane · 12 November 2019, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

The estimate for the Only Watch Grandmaster Chime was only CHF2m to 3m, less than 10% of the final hammer price.

While I agree that estimate is silly low on the 5711, the comparison is apples to oranges. CHF2-3M is what the watch was actually worth, the rest is a charitable write off.

martinr · 12 November 2019, 11:22 AM

Are charitable write offs a thing all over the world? In China or Singapore for example?

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 11:29 AM

The taxman has to make a call, but of course, the friendly big 4 will present a case to the taxman on behalf of their VIP clients.

If qualified as tax deductions, then the question is whether there is a mechanism to bifurcate the intrinsic value of the watch and the charity component. Since this is the only Grandmaster Chime in SS and in salmon, how does the taxman factor these in the value? The only fair way (to me) is to hold off the tax until this watch is put on another auction in a near future without the charity component. Some tax issues may take years to resolve, although the taxman would want the revenue asap.

As I have also raised in another thread, since Rolex is a charity, does my Rolex watches' purchase qualify for tax deductions?

jcoltrane · 12 November 2019, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

The taxman has to make a call, but of course, the friendly big 4 will present a case to the taxman on behalf of their VIP client.

If qualified as tax deductions, then the question is whether there is a mechanism to bifurcate the intrinsic value of the watch and the charity component. Since this is the only Grandmaster Chime in SS and in salmon, how does the taxman factor these in the value? The only fair way (to me) is to hold off the tax until this watch is put on another auction in a near future without the charity component.

As I have also raised in another thread, since Rolex is a charity, does my Rolex purchase qualify for tax deductions?

I can't speak to the Rolex question, but your tax firm would almost certainly use the auction house's estimate to demonstrate the "real" value of the watch.

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcoltrane

I can't speak to the Rolex question, but your tax firm would almost certainly use the auction house's estimate to demonstrate the "real" value of the watch.

The taxman will argue the intrinsic value of the watch is very close to the final hammer price given that this is the only variation and has super complications from a top manufacturer.

The big 4 will argue on behalf of their VIP client that the watch is only worth 2-3m because of the going rate of other Grandmaster Chime. You are right in that the client will want to use the lower value so that he/she has greater room as tax deductions.

They will meet many times to close their valuation.. and then usually the big 4 will win (close to big 4 valuation).

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat_ninja

The nautilus is going to sell for 200k + Sweet. Back to being rich

And you have 3, while 1 has a crook stamp.

jcoltrane · 12 November 2019, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

They will meet many times to close their valuation.. and then usually the big 4 will win (close to big 4 valuation).

Of course they will, that's their job

These watches are small potatoes compared to the chicanery they pull for artwork.

Fat_ninja · 12 November 2019, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

And you have 3, while 1 has a crook stamp.

U silly man I also have a white

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcoltrane

Of course they will, that's their job

These watches are small potatoes compared to the chicanery they pull for artwork.

Though there is one factor in favor of the taxman. The auction up to 20m was quick, furious and bidded by several parties (denoting real demand). From 20m to 30m, there were just 2 bidders but they upbidded by increments of 500k to 1m each time. Hence the value of the 6300a could easily be argued as 30m as the watch could be sold at 30m if not for the final bidder.

Anyway the big 4 is also not cheap, so the winner of the bid may just decide to get on with what the taxman says, and save all that trouble.

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat_ninja

U silly man I also have a white

Gosh! I miss that subtle incoming!

Fat_ninja · 12 November 2019, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

Gosh! I miss that subtle incoming!

I didn’t bother lol... I also didn’t with the replacement 5712r lol

Oops. I did it again... no more nautilus for me. Lol

Ichiran · 12 November 2019, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat_ninja

I didn’t bother lol... I also didn’t with the replacement 5712r lol

Fat_ninja · 12 November 2019, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ichiran

Thought I showed you buddy... I really don’t know why people think nautilus are all that hard to get... now aquanauts... those are tough.

Edit.: Deleted the pics to not seem like a total ass

BigAppleBill · 12 November 2019, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat_ninja

Thought I showed you buddy... I really don’t know why people think nautilus are all that hard to get... now aquanauts... those are tough.

The white dial Nautilus is beginning to grow on me. Nice one!

Fat_ninja · 12 November 2019, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigAppleBill

The white dial Nautilus is beginning to grow on me. Nice one!

My wife likes it. I don’t so much.

BigAppleBill · 12 November 2019, 01:15 PM

Kind of a clean, modern, no nonsense look.

Nikrnic · 12 November 2019, 01:35 PM

I've noticed, it's about time as it's so overated.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

TJMike · 12 November 2019, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat_ninja

Edit.: Deleted the pics to not seem like a total ass

Too late for that

Congratulations on all your incomings; a very impressive set of watches.

Fat_ninja · 12 November 2019, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TJMike

Too late for that

Congratulations on all your incomings; a very impressive set of watches.

True it’s a little late.
Where u been buddy?

TJMike · 12 November 2019, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat_ninja

True it’s a little late.
Where u been buddy?

Was traveling for a few days and could not be bothered to log-in to the website.

TJMike · 12 November 2019, 02:19 PM

Back on topic, DavidSW is now listing a white 5711 for $51975; just reduced the price by $1900. He listed it on September 10 at $57,575.

On September 7 he listed a 5712G-001 at $64,875. Now available for $58,975.

6 November 2019, 07:42 PM	#425
Token74 "TRF" Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Real Name: Vince Location: England Watch: Too many! Posts: 5,707	Yep, my collection has dropped £10k in the last few months according to C24. But...here’s the beauty of that, if I’m never going to sell, then all this means is I’m paying less insurance! Happy days! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Time is limited, make every second count. Patek Philippe Nautilus 5990 - AP Royal Oak 15300 - AP Royal Oak 15450 Blue - AP Royal Oak 15450 Silver - AP Royal Oak Offshore 26480 - Royal Oak Offshore 15710 - Rolex Sea Dweller 116600 - Rolex Daytona 116519 - Rolex GMT 126710 BLRO - Omega Speedmaster Reduced - JLC Reverso GMT Moonphase - TAG Microtimer - Dent Pocket Watch - JLC Atmos Phases de lune

6 November 2019, 05:45 PM	#423
KennyS "TRF" Member Join Date: Nov 2019 Location: USA Posts: 36	Nautilus, I mean is very speculative.... the buyer that pays the current market price is like skating on thin ice ... I mean stainless steel for US $65,000 to $70,000 with simple 3 hands movements. Time will tell how many people that have access $70,000 allowed by his dear wife to purchase stainless steel, machine made, 3 hand timepieces with 330 movements that existed since 1970s with some minor changes at cost of a decent house or a luxury cars such as BMW or Mercedes.

12 November 2019, 08:11 AM	#426
MilesB "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: UK Posts: 103	Factory sealed 2015 5711 coming up at auction with an estimate of $20,000 - $40,000: https://www.phillips.com/detail/pate...ppe/NY080119/1 Am I missing something, or is this estimate way off?

12 November 2019, 09:34 AM	#428
Ichiran 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Real Name: Michael Location: Dotonbori Watch: Mostly blue dials Posts: 7,619	The estimate for the Only Watch Grandmaster Chime was only CHF2m to 3m, less than 10% of the final hammer price.

12 November 2019, 11:22 AM	#431
martinr "TRF" Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: California Posts: 3,099	Are charitable write offs a thing all over the world? In China or Singapore for example?

12 November 2019, 11:29 AM	#432
Ichiran 2024 Pledge Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Real Name: Michael Location: Dotonbori Watch: Mostly blue dials Posts: 7,619	The taxman has to make a call, but of course, the friendly big 4 will present a case to the taxman on behalf of their VIP clients. If qualified as tax deductions, then the question is whether there is a mechanism to bifurcate the intrinsic value of the watch and the charity component. Since this is the only Grandmaster Chime in SS and in salmon, how does the taxman factor these in the value? The only fair way (to me) is to hold off the tax until this watch is put on another auction in a near future without the charity component. Some tax issues may take years to resolve, although the taxman would want the revenue asap. As I have also raised in another thread, since Rolex is a charity, does my Rolex watches' purchase qualify for tax deductions?

12 November 2019, 01:15 PM	#445
BigAppleBill "TRF" Member Join Date: Aug 2019 Real Name: Bill Location: NYC Posts: 1,735	Kind of a clean, modern, no nonsense look.

12 November 2019, 01:35 PM	#446
Nikrnic "TRF" Member Join Date: May 2017 Real Name: Louis Nick Ric Location: Michigan, USA Watch: Blnr, Expll, Subs, Posts: 10,159	I've noticed, it's about time as it's so overated. Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

12 November 2019, 02:19 PM	#450
TJMike Banned Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 428	Back on topic, DavidSW is now listing a white 5711 for $51975; just reduced the price by $1900. He listed it on September 10 at $57,575. On September 7 he listed a 5712G-001 at $64,875. Now available for $58,975.

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