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Old 17 April 2017, 10:42 PM   #31
1William
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I do think that Panerai is dead in the water as a brand. I was involved years ago and was a true fan and collector. Then Panerai started playing games with production, availability and what can only be described as less than responsive service. The brand has milked every aspect of the watch for profit and left the fans on the sidelines. If you have any doubt go to the most popular fan site and see the three posts a day, no sellers listing and prices falling by up to 20-40% on the most popular models. I still like them but will have to get a great deal on one for me to own again and I don't think I will own mutiple pieces again.
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Old 17 April 2017, 11:08 PM   #32
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Yesterday news people still wear Panerai
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Old 18 April 2017, 12:10 AM   #33
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No offence to Pam owners as I own 2 myself but Pam is in a completely different league vs PP or AP - definitely not a fad, they've been around since the 1800's with iconic designs sold over decades and still going
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Old 18 April 2017, 12:42 AM   #34
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No offence to Pam owners as I own 2 myself but Pam is in a completely different league vs PP or AP - definitely not a fad, they've been around since the 1800's with iconic designs sold over decades and still going
agree, not in the same 'league' that's for sure, but to say the brand is 'dead' is far from the truth.
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Old 18 April 2017, 01:48 AM   #35
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Yeah, but isn't the big watch trend that Panerai's been riding slowing down a bit? By the time Rolex catches up to a trend, it's almost over.
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Old 18 April 2017, 02:32 AM   #36
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Yeah, but isn't the big watch trend that Panerai's been riding slowing down a bit? By the time Rolex catches up to a trend, it's almost over.
with the introduction of the due and other thinner watches it seems like panerai is moving away from it as well.
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Old 18 April 2017, 02:34 AM   #37
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A bet ?

But I bet all of you would love to get the new PAM671 right ? To flip it one week after.... ???
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Old 18 April 2017, 03:52 AM   #38
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But I bet all of you would love to get the new PAM671 right ? To flip it one week after.... ???
Sure if I can make 15k profit why not
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Old 18 April 2017, 05:27 AM   #39
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I personally don't feel the brand is dead! i mean crap they have been out a while. obviously not to the masses but they have been there. I personally just bought my first one off of Ebay and I like it. So as far as I see it as long as there are people like me buying they will still be around. I chose the Pam 106 just in case anyone cares lol!
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Old 18 April 2017, 07:42 AM   #40
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Panerai as a brand is no worse than most other brands. Rolex and Patek secondary values might hold up better (and that's not true for all references, I've seen quite a few modern Pateks' prices tank in the secondary, like for example the 5160/1A).

I ran away from Panerai a few years ago but recently came back buying pre-owned 111, 587, and even a 630 (yes a white dial!) at great values, and enjoy wearing them not worrying too much about resale. I lust after the 690 but can't justify dropping $10K for it.

The days of massive appreciation are long over but I would not call Panerai a dead brand.
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Old 18 April 2017, 08:29 AM   #41
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I don't think there are hard verified numbers out there but back in 04/05 production was 5-10k annually. Fast forward to these last few years and I'd guess the number is 80-100k annually. Low end 10x increase, high end 20x increase in production.

Selling more watches is good for Richemont right? Panerai is definitely not dead.
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Old 18 April 2017, 08:54 AM   #42
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I was talking to Federico on a live chat just now and asked him if Panerai sales were flat. He seemed to think they had softened somewhat lately, but are in the process of recovering.
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Old 18 April 2017, 11:10 AM   #43
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Congrats

Quote:
Originally Posted by dominic.warren View Post
I personally don't feel the brand is dead! i mean crap they have been out a while. obviously not to the masses but they have been there. I personally just bought my first one off of Ebay and I like it. So as far as I see it as long as there are people like me buying they will still be around. I chose the Pam 106 just in case anyone cares lol!
Congrats on your first PAM !
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Old 18 April 2017, 11:57 AM   #44
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I hope Panerai isn't dead since I just bought this. I'm a Rolex guy (especially five digit) but there's something unique about Panerai.





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Old 18 April 2017, 12:16 PM   #45
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Not dead at all

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I hope Panerai isn't dead since I just bought this. I'm a Rolex guy (especially five digit) but there's something unique about Panerai.





No worries, Panerai is by far dead, this is mere talk from flippers that regret they can't flip with a 50% up any longer. They used to call them Paneristi, but that species suddenly is extinct.
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Old 18 April 2017, 12:27 PM   #46
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I am sitting here in Belize, looking at my 111 that just turned 11 years old and makes sure every day that my dive computer isn't playing tricks on me! You can say what you want, it the legibility is awesome and the style remarkable.

Would I buy every new special edition released? No.
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Old 18 April 2017, 12:38 PM   #47
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I hope Panerai isn't dead since I just bought this. I'm a Rolex guy (especially five digit) but there's something unique about Panerai.





Congratulations it's stunning
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Old 18 April 2017, 09:51 PM   #48
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My two cents is that Panerai was hyped for awhile, whilst the hype might have cooled off - the brand is far from dead.

From what I've seen it has also grown very big in Asia, and is abit like the "go-to" luxury watch brand, aside of Rolex.
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Old 18 April 2017, 11:47 PM   #49
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If you have one and like it, who really cares?
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Old 19 April 2017, 02:20 AM   #50
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As long as Ellen wearing her Panerai I'm happy 😊
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Old 19 April 2017, 04:31 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by Maltie View Post
No worries, Panerai is by far dead, this is mere talk from flippers that regret they can't flip with a 50% up any longer. They used to call them Paneristi, but that species suddenly is extinct.



Lost in all this is just how good Panerai's SIHH 2017 was.

In comparison, Rolex's SS Sky-Dweller (same watch, new material! Wow!) and larger SD with some red ink and cyclops seems pretty weak....(I like both of the releases, actually, but Basel 2017 was far from the brand showing it has a direction).
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Old 19 April 2017, 02:08 PM   #52
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Everybody likes someting else. I really like my Sub and Speedmaster and definitely enjoy wearing Panerai.
My wife regularly wears my 000 and likes it.
This makes me happy man!

With regards to resale prices or popularity I don't really care as I don't want hobby to became investment and I never buy what I don't like.



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I draw the line at letting Mrs Van D wear my watches but I'm with you on the rest of it.

If I could turn the clock back I'd walk away from only one of my watch purchases and that's my BLNR. All the others I love and none of them are considered investments; I guess I'm just lucky that I could move my BLNR if I wanted and not lose any money.

As for Panerai, it is most definitely not fading into oblivion
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Old 19 April 2017, 02:11 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by ezinhk View Post
No offence to Pam owners as I own 2 myself but Pam is in a completely different league vs PP or AP - definitely not a fad, they've been around since the 1800's with iconic designs sold over decades and still going
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agree, not in the same 'league' that's for sure, but to say the brand is 'dead' is far from the truth.
Some would argue that Rolex are not in the same league as AP, never mind Panerai. I, for one, would say that Rolex are not in the same league as PP.
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Old 19 April 2017, 03:05 PM   #54
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Panerai is definitely fading in the secondary market...still cool pieces, but definitely fading...

I have seen some very low prices on 372 preowned and they just don't sell...

If Rolex made a switch like the 372 crystal change, the previous model would be going bonkers...

With Panerai? It's a "meh"

Only the 000 seems to be holding any kind of value at the moment...
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Old 19 April 2017, 03:12 PM   #55
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while i don't regret purchasing Pams, i regret paying full retail-top-of-the-market for most of them. but, when i take out my 24, i get excited. i love that design. it's like a Panerai "Sub". Classic.
i see quite a few Pams in the wild. especially west coast.
i'll keep the ones i have, but won't be adding any.
AP will be my next chapter. if i can ever be that lucky.
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Old 21 April 2017, 02:24 PM   #56
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I have a beautiful Panerai, a 312, classic Panerai design, and I wear it often. I am somewhat put off by the myriad of pan models, too many in my opinion. The new ones have lost the original DNA of the line and simply look like Panerai attempts at matching other watches in the market, and the results aren't all that attractive. My first watch was a Rolex sub. To this day I consider it my best watch in all ways, though tit is easier to get a quick read of the time with the pan. My next watch will be a Rolex too, probably an Explorer II, polar. It has a super movement and isn't as flashy as the sub. Yet, I really covet the new Sky Dweller. Another great movement, beautiful dial---with flash!

Rolex is still the better choice, in my mind, but I wear the Pan 312 a lot.
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Old 21 April 2017, 05:38 PM   #57
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Panerai is definitely fading in the secondary market...still cool pieces, but definitely fading...

I have seen some very low prices on 372 preowned and they just don't sell...

If Rolex made a switch like the 372 crystal change, the previous model would be going bonkers...

With Panerai? It's a "meh"

Only the 000 seems to be holding any kind of value at the moment...
Not sure I agree with all of this. Rolex releasing an updated model, fair enough, I get that.

As for used values? No, not having that. Have you seen how much the new 671 is going for?

Also, DavidSW has a P series 372, which is either 3 or 4 years old (I don't know if there was a Q serial). He's knocking it out at US$5,975, which I would think is not that much of a saving over a new one considering it's at least three years old. Ok, so it hasn't retained the value of something like, say, a Sub or BLNR but it's probably on par with an Explorer II and better than a DJ. None of the Rolexes would come close to a PP Nautilus but who cares? I personally do not buy watches with an eye on future value. I buy to wear, to love and to enjoy. Unless you can afford pieces that cost similar money to a small Caribbean island, then buying watches as an investment is a mug's game.

Panerai might not be for everyone but then it never was. You get a Panerai for the love of the design and the brand. No one puts a gun to your head and forces you to buy one.
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Old 22 April 2017, 05:53 AM   #58
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Every time I look at my 587, I am like damn..you are one good looking SOB.
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Old 22 April 2017, 12:10 PM   #59
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Panerai might not be for everyone but then it never was. You get a Panerai for the love of the design and the brand. No one puts a gun to your head and forces you to buy one.
troof....bought all of mine because I love the brand, period.
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Old 22 April 2017, 12:35 PM   #60
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Panerai might not be for everyone but then it never was. You get a Panerai for the love of the design and the brand. No one puts a gun to your head and forces you to buy one.
Amen to that and that's exactly why I bought my 563. I was bouncing between the 563, a Rhodium Yatchmaster, and a DJ. Ultimately I wanted a fine time piece that just doesn't scream LOOK AT ME I HAVE MONEY like a Rolex does. Can't beat the price either!



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